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The missus is doing her nut as the two resident tree rats are digging up anything and everything in the garden.
My auntie traps them in a cage and then drowns them in her pond.
Unfortunately, I don't have a pond and the missus would prefer a "humane" way of dispatching the fury vermin.
Any tips?
My neighbour traps and drowns them too.
It's all a bit weird.
I suppose that borrowing an air rifle and shooting them is quite fast and painless if you must.
Have thought of that but the garden is too close to a road. Can't use an air rifle unless it is a certain distance from a public highway IIRC.
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Attack their tree with futuristic helicopter gunships.
good eating too
no chance mate.
thom, char grilled squirrel as a bivy snack for tomorrow night?
BigDummy: Can't use helicopters as it all went a bit wrong for the humans in the film. Tree rats may start an uprising against mankind and technology. May be eradication by proxy: a could borrow a jack russell...
Nature against nature!
Yeah, trap and drown them. Its the best way.
Squirrel curry is OK.
Trap them and then you have to kill them, it is illegal to release them back into the wild. Drowning them is probably illegal as well you must kill them swiftly, airrifle pellet through skull works.
jimmers - MemberHave thought of that but the garden is too close to a road. Can't use an air rifle unless it is a certain distance from a public highway IIRC.
Be discrete and don't shoot towards the road....
airrifle pellet through skull works.
So would a lump of wood.
[i]The missus is doing her nut as the two resident tree rats are digging up anything and everything in the garden.[/i]
Is it really that bad that the solution is "humane" dispatching of them?
What's to say that others won't take their place?
Live and let live personally...if they were nibbling your bikes I'd think differently 😉
Nuke
If you get greytreeratsquirrels in your loft then you will understand.
thom, char grilled squirrel as a bivy snack for tomorrow night?
i'll get one of those gun top tube gun racks from AMBA and bring an air rifle!
[i]If you get greytreeratsquirrels in your loft then you will understand. [/i]
Maybe but they are not in his loft, they are in his garden having a bit of a dig
They're probably discussing how to kill the humans that live in their backyard right now. Let's hope it's humane.
Don't get it, your garden is being used over by wildlife so you want to kill the wildlife? How odd. I'd be glad to see them there, in fact I'd probably feed them.
You need one of these,
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If they don't get eaten they will stay up the trees and off your lawn
If they were red squirrels fair enough, they are grey squirrels which are legally classified as vermin.
I don't mind the odd the squirrel coming into the garden as they are wildlife. But we have an outbuilding that backs on to our garden and the squirrels have a nest in the attic of the building so they are permanently ripping up stuff in the garden.
Never killed an animal in my life, but they are a pest.
My air-rifle is by the bog so in the middle of the night when i wake up for a piss i pick off a couple of squirrels and rabbits before heading back to sleep. Best time to get them really.
[url= http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/law/article3378581.ece ]linky[/url]
According to this article in the Times, without a special license, you are legally obliged to dispatch the squirrel if caught.
The distance you have to worry about is 50m from the centre of a carriageway but you can ignore this iirc, if it does not cause distress to other people. Having said that you are allowed to discharge an air weapon (non FAC) within your garden but you have a statutory obligation to ensure the pellet does not leave your land.
Squirrels have exceedingly tough skulls and pellets (.177, .20 and .22) will sometimes just bounce off them (even guns up to the legal max). The best way of despatching a squirrel is through the chest (under the foreleg passing through the heart etc is best). If you haven't shot animals before don't be surprised if they run about, jump up and down, twitch etc when you have shot them it is just their system shutting down. To be fair to the squirrels though, you do need to be able to take them out cleanly. That usually means being able to shoot to a standard where you can put several pellets through a kill zone maybe the size of a 10p piece (for a squirrel) before you even try and shoot it. Then you have to be prepared to mess it up because of nerves when it comes to taking the shot... many people lose concentration and fluff it, either missing the quarry or wounding the animal which is unacceptable if it could have been avoided.
It isn't just a case of borrowing a gun. Oh yes, and beware ricochets and grumpy neighbours.
Yuo need to do it efficiently
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available to rent, reasonable rates 😀
Jim on squirrel patrol in the park
slowjo: As a nipper in the cadets I got a marksman badge for putting a 5 round grouping in the area of a fifty pence piece at 50yds with an L98 and '22 rifle. But that was some time ago...
If they were red squirrels fair enough, they are grey squirrels which are legally classified as vermin.
Kind of irrelevant, the legalities - they're effectively the same small furry animal, they're still just animals and all it means is you're not able to secure your own property from them properly, rather than it being their fault and them needing to die!
I can see it's a pain if they're doing damage, but you can stop them better ways than killing them - it's not like killing them will make the slightest difference - they breed rapidly and will be replaced quick enough.
coffeeking: How? Any suggestions are gladly welcome. "Dispatching" the creatures is a last resort.
Turf them out of the nest (they've probably fledged(?!)) by now but I'd check first - would be a bit mean ot the littluns) and secure the building. IF they've nowhere to nest they won't stay around with the same nest building tendencies.
Wot coffeeking said.
I'm not a vegan, but imo killing for no reason is gash. If you're not prepared to eat it, or you're not fending for your life, don't kill it. Simples.
They're vermin, they destroy the gardens, plants and veggies. Its in the countrys interest to get rid of em.
We don't have access to the building as it owned by a nursing home and the council are not bothered with the building. They are happy to leave it to rot (based on a previous conversations with them on other issues that are far too long and boring to go into).
That or take off and nuke it from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.
You've got to be careful with them though, they're adapting.
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tree magnet: already got some of that, to be deployed this evening. That's phase 1 of the plan.
This post is about phase 2...(if required)
this is depressing reading... classed as 'vermin' or not, they have a right to life like any other animal. trapping and drowning them? what sick, weird people.
and just cos of holes in the garden or eating a plant? ever thought that a garden should be in harmony with the outdoors, if they want to eat something let them.
on this reasoning, people should be eradicated - we mess up the environment more than any other animal.
c'mon people, get a grip. live and let live.
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Think I'd be onto the council and telling them their building is causing a hazard/vermin problem and needs securing. But I have to say my over-riding comment would be "it's not forever - prob just spring, and it's hardly the end of the world, not worth killing over"
You could set up a deadfall trap it's pretty easy and kills them quickly.
Personally I'd have a word with the missus though killing stuff you're not eating is a bit iffy really.
right to life like any other animal
I think you are looking for a whole bigger argument there chief.
I think you are looking for a whole bigger argument there chief.
Not really, it's a fair point. Regardless of a recent mouse infestation I'd not kill them, I just secure my house better and let them live. Same goes really doesnt it? If we could kill anything that annoys I'd take out half of the UK population!
Having said that you are allowed to discharge an air weapon (non FAC) within your garden but you have a statutory obligation to ensure the pellet does not leave your land.
If it leaves your land and you get caught you can be in big sh*t so be careful.
A pair of garden shears/tree lopper is an excellent fast dispatching method. Or something like this [url= http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Wall-Dispatcher-Chicken-Duck-Poultry-Hatching-Eggs-X3W-/360240064202 ]walll dispatcher[/url]
I like and do respect wildlife of all types. If they were rats then the it would be a forgone conclusion.
They are comical to watch but if they looked like rats I imagine this post would have probably received a different response rather than a mixed response. Is it because they are fury and cuddly looking creatures?
Not having a go, just wandering? They are classed as vermin and I suspect that this is for a reason, putting personal and moral issues aside.
LHS, it's not a bigger argument, it's a moral point. who are we to judge which animals are ok to kill at will for no real reason, and which are not?
life is life.
killing animals if not for food or self defence is inexcusable.
killing animals if not for food or self defence is inexcusable
So if you had a rat/wasp/cockroach/mouse/ant infestation you would just "live with it"??
Bet your gaff is a nice place to be! 😯
i've also had to deal with a mouse problem, but i didn't use traps or poison. it's not their fault my garage is a warm place for them to live and it's not my right to kill them off. sonic devices or blocking holes and removing food supply does the trick.
i wouldn't get roaches or rats if it wasnt a shthle in the first place tho would i )
So if you had a rat/wasp/cockroach/mouse/ant infestation you would just "live with it"??
No, surely the best way is to prevent them in the first place by being clean and securing any entry places rather than just accepting they happen and then wiping them out? With the exception of roaches, the rest are fairly easily removed without mass murder 🙂
My Dad spent years trapping tree rats from his garden, used to clear 2-3 a week, never made any difference to the amount he used to get, all that happened was other tree rats from overlapping neighbouring territories used to invade!
ski, he must've realised that would happpen right? 🙂 my dad was the same with moles, they drove him nuts for years much to our amusement..
Yep, I think so, but kept him busy & gave him something to moan about 😉
james-o - Member
LHS, it's not a bigger argument, it's a moral point. who are we to judge which animals are ok to kill at will for no real reason, and which are not?
Simple, we kill the tasty and annoying ones - top of the food chain innit. Should lions not kill zebras? Or are they morally superior to humans?
jimmers, rats or pigeons, squirrels etc, makes no odds to me but that's just my pov. the vermin classification is about disease transfer or damage to crops etc i think, so rabbits would be vermin too. so yeah if you had a major health issue relating to rats in a hotel for ex then they'd be killed off, fair enough it wouldn't make sensse to argue against that however i feel. but having a garden area full of squirrels as well as mice at times, and having no problems with them, i'm anti this unthinking 'kill em it's just vermin' approach when in many cases they're doing no actual harm. it's just about rationality.
anyway, lunch over, hippy mode off 🙂
After reading this thread and the relentless slaughter of tree rats (still vermin though) may not be for me.
My auntie drowns at least one a week.
We've been talking about getting a dog for a while and a jack russel is the current favourite (more thinking to be done as it is not a decision to take lightly). May be this is a good excuse and doubles up as a squirrel deterrent.
captjon, i did say i had no issue with killing for food, it's natural. killing out of annoyance, well then someone may need to look at their tolerance levels first..
Simple, we kill the tasty and annoying ones - top of the food chain innit. Should lions not kill zebras? Or are they morally superior to humans?
With the greatest respect, the lions don't kill ones that annoy them, only the ones that they eat or threaten their food. That's pretty fair isnt it?
Either way, glad jimmers has has second thoughts (or at least postponed the less friendly way!).
jimmers, the dog would be a lot more forgivable than your aunt drowning animals, with respect to her etc..
Grey squirrels are about twice the weight of a red squirrel.
Grey squirrels carry squirrel pox past pox onto reds, then the reds die.
http://www.scottishsquirrelsurvey.co.uk/pox.html
http://www.bbc.co.uk/scotland/outdoors/articles/squirrel_pox/
Grey squirrels are vermin.
james-o - Member
captjon, i did say i had no issue with killing for food, it's natural. killing out of annoyance, well then someone may need to look at their tolerance levels first..
The "it's natural" argument is a very dodgy one. The next logical step is to adjudge what isn't natural, and there are plenty of problems to be had there.
The "it's natural" argument is a very dodgy one. The next logical step is to adjudge what isn't natural, and there are plenty of problems to be had there.
Just because there are problems doesn't mean we shouldn't ask though does it. Head in sand?
Grey squirrels are about twice the weight of a red squirrel.
Grey squirrels carry squirrel pox past pox onto reds, then the reds die.
http://www.scottishsquirrelsurvey.co.uk/pox.html
http://www.bbc.co.uk/scotland/outdoors/articles/squirrel_pox/
Grey squirrels are vermin.
But ultimately species quite regularly get overcome by invading diseases and species transported from one country to the next by various means. Doesn't mean it's right to kill them. The reds have every right to kill them off, I just don't see where we get the right to decide what gets destroyed and what doesn't, regardless of method of introduction or their ability to beat native animals.
LHS - Member[b]killing animals if not for food or self defence is inexcusable[/b]
So if you had a rat/wasp/cockroach/mouse/ant infestation you would just "live with it"??
Bet your gaff is a nice place to be!
It's a lovely place to be. I live in the countryside, so if I killed all the mice I saw it'd be a full time job. I just secure my house so they can't get in in the first place. Not had a problem with wasps, I always make sure my eaves are well secured. Can't comment on the rest as it's never been an issue. Get the occasional mole hill but just flatten them and it's fine.
Actually, the horses in the field next door chew my hedge. I might just shoot them.
Actually, the horses in the field next door chew my hedge. I might just shoot them
You'd be well within your rights.
Captjon, it is natural to kill for food in the context of this discussion and the food chain that you mentioned, surely? it's a simple statement. if i camp out, catch a fish and eat it, it's natural. i may not need to, but if that meal replaces a burger, then i still feel it's more natural and in keeping with 'nature's way' or whatever you want to call it. on the same basis, a lion eating a man is also natural. it's just the food chain and intelligence doesn't preclude us or any other animal from it.
unatural killing for food would be something like a debate over abbatoirs or mass farming, that's not what we're discussing here.
i'm talking about the personal morals relating to killing an animal that is doing no dicernable harm, killing for annoyance as you say. thats not something i can understand or empathise with.
that is doing no dicernable harm
Go and interview a red squirrel then come back and answer.
"Grey squirrels carry squirrel pox past pox onto reds, then the reds die."
true.
"people expand their environment at the cost of animal's lives, even entire species" also true.
so by this logic people are vermin. in some respects i wouldn't disagree, but it shows that killing off an animal due to it unintentionally upsetting the previous balance is against basic Darwinism? i mean the grey squirrel isn't exactly guilty of intentional genocide is it )
http://www.europeansquirrelinitiative.org/summary.html
Its a European wide problem.
"...the grey squirrel has a dramatic effect on the bird population by destroying nests (eating the eggs and the young chicks)."
http://www.songbird-survival.org.uk/predators/grey-squirrels/
LHS, we should kill all lions and cheetahs off then, as the antelopes would be really happy.
Darwinism. survival of the fittest. i know they were introduced, but the spread of animals naturally or unaturally doesn't change the moral point about killing them because you think it's justified.
macavity, should we kill all domestic cats with air rifles? my neigbour's cat kills birds regularly. that's what cats do, it's instinctive. i don't like what it does but i wouldn't kill it for doing so, the cat hasn't got the ability to reason this. we do, and surely should.
tree-magnetActually, the horses in the field next door chew my hedge. I might just shoot them.
Let me know if you do, I'm rather partial to a bit of equine steak. 8)
[url= http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/home-news/chef-hopes-city-diners-will-go-nuts-for-squirrel-1.1023369 ]Simples[/url]
[i]The reds have every right to kill them off,[/i]
I am fascinated by this idea. I [i]think[/i] it may imply that, say, ethnic cleansing in Bosnia-Herzegovina was morally acceptable, but jimmers drowning a grey squirrel is not.
Which is an interesting position to my mind. 🙂
james-o - Member
Captjon, it is natural to kill for food in the context of this discussion and the food chain that you mentioned, surely? it's a simple statement. if i camp out, catch a fish and eat it, it's natural. i may not need to, but if that meal replaces a burger, then i still feel it's more natural and in keeping with 'nature's way' or whatever you want to call it. on the same basis, a lion eating a man is also natural. it's just the food chain and intelligence doesn't preclude us or any other animal from it.unatural killing for food would be something like a debate over abbatoirs or mass farming, that's not what we're discussing here.
i'm talking about the personal morals relating to killing an animal that is doing no dicernable harm, killing for annoyance as you say. thats not something i can understand or empathise with.
Unless you're camping in a cave and catching the fish my hand it isn't a very natural process at all. In fact, is recreation time natural?
My point is that what is and isn't natural is relative, and therefore a pointless argument to make.
Jimmers... thank God this is the internet or I'd have thought I'd gone mad.
In view of the opinions expressed on here I think the best thing for you to do would be to invite the squirrels round to yours for a drink and a nibble. Explain your position, make sure they know you are offended by their constant digging and appeal to their better nature. If you are firm but fair I am sure they will see your point of view and agree to dig up someone else's garden then you will be happy, the sqizzers will be happy and there will be no point for precious moralising with everyone getting hot and bothered. 🙂
hehe fair point..
captjon, yes recreation time is natural. we have all strived for it since time began. sex is recreation time. but all that aside, arguing what is and isn't natural really is a big debate and it's shades of grey (oops!) as well as a waste of time. one animal eating another for food is natural/normal whatever you want to call it, in most peoples eyes. we've been doing it for a long time. killing animals out of minor annoyance / fun / cos you don't like them is wrong in most peoples eyes too. that's a pretty simple point that comes down to morals not philosohical argument.
you can justify it by finer points of argument if you like, i don't actually know what your thoughts on it really are either. but ultimately, it's a personal call and on this one, since it's not a legal issue as far as i know, we only have to answer to ourselves.
some might have already said this but could the REAL problem be your wife and not the ickle-wickle squirrels?
hmmm?
Just to jump in with both feet and say I'm in favour of wiping greys out. They need to be controlled. Those who think the countryside is full of flowers and no animals should die are urbanised and removed from nature. Ill educated even. Man is part of nature, and thanks to our large brains, can kill for reasons beyond hunger and animal instinct. In this case, because grey squirrels damage woodland habitat, carry diseases harmful to indigenous squirrels, and displace them. They are a man created problem and so there is no way you could argue that man shouldn't blitz them all within the UK.
If you disagree with any of the above I suggest you educate yourself.
Just thought I should mention that if you trap a squirrel they fight like billy o when caught...,. just ask goons dog I seem to remember he was mauled by a squirrel
we have a cat that catches, kills and eats them. he was up to about half a dozen last season.. have to keep an eye out in the cellar, that's where he hides them.
have you contacted the council ? they have pest control, they would at least tell you what you can and can't do, and what they will and won't do.
spud gun ?
Spud gun? Probably, if it's one of those ****-off ones using water pipe and propane propellant and whole potatos. That aughta take the little grey buggers out, no problem.
Oh, and they taste like chicken, apparently.