Is there anything that annoys you about the bike industry?

Shitty attitudes to punters on demo days from importers.

I stood around like a spare prick at a wedding at a recent demo day with £2000 burning a hole in my pocket for a new frame. The only guy making any effort at customer relations was the one from Pivot, the rest seemed to be almost autistic in their lack of basic customer service skills.

If they can’t be @rsed before I’ve spunked my wad, what the hell will they be like afterwards?

Shitty attitudes to punters on demo days from importers.

I stood around like a spare prick at a wedding at a recent demo day with £2000 burning a hole in my pocket for a new frame. The only guy making any effort at customer relations was the one from Pivot, the rest seemed to be almost autistic in their lack of basic customer service skills.

If they can’t be @rsed before I’ve spunked my wad, what the hell will they be like afterwards?

2013 stuff should only be available after 01/01/2013, NOT in the summer of 2012.

What annoys me about the bike industry is the daft pricing.

I recently started looking around at bikes after a few years break and was rather shocked at the marked increase in prices. Silly increases!

I dropped into a new shop fairly near me recently. The first bike I looked at was £5300 – a carbon full suspension MTB.

The cheapest bike was still stupidly expensive. I thought, maybe I’m out of touch, but believed £1500 was a lot for a bike and that one should get something pretty damned respectable for this money.

At the bike show last weekend, I looked at a lot of bike porn, but essentially, there has been very little innovation in several years. The products seem to be more refined and pretty, but otherwise about the same.

High prices put non-enthusiasts off before they even get started! Can’t be good for business! Better jack the prices by yet another 10%!

The insistence of using cheap shit bearings in very expensive kit. Easton wheels, you are guilty as charged! I like everything else about you though.

The way the industry tries to be innovative for the sake of it rather than making something that works amazing.

The insistence of using cheap shit bearings in very expensive kit.

^ this, many of the high end bikes/kit/wheels/components/forks etc is designed in sunnier or drier climates to be used in such conditions with no thought given to wet weather riding, As an example : I’m sure easton wheels are fantastic when ridden in sunny California but bring them over to this country and you may as well strip them down after every few rides in the mud or rain, since CRC started selling them off dirt cheap we’ve had more than a few pairs in the shop for new bearings/knackered freehubs and pawls etc – folk don’t listen to our advice and if they see something for 50% off they obviously think they’re getting a bargain, they should ask themselves why it is 50% off?, Hope may not be the lightest or the fastest pick up but i’ll recommend them over every other hub/wheel build going. Simple to repair, fantastic after service and parts are very easy to get for the average punter.

And it’s not just wheels, some bearings as fitted to FS linkages are woefully inadequate for our climate and riding conditions, another thing that confounds me is cheap n’ nasty headset bearings or BB bearings in expensive carbon or alloy frames….for the love of god why?.

I’m doing myself out of a job i guess but i’d rather see good quality parts fitted as standard, it’s annoying for a customer when 6 months after spending their cash on an expensive bike they’re told that the headset is knackered and the bb needs to be replaced.

Crap suspension setup tips or just basically poor set up from the factory on bikes just so they pass the car park bounce test. Thus ensuring that the woods are full of people riding under damped pogosticks that could actually be quite dangerous.

The majority of bike shops I’ve used are helpful and want to help me spend the money in my wallet without being pushy. Too many – and one large one in particular – treat me like I’m a disruption to their working day rather than the reason for their working day. Not unique to this industry; I suppose some people simply shouldn’t be in the service industry.

the fact that Shimano STILL use a phillips/flathead screw for High/Low adjustment. Why now just use an allen key headed screw? Multi-tools could be much smaller if they didn’t have to have screwdrivers on them..

Standardise on …..stems,bars …. so that upgrading is easier.

WTF?

HG I was referring to standardising on 31.8 bars and stems.

Nothing really annoys me about the bike industry. Bigger fish to fry and all that. Some things are worth getting annoyed about, others aren’t.

Re: pricing – at the end of the day, the companies that make and sell stuff are in business for the same “business 101” reason that pretty much every business in the world exists, i.e. to make money. We shouldn’t begrudge them that fundamental right.

Re: Supply/demand/market creation – again, business 101. And look how many of you are loving having fantastic XTR levels of braking power at SLX price, and clutch mechs on mid range groupsets, plus slick shifting with 10 speed drivetrains. All of this advancement has happened because of the “arms race” between Shimano and SRAM battling for market share at both OEM and aftermarket. And market share is only gained by selling stuff, which in turn requires market “push”.

this is great; i’ve got loads of things to be pissed off about that i hadn’t thought of!

snobbery pisses me off. i’ve finally convinced myself that deore is actually fine. if you’re a pro maybe not but for a lot of us…
also aspirational culture. a lot of juicy (and often presumably good, though not always) products dangled infront of us which a lot of us can’t afford to be spunking on, though we’d definately like and appreciate the engineering. some developments make obvious sense and probably don’t cost more to manufacture than the old style, but are charged at a premium.

If they can’t be @rsed before I’ve spunked my wad…

snigger : )

All the bullshit that goes with it! And too many middle class rich kids thinking they know more about biking than me!! Because they’ve been misled by all the mags feeding them shit! Like not having a clue about what downhill really is, most kids coming into it now think it manicured smooth trails with jumps that I could ride my bmx on!!!

The insistence of using cheap shit bearings in very expensive kit.

Posh bearings and efficient seals add cost, weight and drag, none of which are qualities that win over journalists in ‘ride it a couple of times over a fortnight’ group tests.

Also
Trade magazines forever talking about maximising your profit and business efficiency.

I don’t know what it is with the biking “community” and the way they seem to be entitled to be involved in the “bike industry”. I doubt you’d buy a TV and be as involved in the TV industry in the same manner?!

The bike industry is there to make money. The reason why things don’t fit together as one “standard” is to make money.

The reason why so many new things come out so quickly, such as 9 speed to 10 speed and now 11 speed, is, yes, to make money!

And why shouldn’t they? The bike industry isn’t some kind of not-for-profit charity for our benefit.

Orange boy have you tried Betd in Stoke for mech hangers they may be able to help you out had a few on other bikes. To add to the orange argument I own a 2012 five pro with a few add ons love the bike but have to agree they seem to be milking their customers I am pretty sure about 6 years ago a five pro was about 1700 quid now your looking at 3 grand

From memory I paid £1800 for my old 2006 Pro in the sale, down from £2100. Also from memory a frame only was about £1300 back then and is now £1500 with the maxel option included. Think you need to be looking at Fox/Shimano/etc more then Orange for the price hike.

As for the upgrade cost, who knows what they pay for the parts. Bet it’s a bit more then the huge companies. When it comes down to it you don’t need to upgrade from standard but you have the option. How many of the other big sellers offer this? Maybe the reason they don’t is down to the cost involved?

The fact that it’s very difficult to find simple serviceable stuff. I want a steel rigid singlespeed so that I can ride to the pub, try a couple of jumps and drop offs on the way, and then leave it outside and not be completely gutted when some arsehole steals it or messes with it.

Also, I want suspension simple coil suspension with the bare minimum of external adjustability. I also suspension to be provided with some shims so that I can fettle. I like fettling.

snobbery pisses me off.

yep

And why shouldn’t they? The bike industry isn’t some kind of not-for-profit charity for our benefit.

you work in the industry then?

too many middle class rich kids thinking they know more about biking than me!!

Just a thought; maybe a lot of them do!

cycling clothes that don’t fit cyclists.

And why shouldn’t they? The bike industry isn’t some kind of not-for-profit charity for our benefit.

you work in the industry then?

Nope. I just ride bikes.

good thread this some valid points.

I want a steel rigid singlespeed so that I can ride to the pub

Check out the Viking fixie range. Cheap, basic and reasonably robust although probably not up to jumps and drop offs.

I want suspension simple coil suspension with the bare minimum of external adjustability

Really not very easy when rider weights vary so much. Cars and motorbikes can do it because the vehicle weighs so much more than the rider/driver.

Over engineered shite and having new standards and kit rammed down my gob.

There have been some good innovations over the last 10 years, decent disk brakes, dropper posts, clutch mechs etc.

The thing is this is overshadowed by: 5 different standards for everything, over expensive products that do sod all and the fact that the cycling industry is the worst sport for “all the gear no idea”. All of this is detrimental to decent products that actually work well and last.

When people start realising cycling is similar to any other sport (golf, tennis, etc) in that you can have the same clubs as tiger woods or same raquet as federer, but it isn’t going make you play like them.

Practice and coaching are what make the biggest difference, but this does not help the industry sell bikes.

wrecker – Member
too many middle class rich kids thinking they know more about biking than me!!

Just a thought; maybe a lot of them do!
POSTED 51 MINUTES AGO # REPORT-POST

Haha, we have our selves a middle class rich kid here ^ 😆

I’ll give u an example:
I was down at wharney a few week back, and was told by this little posh kid all armoured up, big bike riding down a smooth track that I needed triple clamp forks on my bike, I told him no I don’t and asked him if he liked his riding technical, he said of course I do reet clever, so I said well follow me I have a track for ya to go darn, he even told me there was no other track where I was taking him! Anyhow he was wrong and I took him down a nice tech line… Or at least I thought I did until I looked back and he was pushing down!!! I said, I thought u liked tech and he then went on to blame his tyres and so on…this is a regular thing happening down there..

Yet I go down my local bmx park see lads who look like they haven’t too pence to rub together riding knackered up old bikes who can pull backflips and flares out of the bowl who tell me they’d love to try out mountain biking if they could afford one but they don’t think they’d be any good!!! Wtf! It’s a totally different attitude, there’s no bullshit in the bmx industry..

THIS

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/warranty-issue-fisher-bit-of-help-needed

Haha, we have our selves a middle class rich kid here ^

Oh, do we? Tell me some more about me then seeing as you know me so well.
I’m not rich, I don’t really know what “middle class” is, and I’m certainly not a kid. So that’s 0 from 3 for you.
I do realise that I don’t know it all, and that there are people out there both older and younger, richer and poorer, better and worse riders who know more about MTBing than me. That’s because I’m not an arrogant ****wit who thinks he knows it all.

Really not very easy when rider weights vary so much. Cars and motorbikes can do it because the vehicle weighs so much more than the rider/driver.

Seems to me that that’s why they provide several different springs.

Actually, I think this is my real pet hate about the industry. Suspension costs an absolute fortune and yet the tolerances that they build springs to is shocking. Peter Verdone reckons that +/- 10% is not uncommon:

http://www.peterverdone.com/archive/bikesuspension.htm

Suspension fluid is another pet peeve of mine. Companies seem to enjoy overcharging when compared to motorcycle manufacturers. I’ve taken Peter Verdone’s advice and started using Silkoline as this allows me to tune the damping and maintain it’s characteristics if I don’t happen to have access to the specific fluid for rockshox, fox, or manitou.

BruceWee – Member

Suspension costs an absolute fortune and yet the tolerances that they build springs to is shocking. Peter Verdone reckons that +/- 10% is not

Sicklines had something on that a while back, found most of them about 7-12 lbs off. Not massive, percentage wise.

http://www.sicklines.com/tech/spring-rate-printed-vs-measured-ratings/

FuzzyWuzzy – Member

Spec’ing Avid Elixir brakes on 99% of bikes under £3k – wtf everyone hates them so stop spec’ing them!

Just speclist bingo- Carrera used to use Tektro on mostof theirs, and the Auriga Pros were ace. Shimano copies, basically. When they downgraded them to Juicies, every review the next year drew attention to the “upgrade”. as a positive thing, and every buyer comment I saw online also thought it was an upgrade.

Spec’ing Avid Elixir brakes on 99% of bikes under £3k – wtf everyone hates them so stop spec’ing them

Really pleased with mine. but i don’t have the basic oem models.

Must agree with the top spec rear mech and cheap everything else.

But the industry is there to make money 🙁

Like not having a clue about what downhill really is, most kids coming into it now think it manicured smooth trails with jumps that I could ride my bmx on!!!

That really annoys me too. Real Downhill is riding with a 54t setup and Tioga Disc Drive down Mammoth Mounatin.

Yet I go down my local bmx park see lads who look like they haven’t too pence to rub together riding knackered up old bikes who can pull backflips and flares out of the bowl who tell me they’d love to try out mountain biking if they could afford one but they don’t think they’d be any good!!! Wtf! It’s a totally different attitude, there’s no bullshit in the bmx industry..

I agree 100%. It was the same 12 years ago when I used to BMX and it’s the same today. It’s almost as though the BMX crowd ride their bikes for fun.

BMX isn’t without its rich kids with nice bikes and the latest harreem skinnies/xxl deep v/condom hat preaching how great weed is, who don’t actually ride/only bother with cool tricks.

Though the amount of rich riders in mtb (not just DH) with no idea, too concerned with bike setup compared to BMX is far greater.

It’s almost as though the BMX crowd ride their bikes for fun.

Bikes for fun? What’s that about?

If you thought the bike industry was bad at kit, then I bring you the world of Windsurfing/Kiting.

Every year, without fail, the kit gets changed. Either 1/2mm has been shaved off the rocker or the fin(s) have been placed 1/2mm further forward (or back) or the width of the board has either gone up 1/2mm or down or it’s had a new paint job or. or.. the sails have changed colourways.. Every year without fail for the last 15 years or so.
This has led to secondhand boards being worth less than a half eaten Clif Bar despite it’s condition.
And since most boards are made of some grade of carbon (have been for years now) the price has skyrocketed to the point they’ve almost priced out the low/med sector of the market. It’s pittyful.

I know Windsurfing/Kiting is image led but change for change sake has ruined this sport/industry.

And to top it all off, there are two factories in Taiwan making all the boards for the Brands, so each knows how much the boards cost to pop out and paint.. and you thought price fixing is only a theory in the second chapter of Economics for Beginners..

Sad, very very sad.

Though the amount of rich riders in mtb (not just DH) with no idea, too concerned with bike setup compared to BMX is far greater.

In my opinion, I would say this is by far the most annoying thing I find with mountain biking. It sounds stupid but with BMX I felt there was a lot more camaraderie and having fun, and much less talk about kit or gear, or what frame or which saddle etc.

Whereas with mountain biking more often than not, you join a new group or meet soem people on the trail and the first thing they do is have a look at your fork and talk about how badly they need xt gearing or how badly they need an extra 20mm of travel etc.. Obviously not all mountain bikers are like this and i’m not painting everyone with the same brush but this is just in my experience going between the two.

Like I said, just my opinion, I don’t want to start a war or anything

And why shouldn’t they? The bike industry isn’t some kind of not-for-profit charity for our benefit.

^^This.

Selling stuff is what keeps manufacturers and people in jobs.

As much as many in the bike industry view it as a bit of a lifestyle choice to do something they enjoy, love doesn’t pay the bills……

Specialized uber lightweight full suspension carbon 29er thingy

You’d need your head seeing to paying this much for a bicycle! And thought £5300 was ridiculous.

In my opinion, I would say this is by far the most annoying thing I find with mountain biking. It sounds stupid but with BMX I felt there was a lot more camaraderie and having fun, and much less talk about kit or gear, or what frame or which saddle etc.

Whereas with mountain biking more often than not, you join a new group or meet soem people on the trail and the first thing they do is have a look at your fork and talk about how badly they need xt gearing or how badly they need an extra 20mm of travel etc.. Obviously not all mountain bikers are like this and i’m not painting everyone with the same brush but this is just in my experience going between the two.

I hear ya!

When I joined here, practically every post was ‘look at my new bike/forks/bars…’ It appeared to me that mtb was all about what you had on the bike as opposed to what you did with it. When I made mention of this, people got defensive and I got called a troll etc.

I’ll tell you a little secret. You know the boys at school who knew every football player, result and and goal scorer, but couldn’t kick a ball to save themselves? Well most of them ride mountain bikes now they’ve all grown up 😀

MTB/Road is a notoriously expensive sport, of course it’s going to attract the more affluent people…

One reason I’ve taken to BMX racing is the hilariously cheap gear for sale (including 2nd hand market).

Nearly finished a 21 lb race BMX project – for around £300…