food manufacturers need to be bought into line by the Government

its not their fault people eat shit anymore than it the Suns fault that people read shitty newspapers
If they could not sell it they would not so blame the consumer not the manufacturer…its part of this blame something else* for your problems so its not your fault syndrome that does not help and its BS.

FFS people need to take responsibility for their own behaviour.

* endless list
i am big boned
I just put on weight easily
i dont eat that much
its not my fault
It generally is your fault you are overweight a syou control what you eat
etc

EDIT: yes they are lazy too good point TSY i was going to mention it but I could only be arsed making one point per post

science question:

how does having a thyroid problem influence fat storage other than a lower/higher basal metabolic rate meaning the body burns less or more calories over the course of a set time period?

solo i expect you to research and present a paper on the subject 😀

CG, i’m not questioning your situation with this post, i’m just intrigued in the science between thyroid stuff and weight gain….

i’ve worked with patients who have various thyroid disorders (hypo being pretty linked with depression in my anecdotal experience) and even with getting the thyroxine level right, the individual still has to work hard at adjusting their diet to meet their metabolic rate, not adjusting the meds to their diet (again, CG i’m not accusing you of doing this!)

just curious 🙂

EDIT:

Proper home cooked food is why people weren’t fat IMO. It’s why people aren’t fat now. None of all this other stuff that’s spouted, there is no magic, there is no secret, just make your food yourself.

hmmmm, that’s all well and good but look at nigella, she cooks stuff and she’s not exactly slimmer of the year! or look at mrsconsequence’s dad… he loves cooking from scratch, loadsa inventive meals, but all it takes is beer and we’ve got a big belly to contend with no matter how healthy you cook!

And what CG says about GPs and thyroid troubles matches my experience of GPs and Lyme Disease.

‘But you only get that in the New Forest’ will do for now.

Taubes selectively picked pieces of information to sell a book IMO. Those German/Austrian scientists were having fun with real life human guinea pigs…

The obesity epidemic wasn’t arround 40 years ago however Taubes wants to spin it.

TSY – I guess you know about WW2 rationing in the UK, the story being that the limited supply meant everyone ate all that was available, getting all the right vits and nuts, leading to a taller generation of teenagers/young adults. Allegedly. Because they had enough but not too much.

Also allegedly, Churchill asked to be shown an example of what the ration diet allowed per person. A minion was sent out and returned with a week’s worth of food for one, which was laid out on a table for the Great Man’s inspection. Yes, he said, that would suffice nicely for a day’. No-one dared tell him.

BS – you’re just too bloody lazy. Make time.

All diets that work have their foundations in proper home cooked food.

We could turn this into a ‘when wives stayed at home and cooked and cleaned and stuff’ thread 😉

FWIW – my wife is [and has been for the last 26 years] a housewife
Homemade steak and kidney pie, roasties, yorkshires and veg from the garden for us last night and I’m still losing weight 🙂

TSY.

Thanks for the reply.

I’m trying to get back to you with some stuff.
🙂

EDIT:
Wow !.
😯

still don’t understand why everyone wasn’t fat 30-40 years ago

Lifestyle.
😉

I get all this insulin stuff… still don’t understand why everyone wasn’t fat 30-40 years ago when they were still eating plenty of ‘staple’ food stuffs?

My guess: Changes in everyday exercise levels and a huge increase in sugar consumption.

Personally I feel it’s unreasonable to expect GPs to be experts on endocrine disorders but the NHS expects them to manage patients with this. There appears to be a reluctance for referral to an Endocronologist who specialises in thyroid disorders.

Sadly that is a common problem with just about any specialist area in the NHS. GPs are the first line generalists, expected to be able to identify the coarse issue behind every condition and then refer to the appropriate specialists where required. That’s just not a realistic approach these days in my opinion. But I don’t know what is.

(My missus is an endocrinologist by the way – but any opinions I express here are mine not hers)

the individual still has to work hard at adjusting their diet to meet their metabolic rate, not adjusting the meds to their diet

Agreed. (I am about to be a little blunt for which I apologise in advance) c_g: you said earlier that you’d gone from “size 10 to size 18 in 3 years” but that “my eating habits haven’t changed”.

Isn’t that part of the issue? You’ve been diagnosed with a condition which has significantly altered your metabolism, but you haven’t significantly altered your eating habits to adjust for it.

To draw a parallel: if one of the skinny wonderboys on here, that eat loads of food but burn it off with a fast metabolism, had a nasty crash and was suddenly unable to do any exercise, then their metabolic rate would start to drop. If they kept eating what they had been eating previously they would then put on weight.

You don’t like Taubes ?.

How about some Lustig ?.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8dWNbEscOw

huge increase in sugar consumption

Bingo !.
😉

Miketually seems to eat a ton of bread… he cooks it himself.

I bake one loaf a week. I eat most on the cheat day and the family have some. I sometimes have a slice or two toasted with my breakfast on other days.

It’s home-made so there’s no sugar added. It’s sourdough with very long fermentation times (two lots of 24 hours) which makes it much lower GI than bought bread.

Plus, I’m not a biffer, so it matters less if I cheat 🙂

Changes in everyday exercise levels and a huge increase in sugar consumption

Move less and eat more.

Lifestyle

Move less and eat more?

Fifty years ago we walked to school, or rode a bike, in all weathers.

Move more?

I guess you know about WW2 rationing in the UK,

Eat less?

Lol @ TSY.

Now who’s spinning stuff ?.

You love muddying the water, dont you TSY.
😀

Lifestyle

Move less and eat more?

The first 40 seconds, please.
you have 40 seconds, don’t you ?.
😉

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0WdRhau_No

Not really Solo.

Granted don’t eat loads of sugar… don’t need a degree to work that one out.

Other than that how does ‘lifestyle’ influence the levels of obesity?

Oh right – we’re fat because we’re stressed. Because we’re stressed we eat comfort foods?

Some people need ‘tough love’.

Granted don’t eat loads of sugar… don’t need a degree to work that one out.

Other than that how does ‘lifestyle’ influence the levels of obesity?

Aw, TSY, Are we argumentative today ?.

You gonna pick on ole Solo again.
And there was me thinking we’d made-up.
😥

am i missing something here?
TSY talking sense and Solo appears to be goading

As he says it aint rocket science for most folk eat less move more

“In 1822, the average American ate the amount of sugar found in one of today’s 12-ounce sodas every 5 days. Now, we eat that much every 7 hours.”

– http://articles.businessinsider.com/2012-02-19/news/31076374_1_chart-capita-american

Can’t remember the source, but apparently the American obesity problem started during the Depression, when the total number of calories people were consuming was relatively low, but grains and sugar had started to be eaten in greater numbers.

I’m not picking on you Solo… I’m just putting across my view and seeking answers to my questions.

Oh right – we’re fat because we’re stressed. Because we’re stressed we eat comfort foods?

Some people need ‘tough love’.

Err, not really.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8dWNbEscOw

Careful, its minutes long !, and he is a professor.
😉

As he says it aint rocket science for most folk eat less move more

To address what ?, ants in your pants ?.

Oh, I laughed.

If only I had a fiver for everytime someone has posted that on this thread.

😆

I’m not picking on you Solo… I’m just prejudiced utting across my view and seeking answers to in my questions.

😀

As he says it aint rocket science for most folk eat less move more

You just DON’T UNDERSTAND!!!!!

*runs out of the room crying*

Ooooh, you guys are really testing my brain fog/articulation so will attempt to answer.

Solo – I’m happy to talk about it, hurrah for t’interweb. 8)

FFS people need to take responsibility for their own behaviour.

Junkyard – they’re plainly not taking responsibility and seeing as the NHS has to pick up the tab eventually then what’s wrong with the Government stepping in?

I could of course speculate that it’s in the interests of certain people for the population to be unhealthy thus ensuring the continuation of fat cat bonuses etc. Let’s make no mistake, some folk in the food and pharmaceutical industries are doing very nicely thank you.

Phil – food is converted to glucose within the bloodstream. If energy isn’t used quickly then insulin is secreted by the pancreas to lower blood sugar and glucose converted to glycogen to be stored by the liver. Glycogen is reconverted back to glucose on demand over a 24 hour span so it acts as short term energy source. If glycogen stores are full then glucose is converted to fat and trasnsported to the tissues for long-term storage. This long-term energy storage may become excessive but there’s nowhere else for it to go hence getting fatter and fatter.

Now interestingly a medic I’ve consulted with lies the blame fairly and squarely on refined carbohydrates. One thing I’ve cut from my diet is fruit of which I ate huge quantities. Don’t eat any now, it’s been hard but no longer have blood sugar levels plummeting and that ‘I must eat NOW’ scenario.

Some people on the thyroid forum I use have enjoyed good results from changing their eating habits to any of gluten-free/meat-free/dairy-free/alcohol-free/tea and coffee-free/carbohydrate-free. Others have found it makes no difference.

Can I post a little pic? Here’s me 3 years ago this month having fun descending Dunkery Beacon on Exmoor. Phil and TSY – notice the difference?

Solo – I’m not prejudiced! Get a **** grip man!
I don’t think of you differently to anyone else that posts on this subject.
I wasn’t overly impressed with the Taubes video, I took the time to watch it and fed back my thoughts. They’re different to your thoughts… so?

Edit: Yeah C_G… that’s not a Litespeed?

What tyre for my belly wheel?

they’re plainly not taking responsibility and seeing as the NHS has to pick up the tab eventually then what’s wrong with the Government stepping in?

Depends on what the issue is but we have to allow adults the freedom to choose and this often involves them making bad choices, alcohol, overuse of cars and fags for example.

What next mandatory exercise?
its a whole can of worms but educating end consumers is the answer not going after the makers.

People need to accept their choices have consequences

Jamie – Member

As he says it aint rocket science for most folk eat less move more

You just DON’T UNDERSTAND!!!!!

*runs out of the room crying*

😆 😆

I’ve not watched one of Solo’s videos before, but this one’s reasonably short and gives a good overview: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8dWNbEscOw

TSY.

You have been given new info, you are also free to search out info for yourself.
You also continue to pose the same question, 30-40 years ago, blah, blah.

Have you actually tried testing your beliefs from a sceptical stand point ?.
Being self critical of your beliefs and seeing if they stand up to your own standards of scrutiny.

You don’t agree with Taubes ?, thats fine by me.
You don’t agree with Lustig ?, OK.
You don’t agree with Smith, or Sissons.

They are all wrong ?.
Well, I’m in hounoured company then.
🙂

I don’t believe that as things are at the moment, that you and I are going to agree on this.
But I’d hate to fall-out with you over that.

Tell me, why didn’t you agree with Taubes comments on why exercising may not result in weight loss, especially in light of the historical records and evidence he referred to, to support his opinion ?.
Also, where was Taubes going wrong when he was discussing the Sao Paulo mothers with stunted growth children ?.

Genuine Qs.
I know you can spot things I haven’t.

Phil – food is converted to glucose within the bloodstream. If energy isn’t used quickly then insulin is secreted by the pancreas to lower blood sugar and glucose converted to glycogen to be stored by the liver. Glycogen is reconverted back to glucose on demand over a 24 hour span so it acts as short term energy source. If glycogen stores are full then glucose is converted to fat and trasnsported to the tissues for long-term storage. This long-term energy storage may become excessive but there’s nowhere else for it to go hence getting fatter and fatter.

apologies as i’m really not trying to challenge you, that’s a nicely worded and clearer description of the process than most could write 🙂 but its describing the process in which food gets turned into fat, not how having hypothyroidism can cause weight gain from a scientific point of view…

so going back to the basal metabolic rate, i have a feeling that reducing ones calorific intake in an attempt to match an individuals BMR will go a long weigh to slowing/halting unnecessary weight gain.

in your case, and please excuse me for making massive assumptions here, injury with a painfully long recovery time has meant you can’t exercise to the level you used to, if you haven’t changed your diet then that could lead to weight gain. its an awful situation as you can’t heal without calories going in! Thank you for your honesty around what you’ve been through, i’m really not trying to pick on you but you’ve provided a good example for discussion.

Now interestingly a medic I’ve consulted with lies the blame fairly and squarely on refined carbohydrates. One thing I’ve cut from my diet is fruit of which I ate huge quantities. Don’t eat any now, it’s been hard but no longer have blood sugar levels plummeting and that ‘I must eat NOW’ scenario.

refined carbs being the emphasis behind the iDiet and many other diets out there, i hope/think most of us are in agreement that pumping sugar into everything is a bad thing 🙂 education is important, there is however a risk of putting people off the concept when people get all evangelical about the iDiet for example, or dont take the time to ask about and attempt to understand an individuals situations before telling them what they should and shouldn’t be eating.

Some people on the thyroid forum I use have enjoyed good results from changing their eating habits to any of gluten-free/meat-free/dairy-free/alcohol-free/tea and coffee-free/carbohydrate-free. Others have found it makes no difference.

cos we’re all individuals 😀 its good those people are trying adjusting their diet instead of just demanding meds and carrying on as they were before. if they were diabetic they’d be expected to improve their diets and not eat boiled sweets for every meal, demanding enough insulin to keep them safe. If they had broken a both arms they’d be expected to stop driving until they had healed instead of demanding driving aids. When we as humans become unwell we need to take responsibility for ourselves and try to make changes for the better, in most cases the medical professionals are pretty good at advising on those changes!

the western world is very demanding of our health sevices and unfortunately most people expect to be fixed with a tablet so they dont have to change anything they’re used to or stop doing whatever they please. shame really as we dont get into the health profession to try and hurt people or stop them enjoying themselves, we do it to try and help people live the best life they can with the limited resources we’re provided with.

New York City plans to enact a far-reaching ban on the sale of large sodas and other sugary drinks at restaurants, movie theaters and street carts, in the most ambitious effort yet by the Bloomberg administration to combat rising obesity.

Not a headline that may ave been published in the NYT, 30-40 years ago.

Can someone tell me if I eat only sugar say 1500 calories a day, but burn 3000 calories a day… will I get fat?

Solo – Member
Granted don’t eat loads of sugar… don’t need a degree to work that one out.

Other than that how does ‘lifestyle’ influence the levels of obesity?

Aw, TSY, Are we argumentative today ?.

You gonna pick on ole Solo again.
And there was me thinking we’d made-up.

Posted 40 minutes ago # Report-Post

I just thought I’d quote you, quoting me Solo.. to help you out… what have I missed from the videos?

Maybe this quote for Miketually’s re post..

“I you burn what you eat, then there’s nothing to store – you don’t need much insulin. If you don’t burn what you eat, then you need to store it and insulin will go up very specifically to drive that energy into fat cells for storage”

It’s semantics really isn’t it… these Scientists want to take responsibility away from the individual for eating and drinking sugar. I want to place it on the individual. If the individual wants to eat sugar… then they need to get off their (soon to be) fat arses.

Phil.

I don’t see and would like to know if a malfunctioning Thyroid might effect insulin response in some way ?.
Genuine Q.

For that matter, CG, is insulin response effected by Thyroid issues ?.

TSY, I would guess that you would lose weight and gain fat.

Can someone tell me if I eat only sugar say 1500 calories a day, but burn 3000 calories a day… will I get fat?

What did the professor tell us at the end of that 15 min video ?.

Can someone tell me if I eat only sugar say 1500 calories a day, but burn 3000 calories a day… will I get fat?

From the explanation given in the video above, the sugar would cause an insulin response leading to a chunk of your 1500 calories being immediately stored as fat. So, you’d only fewer calories to burn (your body can’t access the calories stored as fat, because of the insulin). You’d feel tired, depressed, lethargic and hungry so you’d go home sit on the sofa and eat and play video games and, yes, you’d get fat.

Can someone tell me if I eat only sugar say 1500 calories a day, but burn 3000 calories a day… will I get fat?

For the sake of a good argument, try it?

I’d put money on you loesing weight, but ending up a higher %age bodyfat as the exercise breaks down your muscles and there’s nothing going into replace it. So at best you’d lsoe muscle and some fat, at worst you’d lose lots of mucle and no fat.