Labour Party problems

All while the right wing of the Tory party gets to carry on reeking havoc unperturbed by whats laughably labelled HM Opposition

Interesting you mention the right wing of the Tory party. Where are all the Labour “moderates” campaigning against Brexit and helping push their party one way or the other.   Only time they pop up is to launch attacks on Corbyn. If the “moderates” put half as much effort into sensible arguments as they do into rants about the cult of Corbyn perhaps they would be taken seriously themselves.

As for ” Corbyn is Labour leader then the right-wing press will just keep doing this”. Wrong they will keep doing it to any Labour leader who doesnt bow down to the right wing and follow their owners wishes where it counts.

A backbench Icarus

You could at least credit the tweet you copied it from. Original thought is too much to expect I suppose.

the AS furore

The AS furore about them adopting a stricter definition than the Tories did?

Where are all the Labour “moderates” campaigning against Brexit and helping push their party one way or the other. Only time they pop up is to launch attacks on Corbyn.

Disonnance, you’re talking bullocks, and I suspect you know you are. Lots of Labour MPs pushing, all the time, for the Labour leadership to support Labour members and push for an EEA style deal, and a public vote on remaining or excepting whatever deal occurs. When they do so, they are often labelled anti-Corbyn, for not supporting his unfulfillable plans as regards Brexit.

Speaking of baggage:

23 April, 1977. Jeremy Corbyn, then Haringey Councillor, organised a counter demonstration in defence of London’s Jewish Community & others, against the National Front – 1,000 of whom marched through Wood Green protected by the old bill. 81 arrests that day. The people calling this man an antisemite are not fit to tie his shoelaces. His mother stood on the same streets, fighting the same battle, 40 years earlier.

E. Clarke

When they do so, they are often labelled anti-Corbyn, for not supporting his unfulfillable plans as regards Brexit.

Ah yes of course. Its all Corbyns fault isnt it?

Come on, mention all those Labour “moderates” who are getting the headlines pushing for a sensible position?

Now that the labour party has effectively been colonised by Momentum, any dissent from the words of the Glorious Leader is immediately seized on as treachery and (in addition to your vilification via social media) the campaign for your deselection whirs into action.

This is being somewhat comically referred to as restoring democracy to the party, as opposed to replicate a Russian Politburo.

Now that the labour party has effectively been colonised by Momentum

Take more water with it.

Now that the labour party has effectively been colonised by Momentum,

Are you a member? If so you will have a say in what goes on.

Speaking of baggage:

23 April, 1977. Jeremy Corbyn, then Haringey Councillor, organised a counter demonstration in defence of London’s Jewish Community & others, against the National Front – 1,000 of whom marched through Wood Green protected by the old bill. 81 arrests that day. The people calling this man an antisemite are not fit to tie his shoelaces. His mother stood on the same streets, fighting the same battle, 40 years earlier.

E. Clarke

Are you sure that is accurate Ransos?Although Tweeted, I believe it is something that Jeremy would be involved with but it seems it might be slightly embellished by time. Happy to see your source.

http://www.harringayonline.com/group/historyofharringay/forum/topics/1977-antifascists-battle-it/

<div class=”bbp-reply-author”>dissonance
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You forget how he won those three elections.Namely by ignoring the traditional voters whilst chasing the city money, right wing press coverage and swing voters. The cunning triangulation strategy had the massive flaw that it had to keep moving rightwards for those three “wins”.

Well, more specifically he won the first one just by taking over a winning hand after John Smith died. People talk about his lurch to the right as if it was necessary to win an election but it’s absolute nonsense, everything he did then, he did from choice not necessity. (and I think part of the same nonsense that claims “Miliband was too leftwing”)

Labour certainly doesn’t need another Blair, the country bloody needs another Smith though.

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Are you a member? If so you will have a say in what goes on.

if you want to get an idea of the level of ‘debate’ within the labour party under Corbyn, then get onto one of the Glorious Leader and Momentums favoured social media feeds like Red Labour, or maybe go to Twitter and have a look at the tirades of vitriol directed at Tom Watson or anyone who has dared to put their head above the parapet to criticise their anointed one. You’ll soon see that the far right certainly doesn’t have a monopoly on genuinely nasty and threatening political thuggery.

And just have a look at the truly vile stuff directed at Margaret Hodge if you were still labouring under the misapprehension that the labour party doesn’t have a problem with antisemitism.

One thing that’s a consistent theme in all of this is how little interest they seem to have in offering an opposition to the Tory’s. Much preferring to attack anyone in their own party, the BBC, the press, MI5 (yes, seriously!), and anyone else they seem to pick up with their tinfoil helmets.

I wouldn’t go to Twitter to gauge anything

Other people do though. Seriously… go and have a read of the comments of some of Corbyns cheerleaders and it doesn’t make for pleasant reading.

I’ve not had a look for a while and just popped on to Red Labour now. It seems like Momentum is now going full Peoples Front of Judea, and that Jon Lansman, Corbyns leadership campaign manager and Momentum founder is now ‘The Enemy’ for not being a true believer any more.

You couldn’t make it up

You couldn’t make it up

You do little else. Are you a member of the Labour Party?

Today’s polling ….

Westminster voting intention:

LAB: 39% (+2)
CON: 37% (-2)
LDEM: 10% (-)
GRN: 5% (+1)
UKIP: 5% (+2)

via @BMGResearch, 06 – 10 Aug

— Britain Elects (@britainelects) August 14, 2018

No, I’m not.

So, just to confirm… what am I making up?

Are you sure that is accurate Ransos?

Detailed account here https://kmflett.wordpress.com/2017/04/21/jeremy-corbyns-role-in-organising-opposition-to-fascism-at-the-battle-of-wood-green-23rd-april-1977/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

No, I’m not.

So you belittle the membership for having a different opinion to you yet your protests extend only to bleating on here?

And let’s be clear that is a small part of the membership (how many of the 600,000?)

You cannot gauge a membership of 600,000 from a few social media idiots, well unless you have an agenda (which you clearly do)

You cannot gauge a membership of 600,000

Indeed – there are full members, registered supporters, and affiliated supporters within that number. All three categories elected Corbyn by a substantial majority. No doubt Binners think that Momentum infiltrated the whole lot.

For the record, I get a vote as a member of an affiliated trade union.

Two pages on the same old rubbish as we had on the Corbyn thread. If we’re going to go over old ground about sixth common rooms, Tony Blair being a progressive messiah as opposed to a war criminal, Corbyn the racist/anti-semite/terrorist sympathiser/communist/socialist worker/militant sympathiser/russian spy/peadophile/baby eater/etc then I might as well repeat what I said two years ago. If supposed labour MPs, supporters and others spent half as much energy supporting him instead of doing the tories job for them then he would be 20 points ahead and spending his time attacking the tories as opposed to firefighting his own party because a tiny few within it still can’t accept the result of two leadership elections.

And as for him not having policies. Really? There are many things to be said about Corbyn, but not having policies isn’t one of them. The last manifesto was wildly popular and the policies within it prevented the tories from winning on outright majority when some on here said it would be 170.

Wildly popular and losing the election don’t really correlate

The demand for absolute loyalty from a long-term dissenter of all the previous labour party leadership seems very hypocritical

Most political parties are broad churches, seems to be out of fashion for the current labour leadership

I see the idiot Luciana Berger has been stirring the shit saying that merely being there means Corbyn was complicit Funny she didn’t apply the same logic to her equally hypocritical fellow traveller Louise Ellman when it turned out that she had attended the Hajo Meyer meeting (referred to above).

As has been said, if these two would spend half as much time backing Labour as smearing Corbyn, maybe there would be a Labour govt RIGHT NOW.

Most political parties are broad churches, seems to be out of fashion for the current labour leadership

They are but the left is more interesting, looking at the US and Australia gives some parallels where the left is a collection of people from vastly different backgrounds and standpoints.

The old/classic working class who have come from heavy industry

The green/environmental side taking issues with big business and old indsutries

The socially liberal who want better treatment for all and inclusion

There are more groups there too when you throw in some of the Blairites too

Bringing that group together is harder than uniting the right into just hating somebody.

Wildly popular and losing the election don’t really correlate

Popular enough to overturn a 20 point deficit in the polls, gain dozens of seats and turn predictions of a tory landslide into a hung parliament. Whichever way you look at it, the labour manifesto, and the man fronting it won a lot of people over. Far more than anyone predicted or expected. But yeah, they lost narrowly so obviously they need Tony Blair and his cronies back, despite the fact that outside the PLP, they are pretty much the most hated ex-politicians in Britain.

<div class=”bbp-reply-author”>big_n_daft
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The demand for absolute loyalty from a long-term dissenter of all the previous labour party leadership seems very hypocritical

It would do, if it happened,

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Of all the contradictions that corbyn bashers manage to believe in, this is the oddest one. All the way along he’s been open- probably too open- tohaving critics within the party. His original cabinet was full of people who only ever used it as their opportunity to quit. His deputy leader’s able to be openly critical

It’s like the simultaneous weak/bully thing, and the “he has no policies/and all his policies are rabid hard left”

The demand for absolute loyalty from a long-term dissenter of all the previous labour party leadership seems very hypocritical

Dont suppose you have any quotes from him regarding this demand for absolute loyalty?

As for his dissent from the previous labour party leadership. Given a large number were about being opposed to the Iraq war and also wanting a proper investigation into it I am not sure he can overly be blamed.

Most political parties are broad churches, seems to be out of fashion for the current labour leadership

Apart from when you look at the original cabinet it was a broad church. It was only when the “moderates” threw a hissy fit and started announcing they wouldnt serve in his cabinet and then launched attack after attack on him that things changed.

The problem seems to be more with the “moderates” who come across as ideologically extreme which is quite impressive since most of them dont really seem to have any real beliefs aside from a hatred of the anything more left wing than centre left.

So the entire thing looks like fake news by the mail

He was at a conference to commemorate an illegal israeli airstrike in Tunisia (also attended by lib Dems & a Tory), he then went to a wreath laying ceremony at the cemetery for them , this martyrs cemetery also has the graves of 2 PLO leaders accused of planning Black September attacks.

Anyone who didn’t like him is outraged, everyone else looks at the smears & thinks how desperate the right have become…..

And Labour rise 2 points in the polls !

I like Frankie Boyle’s take on it-

Cynical, I’m sure, but I imagine the Corbyn wreath story was in a pile of things being saved for the election and got shuffled up because Boris was in trouble.

— Frankie Boyle (@frankieboyle) August 14, 2018

@cranberry which right wing paper is that from? Do they mention who else was there?

If supposed labour MPs, supporters and others spent half as much energy supporting him instead of doing the tories job for them then he would be 20 points ahead and spending his time attacking the tories as opposed to firefighting his own party because a tiny few within it still can’t accept the result of two leadership elections.

Spot on.  None of Corbyns policies should be hard for a Labour MP to get behind and their focus should be on supporting whoever is leader to ensure they can get into power (whether they like him or not)

Worse than that. The Munich killers are buried in an entirely different country. The whole thing is just a fabrication by the Mail, dutifully repeated by the BBC and Labour troublemakers like Luciana Berger and of course by our local chorus of Corbyn basher.

Dennis Skinner has always been great but that was excellent.

I believe that the BBC and others (I don’t read the Mail) reported that the wreath laying ceremony was at a Memorial. A memorial is not the same thing as a grave.

From the BBC – “Mr Corbyn has faced fresh questions about the 2014 conference after the Daily Mail said he was pictured with a wreath near memorials to members of the Black September organisation.”

From Sky – “Jeremy Corbyn has admitted being present at a wreath-laying memorial for Palestinian terrorists accused of being behind the murder of Israeli Olympic athletes in 1972.”

A memorial is not the same thing as a grave.

You need to tell Chris Grayling, who just now on R4Today said “funeral”.

It’s now clear what Corbyn did and didn’t do – only the desperate Tories are propagating the lies.

I believe that the BBC and others (I don’t read the Mail) reported that the wreath laying ceremony was at a Memorial. A memorial is not the same thing as a grave.

Yes, a memorial to the 1985 bombing of Tunisia by Israel.

Thinking about it, I did once visit Highgate cemetery so I expect the Mail thinks I’m a Marxist.

Grayling – what a ****

“What do you think should happen to Boris Johnson over his Burkha comments?”

“What I’m interested in is what’s going to happen to Corbyn blablabla…..”

The government advisors will be congratulating him, the blue rinsers will be lapping it up and anyone with half a brain is screaming “answer the **** question!” at the radio.

You need to tell Chris Grayling, who just now on R4Today said “funeral”.

As far as I am concerned, the vast majority of politicians can **** off because the self serving **** generally put their own interests first, whether its their commercial or ideological wants and needs.

We should be getting the best people possible to run the country, do the job properly and pay them accordingly.