Arsebiscuits – removing a rounded Manituou Hexlock SL

For anyone that knows the Hexlock SL from manitou (on my mastodon), its held in place not by a QR, but by a 6mm retained bolt.

I rounded that bolt, The 6mm Allen key just spins inside the bolt head, and now cannot get it loosened, and thus remove the axle or wheel. Balls.

How would one go about removing it? Any ideas? I have a replacement axle ready to go, just need this one out so not worried about destroying it.

As can be attested by my other posts, I am mechanically challenged so clear and followable advice appreciated.

THis happened because 1st of all, I don’t think I had greased the bolt threads. Secondly, out on the trails recently the axle came a little loose, and I likely overtightened with a multi tool – you know, I really didn’t want it to come off.

Then, when back in the workshop, breaking my bike down for packing it for another trip, when trying to loosen the bolt it needed a massive heave, and then… arsebiscuits.

In case anyone needs it know how it works, here is the install video.

As usual, help greatly appreciated!

Suitably sized Torx tapped in gently 🙈

Or liquid metal around a 6mm hex and let it harden then remove.

Or weld a nut/socket onto/into the rounded one and undo that.

Or Dremel a slot into it and use a Gert big screwdriver to undo it.

Or get tap tap tappity tappy with a hammer and punch.

Or drill it out, but you may need a pillar drill for this.

Oh, and soak it it lots of plusgas penetrating fluid beforehand.

I think that’s all the bases covered.

Sounds like you need a new bike.

I’ve used these to move a **** and stuck solid pivot bolt in my frame
https://www.halfords.com/workshop-tools/tools/hand-tools/laser-damaged-hex-bolt-extractor-set-7pc?cm_mmc=Google+PLA-_-Tools-_-Hand+Tools-_-208622&istCompanyId=b8708c57-7a02-4cf6-b2c0-dc36b54a327e&istFeedId=62b447cf-331e-4fec-a47a-9985ff72d404&istItemId=ittamtrtm&istBid=tzwt&_$ja=tsid:94971%7Ccid:1537737348%7Cagid:57846659199%7Ctid:aud-80976661069:pla-331014971495%7Ccrid:291898457426%7Cnw:g%7Crnd:250785212951553830%7Cdvc:m%7Cadp:1o5%7Cmt:%7Cloc:1007336&gclid=CjwKCAiA5JnuBRA-EiwA-0ggPXazmr_iVSNEkJ8Q4jR7P1I_X0Vndt8i8JlwPp99x6aAbuhmCj8WwBoCgQUQAvD_BwE

Is the hex fitting deep enough to take a screw extractor?

Scruff – that is for sure the simplest option, but the current one is at least clean…

Hainman – I like the look of those, I’d need the 6mm one, did you drive it with a power drill? This thing is so **** stuck in there there’s no way a drill would provide enough torque to get it out (I fear)

Re the screw extractor – same challenge with those, I think the hex fitting is plenty deep enough, but I’m pretty sure a drill will not give enough oomph.

Thoughts?

Ah, and the slot thing I did think about, have a dremmel with cutting disc and have done it before to another bolt – but there no way I can get enough torque on a gert big screwdriver to budge it i think.

@big_scot_nanny I’m sure I just put it in as a normal Allen key and used a screwdriver thing to get grip and twisted as normal the thing was tight but moved right away and came out

Use an impact driver on it after cutting a slot or use a screwdriver with a square on it that you can put a spanner on

sv’s suggestion of a suitably sized Torx bit tapped in is my usual method. Even beter if you can lay the bike over and get the other end onto something solid. The tapping can sometimes help to loosen the thread.

Re the screw extractor – same challenge with those, I think the hex fitting is plenty deep enough, but I’m pretty sure a drill will not give enough oomph.

The screw extractors I’ve got use a tap handle; presumably could be used with a n extension bar of some sort?

Use a pin spanner to remove the hex lock ring thingy, should give better access

Then it may be possible to get an external bolt extractor on it. My preferred way of removing rounded bolts as there’s no chances of then having to drill out the hardened steel of a broken screw extractor or need for any drilling.

https://www.irwin.com/tools/screw-bolt-extractors/bolt-extractors

I though that you didn’t need to touch that bolt once it was in place . Removing the wheel is just a quarter turn on the lever on the other end of the axle
and looseness is taken up by rotating the collar that sits inboard of the lever . You can see how it works in that video clip .

Neil it’s a new system no QRs on them now, 6mm hex key end/axle bolts into the other fork leg.

Thanks all – I’ll give it a try with a Torx first – biggest I have is T40, and that just fits but spins, so will bet a T45 bit.

If that fails, will try the hex bolt extractor suggested by Hainman.

Both of these preceded by a good dousing in plusgas.

Then its on down the list that folks suggested. Will report back on outcomes, many thanks for all the tips.

Thanks for that SV , I should have watched the whole video not just the first 30 seconds .

Because we are talking axles on forks here, I suspect the bolt will be made of a harder metal than the GX1 crank bolt I decimated yesterday with a normal HSS drill bit in about five minutes. Just in case it isn’t, and you are not arsed about the bolt or the axle (and could get a new extractor cap) then just try to drill a small pilot hole in the middle. I guess then you would know how hard the metal is.

Assuming you ‘only’ did it up with a ‘palm of the hand’ multi tool and it then rounded when you tried to remove it, might suggest it is softish?

Good luck, I really only got away with mine because I was chucking the whole lot in the bin (bottom bracket cups included), so as long as I didn’t damage the frame, I didn’t give a monkey’s.

If you are going to use plusgas there, make sure you remove your brake pads and also try to seal a plaggy bag around the disc!

Danny, good call on the pilot hole – good idea.

re. plusgas, ironically I’m thinking ‘why do I need to cover the disk/pads? I can just take the wheel out and dip the bolt side drop-out into the fluid. Oh, hang on…’😆🤦‍♂️

OK, update on this: its still there! Bastard thing. Good news, I can still ride and the axle is definitely never coming loose. Bad news – well, anything that requires taking the wheel out is off the cards!

I really don’t care about saving the axle (have a replacement ready), but would rather not damage for fork lowers or front hub. I’m also now too embarrassed to take to my wonderful LBS (from whom I got the forks and the Wheel, plus many other things/bikes over the years), so want to get this done myself!

With a couple of mates, we took the retaining disk out, then soaked it in plusgas overnight, then we:
1) Hammered in a T45 torx bit – but then under a phenomenal torque it just made a huge cracking noise, sparks flew out, but the bolt held firm

2) used some cut up sheet from a coke can as a ‘wedge’, hammered in a 6mm Allen key – but same outcome as before

3) Cut a slot in it (slightly damaging the lowers, but not the threads thankfully), used a big **** off flat head screwdriver, 2 blokes and a monkey wrench – but same outcome as above

4) Started down the path of drilling it out with a good cordless drill and a 5mm metal drill bit – but it just spins, tiny bit of swarf, but it’ll take a year to get through the damn thing

So, what next? My mate has a mains powered drill with a higher RPM, and wider drill bits, so we can give that a try? Anything else?

We’re driving back to Glasgow for Crimbo soon (from Basel) via ferry to Hull – if anyone wants to take go in person and you live on the route between Hull and the WoS, your welcome to have a go in person!

Hammer in a T50 Torx and yank it, dont gradually load it.

I also learnt a tip recently through youtube about packing it with coarse grinding paste (for lapping valves in) to help fill the gaps.

Might be worth seeing if Ben@ Kinetics would have the time to help out? Maryhill based..

https://www.irwin.com/tools/browse/screw-bolt-extractors/bolt-extractors

External bolt extractor.
As I mentioned above, these work really well on 30 year old round bolt heads. The more torque applied, the more they bite.

If you’re going to drill it out you need a tungsten carbide bit. I’d avoid it if at all possible though.

@jamesoz – I’m clearly a fool, but regardless, to clarify – will this work on the completely spherical outside of this bolt? How does it grip?

I forgot to say i tried the internal bolt extractor things – absolutely no joy

I’ve used them to remove rounded out hex bolts. I know they’re meant for standard bolts not hex bolts, hammer onto the bolt, as you turn the extractor the flutes dig into the round outer. It may not work if the fit isn’t perfect but I used one to remove rounded out spline bolts on a car flywheel (Done up to many Nm), worked a treat.
If they don’t work then as I said a tungsten carbide drill will.
I recently had to drill a recessed cam shaft bolt out that normal drills wouldn’t touch, they just got hot and went blunt. Tungsten carbide did the job.

Cheers fella

Triple square/XZN bits work better than torx in rounded bolts. (hammer in)

You could also try an Irwin bolt extractor if there is room (hammer on the outside)

Your slot will have weakened the bolt head though, it will be more likely to collapse.

If you drill the head off you will be able to drive the axle out. If its a steel bolt you will need a decent drill bit and get the pressure/speed right, if you just rub you will work harden it.

You can also weld nut on the end, you might want to weld a washer on first and build up the middle, then weld the nut onto the washer. The expansion/contraction can help as well.

You might also want to consider taking it to somebody to remove. (not trying to be rude, but sometimes paying somebody for 1/2 an hour labour to just get the job done without any more damage is money well spent)

From what you said about trying to drill it, it sounds like the whole axle is spinning which is the main problem with any of the above solutions. You need to figure out how to stop that, do you have a picture of the other side?

@coppice – bad description on my side, no, axle bolt firmly in place, I was referring to the drill bit just spinning, not cutting

Do you have a picture of the other side?

From what you said about trying to drill it, it sounds like the whole axle is spinning which is the main problem with any of the above solutions.

It shouldn’t be, axle and fork interface are a hex

Ah, that explains it better. Have you tried soaking it with plusgas from the other side then? Looks like a steel bolt in an Alu axle.

Again from a youtube video i’ve seen and used brake fluid as a penetrant, not very nice for your hands or paint but has worked well for me on a motorbike centre stand axle.

@coppice – Stupidly, no I haven’t. Makes of a lot of sense 🤦‍♂️

Would it matter if I try DOT4 or Mineral? I have both.

Will soak that for a bit then try the external bolt extractor recommended by jamesoz.

I liked the video of the grinding paste, but the head is well past that, the correct (and new!) Allen key will spin within it.

I only have toolstation’s penetrating oil which never seems to do a lot. I’ve no experience of Plusgas but if you have that i’d try it first, if that doesn’t work try the DOT4.