bencooper

I don’t want Trident

The alternative is? Given the current level of Russian military activities who is going to defend us and with what if we are to gain Devo? Then there is the devastation to jobs out with the area, housing etc???

more free Uni places

Why? I would rather see more apprenticeship schemes 💡

The alternative is? Given the current level of Russian military activities who is going to defend us and with what if we are to gain Devo?

The alternative is having good international relations and not going to war. Seems to work for many other small countries in the world.

wanmankylung – Member
The alternative is? Given the current level of Russian military activities who is going to defend us and with what if we are to gain Devo?
The alternative is having good international relations and not going to war. Seems to work for many other small countries in the world.

The horse has surely bolted on that one given we are currently part of the UK 💡
The way the “enemy ” thinks” nowadays there will be no distinction or recognition of Borders

The horse has surely bolted on that one given we are currently part of the UK

Well leaving the UK can go some way to improving international relationssurely, no?

There’s plenty recognition of borders or differences in culture and approach. Scotland will do fine and dandy.

There’s plenty recognition of borders or differences in culture and approach. Scotland will do fine and dandy.

So if ISIL or whoever reach Hadrians wall or see the Welcome to Scotland signs the will stop and say “whoaha the Scots support us let’s turn around”……Yeah, right!!
Putin seems to be another who recognises Borders 💡
When the first Russian warship or sub sails up and docks in Leith or the Clyde what will be the reaction?
Are we going to allow the current level of Russian aircraft activity to fly over our lands without intervention given our proximity to the rUK?

If ISIL reach Hadrian’s wall there’s something gone wrong and your point is moot because they’ve already defeated rUK.

When the first Russian warship sails to a Scottish port the response will be “lets get pissed” and see who can handle their drink the most. US warships would be welcome by some, so why not Russians or Chinese?

Current level of Russian aircraft activity flying over any part of these islands is a big fat zero, so yes the current level of activity will be allowed to continue.

So if ISIL or whoever reach Hadrians wall or see the Welcome to Scotland signs the will stop and say “whoaha the Scots support us let’s turn around”……Yeah, right!!
Putin seems to be another who recognises Borders
When the first Russian warship or sub sails up and docks in Leith or the Clyde what will be the reaction?
Are we going to allow the current level of Russian aircraft activity to fly over our lands without intervention given our proximity to the rUK?

Russians at our borders? What the hell have you been smoking john?.

In answer to the OP’s question, I voted for the Scottish national party as I agree with more of their policies than all of the other parties put together.

Never understood people who are lifelong voters of one party, blind faith is bizarre.

Nobeerinthefridge – Member
Russians at our borders? What the hell have you been smoking john?…

I wonder why Scotland will be invaded by the Russians when they have neglected nearly 100 years of opportunities to invade Ireland.

I think some people have been reading way too much Tom Clancy…

Yes Scotland likes to bring up examples of Russia encroaching on UK airspace in Scotland to show that we are not well enough protected against Russia whilst being a part of the UK. Make your effing mind up. I do agree though that Putin probably would not invade Scotland as Salmond has admiration for him.

Funny that your apparently tolerant stance is at odds with Russia’s often homophobic, racist outlook. In reality it is difficult to do business on the global stage and not get your hands dirty.

And your point is?

Murphy gone! The greatest advert for the SNP since some grocers wean.

And your point is?

Come on Nobeer, you are surely cleverer than this?

It’s possible to, at the same time, think that Russia aren’t going to invade Scotland and also think that the UK’s priorities in therms of defence are very skewed. That was Yes Scotland’s point about the Russians – they’re really not going to invade us (we’ve got nothing they want, and they’re not that stupid), but we should have some kind of patrol vessels and aircraft, instead of relying on a fisherman tweeting the MoD.

And why does Russian politics have anything at all to do with this?

Russian politics is not important to you, as Scotland will be a small country you can happily bury your head in the sand. An independent Scotland will have to deal with these countries on an international stage. That is when your principles will go out the window to avoid hassle from a larger country.

Hassle? Is Ireland being hassled by Russia? Is Denmark? Malta? New Zealand?

Russian politics is important to me in that I care about human rights – I don’t think it’s relevant to the discussion about Scottish independence.

Edit

Oh, if only we could ignore the result – we’d be free of the Tories.

I don’t mean hassle from Russia, rather hassle from your own conscience. Just saw an interesting but surely biased exposee(BBC) regarding Russian homophobia. Don’t know how it played put in Ireland?
I just don’t wish to see a country throw out it’s beliefs because it is wee. You may wish that though!!

So, let me get this straight, Scotland being independent is bad because Russia has some fairly nasty political stuff going on?

I suppose that means Greenland is bad because Robert Mugabe is a dick and El Salvador can’t be trusted due the ongoing situation in North Korea.

This is certainly the most interesting argument I’ve heard yet.

I have no idea of the reasons that any of those three [Gloag, Souter, Murdoch] have for claiming, or otherwise, to support the SNP.

Did you read the articles linked to? Souter wanted a knighthood; Souter and Gloag wanted protection from further public regulation of buses; Murdoch wanted protection from public obstruction of the BSkyB deal. They all got them from the SNP.

I don’t mean hassle from Russia, rather hassle from your own conscience.

Now you’ve completely lost me. If Scotland was independent we wouldn’t be able to threaten Russia with nuclear weapons, so they’d be nastier to gay people, and that should be on my conscience, is that what you’re saying? Seriously?

What we can do for gay rights in Russia isn’t threaten them with nuclear weapons, it’s lead by example:

http://news.stv.tv/scotland/1320036-scotland-named-best-country-in-europe-for-lgbti-legal-equality/

Souter wanted a knighthood

I’m not an expert on the affair, and I’m not a SNP member so have no interest in defending them,but wasn’t this investigated?

http://news.stv.tv/politics/282982-inquiry-clears-salmond-of-influencing-souter-knighthood/

athgray – Member
I don’t mean hassle from Russia, rather hassle from your own conscience. Just saw an interesting but surely biased exposee(BBC) regarding Russian homophobia.

😆 how is scotland going to solve russias homophobic (and racist attitudes, i saw the same documentaries) or even the uk or europe for that matter?

Should an independent Scotland invade russia to protect it’s minorities? 😆 should the uk, should europe? 😆

Souter wanted a knighthood

I’m not an expert on the affair, and I’m not a SNP member so have no interest in defending them,but wasn’t this investigated?

http://news.stv.tv/politics/282982-inquiry-clears-salmond-of-influencing-souter-knighthood/
Well, okay, let’s imagine for a moment that Brian Souter’s knighthood was entirely unconnected to his promise to give £500,000 to the SNP not long before. (You’ll notice how limited in scope the “inquiry” cited was: “Lord Fraser came to his conclusion after writing to the head of honours and appointments in the Cabinet Office, who replied that he could find no written communication from Mr Salmond or any evidence that the First Minister had approached his office, directly or indirectly.”).

How does one reconcile multimillionaires giving money and support to the SNP and receiving protection from government regulation of public services in return with the idea that the SNP is a social democratic party?

I don’t need to reconcile it, I’m not a SNP member. They’ve done a bunch of things I’m not a fan of, like cosying up to Donald Trump, but nobody’s perfect.

How does one reconcile multimillionaires giving money and support to the SNP and receiving protection from government regulation of public services in return with the idea that the SNP is a social democratic party?

You see your wife – do you like everything that she does, or does some of it get right on your tits? Nobody is perfect – the SNP are no different.

SNP are a means to an end for me- a fairer society, which I think would come about in an independent Scotland.

Will probably vote Green at the 2016 elections

The thing that puzzles me, is that in all the litany of disasters that are promised us by the antis, yet none of them have pointed at how Ireland which has no oil and which shares a land border with the UK is desperately begging to come back into the warm clutches of the UK.

Oh, it isn’t…. 🙂

@eipc Ireland was a very poor country and received significant EU funding. The EU paid for the road to Dublin airport as the country couldn’t afford it. The country set up a tax haven for banks to attract business and then required a massive bailout as their economy imploded during the financial crash. Is that your model for Scotland ?

Anyway, SNP MPs spent hours and hours sitting in an empty House of Commons in the normal seat of Dennis Skinner just so they could prevent him sitting there. Glad they are using their time productively. How very pro-democracy that is bullying what is now quite an elderly man with a bit of a sit-in. Oh yes and they did the same to sit behind the Labour front bench, oh how very radical that is, end to the Westminster order eh ? Fortunately the voting system remains the same, one MP one vote.

The thing that puzzles me, is that in all the litany of disasters that are promised us by the antis, yet none of them have pointed at how Ireland which has no oil and which shares a land border with the UK is desperately begging to come back into the warm clutches of the UK.

It doesn’t puzzle me, what with the situation being totally 100% different and all, but then I’m not pulling spurious crap out of my arse to justify a pre-conceived point of view 🙂

SNP MPs spent hours and hours sitting in an empty House of Commons in the normal seat of Dennis Skinner just so they could prevent him sitting there. Glad they are using their time productively. How very pro-democracy that is bullying what is now quite an elderly man with a bit of a sit-in.

My money is on the beast. After all my new SNP MP is an attention seeking ex-Tory and Dennis knows how to deal with them. Makes you think about how inappropriate the “Red Tory” jibe actually is….

The beast saw them off – takes more than hot air and flufff

Yes, that was childish. However you’ve missed out the context – Labour didn’t want the SNP to sit in the seats usually used by the third party, so they pinched Labour seats instead.

jambalaya – Member
@eipc Ireland was a very poor country and received significant EU funding. The EU paid for the road to Dublin airport as the country couldn’t afford it. The country set up a tax haven for banks to attract business and then required a massive bailout as their economy imploded during the financial crash…

That’s my point.

They still prefer to be independent.

The UK is not exactly a paragon of fine economic management either, is it?

How does one reconcile multimillionaires giving money and support to the SNP and receiving protection from government regulation of public services in return with the idea that the SNP is a social democratic party?

You see your wife – do you like everything that she does, or does some of it get right on your tits? Nobody is perfect – the SNP are no different.

So is it fair to say that despite the SNP taking significant support from multimillionaire capitalists to block public regulation of their businesses, you still believe the SNP is a social democratic party?

Hassle? Is Ireland being hassled by Russia? Is Denmark? Malta? New Zealand?

I notice you didn’t mention Finland, Sweden, Australia or Cyprus, let alone Georgia, Ukraine or Moldova. They’re all examples of less influential countries being hassled by Russia.

neither did you mention that Russia has been hassling Malta about gay adoption and only didn’t hassle New Zealand because NZ refused to implement sanctions on Putin’s cronies after the invasion of Ukraine. NZ exports $250m of mostly foods to Russia every year, those who sanctioned Russia were banned from exporting foods there. Perhaps that’s the kind of “don’t annoy Russia and they won’t hassle Scotland” ethical foreign policy you were thinking of.

http://www.maltatoday.com.mt/news/national/32526/minister-stresses-importance-of-eu-russia-relations-20131220#.VVqKl9kazTo

Ah, so the reason the UK isn’t being hassled by Russia is that we have nuclear weapons? Without them, Russian agents would be murdering dissidents in London?

Oh wait, they did.

The reason Russians like the UK is that we’re a tax haven for them, and they can sue each other in our courts.

In your Malta scenario, how would it help if Malta had nuclear weapons? Would they threaten to nuke Moscow if the Russians didn’t allow gay Maltese couples to adopt Russian babies?

And really, if that’s “hassling” then every country does things like that. The USA is also keen on trying to export it’s sexual morals, holding back aid if it’s going to contraception groups and the like.

konabunny – Member
…So is it fair to say that despite the SNP taking significant support from multimillionaire capitalists to block public regulation of their businesses, you still believe the SNP is a social democratic party?

The SNP is an independence party first and foremost and attracts support from across the spectrum. We’re not really interested in the buzzwords as long as it continues to do a decent job, and it appears more Scots think so than don’t.

We can fragment into various parties once the job is done.

It would be good if the same scrutiny to sources of funds and potential conflicts of interest was paid to the current UK govt. That’s a bit mind boggling.

Yup, I also remember a lot of snobbish comments when the Weirs gave money to the SNP.