Couch to 5k

Stupidly entered a half marathon next April for charity and as it’s my 50th and thought it would be a challenge.

Downloaded the NHS Coach to 5k app which seems really well thought out, and did first run/ walk last night, its good in that you can have music playing and gives audio cues over the top.

With the NHS one, it has you taking 9 weeks to get to 5K.

Looked at other plans, including a few on the internet, taking you to 5k, then to 10k, then to half marathon, over 3 months, so only taking 4 weeks to get to 5km distance.

I am not a natural runner at all and whilst I don’t struggle with the cardio element, i feel like i run very flat footed.

Am I best taking it a slow as possible and maybe aiming for doing a Park Run or similar around xmas time as per the  NHS plan or pushing on a bit harder if i feel i can?

Very conscious of trying not to overdo it was also cycling and weight training.

The problem with running when you get older is injuring yourself.  You feel good, are making progress so you push it a little then bam! An injury which stops you training and you’re back to square one. And repeat.  I know this, as I’ve been in that cycle for years. I’m currently on an uninterrupted 5 month spell and have to force myself to ease off and slow down, every time I go out.  Don’t rush it, you will end up torpedoing your chances. Slow and steady, very gradual increases in distance. Warm up properly and stretch afterwards. Good luck!

Thanks for that.. i have avoided running since i left the army due to dislocating knee, but I have done a lot of strength work and i am a singlespeeder, so my hope is that my knee will hold up to the abuse i’ve already given it the last few years.

But will heed your warning and take it slowly as being injured would be a pain.

Physotherapist and former national runner cousin told me to repeat weeks around 4 or 5 of C25K as the duration goes up a lot and she sees a lot of injuries from around there.

I am not a natural runner at all and whilst I don’t struggle with the cardio element, i feel like i run very flat footed.

I was the same.

The NHS app timeline is obviously on the cautious side, and I certainly accelerated the schedule a little – but I wouldn’t go too nuts too soon.

I only got an injury when I later started running about 15km, my legs just aren’t built for it (flat feet and bow legs).

I’m a veteran of breaking myself trying to do C25K, usually weeks 7-8. I’ve just finished Week 6 on my latest attempt, so getting nervous. My aim is also a Parkrun before Christmas.

I’d always err on the side of caution – I can ride 50 miles comfortably but running has never been my thing, I just want a more time efficient  and convenient way to exercise.

The right shoes have been a big factor – worth spending more at a proper running shop (can recommend Derby Runner)

There’s a lot of running clubs around who will be running marathon training plans in the new year. If you can get to 5k/Parkrun by Christmas, they’ll be able to get you to a marathon in April.

Agree that stretching/recovery is vital – didn’t stretch after Tuesdays run (25 minutes) as I was rushing in my lunch break, and my knee is expressing some displeasure still.

Echo the above. When I started running I was reasonably fit from bikes. Within a couple of months I had agonising pain in the outside of my knee.
Went to a physio, and he pretty quickly diagnosed ‘Runner’s knee’. Said it was incredibly common when people who were ‘cardio fit’ from other activities – they have the fitness but the muscle structure to support the movement wasn’t there yet. Basically told me to slow down, go back to the start, and work up slowly, and stop as soon as the pain happened. It was frustrating, but it worked.
Just take it easy.

Yeah, I feel you can’t take it slow enough!

I took about 10 weeks to build up to a 10km trail run, basically started at 2 x 2km runs a week and built from there.

Even then I developed (manageable) tendon issues in my calf by transitioning to hills too abruptly, although there might have been an element of poor form/hamstring weakness contributing to that.

Enjoy though, at least you have a good long window to work with ?

I have done a lot of strength work and i am a singlespeeder, so my hope is that my knee will hold up to the abuse i’ve already given it the last few years.

This is good. Other than being cautious when increasing running load, it is the single best thing you can do to prevent injury imo. Bizarrely, what has allowed me to get back into running is snapping my cruciate ligament 2 years ago! Not a running injury.  I had the op to reconstruct it, but made rehab a full time job. I got the gym habit and have kept it up, I do a lot of leg, lower body and core stuff to prevent injury running and on the bike. When you get older (I’m 60), if you want to stay active it’s absolutely essential imo.

I’ve been doing a few exercises from the Run Better with Ash channel on YouTube. These made a huge difference to my stability and strength, helping avoid injury as I stepped up the distance. There are pre-run routines, post-run stretches and various strength options.

If you are looking for a progressive training plan then you could have a look at the JogScotland one. Our running club uses this at the Beginner through to Intermediate 2 levels and we’ve seen a few folk building up to half marathons as a result.

https://jogscotland.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/jogscotland-jogging-programmes.pdf

If you haven’t done much running yourr knees, ankles and feet might not be used to the different loading they will experience. There’s  a lot more bounce/impact and sideways forces than cycling, so probably worth taking a look at some of the return to running prehabilitation vids on insta and YT. Calf raises,hops, rdls, etc etc will all work to build up knee/lower limb tolerance alongside the running.

Running_fitness_dude and galephysio are two worth looking up on insta

Edit: like blokeupthethread, I too had an ACLR, and am 59½

Physotherapist and former national runner cousin told me to repeat weeks around 4 or 5 of C25K as the duration goes up a lot and she sees a lot of injuries from around there.

Similar from my physio, though my injury was an inguinal hernia, so I had to take a lot of time out and then started again last Feb, but when I started up again that was his advice. I’d completely agree, from my own experience, about repeating certain weeks as the running time increases, the app suggests this, and definitely helped me. The other key thing for me was getting a decent pair of running shoes. Having said that, we are all unique, so the best bet is to not rush things and listen to your body.

I’m 90% through the Zwift “Cyclist to 10km” plan. It is pretty cautious both in terms of distance and speed. Running on the treadmill is nowhere near as interesting as running outside, but having injured myself too many times as per other posters above, I’m going to disciplined until I am sure my body is ready for outside running

I think it was @scotroutes on the 100 days thread that suggested running with ash (as he has above) on YT and I’ve found that channel excellent for both pre and post run. I do both every time as I’m sure it was the lack of stretching / strength focus that caused the issues when I’ve tried to build up some kind of running fitness before.

I did C2-5K years ago when I finally got off my arse and got fit ? I thought it was a great programme. That said, I don’t run now (although I’d like to tick a marathon off the bucket list at some stage, just because!) I think unless (and possibly even if) you’re focussed on technique and quite diligent about stretching/flexibility etc you’re quite likely to end up with long-term niggles/injuries! Plus cycling is way more fun ? I’ve ended up cycling through half marathon routes a couple of times, including last weekend, and everyone’s face is just set like grim death, no-one is smiling or enjoying it, the complete opposite of cycling! Not my idea of fun!!

Running on the treadmill is nowhere near as interesting as running outside, but having injured myself too many times as per other posters above, I’m going to disciplined until I am sure my body is ready for outside running

That is the approach I’ve taken this time – I can control the speed and impact rather than running outdoors so this will hopefully allow me to get the fitness and some resilience.

We have a pan flat Parkrun nearby at Long Eaton (assuming it’s not flooded in the winter) so if I can do a couple there and then maybe look at the more local trails run version.

@zilog6128 most Halfs and Marathons are much like Sportives. There are always a very really serious/earnest folk at the pointy end, there’s a few really struggling but determined folk at the tail, but the majority are having a good time, be that for the social aspect, the personal challenge or the surroundings (or any combination of those). For me though, I just get a lot of joy in trail running, often through countryside and terrain where a bike would be a pain. After having taken a bike through the mountain pass of the Lairig Ghru a few years ago, it was much better doing so whilst running a couple of months back.

@scud what charity? If you put a Just Giving or similar link on here, I’m sure a few will chip in.  Having a few people sponsor you keeps you honest and accountable. It’s a great motivator to train properly!

Lairig Ghru

I’m both pleased you did that, and annoyed I didn’t ?

As a long time runner my advice would be to build very slowly and regardless of schedule if you feel a bit too tired or that you havent recovered sufficiently from the previous effort then rest. Dont be tempted to try to make up the session you have missed, just pause then pick up where you left off.

Weights and strength training are very important as you get older (I am 60 and do a couple or 3 dumbbell sessions a week as well as running 6 days (circa 40 mpw)) so you should find time for these.

Try to eat and drink after runs and although I have never taken supplements (besides a multi vit) I now take some protein each day.

I wouldn’t spend much time stretching, unless you enjoy it. Do warm up gently and warn down for a couple of mins after each run.

Coming back from a herniated disc, my physio suggested that the couch-to-5k plan ramped up too quickly.  Instead, his advice was start with 30 minute sessions of 6 blocks.  In week 1 you walk 4:30 and run 0:30 per block.  Each week you increase the run by 30 secs and decrease the walk by 30 secs.  After 10 weeks you’re at half hour running, which even at my pedestrian pace is more than 5k.  I found the progression very easy (easier than the middle bit of the couch-to-5k plan I’ve done in the past).  After a couple of weeks at 5k I started to increase distance on one run per week or so, generally adding about 1k each time.

@scud what charity?

https://diabetesresearchwellnessfoundation.enthuse.com/pf/paul-whitlock

I have only just set it up, it is for the Diabetes Research and Wellness Foundation, my daughter, Freya, has been Type 1 diabetic since 4 tears of age.

Many thanks, and sponsorship would be much appreciated and all the advice has been great thank you.

Thank you very much @blokeuptheroad very kind of you

If you have a Garmin ( don’t know if it’s all watches though) then the app has Garmin Coach Plans.  Set you objectives fitness levels, training days etc and pick a coach and it sets out a programme for you with short/long runs and other exercises  like speed repeats etc. The runs are loaded on to your watch and track against you on the run (pace etc), it’s particular useful for speed repeats. You also get videos of the coach giving tips.

Worth checking it’s available with all watches – but it was with my old fairly low spec forerunner

I used it to get up to half marathon back in COVID days.

Just checked – they do cycling programmes as well now

If you have a Garmin ( don’t know if it’s all watches though) then the app has Garmin Coach Plans

Unfortunately having loved my Wahoo bike computer and turbo trainer, i bought their watch…. its pants.. have been looking at Garmin watches though as i’d like one i can store music on for gym.

Instead, his advice was start with 30 minute sessions of 6 blocks.  In week 1 you walk 4:30 and run 0:30 per block.  Each week you increase the run by 30 secs and decrease the walk by 30 secs.  After 10 weeks you’re at half hour running, which even at my pedestrian pace is more than 5k.

Ooo, I like that!  Thanks for sharing. 🙂

As a non-runner but husband of a very experienced, (very) long distance runner, the advice above about taking it slow is really good. It’s not necessarily about building strength or fitness, it’s about building adaptation, as running places very different loads on the body.

If you can, run off-road as much as possible, it’s both far more forgiving (as the surfaces tend to be softer) yet also better for building ankle adaptation (as the surfaces tend to be softer and uneven, so your ankles have to do a bit more and your brain has to adapt to controlling your ankle more). And stretch after every run.

As an aside if you can run 10k then you can run a half marathon, so April seems completely achievable. I started running during COVID. As others said the cardio part was easy, but took a while to get the muscles sorted.

Anyhow one day I ran 10k, figured I felt pretty good so ran a half marathon distance. Fairly flat as it was along old canals and railway lines.

Only issue I had was probably lack of food and water as it was a bit ad-hoc and my feet really ached for the last few miles. No blisters, just aching feet from the pounding. Took just over 2 hours.

Only just started running as I’ve been off for ages due to planta faciitus. So yeah injury is very frustrating.

If you can, run off-road as much as possible, it’s both far more forgiving (as the surfaces tend to be softer)

I have been aiming for that, we have a local bridleway that starts about 5-6 minutes walk away, so been walking briskly to start of that before starting any running.

Does technique get better as you adapt, as per my OP i do feel like i am very flat footed and “Stomp”, whereas i watch actual runners and they seem to be light on their feet!?

Does technique get better as you adapt, as per my OP i do feel like i am very flat footed and “Stomp”, whereas i watch actual runners and they seem to be light on their feet!?

Probably, but technique is a very, very personal thing. I go watching MrsIHN at stuff and you see people who look they have a lovely, light, fast-footed technique, but they’re not going particularly quickly, and there’s folks who run like a bag of spanners who just fly. TBH, MrsIHNs technique is pretty stompy, but it doesn’t stop her running 50 miles, or three marathons in three days along the SW coast path, or any other of the, frankly mental, stuff that she does.

Earlier this year I went from randomly doing occasional runs – two or three times a week & doing anything from 3km to 10km – to deciding I wanted to do the Great Eastern Run (Peterborough Half) in October.

I ended up downloading the free Kiprun Pacer App (Decathlon) and found it to work really well. Lots of long slow runs.
It’s definitely worth a look.

There’s a really impressive Couch to 5K story on the BBC website at the moment if anyone’s in need of some inspiration – https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/clyd0n12x17o

@pjay

Blimey thats some loss, just shows, I belong to a number of Type 2 diabetic groups, and all they do is bleat about Mounjaro or other weight loss drugs not being available, yet mention exercise and they all have an excuse they cannot (of course some are genuine). There is someone taking control of their life for the better.

The accuracy in that article is top! was 117kg, lost 95kg, so now weighs 22kg? o_O.

Still that is an amazing change, well done to the guy!

Well i’m pretty chuffed, went out for week 4 run 3, with the 2x 3 mins running and 2x 5 mins running intervals, but the sun was out and bridleway had drained well, and i knew week 5 has a big step up to 20 mins continuously, so i thought i would try and do 10 mins, 2 min walk, and then another 10 minutes so the step wasn’t so big.

But i kept running pace down, got to 10 mins, wasn’t dying, although i still have the grace of a baby elephant, and ended up running the 5k straight in 33 minutes, so not quick, but it was first run straight through with no walking.

So…

Do i keep trying to go out and run straight through and just try to up the pace a little bit each time?

Or, do i  go back to following the run/walk intervals of the program and maybe just try to increase the pace a bit within the intervals?

Conscious again of not overdoing it and ending up with some daft injury…

Well done OP – it’s great when you easily exceed a target.  Personally, I would revert to the intervals and aim to up the pace.

Thanks @blackhat I will, i am far from a natural runner, but weirdly enjoying it

Well done scud,

Still not allowed to run by the physio, she’s suggested I try doing the C25K on an elliptical trainer till my knee had recovered.

Might just ride the bike instead…

Try running to time instead of distance. I like it better.

I find the Coopah app good if you want to train to a half. Although you do have to pay for it.

https://coopah.com/

2 weeks trial and 20% off with code  FORDYRUNS2

Take it easy and don’t care about pace or chase missed session and you should be ok.

I used the First schedule for marathons – 3 runs a week. From memory, the requirement was that you could run 10 miles comfortably when starting the 16 week schedule, maybe that’s a good target?

NHS couch to 5K put me out for several weeks after day 4 if I remember correctly.

It ramps up too quickly is what my running friends said. I was also scolded for choosing Sarah Millican as my ‘coach’.

There are better choices but I forget them.

Running is horrible. But if you have to, interval running is slightly less horrible than endless pushes. Intervals are what the NHS app tries to do but it pushes for progress too quickly imo. If I were to retry couch to 5k from my ‘I never run, even for a bus but I am happy to ride up things folks don’t like to walk up’ position then I would repeat the earlier days over a week or so until they were NO PROBLEM AT ALL. Then I would proceed to the later days.

I remember when I was speaking at a conference in Geneva I tried the ‘Run, zombies’ app. That was an excellent motivator! IDK if it is still available. And I have no idea how it would prepare you for a marathon but it did make me run quickly along the dog-egg marked streets of Geneva.