Joe Biden does a Trump

I’m surprised that this hasn’t been picked up on. Joe Biden has unconditionally pardoned his son Hunter despite repeatedly saying he wouldn’t.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c4ngnw2qr01t

I can just imagine the conversation between Joe & Hunter over the weekend, can you imagine being in the same position?

Liberals and non-crazy right wingers are going to have to learn from the populist proto-fascist playbook if they’re going to survive politically, if not literally in the long term.
This is a start.

On one hand it’s disappointing but on the other the orange one probably had Hunter’s extradition to Guantanamo drafted and ready to go.

I don’t blame him as Trump would have gone after Hunter when he’s back in power.

I’ll give him a pass, purely because it will send the MAGA clowns into an apoplectic rage

Nice play. Right wingers go crazy over this abuse of power, which nicely hamstrings trumps pardoning ability or they say nothing and just take it and feel weak.

Either way a win for Hunter.

I’ll give him a pass, purely because it will send the MAGA clowns into an apoplectic rage

I cannot think of a worse reason. That is not how “justice” works.

So hands up who here would sacrifice their son’s liberty so they look good in the opinion columns?

The rich and powerful are above the law.

Biden looks incredibly stupid and hypocritical.

Trump did similar Kushner.

What I didn’t realise that Presidents pardon 100’s of people during their time in office. Why?

Liberals and non-crazy right wingers are going to have to learn from the populist proto-fascist playbook if they’re going to survive politically, if not literally in the long term.

That’s your takeaway from this? Aim for the gutter? So everyone becomes an unprincipled, undemocratic, dog whistling populist grifter? What a bleak, depressing take on things. Maybe that is the direction things are heading in but I really hope not 🙁

I’d have an issue with it if he’d done anything I was remotely bothered about. But let’s face it, most folk wouldn’t be thrown in jail for doing what he has done

If you don’t fight back dirty you’re going to get squashed. That’s the brutal truth.  There’s no points available for being nice any more, we are rapidly reaching the stage where they are just going to roll over Western liberal democracy as we’ve known it and it’ll be too late.  Trump, Meloni, Le Pen, Farage, Putin, Xi, Erdowan, and on and on. Pretending we can rise above them and hold onto power by taking the high ground is not a lesson history teaches us.

It is bleak and depressing but we’re not beaten yet if we fight back robustly. Get a firm grip of social media firms, double down on liberal education, realign capitalism so it’s organised for the benefit of society rather than society organised for the benefit of capitalism.

Biden looks incredibly stupid and hypocritical.

Oh yeah, Biden. Just Biden. Not the last lot at all.

Double standards much?

What I didn’t realise that Presidents pardon 100’s of people during their time in office. Why?

Good question. And if it’s such a good idea why don’t UK prime ministers have similar powers?

Trump pardoned 237 people.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_granted_executive_clemency_by_Donald_Trump

Clinton pardoned 456

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_pardoned_by_Bill_Clinton#:~:text=As%20president%2C%20Clinton%20used%20his,final%20hours%20of%20his%20presidency.

The USA is a strange place.

The USA is a strange place.

This.

On a slightly broader note I had no idea any of this was even remotely possible until Trump started pardoning people after his first term. I understand Clinton also used this provision. Why is it even a thing.

I know we’re way past it now but here’s an idea- maybe nobody should get to pardon anybody.

There’s no real justification for it, but I would do the same for my son.

Pretending we can rise above them and hold onto power by taking the high ground is not a lesson history teaches us.

You are suggesting that Joe Biden pardoning his own son is necessary for the Democrats to hold on to power?

If anything I would suggest the reverse – it feeds the narrative that all politicians are the same when they are not, at least they shouldn’t be. And it lets corrupt politicians like Trump off the hook.

The rich and powerful are above the law.

Biden looks incredibly stupid and hypocritical.

This was my thought too, although I do get that Trump is vindictive & malicious enough to go after Hunter during his presidency.

US Presidents seem to like exercising their right to pardon (don’t they pardon a turkey at Thanks Giving?) but the ability to pardon oneself seems utter madness.

Dissapointing, its mad that the president even has the power to do this

Trump is obviously many times worse but that doesnt help

How to legitamise Trump’s abuse of power and demolish the Democratic party in one single act.  What a legacy he leaves behind.

 I do get that Trump is vindictive & malicious enough to go after Hunter during his presidency.

Is he though? During Trump’s 2016 presidential campaign one of his rallying cries was “lock up crooked Hilary”, even before he took office he had abandoned the Idea:

“Trump team won’t pursue charges against Hillary Clinton”

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38069585

US politics is a different place,  and the fact they do this (presidential pardons) just highlights it really . I can see why Biden’s going to do it, what father wouldn’t? And I can anticipate the howls of indignation from the Trumpists despite the fact that they all know full well if it was Barron or Don Jr, Trump would’ve done exactly the same thing.

Presidents have the power because European kings had that power at the time the post was created. And they were creating a temporary king style post. Seems antiquated now, but was probably reasonable 250 years ago.

I do get that Trump is vindictive & malicious enough to go after Hunter during his presidency.

Is he though?

Personally I think that he probably is (and he’s known to have been so away from the political arena) but whether he’s politically savvy enough not to, or the Republican party/advisors can reign him in I don’t know. This time though he can’t stand for re-election so there’s probably less impetus to look decent.

Either way, Biden’s actions are going to make it incredibly difficult for the Democrats to criticise Trump when he invariably uses the same powers to his advantage (possibly even pardoning himself).

Presidents have the power because European kings had that power at the time the post was created. And they were creating a temporary king style post. Seems antiquated now, but was probably reasonable 250 years ago.

And how many European monarchies ended with the monarch’s head on a spike?

Makes you think. 😉

Disappointed the three wasn’t titled ” Biden did a Trump and tried to let it slip out unnoticed” or similar

Justice is an entirely arbitrary concept decided by whoever writes the rules, not some kind of immutable natural law.

The reins are about to be handed to the populists so it makes sense to lock down as much stuff down as possible before the frothers go crazy. I imagine there’s a lot more of this type of thing coming before January.

What I didn’t realise that Presidents pardon 100’s of people during their time in office. Why?

Because the US system is screwed up so that the judiciary and politics are intertwined.  Americans believe that are the definition of freedom and democracy but they are far from it.

Good question. And if it’s such a good idea why don’t UK prime ministers have similar powers?

It may have escaped your notice but Prime Ministers are not the head of state.  The King does have the power to pardon people, his mother did so on a small number of occassions when recommended to do so by her Ministers.  However I don’t think you need to spend too long thinking about it to realise that outgoing UK prime ministers have their own weird ways of rewarding their friends.

I’d have an issue with it if he’d done anything I was remotely bothered about. But let’s face it, most folk wouldn’t be thrown in jail for doing what he has done

I think this is actually the crux of the matter – was he punished more because he was the president’s son?  I honestly don’t know the answer to that because the US judicial system is crazy, but my gut feel is an average white guy with family wealth would have been able to negotiate a better deal.

So hands up who here would sacrifice their son’s liberty so they look good in the opinion columns?

If my son cost me the political and emotional capital that Biden’s did I might take a lot of convincing to show him any compassion!

The rich and powerful are above the law.

Well, USA Presidents are literarily above the law. Something we find very confusing back here.. but then… the Royal Family.

It may have escaped your notice but Prime Ministers are not the head of state.

You won’t be surprised to learn that I had noticed. I was obviously referring to the royal prerogative. But thanks for pointing it out anyway.

Saving your son from a vengeful nasty incoming regime, when you have the power to do so – you’d do it every time.

This will make zero difference to what the MAGA lot will do over the next 4 years no matter what they say now.  They will be pardoning their friends (again) and locking up their enemies.

Is he though? During Trump’s 2016 presidential campaign one of his rallying cries was “lock up crooked Hilary”, even before he took office he had abandoned the Idea:

“Trump team won’t pursue charges against Hillary Clinton”

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38069585

There may be some Epsteiny details that prevented that…

Trump has made clear that much of what motivates him during this term is retribution against his political opponents and his nominations for head of DOJ, FBI (Kash Patel FFS) is putting the pieces in place to pursue this. Hunter Biden has been, and remains, the obvious weak link to get at his father.

Joe Biden knows what’s coming down the track for Hunter – more politically-motivated investigations, prosecutions and most likely sentencing far in excess of what an ordinary citizen would receive for similar circumstances – and I can’t blame him for this, TBH.

This time he is getting unqualified yes men into every position, it remains to be seen if congress mounts any real challenge to that, they will probably reject a couple for show then instate equally unqualified yes men. I really don’t think the institutions of state are going to offer much if any resistance at all this time around.

What I didn’t realise that Presidents pardon 100’s of people during their time in office. Why?

Theres a good reason to have a system to commute and pardon in the US and it’s basically because partisan issues and partiality are baked into their legal and law enforcement systems. Judicial and senior police roles are largely either elected or directly politically appointed which means there are a lot of convictions and sentences that are either unsound or even if technically correct were never less personally, or politically (and often racially) motivated. Theres also circumstances where people have been convicted and sentenced for crimes we now no longer view as crimes.

Flicking through the list of Clinton’s pardons theres an example of someone convicted of ‘Conduct unbecoming of an officer’ – that unbecoming conduction was basically being a black officer in the 1880s and successful in the role in a way that obvious upset fellow white officers.

However we tend not to know or hear a lot about of pardons because they are often in themselves quite mundane crimes and quite un-noteworty people. Reading through the bulk of Clinton’s pardons – without knowing the details of any particular case – it looks like a long list of ‘so what’s.

While theres a necessary role for pardons and commuted sentences – there more of a question as to whether it should be the President or someone of something else who operates that statement  – but if not them then who?

In a more innocent time it was sort of understood that although elected on a party ticket the role of president was one of service to all off the country – that they are a head of state as well as a politician. Trump has broken that model and positions himself very much not as the ‘President of the USA’ but as the “President of the people who voted for him’ but by doing that he leaves the country without anyone in that head of state role.

We have ‘Royal Pardon’s and other similar tools here of course – not as many – on average about six a year – Alan Turing being the most famous example

Trump has made clear that much of what motivates him during this term is retribution against his political opponents and his nominations for head of DOJ, FBI (Kash Patel FFS) is putting the pieces in place to pursue this. Hunter Biden has been, and remains, the obvious weak link to get at his father.

Joe Biden knows what’s coming down the track for Hunter – more politically-motivated investigations, prosecutions and most likely sentencing far in excess of what an ordinary citizen would receive for similar circumstances – and I can’t blame him for this, TBH.

I agree.  I don’t think Biden had much choice really.  Trump would clearly ruin Hunters life for him out of pure malice.  Remember unsavoury tho Hunter might be the crimes he committed he had done a plea deal on which was reneged on.

I am not a massive fan of the American model but surely the President of the United States cannot find someone guilty, only a court of law can do that? So I don’t know what this Trump going after Hunter implies.

And the one issue everyone seems to be ignoring is that if pardoning his own son is perfectly acceptable, appropriate, and morally justified, then why did Biden very clearly say that he would do the opposite, ie, that he would definitely not pardon him?

He could have made his intentions clear from the start. Instead he has now simply added liar to the charge sheet as well as hypocrite

Great ammunition for Trump.

“I said I’d abide by the jury decision, and I will do that. And I will not pardon him,” Biden told reporters on the sidelines of the G7 summit in Italy. – Joe Biden