- This topic has 870 replies, 83 voices, and was last updated 14 years ago by anagallis_arvensis.
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6 Nations
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CaptainFlashheartFree MemberPosted 14 years ago
there is only one real TJ
There can be only one!
(He wasn't a real Scotch person, either! 😉 )
backhanderFree MemberPosted 14 years agoThat's as may be, Wales points diff was -4.
I'm very happy to provide a neutral reference to my claim;
http://www.irb.com/rankings/index.html
You'rs are? results matter in the real world
that's aside from the fact that england have beaten wales, and finished consistently above them for the last 4 odd years.
Just for rhys
http://www.rbs6nations.com/en/match-centre_table.php
enjoy mateanagallis_arvensisFull MemberPosted 14 years agothat's aside from the fact that england have beaten wales, and finished consistently above them for the last 4 odd years.
erm last year you lost in wales, year before wales won grandslam so I'm pretty sure you lost then, year before wales beat england 2006 wales got hammered, 2005 we won the grandslam again……… England are not very good and its hard to justify a conclusion that they are any better than wales currently
juanFree MemberPosted 14 years agoWell who cares if england is better than wales…
*/smug mode/*
Who wont the grandslam this year :pTandemJeremyFree MemberPosted 14 years agoWales / England – – IMO England have been playing mediocre rugby for years – whereas Wales alternate between great and rubbish..Hard to say which is better really . Stodge all the time or Champagne one day and dogfood the next?
backhanderFree MemberPosted 14 years agoThis is just ridiculous. Wales lost to england this year, england finished the table above wales. It really is that simple.
And you still maintain that wales are a better team? FFS
I sense some excuses coming (oh we had a bad game and france didn't let us finish waa waa waa).
Wales have finished higher than england in the 6N 3 times since 1991. Wales may have won some individual games but it's the 6 nations.TazFull MemberPosted 14 years agoBack hander as a neutral in the England / Wales debate I think your argument is at best weak.
I think in terms of winning head to heads (now – not over the last ~ 20 years) it could go either way but I would happily bet my money on a fully fit Welsh team and can say 100% that of the two they would easily be my preferred team to watch. Were any of the England games good spectacles? I did not see the Irish game so maybe that was? The others were dire.
It's a pity rugby was not played on paper as I think England could win that. Somehow MJ and co cannot make the sum of the parts work. As an English fan you must find that hugely frustrating?
DezBFree MemberPosted 14 years agoI agree – who cares that England are better, on paper, than Wales.
I'd much rather watch Wales, than the England team of the first 4 games in the tournament.
In fact, I think I'd rather watch f%^&ing GOLF than the England team of the first 4 games!I found myself not caring that England lost against France, just so
happyrelieved that they weren't SHIT.ocriderFull MemberPosted 14 years agoI second Dez's comment above.
The relief that England actually played rugby for once in this years 6N has comforted me greatly.The irony of france playing a patient game in the rain, waiting and kicking the points or as they call it: le jeu a l'anglaise shouldnt be taken for granted. That team are learning to graft a result rather than win with style and will be surely a big contender next year in NZ.
IdleJonFull MemberPosted 14 years agobackhander – Member
This is just ridiculous. Wales lost to england this year, england finished the table above wales. It really is that simple.
And you still maintain that wales are a better team? FFSWales have finished higher than england in the 6N 3 times since 1991.
Why stop at 1991? Shall we go back to 1970?
backhander, well done, you've cheered me up today, reading this. 😀
and also
juan – Member
Well who cares if england is better than wales…
*/smug mode/*
Who wont the grandslam this year :pjuan, that made me laugh as well.
backhanderFree MemberPosted 14 years agoBecause that's how far back it goes on the 6N website
http://www.rbs6nations.com/en/match-centre_table.php
That's why.anagallis_arvensisFull MemberPosted 14 years agobackhander, I think for your own mental health you need to embrace English rugby's crapness.
backhanderFree MemberPosted 14 years agoI am in no way saying that england aren't crap. Just slightly less crap than wales over the course of the tournament according to the results and table. Which is the point of a tournament. See?
rhysFree MemberPosted 14 years agoRemember I'm genetically predispositioned to disagree with everything you say 🙂
whytetrashFull MemberPosted 14 years agoBack hander you are a clown…2005 2008 grand slams…how can you say England have been better than Wales for the last 4 years..
Think it was Hensons comment after we kicked you sorry arses at the Fortress in 08…"we only played well for 10 minutes but it was enough"
England have played a load of stodgy crap…only entertainment is watching MJ having hissy fits with post game interviewers!
Where have been your exciting trys?…we have had loads!
whytetrashFull MemberPosted 14 years agoThink your mum must have dropped you on your head mate!..very reasoned response there addressing all the key points!….Rugby is a game to entertain…England patently do not ergo Wales are better!
backhanderFree MemberPosted 14 years agoWhat? You steam into page 22 of a thread and immediately call a participant a "clown". Do one.
TimPFree MemberPosted 14 years agoAs and Englishman I do sadly have to agree with some of the points made by the Welsh on here, but at the start of this thread A-A did go on about how great the Welsh 15 are, now he has finally admitted that they really struggle with a few injuries. Eng to have struggled to find a setteld 15 with the injuries we have had, and it definitely shows in our performances.
The choice of Tindall in the centres was obvious to counteract the big Basterau, don't understand why that confused you. He is a very good player and has spent a long time out with injury, otherwise he would have been in the squad from the start.As for Eng v Wales at the moment, well that was settled a few weeks ago. However much you complain, and you say that Wales play better, the record books show that Eng beat Wales, and it is pretty difficult to argue that the losing side is therefore better. On the given day, England managed to score more points than Wales, which is the idea, and regardless of how they did it, it does make them better at rugby. England are not playing attractive rugby and havent for some time, but they are getting some reasonable results out (lots of 2nd and 3rds in 6N and 2nd in WC), and yet no-one is giving them any credit for that. Personally I would be happier supporting them if I had a bit of confidence that they might either show some flair or conviction, and I did hope MJ might get them going this year and use some younger players before the WC, but not to be.
Overall the table is pretty fair
France won all games without too much bother
Ireland second best to France
Eng average, and a bit lucky
Wales played less than 40mins per game and so cant be too upset with 4th
Scot played some good rugby, but didnt score enough tries (been a problem for years)
Italy need to stop bringing in struggling SH players, think the ML promotion will helpdeadlydarcyFree MemberPosted 14 years agoIn summary then…
France – as good as they and everyone else thinks they are
Ireland – not as good as they think they are but about as good as everyone else thinks they are
England – around as good/crap as they think they are but not as crap as Welsh fans think they are
Wales – around as crap as everybody thinks they are but around the distance from here to the moon behind where they think they are themselves
Scotland – Around as crap as everybody thinks they are but beating the second best team in it means they think they are world class
Italy – What TimP saidmolgripsFree MemberPosted 14 years agoEngland are obviously a worse side than Wales currently. The fact that they finished higher in the table is immaterial since not all of their opponents play the same standard in each match.
That's my theory anyway 🙂
Seriously though, I think Wales are cooking up something fantastic. It just needs to click – if it does, then we will be fabulous. Until Martyn and Shane retire.. then we'll be worse 🙂
PigfaceFree MemberPosted 14 years agoWhoa there Darcy you hunk a spunk of Shamrock love I know Wales are the best side in the world, it is in my DNA to think that I can not help it. Whatever contradictory evidence is put in front of me 😉
deadlydarcyFree MemberPosted 14 years agohunk a spunk of Shamrock love
😆 Absolutely loving that phrase Pigface.
IdleJonFull MemberPosted 14 years agoTimP – Member
As for Eng v Wales at the moment, well that was settled a few weeks ago. However much you complain, and you say that Wales play better, the record books show that Eng beat Wales, and it is pretty difficult to argue that the losing side is therefore better. On the given day, England managed to score more points than Wales, which is the idea, and regardless of how they did it, it does make them better at rugby.
A fair summary, TimP.
The funny thing is, I never said that Wales were better than England this year.
backhander somehow managed to create his own argument there..
TandemJeremyFree MemberPosted 14 years agoDarcy – Scotland fans know how crap they are – just delighted to be significantly less crap than last year.
Were Scotland the only team that improved this year? Maybe Italy and France? England were the worst I have ever seen – lowest points total in the 6n that they have ever got
anagallis_arvensisFull MemberPosted 14 years agoat the start of this thread A-A did go on about how great the Welsh 15 are now he has finally admitted that they really struggle with a few injuries
Surely that makes perfect sense, Wales have a very good first 15 that on their day could make anyone sit up and take notice, however they have no replacements of international quality for a number of those and some distinctly average replacements in others. England have a lot of very good players but none of the quality of Gethin Jenkins or Mike Phillips for example. I think this is how I can remain positive following a shit six nations as the way forward for wales seems fairly clear. In contrast England seem to have no clear idea of what their first 15 is. For example Armitage was the star last year and is dropped for the next big thing this year. A new attacking dawn was promised with a pacey elusive 13 picked and then as soon as the pressure comes on Tindall is bought back who despite being a fine player is the polar opposite which suggests the whole attacking plan has changed and yet they choose Flood at ten who could have got more out of Tait. Wales on the other hand picked roberst and hook in the centre and despite their obvious problems they have been stuck with as the coaches seem to have a plan (this is one area in which wales have options) I'm not sure the england coaches have a plan.
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