How do they do it? Benefits/Life of Riley Content.

I don’t work.

I do alright 😀

Do you think its fair that good, honest workers fund work shy, lazy bastards* that play the state taxation system aka some of my/your wages to fund their lifestyles?

IIRC you have to be in the top 40% of household income to break even. Anyone who is “hard working” but whose income is under £40k is a net taker.

I could gloat and say that I earn plenty more than that. Or I could suggest that a fair welfare state is a jolly good idea and that the amount of benefits fraud (which is what the OP has implied) is tiny (and disprortionately reported on.

Or, in others words: check you’re not in a glass house before throwing any stones….

edenvalleyboy – Member
Kryton57 » ]Do you think its fair that good, honest workers fund work shy, lazy bastards* that play the state taxation system aka some of my/your wages to fund their lifestyles?

This argument is illogical, factually incorrect, hypocritical, unempathetic and ultimately oppressive…

Is it? Care to explain?

illogical, factually incorrect

Its logical that there are good workers, and workshy people, both are factually correct.

hypocritical

Nope, I’m neither workshy nor claiming anything from the state

unempathetic

To people playing the taxation system to gain free/more more at the expense of the honest workers contribution? Ok yes I hold my hands up to that one.

ultimately oppressive

You may have to explain that to me, but although I promote the oppression of cheats, I don’t believe I’d ultimate achieve it by posting on STW,

Kryton57 » ]Do you think its fair that good, honest workers fund work shy, lazy bastards* that play the state taxation system aka some of my/your wages to fund their lifestyles?

If I ever become a good honest worker I’ll pop back and voice my opinion 😉

if we can afford to pay for the royal family we can damn well afford to give some poor people a few quid extra.

If I ever become a good honest worker I’ll pop back and voice my opinion

but but but – anyone with a job is good and honest and hardworking. Anyone on benefits is lazy and feckless and morally deficient. It’s a simple binary, just grab a pitchfork and stop confusing the issue!

@Kryton57 – my mistake – I should have disclaimed you – I was meaning the base of the argument I.e. what was written is general rhetoric from the media…its hypocritical because all sections of society sponge from the state, factually incorrect because the argument claims many people are living the high life when they are not (numerous stats out there to disprove the benfit fraud argument), illogical e.g. we know jobs are scarce but we bash people for not working, maybe they can’t work etc…if I was to assume anything I’d guess OP’s comments all based upon how the family ‘look’ and then OP made the assumption they are scrounging…that’s the oppressive part…

My wife has taught dozens of kids over the years who are destined to be the third generation of their families who’ve never worked

johnners – Member
Dozens encountered by one teacher? I guess your wife could be in at the start of a new cultural phenomenom but that whole worklessness passed down generations myth has been debunked so it seems a bit unlikely.

Or maybe she’s just spent the last 16 years teaching in tough comprehensive schools in fairly challenging areas (like New Addington/Erith/Ramsden/etc) with a high percentage of traveller families (who in essence don’t work) and high percentage of families trapped in a cycle of poverty/illness/work refusal.
It is hardly surprising that some kids aren’t too fussed about exams when they’ve got more pressing issues to deal with at home – like cooking dinner for their younger siblings due to their parents being either absent or wasted.

Or maybe she’s just spent the last 16 years teaching in tough comprehensive schools in fairly challenging areas (like New Addington/Erith/Ramsden/etc) with a high percentage of traveller families (who in essence don’t work) and high percentage of families trapped in a cycle of poverty/illness/work refusal.

Well, maybe so. I can accept the odd isolated instance exists and I’d be interested to see any evidence for the problem being endemic in whole communities as you seem to be suggesting, but I’ve seen no such evidence. For now I’m going to pass on the teacher anecdote in favour of the report I originally linked to.

My wife has taught dozens of kids over the years who are destined to be the third generation of their families who’ve never worked

How would she know what the parents and grandparents do ? How can she predict the future ?
Three generations remains a myth and two generations is only 0.1% of all households or 26,000 – your wife seems to have got very unlucky or be very judgmental,

How big is the problem of families on benefits where generations have never worked?

Patterns of work in working-age households
Observer graphics
The Joseph Rowntree Foundation published a study in December testing whether there were three generations of the same family that had never worked.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2013/apr/06/welfare-britain-facts-myths

The falsehoods that folk swallow and repeat on benefits is staggering. That some have degrees is shocking

the rest of your post was basically borderline racist as well as being a factually accurate as the first part.

with a high percentage of traveller families (who in essence don’t work)

What?
Travellers do work. They may not declare all their income to the taxman but they do work.

On the subject of tax avoidance

The Moneysupermarket.com co-founder, Simon Nixon, is set to become a billionaire on the back of a share sale worth up to £115m, but will avoid paying capital gains tax because he lives in Jersey.

http://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/dec/01/share-sale-to-make-moneysupermarket-co-founder-a-billionaire

We subsidise the rich far more than the poor, through taxation.

This is true, I’m finding out for myself over the past couple of years as a ltd company owner/director. Not a big ‘rich’ company, it’s just me on my own doing manual work.
I’m doing okay though, and my tax bill is ridiculously small really for what I earn. If I paid profit at the end of the year into my pension my tax bill could be next to nothing.
No fancy accounting required, it’s just how it is. Good for me personally, a bit crap overall though.

Mystery solved. Their previous car was recalled and they did a phenomenal job of negotiating to get this thing. Good work by them.

Oh FFS, what a massive anti-climax.

So if you checked how they got the new car in the first place, this thread wouldn’t have happend and i would’t have wasted my money on buying a pitchfork 🙁

No pudding for you Grrrrr

The Moneysupermarket.com co-founder, Simon Nixon, is set to become a billionaire on the back of a share sale worth up to £115m, but will avoid paying capital gains tax because he lives in Jersey.

Donald Trump will also avoid UK capital gains tax as he lives in the USA. Warren Buffett, Mark Zuckerberg and a whole heap of other people who do not live here will not pay uk tax?

As a 25 year taxpayer, those people to whom you refer are being funded by people like me and presumably you. Taxes increase (in part) to fund them.

Do a cursory bit of research into what people on benefits can actually receive. There’s a per household limit. If you’re disabled, you’re subject to frequent assessments, regardless of whether your condition is chronic.

Don’t believe everything you read in the Murdoch press or Daily Heil.

Also, I’m a forty one year old taxpayer. I’ve been doing it a long time and I’m far angrier at subsidizing the likes of big business and the wealthy who can simply choose to make tax liabilities disappear, while at the same time the seem to whinge incessantly at having to pay tax in the first place.

Did you know that, in additon to the vast amounts of tax avoidance…

Taxpayers are handing businesses £93bn a year – a transfer of more than £3,500 from each household in the UK.

PJM1974 – Member
As a 25 year taxpayer, those people to whom you refer are being funded by people like me and presumably you. Taxes increase (in part) to fund them.
Do a cursory bit of research into what people on benefits can actually receive. There’s a per household limit. If you’re disabled, you’re subject to frequent assessments, regardless of whether your condition is chronic.

Don’t believe everything you read in the Murdoch press or Daily Heil.

Also, I’m a forty one year old taxpayer. I’ve been doing it a long time and I’m far angrier at subsidizing the likes of big business and the wealthy who can simply choose to make tax liabilities disappear, while at the same time the seem to whinge incessantly at having to pay tax in the first place.

Thats all very well, but please be clear when you quote me – words 6-11 refers to the OP’s description, not of the general populous whom may be recieving benefits. You know as well as I do that my text is aimed at benefits cheats, not benefit recipients per se.

Donald Trump will also avoid UK capital gains tax as he lives in the USA. Warren Buffett, Mark Zuckerberg and a whole heap of other people who do not live here will not pay uk tax?

Only because we chose to let them. We could easily legislate that all profits / earnings from the UK had to pay tax in the UK, which would be the sensible thing to do.

The US taxes overseas income, which is why so many US corps have billions stuck in offshore subsidiaries…

After all we’re subsidising their profits through infrastructure, tax credits etc ……