How to fix UK broken political system

With the forecast of a Labour landslide in the next election and the assumption that they will be putting more money into undoing the effects of a long period of Conservative austerity caused by them Replacing a Labour government which reversed the previous Conservative government and years of austerity and so on do we think that there is an answer to basically having 2 electable parties , each with polar opposite financial theories that come in and undo the work of the previous government  . Basically is there a different , workable system , where the main options are not so far apart with their political ideas ?

If we can get to the point where the LibDems are the official opposition, and the Conservatives are just a rump of a third party in parliament, we could see moves away from this swinging between the same two parties pattern.

It’s hoping for a lot, but the voters of the UK could make that happen, if they wanted to.

the main options are not so far apart with their political ideas ?

Isn’t that why the whip’s office is overseen by the Royal Household…

Proportional representation in some form.  The Scottish system works

Ban all the legalised corruption of second   ” jobs”

I want more voting on big things like whether we go to war with a country.

Also separate votes for your local mp and the Pime Minister.

The Prime Minister should be able to pick the best MPs for the key roles from all parties, even independents. Not just from their own party.

If you have a key roll in government, as well as being an MP, you shouldn’t be able to have another job. As there is no way you can dedicate yourself to all three sufficiently IMO.

MPs and political parties should have to stick to their manifesto, not sure how this could be policed.

You should not be able to change the Prime Minister without a another election.

Politics should be taught on the national curriculum, including debating.

Either reduce voting age to 16 or change the law so that you’re not classed as an adult until you’re 18. If you’re old enough to work and pay tax, and be treated as an adult in the courts then you’re old enough to vote IMO.

A Conservative party that comes third, or even fourth, in seats, based on coming second in the popular vote might start to agree with you TJ. Opposition to PR might crumble across opposition benches then… which could lead to voting system reform.

Turkeys don’t vote for Christmas, the current system suits the career politician. So can’t see any significant changes to our political system in my life time.

Career politicans (ie people who once elected are dedicated to service) is what we need… we have lawyers working in the Bahamas that occasionally show  up… etc.

Voting reform is only likely to happen if forced by the electorate as a key issue when deciding who to vote for.

It’s really high on my list of things needed.

Any government is only concerned with can they get elected at the next election, so they can’t implement any longer term strategies which may be unpopular otherwise they get kicked out and their work undone by the next election. Obviously that doesn’t answer the question…

Proportional representation in some form.

This would be the important first step. But I am generally of the view that a large part of the electorate does not really understand the nuances of the fptp system, and so there needs to be a significant campaign to raise awareness of that. We see more talk of lords reform, yes, important, but it deflects from the issue we really should be discussing.

That, and increased investment in punctuation

This is worth a good read through.

https://theconversation.com/polls-predict-total-wipeout-for-the-tories-and-britains-constitution-makes-it-a-real-possibility-227202

The leader of the LibDems was in Chippenham the other day, appearing on BBC Points West news, which, considering there’s no council elections coming up, is most unusual. I think they can taste blood in the water, they hold the local council, percentage-wise there’s about 5% between them and the Tories, with Labour on 4% and the Green Party on 5%, so I can see them annihilating the Tories here.

Proportional representation.  FPTP , combined with the tribal tendencies of voters has encouraged extremist politics in both parties in the US and UK.

I think it needs to get worse before it gets better.

There are still too many people that do okay at the expense of many others.

It’s not the political parties as such these days (they’re following a similar path) – it’s the economic system they both adopt which is built on a totally irresponsible concept of running the country – certainly for the good of most of us.

It will break at some point. It won’t be pleasant but hopefully we can rewire the whole thing.

Guy Fawkes has a good idea for a fix.

Career politicans

We don’t need this class of MP, we require vocational politicians. Ones that are dedicated to public service and have had life experience outside of the Westminster bubble to avoid group-think. Those who have been to college then MP’s staff/researchers then straight into election are not fit for purpose.

No second jobs for any sitting MP (including being a landlord), but make the pay commensurate with the responsibility. No London housing bought by the tax payer and profits going to the MP on sale, that’s public money and goes back to the treasury.

Hours of attendance at consituency and Westminster to be formally laid out with recesses trimmed in length but overnight sittings in the house to be abolished.

Reform of the lobby (with prison for breaches) and off-the-record briefings banned (if one doesn’t want ones’ loyalties known) don’t talk to the press.

Power of the whips to be reduced, my MP is there to serve contituents first, country a close second with party a distant last.

Anyone attempting to out orientation, or use an MP’s proclivities against them shall be cast out of society (as long as it’s legal, decent and honest it’s not our business).

Unlikely to happen but a useful wish-list

I think it needs to get worse before it gets better.

Even with this wording I think you’re being very optimistic.

Require all MPs to cycle everywhere, or take public transport, even the prime minister.

This would fix politics in a number of ways.

As we all know, cycling makes you cleverer because of the increased blood flow to your brain.

It also makes you less miserable – hard to be unhappy when riding a bike, even (especially?) in the rain. A happy politician is a good politician as my old grandad used to say.

And travelling on public transport would mean our politicians meet the people they make decisions for on a daily basis, rather than only when out campaigning.

Barrels of gunpowder?

Edit: goddammit, beaten to it.

Guy Fawkes has a good idea for a fix.

PR-STV. It’s how Irish governance took such a different path to British and Northern Irish governance, despite Dévalera, the bishops, and everything else.

No London housing bought by the tax payer and profits going to the MP on sale, that’s public money and goes back to the treasury.

After the expenses scandal put a stop to flipping homes, the latest wheeze is that MPs buy a London house, promptly rent it out privately and then they rent a house nearby – because rent counts as an expense that you can claim back. So they’re living in a rented house (paid for by the taxpayer) but also receiving thousands in rent per month on their own property.

No second jobs – if being an MP is as demanding as they constantly claim, you don’t have the time to be doing second/third jobs, appearing on reality TV or having your own “news show” on a far-right TV channel.

An end to expenses. No other job permits the sort of expenses free-for-all that MPs have. I’d create a nice “MPs hotel” near Westminster and when they’re on parliamentary business, they have to stay there. There’d always be a room, it’d be private and secure but they can have a home in their constituency and free use of the “MPs hotel”. That’s it – no-one else is having rent paid, second homes done up etc at taxpayers expense.

Lords Reform – an end to the tradition of Prime Ministers stuffing it full of lackeys as soon as they leave office. Of course it’s worse in recent times cos we’ve had so many short-lived PMs who’ve still managed to rinse the system…

No lobbying. Being an MP is about representing your constituents and the interests of the country, not being a mouthpiece for Big Oil or any other corporate interest. Apart from anything else it’s a security risk.

And a simple way of disciplining and sacking MPs when they’re shit. Currently there’s a whole traditionalist thing of losing the whip for a bit, being told you’ve been a bit naughty and then coming straight back after a half-hearted apology. Again, no other job allows that sort of leeway.

That’s a start anyway.

As usual, most suggestions are left biased, which is one of the reasons nothing ever happens, like it or not, the UK has a large right wing population, the tories are their party of choice, so you need a strong opposition, no matter who the sitting government is.

Proportional Representation sounds great, but has just as many negatives as it has positives, for every green MP you’d get, you’ll get a Nigel Farage.

Remove any benefits from MPs sounds good, but you’re talking about wanting to find 650 people, with some having a lot of power, being paid not a huge amount for that, and you may drive out the normal candidates, leaving those with their own funds who see the pay as pocket money.

Personally, i’d like to see labour come in and do what they say in pushing power away from London, i’d also like to see a little more move to minimise the impacts of voting on departments in certain circumstances, where they have to make wholesale changes due to some populist vote, or the media vote of the day, make them go through more justification, again reducing the workload on MPs who can do more locally then, and have less worry about blind voting.

Change the rules on contributions to political parties:

None from foreign nationals, non-dom taxpeyers

Limit size of donations

Funds for elections paid from central funds and each party gets the same amount.

No seats in the Lord’s for just giving parties money (but we’ve reformed the lord’s up thread haven’t we?)

An actual written constitution that can’t be picked around for political goal scoring

the tories are their party of choice

People on the right should have a choice as well. Lots of people vote Tory only because FPTP only gives them one route to representation. Having 2 or 3 right of centre parties in parliament would be totally legitimate… the idea that everyone on the right wants a majority Tory government is rubbish… many just want to avoid a Labour government… and under FPTP that means voting Tory, even if you think the current Conservative government is corrupt and inept and can’t deliver for you or your family.

I want more voting on big things like whether we go to war with a country.

What you want more bellends invoking the “will of the people” you sure about that?

Also separate votes for your local mp and the Pime Minister.

So you could (theoretically) end up with a PM from a different party to the majority of the sitting MPs? We already have a largely symbolic head of state in Buckingham palace, why do we need another in the commons?

The Prime Minister should be able to pick the best MPs for the key roles from all parties, even independents. Not just from their own party.

They already can can’t they? They just pick their chums because that’s what anyone would do TBF.

If you have a key roll in government, as well as being an MP, you shouldn’t be able to have another job. As there is no way you can dedicate yourself to all three sufficiently IMO.

Agreed.

MPs and political parties should have to stick to their manifesto, not sure how this could be policed.

It can’t be, perhaps they should be independently scored/reported on delivery of their manifesto pledges in the run up to the next election(?) which is sort of the point of the press…

You should not be able to change the Prime Minister without a another election.

I respectfully disagree, you vote for your local MP, the party they represent wins enough seats they get to govern (or a coalition is formed), the governing party/coalition pick a PM from their own ranks, and if necessary change that person during their term in power, it actually sort of works. As chaotic as the Tories have been during this last parliament, it would have been even worse had we been constantly holding GEs and had all MPs in campaign mode 70% of the time.

Politics should be taught on the national curriculum, including debating.

Either reduce voting age to 16 or change the law so that you’re not classed as an adult until you’re 18. If you’re old enough to work and pay tax, and be treated as an adult in the courts then you’re old enough to vote IMO.

Meh, I’m not sure politics is really a teachable ‘subject’ the rest of the curriculum however should equip kids to identify bullshit as they get older, between history, sociology, physics, mathematics and English all the basic tools are there. Individual judgement can’t really be forced into kids by teachers, maybe parents should accept their role in shaping individuals too?

My own gripe is the direct links between certain MPs and either paid roles/business interests and/or media (propaganda) organisations. The likes of JRM should be booted for blatant corruption and bias.

This is a very small thing, but if you’re an MP or local politician, no politics via social media.

They’re toxic pits of shithousery and an utter distraction from actual work and politics.

Some may not like that but the divisiveness of those platforms isn’t helping anything.

That would go those not currently in office a path to building support that sitting politicians would be barred from.

Require all MPs to cycle everywhere, or take public transport, even the prime minister.

Most definitely! No helicopters, no private planes, you have to travel on the same dysfunctional overcrowded, unreliable  rail network as everyone else

… and no private education for their kids or private medical care. They have to have their precious offspring educated in the worst performing state school in their constituency and they have to spend 24 hours waiting on a trolley in a corridor in an NHS A&E, just like anybody else

I reckon theyd soon have an interest in properly sorting out the NHS and the education and transport system, if they had no option but to actually use it!

People on the right should have a choice as well. Lots of people vote Tory only because FPTP only gives them one route to representation. Having 2 or 3 right of centre parties in parliament would be totally legitimate… the idea that everyone on the right wants a majority Tory government is rubbish… many just want to avoid a Labour government… and under FPTP that means voting Tory, even if you think the current Conservative government is corrupt and inept and can’t deliver for you or your family.

Flip side is you’re allowing the fringe lunatics to set up their own parties and gain some power, if they join to form a majority, you then get some complex manifestos due to this, not to say it can’t work, or doesn’t work elsewhere, but what we’ve seen in the UK over the last few years does provide a fair few worry beads!

FPTP again has issues, but lets not pretend PR is a silver bullet for this, it needs proper thought and roll out if it ever gets in, if i had a choice, i’d prefer more proportional power sharing across central and local governments.

The dream of PR is not always great in reality as while it can stop the sort of bullshit the tories get up to it can also stop any progression.  If you end up with 10 parties with 10% of the votes each then very little gets agreed and the few things that do are set in stone and nobody ever wants to change them even if they are clearly not working as getting an actual agreement on them in the first place was such a major achievement.

I would spilt the country in two with a left and a right so at least you can live in a sub country that you largely agree with the approach of, where money is spent, how people are looked after etc,. rather than for example me having to live in a **** awful tory country for most of my life.

UK has a large right wing population, the tories are their party of choice

That remains to be seen although currently it is true they are easier scared into banding behind the tories regardless of how varied their politics are.

Proportional Representation sounds great, but has just as many negatives as it has positives, for every green MP you’d get, you’ll get a Nigel Farage.

And? Whilst I have no time for him why shouldnt those who like that crap be able to vote for him rather than having to vote for the tories. I suspect though he wouldnt do so well after an election or two when he is held to account. He only did well under PR in Europe since he could just shout about the nasty EU and their fishing laws whilst not turning up to the fisheries committee. Its a harder trick to pull at a country level.

It can’t be, perhaps they should be independently scored/reported on delivery of their manifesto pledges in the run up to the next election(?) which is sort of the point of the press…

Yeah, there’d have to be press reform at the same time and that didn’t go down well at the last attempt (Levenson Inquiry).

I’d run a live factcheck on all MPs interviews and claims though. Scrolling text up the side so that when someone stands up in Parliament and claims they’re giving record funding to the NHS or that waiting lists are down, more police on the beat etc, it’d scroll up something to say “that’s total shit” with all the reasons why.
This would be prominently reported in the press the following day as well – there’d have to be a summary of what was said in PMQs, the answers given and the reasons why it was all bollocks.
Again – no other job permits that level of bullshit. If I stood up at work and gave a presentation to a room of colleagues based on wishlists, imaginations and what I wanted the truth to be, I’d be fired in minutes.

It’d shut that insane Susan Hall up too in all her wild fantasies of removing ULEZ on Day 1 – no, you can’t do that, there’s a process to go through. Problem is that many people don’t know that, they just hear the words coming out of her stupid mouth and think it’s fact, it’s achievable.

Move parliament into a purpose built building that works. It seems Westminster is expensive and not fit for purpose. Also move it around the country. So it sits in 6(?) major cities in a term, or 5 if one a year makes it easier.

Proportional Representation sounds great, but has just as many negatives as it has positives, for every green MP you’d get, you’ll get a Nigel Farage.

This is often cited as negative of PR but conversely it also puts the likes of farage firmly in the light, and as we know, daylight is the great disinfectant. And besides, the bending of UK politics in a ukip direction has taken place despite his likes not having a parliamentary seat. (Clacton aside). Keeping a system in place so as to prevent particular politicians entering parliament demonstrates the weakness of the system and the weakness of the mainstream parties to make their case in particular.

It’s also I think difficult to visualize the political landscape post a PR based general election when we are so used to our FPTP vision.

Personally I’d like to see both Tory and Labour leads significantly shrunken. A melting pot of all walks of life is what we need, if that means someone ends up with a right wing dingbat as an MP it should be a wake up call for better people to work out what went wrong and how to correct it. Unfortunately that’s exactly what hasn’t happened in Sheffield and the council have basically ignored the only conservative seat which has helped the “they only care about their own” narrative and strengthened the Tory vote.

PR could let someone like Farage in but I’d prefer him elected as MP for some backwater under some ineffective party than as an even more vile conservative party which is growing more and more likely by the day.

The Lords needs an overhaul but let’s not forget they’ve put a halt on quite a bit of the current government’s mess, we’ve already seen an group of elected MPs ride roughshod over a lot of stuff, thinking an elected lords would be somehow a massive left wing coup.

I’d run a live factcheck on all MPs interviews and claims though. Scrolling text up the side so that when someone stands up in Parliament

I am also tempted by having mps have to wear a top listing their current sponsors so we know when they are speaking out on behalf of the gambling company or whomever they have just accepted cash from them.

What’s the political equivalent of zip ties and an old bit of tyre?

Flip side is you’re allowing the fringe lunatics to set up their own parties and gain some power

Psst… fringe lunatics are in power right now… helped by people who don’t want a left of centre government in power so voted for these people while holding their noses… it was the only option they had given the voting system.

“The scottish system works”

I will vote against any party that proposes the Scottish system. I want people to be able to vote for each candidate, rather than have unelected party loyalists appointed by government.

That wall for when the revolution comes ?.

Could at least make a start by picking the wall.