F1 2019 (spoilers obviously)

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  • F1 2019 (spoilers obviously)
  • stumpy01
    Member

    For people with catch-up issues, it might be worth looking into a freeview PVR like a HUMAX?

    You can get a re-furbished one from HumaxDirect for £90 or so.
    Or something new from Argos/John Lewis etc.

    When we got our new ‘smart’ TV, we debated getting rid of the Humax box. But, the reality is that we still use it loads. I record the F1 on it, so can watch it back whenever I want & can fast-forward the ads, which you can’t do on C4 catch-up.
    We also use it to set-up series record for things that we are likely to forget.
    You can set it to record 2 things at once as well & we also use it for recording films that we might want to watch at a later date.

    I could probably do the same by plugging a HDD directly into the TV, but there seems little point when the Humax keeps soldiering on.

    Premier Icon simondbarnes
    Subscriber

    For people with catch-up issues, it might be worth looking into a freeview PVR like a HUMAX?

    Not much use for Bez who hasn’t got an aerial

    shermer75
    Member

    Just caught up. What’s that, the third or even fourth exciting race in a row? Surely they’ll have none left for the rest of the season!!

    eddiebaby
    Member

    I’m enjoying it all, especially the way Mclaren are getting back into the race.

    shermer75
    Member

    I’m enjoying it all, especially the way Mclaren are getting back into the race

    Likewise, I think it’s been one of the best seasons in a long time

    mashr
    Member

    That was another good race. Not quite the drive that the excitement of the last page indicated but he certainly made the most of a cracking strategy call. Not quite up there with Schumachers French 4-stopper yet!

    Premier Icon simondbarnes
    Subscriber

    Not unexpected, they have form for it!

    stumpy01
    Member

    Ooof! That must be a de-moralising situation for Gasly, but you can see why they have done it. And now Albon has to prove that he can do the job better. No pressure, then….

    No bad for a driver who had given up on F1!

    I suppose one advantage for Albon is because he had given up on F1 he’s less likely to be hampered by the pressure. He knows there’s life outside F1 for him.

    Premier Icon njee20
    Subscriber

    Can’t say I’m hugely surprised. Great result for Albon.

    retro83
    Member

    Nice, just hoping the pressure doesn’t destroy him.

    Premier Icon tomhoward
    Subscriber

    No bad for a driver who had given up on F1!

    I suppose one advantage for Albon is because he had given up on F1 he’s less likely to be hampered by the pressure. He knows there’s life outside F1 for him.

    Didn’t work for Brendan Hartley. Though, I suspect talent may have been the bigger issue there.

    hols2
    Member

    Hartley, Gasly, and Kvyat (Vettel too) were strange because they all seem to be fast when they drive decent cars and are supported by their teams, but wilted under pressure when they were thrown in the deep end. Hartley won the WEC and Le Mans, but looked hopeless against Gasly, who was much more assertive (and seemed to have the support of the team). Now, Gasly looks hopeless against Verstappen (much more assertive and has the support of the team). Kvyat always looked fast, but just seemed to be trying too hard up against a very tough teammate. Vettel is obviously a very quick driver when the car suits him, but looked hopeless against Ricciardo when the car wasn’t to his liking. To me it just looks like Red Bull are wasting decent drivers by promoting them too soon and putting them under too much pressure. I don’t think Hartley would ever be championship material, but Gasly and Kvyat both looked quite decent at Torro Rosso before getting promoted to the senior team.

    shermer75
    Member

    Red Bull replace Gasly with Albon from Spa!…

    Whaaaaat!

    Red Bull career graveyard needs another headstone then. Punishing!

    escrs
    Member

    Albon to drive for Redbull till the end of the year and then Bottas will go to Redbull if Merc give Ocon his seat

    Albon will go back to Torro Rosso and Gasly will leave F1 unless a seat becomes a available elsewhere, Maybe at Hass if Gunther loses his rag with Magnussen or Grosjean and Gene Hass says fire one of them

    Or maybe someone else decides to exit F1 of their own accord

    That’s my prediction

    PJM1974
    Member

    Oof. We all saw it coming, but Hungary’s result off the back of the Hockenheim incident was the writing on the wall.

    I’m reminded of last year’s soap opera that was Hartley vs Gasly at Toro Rosso. Gasly has had his confidence ripped out from asunder – even having to default to Verstappen’s car settings and then being dropped. He’s going to have a shit time at TR, going head to head with another Red Bull demotive and them both fighting it out for the chance to be Verstappen’s replacement’s wingman for 2021, assuming that Max decides to throw in his lot with Ferrari et al.

    PJM1974
    Member

    …Grosjean is definitely out of Haas soon, surely? I like the guy hugely, but his bout of the Yips is never ending. He’s 33 and there’s no sign that he’s on the cusp of becoming the next Damon Hill.

    He’s bloody handy on a Whyte though.

    Tom B
    Member

    I’m fairly certain that Max will be staying at Red Bull for next season.

    PJM1974
    Member

    Am fairly certain that you’re right. The weakness in the package – the Honda engine – certainly has pace and enough durability to last a couple of races. The trajectory is ominous, the RB is clearly a quick car and Honda appear to have got their act together.

    hols2
    Member

    I think there’s zero chance of Bottas going to Red Bull, or of Verstappen leaving the team. The point of Red Bull having a driver development program is that they have a stable full of drivers ready to step up to the senior team. If they promote from outside that, there’s no point in spending money developing young drivers. My guess is that they want to compare Gasly, Albon, and Kvyat before deciding on next year’s partner for Verstappen. Next year they will be hopeful of challenging for the constructor’s title if they can find a solid partner for Verstappen. Kvyat has already shown he has the speed to be useful at the senior team, he just lacked the maturity to not crash on the opening lap. Now they can see how Ocon handles the pressure and also see if Gasly can sort out his problems. That gives them three drivers to choose from next year.

    My money would be on Hulkenberg going to Haas and Ocon to Renault for a year before replacing Bottas at Merc. Bottas is a safe bet to score points for the constructor’s championship. Ocon is probably a better long-term bet, but Merc won’ want him to end up like Kvyat or Gasly if he gets promoted too soon.

    jamesy01
    Member

    The point of Red Bull having a driver development program is that they have a stable full of drivers ready to step up to the senior team

    This might be true but iirc Verstappen was never in the junior program. He won 6 f3 races on the trot and was snapped up!
    For what it’s worth they should have never let Saintz go, he is maturing into a handy driver.

    hols2
    Member

    Yes, but Verstappen had to work his way up through Torro Rosso as a rookie. Hiring an experienced outside driver for the senior team would mean that there’s no point in running TR as a driver development team.

    IIRC, they initially loaned Sainz to Renault because they didn’t have a seat for him at the senior team, they thought they could get him back if they needed him. Ricciardo’s move was a massive shock, so losing Sainz didn’t seem like such a problem then. Sainz always looked like a very good driver, but Verstappen looked like a potential champion, so Red Bull promoted the one they thought was better. The only way they could have kept Sainz was to promote him and demote Ricciardo back to Torro Rosso, which would have been silly.

    Premier Icon Bez
    Subscriber

    My money would be on Hulkenberg going to Haas and Ocon to Renault for a year before replacing Bottas at Merc.

    Yeah, that’d probably be my bet too.

    shermer75
    Member

    For what it’s worth they should have never let Saintz go, he is maturing into a handy driver.

    It would be interesting to see if they can get him back

    shermer75
    Member

    He was contracted for another year until the end of 2020 by McLaren after Silverstone. Smart move McLaren!

    escrs
    Member

    The point of Red Bull having a driver development program is that they have a stable full of drivers ready to step up to the senior team

    How has that been working for them? they have had 4 different drivers at Toro Rosso in 3 years and 2 of those have been promoted to Redbull only to be dropped back down and then dropped completely for a year (kvyat) or dropped from the program permanently in the case of Hartley, then Sainz went to Renault

    What’s the point of running a development team if its not delivering the drivers you need?

    Bringing Bottas for a year or two would take the pressure off the Toro Rosso drivers trying to perform at Redbull too early and allow them to spend more time at Toro Rosso developing for a couple of years before stepping up to Redbull

    shermer75
    Member

    How has that been working for them? 

    Four back to back drivers’ and constructors’ championships and Verstappen?

    escrs
    Member

    That was back in 2013, 6 years without a championship win and coming 3rd in the constructors championship every year since (some of which is engine related) and never really been a challenge to Merc of Ferrari till this year

    They seem to be stuck in a rut of promoting drivers too early, then when they don’t perform demoting them back down and it just isn’t working (Verstappen being the exception to the rule)

    Verstappen spent 1.5 years at TR before being promoted to RB
    Kvyat spent one year at TR before being promoted to RB for a 1.5 years then being demoted and finally left F1 for a bit
    Hartley spent 1 year at TR before leaving F1
    Gasly spent 1 year at TR before being promoted to RB only to be demoted back down after 6 months

    Unless TR have the next Max Verstappen in the wings then they would be better off letting their drivers spend a few years at TR before promoting them to RB, bringing in Bottas or another proven driver to RB for a couple of years would allow all the TR drivers to hone their F1 skills before being promoted up to RB

    All in my opinion obviously but RB need a stronger 2nd driver and TR aren’t supplying that

    Premier Icon nickc
    Subscriber

    Ricciardo’s move was a massive shock

    was it really? I can’t imagine for a minute that when Ricciardo let them know he was off to Renault there was much surprise at all…I’m a casual F1 watcher, and by mid season even I knew he was going.

    hols2
    Member

    Doctor Helmut is a total prick and his ideas about motivating drivers are terrible, but they have produced some outstanding drivers. Vettel (4x champion) is now lead driver at Ferrari. Ricciardo (multiple race winner and highly rated throughout the paddock) is now lead driver at Renault. Sainz is now lead driver at McLaren and has had an impressive season. Plus Verstappen is now looking like the next Big Thing. So Red Bull have actually produced a lot of good drivers, they just messed up by losing Ricciardo and Sainz at the same time. Last year they had three top-level drivers and only two top-level seats available.

    As far as results from the last six years go, the Renault engine was woeful. That Red Bull actually managed to win some races and beat Ferrari and the customer Mercedes teams shows how good their car and drivers have been.

    hols2
    Member

    Ricciardo’s move was a massive shock

    was it really?

    Yes, everybody expected that re-signing with Red Bull was really a formality. Going to Merc or Ferrari would have made sense if a seat was available, but Renault was a huge shock. Merc had already arranged for Ocon to driver there, so that put him on the sidelines, leading to some nasty comments from Toto Wolff about broken promises.

    PJM1974
    Member

    Yes, Ricciardo’s move to Renault was a shock for everyone, especially Red Bull who had to promote Gasly way too soon and to recall Kvyat to Toro Rosso.

    When he joined Toro Rosso, Gasly had a certain cockiness about him that will have been comprehensively undone over the last six months. The rug has been comprehensively pulled form under him, his preferred car setup choice has been overruled and he will have been humiliated by the team’s finding that nothing was amiss with his stripped down Red Bull. He will have been made to look an idiot in front of his engineers and any insinuation that he and Verstappen are racing with unequal machinery will not be looked kindly upon, even if there’s some substance to it. Over the last couple of races, Gasly been ordered to use Verstappen’s setup, which will have been indicative of the team’s confidence in his ability to communicate effectively with his engineers.

    Gasly now has nine races in the Toro Rosso to prove his mettle, he knows that a return to Red Bull for 2020 is off the table no matter how well he performs. Renault is a potential lifeline, there’s a suggestion that the team are looking for a French driver in their lineup but the odds are slim when you consider that not only is Gasly up against Hulkenberg, but also either Ocon or Bottas for that seat. The only other potential seats in the frame are Williams and Haas, neither of which are particularly appealing.

    Premier Icon Bez
    Subscriber

    I reckon the Haas seat has potential. Yes, the team seems to be a bizarre clusterfuzz of comedy pit stops, dodgy sponsors and an inability to know what makes the car perform, but on the random days when it’s on song they do have a car which can make a good driver stand out. Providing it doesn’t get taken out by the other car, obviously.

    PJM1974
    Member

    It’s clear that Haas – like Williams this year and McLaren last year – do not fully understand their car. I don’t know whether this is due to insufficient wind tunnel data or other factors affecting the balance of the car, certainly their recent decision to revert to start of the season spec is drastic, I can’t think of any other team doing this in recent history.

    Do they ride out the rest of 2019 dealing with the collateral damage and divert their efforts to 2020 or do they try to turn the performance around over the next nine races, potentially compromising the development cycle of next year’s car?

    Premier Icon Bez
    Subscriber

    I guess Haas are in a slightly unusual position in that, because they buy in so much of the car, they presumably have to be quite reactive to each year’s set of components, rather than proactive in developing them. So you have to wonder how much they can develop ahead of season compared to the other teams, especially the works teams or sole PU customers, ie Red Bull.

    shermer75
    Member

    I guess Haas are in a slightly unusual position in that, because they buy in so much of the car, they presumably have to be quite reactive to each year’s set of components, rather than proactive in developing them.

    I like Gunter Steiner but it would be satisfying if their business model holds them back!

    eddiebaby
    Member

    2021 car model in the windtunnel:

    https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.first-look-formula-1s-2021-car-in-the-wind-tunnel.6ye3S7Pb8NRX1K7PjTBxtS.html

    If those numbers about effect on following cars are right then it could be just the ticket.
    That is a very big IF though.

    oomidamon
    Member

    Looks like Ocon is definitely going to Renault, so I’d assume Hulkenburg will end up at Haas. The relationship between Hulk and K-Mag will be ‘interesting’…

    Premier Icon Rick Draper
    Subscriber

    So Bottas is now confirmed at Merc for 2020.

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