Wiggle wiggle wiggle 😆

Where?

5 miles was still too far for us, which is the point I was making Too far to walk, have a pint and walk back in an hour

Bull Inn, Libanus, its open on a Sunday. Opposite direction to the way you want to go, but there is no need to walk back to Story Arms, another bus stop is 20 yards away. Its on the same route.

I understand 5 miles is a long way when you’re shagged out and just missed a bus. I was merely seeking to redress the exaggeration. I’d have gone for another short stroll while waiting if my legs could have stood it, or thumbed a lift, or got my book out.

Thinking about it, there was a Sunday train service in the mornings, not in the afternoon I think. Anyway it’s not convenient which is what I was thinking.

I don’t want to bang the drum too much, but the last train out is half 9 on a Sunday.

Everyone recognises it takes planning and is a PITA compared to driving, nor is it foolproof. Just don’t try and make out that it is impossible.

I’m not – this is in reference to a trip I actually DID so I can hardly make out that it is impossible 🙂

Just acting as a grounding influence to TJ’s evangelism that’s all.

Btw re trains this was 15 years ago and I am fairly sure there were not enough trains on a Sunday.

Fair enough – you’re probably right about the train/bus. The valleys were like something from the Cretaceous period just 15 years ago.

I like TJ’s style, but I’m also a realist. I’ve ended up not doing stuff becuase it is a major hassle minus motor conveyance, or like an Audax I did a few weeks ago, finding the last train from Exeter to Bristol had left at 20:45 was a PITA … mostly me not being well organised enough though.

One of the many nuances you miss molgrips is these things are only a nusience if you let it be one.

Another is I just go an hire a car if there is no other reasonable way to do what I chose to do

Fair enough – you’re probably right about the train/bus. The valleys were like something from the Cretaceous period just 15 years ago

Closer to the truth would be that they were like something from before 1963… 🙂

One of the many nuances you miss molgrips is these things are only a nusience if you let it be one

You’re assuming I’ve missed that. As I keep saying I did this a lot and it DID NOT bother me save for the fact that a) there was not enough time in the day unfortunately to do some of these things and b) the service in Wales at least is just not good enough to allow you do to a lot of stuff.

Me and a mate tried to do the Gap from Merthyr travelling by train. We had to cut short because we needed to get the last train. I was happy to have been out on the bike, but it was a shame not to complete the route.

For the record I still like public transport. As in, I actually enjoy train journeys. Bus less so though.

Then it clearly did bother you and still does. Yes sometimes you have to make compromises – so what. If it didn’t bother you you wouldn’t say

…but it was a shame not to….

Its about being content with what is. Not hanker for what might have been

Its about being content with what is. Not hanker for what might have been

On a wider philosophical level, that implies a lack of ambition doesn’t it?

No. It implies contentment. Acceptance. Understanding of the now. That sometimes things “just are”

Hmm.

I fully understand the acceptance of things, but there is a dichotomy here because I also like to explore new places. The fact that I AM here at work I accept, but I am not happy about it. I would rather be out exploring some new riding area.

You must accept that having a car give you far greater flexibility to do this. Whether you own it or hire it is simply a matter of cost.

Edit – crossed posts. No there is no dichotomy. You can still explore new places and I do all the time. If I can’t make a sensible trip without doping so I simply hire a car

.I’ll give you an example of this.

Last year Julie and I wanted to go climb a Munro – using trains. We settled on Beinn a Ghlo. Now although there are plenty of trains so its possible to do the whole massif in a day from the train its a long walk – and we like to camp. So we got a train up in the afternoon, walked in and camped. Next day woke up out in the mountains. Leisurely breakfast and off to do the walk. Did a circuit of tops. Back to the camp site and decided we just had the time to catch a train home – so yomped back down to the train station and caught a train home. On the train back we relaxed, chatted and enjoyed a couple of beers.

Now we could have done this by car in a day. But it would have been a long day away from home, we couldn’t have had the relaxing beer on the way home. Instead we would have had a hundred mile drive when tired.

So its not – we couldn’t do it in a day, its the positive opportunity to enjoy a night wild camping and to enjoy a beer on the train on the way back – and still enjoy a grand day out on the hills.

So accept and take the positives. forget teh negatives.

I think that’s a good point, it’s not about replacing the car with something just has handy, it isn’t going to happen. It’s all about changing your lifestyle for the better.

molgrips – Member

Hmm.

I fully understand the acceptance of things,

No you don’t or you wouldn’t say and think

The fact that I AM here at work I accept, but I am not happy about it. I would rather be out exploring some new riding area.

The fact that I AM here at work I accept, but I am not happy about it.

Can I be first to point out that you’re in work (in part) to pay for your car?

😉

Toys – and making it work for you – so in the example above we were 30 hrs away from home not 18 – but we had a night wild camping and a relaxed train ride with beer rather than tired car journey

No you don’t or you wouldn’t say and think

The fact that I AM here at work I accept, but I am not happy about it. I would rather be out exploring some new riding area.

Hmm. I accept things where I cannot change them, but I strive to change that which I can.

Are you saying I should not want to be somewhere other than work?

RE the weekend above – sounds lovely, and you made it work with the limitations of train travel. Which do exist…

Can I be first to point out that you’re in work (in part) to pay for your car?

And a whole list of other things which I deem important enough to make this sacrifice for.

I could become a new age traveller but that also has disadvantages. However I’ve seriously considered it many times. I do have a plan though and I do not intend to be in work continuously until I’m 65 🙂

No – that you need to accept and be content with what you cannot change or the choices you have made. If that means being at work today then be content with and accepting of that.

Edit – no I did not “make it work within the limitations of train travel” These “limitations” become positives viewed with my attitude – so indeed were not limiting added to the experience when approached with contentment and acceptance

No – that you need to accept and be content with what you cannot change or the choices you have made. If that means being at work today then be content with and accepting of that

This is a better discussion than the train thing on which we both actually agree but still are somehow arguing about.

So I accept that today I have to be at work. Should I not strive to be in a position where I do not have to be? (rhetorical question there) If I do strive, does that mean I am accepting or rejecting the working life? (genuine question)

If you accept it then there is no need to strive to be elsewhere. want to be elsewhere? Make it happen

Yes but this is a philosophical question, not a request for advice.

Is it accepting or not? Accepting in the short term, as a means to an end…

And I answered. If you accept something ( in they way I mean) and are content within that you have no desire for anything different. If you desire something different that you have not fully accepted / embraced / become content with / at one with the situation you are in.

It’s funny how these terms are loaded isn’t it?

Saying someone is accepting of their situation has a positive feel to it. Saying they lack ambition has a negative feel.

You two really need to get on MSN….

Christ no. I’d be less restrained 🙂

And I would have to be restrained

we have 2 cars & one of them (mine) is due a rather expensive service & cambelt change in about 5000 miles – for me that’s about 3 months time.

I think I’ll move it on before then.

Mrs_d walks to work so I’ll have her car 😈

I did for years, ironically I only own a car because of mountain biking.

Like Emsz and BigDummy, I’ve never learned to drive. Simply no need to really, living where I do. Buses, Trains, Tube, DLR, Minicabs, Taxis. Everything I need is within a mile or two. Longest commute I’ve ever had was about 6 miles each way, with cycle or public transport options.

Interestingly, I cover more distance than most of the people I know here who drive. Not surprisingly, I’m also fitter than them (and sexier and more intelligent and fun). It’s amusing listening to their attempts at justifying car ownership. None of them really ‘need’ their cars. Some folk have ditched their cars and just hire one when needed. Saves an absolute fortune over owning a car. Insurance, VED, MOT, servicing, petrol, parking, etc. Some folk spend several grand a year owning a car, yet hardly ever travel outside London. Just stupid.

Would be handy to be able to drive, so’s I could hire a car or vayn to have weekends away a bit further afield I spose. But then as BigDummy sez; I’d then find ‘reasons’ to drive places….

I find myself increasingly finding ‘reasons’ not to drive to places… including (nay, especially) the supermarket. I go on my way home from work rather than going back out later

I had a car for 3 years. I worked out that it cost me roughly £7 per day to own, including depreciation, maintenance, and fuel, and of course that is regardless of whether it was getting used or not i.e. during the week, when it wasn’t used at all, it sucked £35 to just sit there.

I sold it to fund an MSc, and the only regret is not being able to just go ride places whenever I want to. I’d like a vehicle again, but not until I can really afford to run one sensibly.

GiantJaunt – Member
I’m seriously considering getting rid of my car once I’ve had it MOT’d this month. I live 1 mile from work and do the vast majority of my cycling from home. I can easily get a train into the city for shopping and nights out so I’m thinking the environmental and financial benefits will outweigh having to do without.

I had my licence medically revoked nearly two years ago due to epilepsey, so I didn’t have any say in loosing my car & driving. I live less than a mile from work, I can walk there in 20 minutes, plus my Mrs still has a car so we’re not completely isolated. We live close to local rail services and being classed as disabled means I am entitled to a concessionary travel pass – at least until the government pull them.

My main concern is that I won’t be able to organise cycling trips away and visiting friends and family so easily.

Agree that cycling trips have been sorely missed, a good mate has taken us off to Llandegla & Gisburn a couple of times but it feels like an imposition on him.

It could either be one of the best things I’ve ever done or a big regret. Someone said that if I want to get another car in the future I’ll have to pay loads for insurance but I don’t know about that.

My understanding is that a proof of no claims will stand for two years and then insurance is like starting from zero – maybe consider it for 12 months and then reconsider?

Has anyone else tried it and how did things turn out?

Not as bad as I thought when I first realised that ongoing seizures produce an indefinite rolling 12 month licence suspension – earliest I can get my licence back currently is mid March 2012, assuming I remain seizure free until then. I’m at a point where if I can avoid having to return to driving then I might try and carry on car less even if I do get my licence back.

Surely the answer is to use whatever transport is the most appropriate for the journey?

So today:

90 miles – Motorbike to work and back
1 mile – Cycle to the cashpoint
4 miles – Car dropping a mate off

Surely the answer is to use whatever transport is the most appropriate for the journey?

Yes. I think the problem for 99% of the population it is assumed that a car should be used for 100% of the journey 100% of the time. I can empathise though as outside select areas public transport can be very expensive as well as irregular, even more so if you already have a car and are just trying to reduce your usage of it by doing mixed mode journeys or public transport for some trip a car for others as your need require.

I personally love using the train to go ride new areas, but frequently drive because of the poor pricing structures. Went to go by train last month and it cost me more for the return journey than the outgoing!

A lot of car less people I know rely on other people having cars. There’s examples on this thread like borrowing a car for 4 weeks or getting lifts off friends and family. That’s not a criticism, just pondering about how many car less people becomes unsustainable. If you’re a group of 5 mates and 1 is without a car then it’s fairly easy to work around that without anyone feeling used, but what about if only 1 out of 5 has a car?

I dont have a car and never have had. My eyesight is pretty crap which put me off driving in my younger years and after that it became more of a decision not to want to drive. My wife has a car which she uses for work and we all use for trips out from time to time. I’m a sentimentalist I reckon, and I hate what our use of the motor car has done to us and our environment. There’s no getting around getting around (as someone who should be more famous than they are once said). Our entire society is geared up to car usage, if you don’t have one you aren’t welcome. Our streets used to be part of our homes, now it’s just somewhere we park. You want to look for the roots of the breakdown of community? Start there.

You can live a happy life without a car, I know cos I have. Just be prepared to wait longer, be more patient, more flexible and come last on the the list of local government priorities.

but what about if only 1 out of 5 has a car?

One of three things:

1) you become very popular
2) you become teetotal
3) you spend a lot of time at Ikea.

Btw, it’s not quite the same thing saying ‘well I don’t have a car’ then revealing your OH has one and you only live 10 mins walk from work. You don’t flippin well need two in that case!

Our streets used to be part of our homes, now it’s just somewhere we park. You want to look for the roots of the breakdown of community? Start there

Disagree. In America cars are an even bigger part of life than they are here. Every journey is a car journey more or less. But they still have close communities in small insular places, just the same as anywhere.

Disagree all you like. I’m not talking about the US.

In the majority of towns and cities the outside is where you park. Not talk to your neighbours or let your kids play. Park. That’s all.

ebygomm, the 4 week borrowing example was me. To be fair, I did give her some money towards the car, so it wasn’t just a blag 🙂 And as I said, I reckon it’s just me being a bit cautious due to this being our first baby. I wasn’t keen on getting the bus to hospital with the wife in labour, though she’s subsequently told me that’s what her mum did!

Perhaps the people you know are a bit selfish? I don’t think I’ve ever asked for a lift to go shopping or anything like that, though people have offered and once or twice I’ve accepted. Had people drop stuff off at mine a few times, but that’s about it. I don’t think I’ve imposed too much, and I never considered it an imposition driving to go biking when I used to do it. If 1 out of 5 has a car then it’d cost you less than a tenner for an extra car every weekend 😉 For biking we always used the company van and another car. Van hire isn’t that cheap, but it’d still only be about £25 each for a long weekend.

In the majority of towns and cities the outside is where you park. Not talk to your neighbours or let your kids play. Park. That’s all

That’s not been my experience in the UK either to be fair. Our street is full of cars but also full of playing kids. Kicking balls into the cars *ggrrrr!*

there is another option…. scooter
iv been car free for about 2 years ride 15 miles 4 times a week and the 5th day i use the moped as its a 12hr shift i have a 2yo and misses the public transport is superb and very close to evrything i need so but when i get up late or to tierd to ride the scooter is very handy
£15 a year tax(for 125 and under)
£120 a year ins
fuel i get 120miles from £5.50(thats a full tank) 😆
parts are cheep as chips and very basic enough for your avreg person to work on
ideal for shoping trips as i use my wrap over panniers when needed.

it costs thousands a year to run a car

How do you work that one out? Even after VED,MoT and insurance I bet it didn’t cost me a £1000 pound last year. I admit I don’t use my car a lot but saying it cost thousands?

Are you kidding fella! Ofcourse it costs thousands to run a car.
Quick run down from last year and I only did 3000 miles.

Insurance £525
Tax £245
Service £140-£300.

Bang that’s £1000 before it’s even been driven.
Then there are things that wear out like brakes and Tyres.
Discs and pads £600
Tyres £550

So as you can see I spent £2000 before even driving it.
Don’t get me started on fuel.