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As usual squirrelking, you’re very quick to point out what can’t be done and why it’s not suitable for you and thus why EVs are bad
And as usual you miss the mark completely and come to a conclusion based on opinion rather than fact. Tell me where I suggested EV's were bad? I never. I'm just agreeing with trail_rat that your figures are pish and cherry picked to suit your agenda. You're constantly shifting goal posts, the latest being that nobody talks about deposits because they can get them from work. I simply pointed out not all of us have or want that option and in a general discussion about EV's I don't see the problem. As a supposed pragmatist and scientist I'd frankly expect better, acknowledging other arguments without shouting them down for a start. Usual STW 'unable to think of any situation other than my own as being anything other than an edge case' mentality.
As for the Tusker redundancy protection, that's after an initial 3 month exclusion (presumably from delivery rather than order) which given the entirely unknown lead times could well result in a car being delivered at a bad time and you being on the hook for 6 months of charges to terminate. Sounds silly really, which is why company cars aren't for everyone, sounds pretty pragmatic to me yes?
What efficiencies are people with 64kwh e-niros seeing long term?
Currently weighing up between that and an EV6. Ranges look similar, but the e-niro does it from a smaller battery, EV6 charges considerably faster.
According to the app, our eNiro has average 6.48 km/kWh over the last month. That is in temperatures down to -20C and a mix of long distance driving (at 110km/h-ish) and town over approximately 2000km.
A question for the ID3 drivers if I may. My wife has an ID3 registered in July 21 (I think..) and the **** thing keeps yanking on the handbrake and kicking me out of drive/reverse during low speed manoeuvres and it's pissing me off (mainly from a safety perspective as we live on a main road and it has a habit of doing it, sometimes more than once!, as I'm reversing onto the drive).
I think I posted about this previously and after a bit of digging on various forums there seemed to be a consensus that in reverse if you look over your shoulder and unweight the drivers seat it thinks you're getting out of the car and jams the brakes on. This is not the case as the car is now doing the same stunt when going forwards! (and I've adjusted my reversing tekkers to not unweight the drivers seat as much and it still does it).
I think the issue is partly to do with the behaviour, and more specifically the lack of precision, of the throttle. Our driveway is slightly downhill so when pulling off the drive in the ID3 I'm very gentle on the throttle and the behaviour is thus: press pedal lightly>nothing>nothing>nothing>press a bit more>lurch forward towards path/road>lift off>car jams brakes on automatically.
I have absolutely none of this in my Model 3, where I can just meter out exactly how much power I want very precisely. Does anyone else get this behaviour in the ID3? I feel like VW need to sort the map (is it still a map in an EV?!) out on this car pronto! Thoughts/views on this most welcome.
Thanks
I've read/seen that the eNiro is more efficient than the EV6.
saying that the eNiro is not a dedicated EV, the EV6 is and it has better charging speeds.
We have an eNiro and its ace but I've be going for the EV6 this time around
The EV6/Ioniq5 are less efficient than the e-Niro/EKona, but they are much bigger vehicles. They do have bigger batteries so range is still better.
The new cars charge much faster on ultra fast Commercial chargers like Ionity and Gridserve, but the same on home chargers, meaning a full charge a5 home takes longer for the EV6/I5.
For clarity, I’m awaiting an Ioniq 5 AWD through my work Salary Sacrifice Tusker scheme.
Currently weighing up between that and an EV6
If the e-Niro is like a Hyundai Kona, then the EV6/Ioniq5 is a different class of car altogether - bigger, more premium, more advanced and more expensive.
lightly>nothing>nothing>nothing>press a bit more>lurch forward towards path/road>lift off>car jams brakes on automatically.
Something to do with the regen settings or one-pedal driving?
That’s correct - Kona/eNiro are sister cars on the same platform.
My Ev6 order (from May in the preorder windows) got delayed from October to January and is now June. So frustrating as the dealer is completely useless at communicating anything, I have to initiate everything. Also, it's not really the dealer's fault it's Kia manufacturing being delayed and not communicating that to dealers (presumably silicon chip shortages).
The carwow range test suggested that the EV6 can do 90% wltp range on the run they did ~ 3.7m/kWh. I could live with that, but the e-niro sounds like it should be better at the balance of lower charge rate.
As for the Tusker redundancy protection, that’s after an initial 3 month exclusion (presumably from delivery rather than order) which given the entirely unknown lead times could well result in a car being delivered at a bad time and you being on the hook for 6 months of charges to terminate. Sounds silly really, which is why company cars aren’t for everyone, sounds pretty pragmatic to me yes?
Er.... no. If you got made redundant whilst the car was on order you would walk away having not paid anything and not owing anything. The company would foot the bill to return to Tusker, not the individual - you would have left! (Presumably Tusker then put it into their "READY RIGHT NOW" pool of cars to sell out.") If there was an overlap, say the car arrives but you only have a month to work your redundancy notice, you'd pay 1 month, keep the car for an additional 3 months once employment terminated, but not pay for those three months. It's designed to leave you not in the absolute sh1t should the worst happen.
nickewen
Free Member
A question for the ID3 drivers if I may. My wife has an ID3 registered in July 21 (I think..) and the **** thing keeps yanking on the handbrake and kicking me out of drive/reverse during low speed manoeuvres and it’s pissing me off (mainly from a safety perspective as we live on a main road and it has a habit of doing it, sometimes more than once!, as I’m reversing onto the drive).
@nickewen - simple answer, no, our iD3 has never done that, and we reverse on and off our drive regularly. It does sometimes put the normal brake on at very low manoeuvring speeds, I assume it's detected something it doesn't like. But never the parking brake.
lightly>nothing>nothing>nothing>press a bit more>lurch forward towards path/road>lift off>car jams brakes on automatically.
Something to do with the regen settings or one-pedal driving?
@molgrips - It seems to behave like this in both D and B (one pedal) mode when going forwards. It's almost as if they've tried to deliberately make it behave like an ICE auto.. rather than embracing what you can do with the characteristics of the driver controls with an electric drivetrain. The throttle behaviour is closer to my old M135i ZF auto than it is to the Tesla.. which is odd!
Thanks @tlr that's interesting. Does it kick you out of drive/reverse when it applies the normal brake? It's pretty aggressive when it happens in ours and will just stop you dead in your tracks..
Nope, never had to put it back 'in gear'.
We always drive in B mode, sport setting.
If the e-Niro is like a Hyundai Kona, then the EV6/Ioniq5 is a different class of car altogether – bigger, more premium, more advanced and more expensive.
The EV6 air isn't much more than the e-niro 4+ that's why it's a consideration. Lose some toys in the EV6 but many of them aren't that significant.
Our e-Up has a 'crawling function', which it appears the ID3 also has - if you can get it into this mode it may avoid the issue?
<b>Crawling function </b>
The crawling function allows you to drive forwards or backwards slowly at a speed of around 5 km/h (3 mph) without pressing the accelerator.
The crawling function is automatically activated when:
—The vehicle’s drive system is activated and the D/B position or reverse gear R is selected.
—The vehicle is travelling at a speed below 10 km/h (6 mph).The crawling function is deactivated:
—The vehicle is driven faster than 10 km/h (6 mph).
—The position switch is in N position and the electronic parking brake is switched on.
The problem you're having may also be something to do with the 'Auto-hold' for hill starts? Not had the e-UP long so this is all quite new to me.
squirrelking
Free MemberAnd as usual you miss the mark completely and come to a conclusion based on opinion rather than fact. Tell me where I suggested EV’s were bad? I never.
Where to start!? Page 31, 32, 33, 34, 37 and 42 of this thread! With EVs are bad because:
1. "they're heavy"
2. "they use too many resources"
3. "they're too expensive"
4. "Charging is difficult"
5. "the range isn't good enough"
6. "they catch fire"
And whilst I haven't gone back through, there may have been something about towing, but, whatever. You're clearly right, you've never intimated that they were bad....
I’m just agreeing with trail_rat that your figures are pish and cherry picked to suit your agenda. You’re constantly shifting goal posts
No - you're (and to an extent trailrat) shifting the goal posts. My original point (if you could be even bothered to read) was that in the 5th Gear Recharged article, they compared two, equally specked, equally financed Corsa models and compared the TOTAL costs over 3 years with the EV being cheaper by a substantial margin. Both were financed, both had the same deposit contribution.
the latest being that nobody talks about deposits because they can get them from work.
Again, wrong. I did talk about deposits and I did not twist figures. Others did that in saying that the Corsa EV was £30k and the petrol was £20k. I addressed that. I ran my figures through a leasing site with (I think) 3 down and 33 to pay. Yes the EV deposit was higher and the monthly payment was higher, but the overall costs were lower.
I simply pointed out not all of us have or want that option and in a general discussion about EV’s I don’t see the problem.
I agree, but finding £700-£1000 as a deposit for an EV is no different to finding £700-£1000 for a banger. In both cases, you're expecting to write off the initial payment, but for the EV you KNOW it's once every 3 years, whereas the banger could be dead in 3 months.
As a supposed pragmatist and scientist I’d frankly expect better, acknowledging other arguments without shouting them down for a start.
NOt shouting down, but I've spent enough time in Science and Engineering to know that people are always quick to latch onto what can't be done and why, especially if it adds complication or difficulty.
Usual STW ‘unable to think of any situation other than my own as being anything other than an edge case’ mentality
Utter rubbish. My critique and feedback was based purely on real data, real experience with EVs and background in technology adoption modelling.
You've been a largely consistent negative voice in this whole thread, very quick to latch onto what's wrong, what's difficult, etc. Whilst I agree, they're not for everyone right now, continually pointing out the negatives which make it unsuitable for you at the present time rather than considering a way that could make it work for you seems a little pointless.
It seems like you're still on the downward slope of the Kubler-Ross curve...
Much love. D.
@nickewen this may be more a VW auto-hold issue, I had pretty much the same on 3 diesel manual passats at very low speed - the auto hold would switch itself on as the speed was below (I assume) what it could recognise as 'moving'. I would just have to accelerate a little bit out of it, as I think you are doing.
Er…. no. If you got made redundant whilst the car was on order you would walk away having not paid anything and not owing anything. The company would foot the bill to return to Tusker, not the individual – you would have left! (Presumably Tusker then put it into their “READY RIGHT NOW” pool of cars to sell out.”)
Well, obviously. Why would you be paying for something that wasn't delivered?
If there was an overlap, say the car arrives but you only have a month to work your redundancy notice, you’d pay 1 month, keep the car for an additional 3 months once employment terminated, but not pay for those three months. It’s designed to leave you not in the absolute sh1t should the worst happen.
Do you have a source? Because between my employers website and Tusker I can't find anything about the Lifestyle Protection insurance any more, it was there last week when I made that last post! Anyway, this is what's written at my end:
Tusker automatically include their Lifestyle protections which make provision for a variety of life events and mean that in many circumstances a car can be returned without cost after an initial exclusion period (3 months) examples include resignation, redundancy and loss of licence on medical grounds. Other lifestyle events such as maternity, paternity, adoption and long term sickness also have provision made for them. Please note that some events such as dismissal or choosing to hand the car back early do require an early termination charge to be paid which is capped at 6 times the monthly gross cost. For full details of Lifestyle protections and your obligations please see Tusker’s website and review the Tusker FAQs in 'Useful Links'.
And from an [url= https://www.tuskerdirect.com/articles/protect-your-organisation-with-tusker-s-lifestyle-protection ]article[/url] on Tuskers site:
Comprehensive protection in cases of resignation, redundancy, retirement and TUPE
It’s not always possible to predict retirements and resignations. And organisations don’t always know when a restructure or a TUPE situation - when firms need to make people redundant or replicate employee benefits for staff joining their organisation through an acquisition or merger - could hit.In these situations, our Lifestyle Protection scheme gives employers and employees the option to hand the car back three months after it has been delivered with no termination fee. Because these scenarios can mainly be planned for in advance, it should be easy to avoid paying any fees.
If the car was delivered less than three months before the individual leaves, your organisation is liable for the lease contract. However, it is possible to charge the early termination fee to the employee if the car was delivered less than three months before they leave.
So it looks like what you said is almost entirely made up unless you have an actual copy of the Lifestyle Protection T&C's that say otherwise.
No – you’re (and to an extent trailrat) shifting the goal posts. My original point (if you could be even bothered to read) was that in the 5th Gear Recharged article, they compared two, equally specked, equally financed Corsa models and compared the TOTAL costs over 3 years with the EV being cheaper by a substantial margin. Both were financed, both had the same deposit contribution.
I believe TR dealt with this one, they weren't equal at all hence the arguments.
Where to start!? Page 31, 32, 33, 34, 37 and 42 of this thread! With EVs are bad because:
1. “they’re heavy”
2. “they use too many resources”
3. “they’re too expensive”
4. “Charging is difficult”
5. “the range isn’t good enough”
Ah, I see your issue, I've simply said why they don't work for me, and presumably many others like me. As I said:
Usual STW ‘unable to think of any situation other than my own as being anything other than an edge case’ mentality
If it works for you, great, crack on.
But all that said, on Page 31 I was having a spat with Edukator because he was talking about French things that don't apply in the UK. Except for
I keep saying it, the solution for atypical long distance journeys is a trailer mounted battery pack with a common standard connector.
Looks a lot more like an argument that would make the case for EV's to me.
Feel free to repeat this exercise on the other page numbers you quoted or, preferably, stop talking shite and making stuff up that I never said.
I'll say it again for clarity - I am not and never have been against EV's. I do however have issue with our attitude to car use in this country and believe that replacing cars with more cars is unsustainable in the long term.
@nickewen I reckon it’s your Auto-hold. It makes the car quite undriveable at parking speeds.
Swipe down from the top of the screen and there should be an option to switch it off.
I saw an EV6 today for the first time, driving past. It really was ugly in a rather unpleasant way.
Sorry, you think that every company takes a standard deal with Tusker? That there's no room for negotiation on the overall scheme contract, even if that negotiation means the company buying better protection for the employees? I've just checked, my company has a turnover in excess of 100x that of Tusker with significantly more employees... I'd say I know where the balance of power resides in those negotiations.
The protection I describe is in the T&Cs issued to me, the ones with my name and address on. I know they are correct.
stop talking shite and making stuff up that I never said.
He's quoting you without edits, that isn't making stuff up.
It wasn't a spat with me, I was calmly addressing your red herrings.
For my use the Zoé has become just a car that works very well. It's increasingly cheaper than an ICE to run as fuel prices rise. It's pleasant to drive, exceptionally quiet, does everything within 150km of home without a charge and fast chargers are springing up all over the place beyond that. It takes two people with their 27.5 MTBs. The two-year-service was 120e, it's guaranteed for five years and the battery eight. Madame likes driving it.
Yesterday was typical: put it on charge before breakfast to warm up the battery and top up, drive up to the mountains, ski tour, drive junior back to his base on the way home, plug in the car on arriving at home. It's ready to go again.
Re the ID3 issue above, mine doesn't do that.
I've just checked the status of the auto hold and it is on, as is the crawling function.
The only time that the brakes have jammed on was when Mrs B was driving Beamlet 1.0 to the school bus stop and Beamlet 1.0 was jabbering away and Mrs B applied the parking brake thinking that she was about to activate the screen washer.
Beamlet 1.0 stopped talking at that point.
Egolf needed auto-hold turning off (thankfully there’s a button right next to the parking brake) for jerk-free slow manoeuvring. I also had the “slam brakes on” thing a few times, it’s when the car thinks you’re going to hit something - but it didn’t take turning into account. If I reversed into our drive a little faster than normal it would think a post would get hit even though steering was at full lock and we were nowhere near hitting it.
When my skis slip onto the handbrake button Zoé flashes up a little message rather than jamming on the brakes. I miss the old mecahincal handbrake and rear drum brakes of our last Zoé, it worked really well.
Sorry, you think that every company takes a standard deal with Tusker?
I'm basing my assumptions on what's written on my employers website, they refer to Tusker WRT redundancy protection so that's what I'm basing my argument on. Like I said if you have something to bring to the party feel free to quote it. Or not. In fact don't bother, it's nothing to do with EV's really.
He’s quoting you without edits, that isn’t making stuff up.
It wasn’t a spat with me, I was calmly addressing your red herrings.
FFS he never even provided a quote, he literally said:
Where to start!? Page 31, 32, 33, 34, 37 and 42 of this thread! With EVs are bad because:
1. “they’re heavy”
2. “they use too many resources”
3. “they’re too expensive”
4. “Charging is difficult”
5. “the range isn’t good enough”
None of which was said on the mentioned P31.
Anyway, can we just talk about cars rather than making up what I did and didn't say? If you want to start a "Things Squirrelking said in my head" thread feel free to do so and stop shitting on this one.
I really am falling in love with my car again. I moved house last year and havent been able to arrange for a charging point to be reinstalled in the new house until last week. This basically left me at the mercy of rising diesel prices. Car has still managed a decent 58mpg on the diesel alone.
Now that i have the charging point back it is averaging 70+ mpg and rising even though i did a 300mls round trip on mostly diesel at the weekend. This week i havent used a drop of diesel too.
Car is a C300de Merc. It has a 25-30mls range on electric and has 200bhp diesel + 100hp electric (300bhp combined). 155mph limited top speed and i think its about 5.5s 0-60.
I even find myself driving through town now rather than ploughing up the motorway so i can leave it on electric. I can drive to work and back 3 times before needing to recharge the 11kw battery (i think).
I dont think EV suit everyone but if you can get one that suits your needs they really are amazing
You challenged Daffy to tell you where you said EVs were bad Squirrelking. Your quotes on page 31 are in order:
What about EDF then? They do the same thing. Or is that okay because they’re not oil?
Slagging off the EDF charge points.
Cool story bro.
I’m not speaking from a French perspective in case I haven’t already made that abundantly clear.
Replay to a reasoned post about EDF charge points
Try the fact I’m talking about EDF in the UK. They’re a multinational company in case you never noticed. Anyway, installing chargers and charging higher prices, is that okay because they’re not an oil company? Answer the actual question I asked rather than starting some jackanory nonsense please.
Still slagging off expensive EV charging and getting insulting when you don't like my replies as usual. Yet I continued to provide polite answers. You'll note I continued to ignore your red herring provocative trolling about oil companies because I was talking about EDF.
You've spent the whole thread slagging off EVs Squirrelking, if you don't like them post on the 700bhp Audi estates thread, I haven't because they're not my thing but I'm not going to piss off the people on that thread with a lot of disinformation about big fast(ish) estates.
Loving our EV, yes its about 100/month more in capital costs but we are not spending (on average) £150/month in go go juice. Charging at home is currently costing around £10/month.
So easy and nice to drive.
You’ll note I continued to ignore your red herring provocative trolling about oil companies because I was talking about EDF.
You were talking about oil companies, I was the one who brought up EDF. It's literally right there on the pages mentioned.
Edukator:
Does it not ring alarm bells with anyone else to see oil companies installing charge points
Last post: https://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/the-electric-car-thread/page/30/
Me:
What about EDF then? They do the same thing. Or is that okay because they’re not oil?
7th post: https://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/the-electric-car-thread/page/31/
Be as polite as you like, you're still either a liar, completely barking or just reverting to type (troll). Which, given nobody even asked for your opinion I'm taking to be point three. Give it a rest you sad little man.
you’re still either a liar
On page 31 I was talking about EDF, that was the page in question, the quote came from page 30. Daffy didn't mention page 30. Check back up the page.
Repeating the same question over an over is a provocative method of trolling. I ignored it because it was a red herring. The intelligent reader doesn't need me to answer to see that EDF installing charge points is very much part of their business and oil companies installing charge points with dissuasive prices is another matter.
Your insistance on battery trailers is also clear trolling, it's the only thing you've been positive about even when it's pointed out to you that it's been tried and failed, and with cars with bigger batteries utterly pointless. But still you insist, you've trolled the thread from start to finish and continue to do so.
you’re still either a liar, completely barking
From you I'll take that as a compliment and file it with:
starting some jackanory nonsense please.
Cool story, bro
If you're looking for rise you'll have to try harder.
Your just a petrolhead troll trolling an EV thread and feign getting all upset and self-righteous whe called out by Daffy. My troll tag was removed, I'd be suggesting you be given one if they were still being attributed.
You have a personal grudge against me that I note on numerous threads. A stream of insults.
Thank you to everyone who replied on the ID3 braking issue. Sounds like I need to play around with the auto-hold settings!
stop shitting on this one
He won't, he's like a dog with a bone. As are you, apparently. Take it to DMs if you need to no-one else is interested 🙂
Daffy started the Squirrelking slagging off EVs list, I'll add
6/page 20, electrocution risk if you unplug your EV battery - (anyone intend to do that?)
7/ pages 21 and 22 fire risk - when in fact petrol vehicles have 100 x the risk of catching fire!
8/ slagging off EDF and electricity production: nuclear etc. somewhere in the page 20s
9/ Batteries use finite resources. page 32. - So do lots of things but finite doesn't mean there isn't enough
10/ weight reduces range page 32 - but nowhere near as much as a bit more wieght adds range. The Zoé more than doubled its range with around 7% weight increase.
Red herrings, spurious anti-EV propaganda.
Page 22 is where there's some pretty unpleasant xenophobic stuff aimed at me.
@nickewen mine has only slammed the brakes on when I've been reversing slowly into the local Osprey charger bay, I assumed it was because the car thought I was too close to the charger / signpost / barrier. Didn't realise it might be because I'm lifting a butt cheek on looking over my shoulder. BTW, the 2019 Tesla M3 I previously had for 2 years used to slam the brakes on quite often during general driving although I could usually anticipate it.
Daffy started the Squirrelking slagging off EVs list
Still don't care.
Still don’t care.
But care enough to type you don't care. You have had a grudge against me since I denounced the i-Dave fad diet, Molgrips. You do care but couldn't possibly be seen to agree with me or Daffy. 🙂
Do you think you could all stop it now please?
There are people on here who want to ask about EVs.
There are people on here with EVs who want to help, answer questions and exchange experiences.
It’s very hard to do any of that with the petty bickering.
It should Ok for a bit someone has won a holiday.
He won’t, he’s like a dog with a bone. As are you, apparently. Take it to DMs if you need to no-one else is interested 🙂
You're right, point taken, I'd very much like to just discuss EVs.
Sorry everyone.
Yay, I'm joining the club next month by the looks of it. VW ID4 incoming, I was convinced I wouldn't get on with it but it just felt more practical for what we do than the Ioniq 5/EV6 and made the e-niro seem very small.
Managed to get one that is sat on a boat in dock waiting to be unloaded so avoided a 40 week wait. Does mean it's white, might have to up my car cleaning game.
Nice. Enjoy!
might have to up my car cleaning game.
Life's too short 🙂
VW ID4 incoming
Good choice.
My delivery keeps getting pushed back. May now but I suspect it'll be later. Reckon July.
Fiat 500 inbound... wasn't going to get one this year but our car has suddenly started getting expensive so its time to make the change. Feeling quite oddly excited by the idea.
Doing the figures for an EV. Home charging is ok but I’ll have to charge out on the road a fair bit. I’m seeing 30-80p per kw. That works out at over twice the cost per mile compared to my current 55mpg diesel. The lease on the EV is already £200 more so it’s gonna cost an awful lot more to run, I’m also reading rumours of cost per mile for road fund licence so add that in and the days of cheap motoring are long gone, are EV users just accepting this is how it’s going to be ?
No. I’m fitting home a solar/battery system, which along with an EV/off peak electricity deal makes it much cheaper.
There are also much cheaper options for charging away from home.
Took delivery of ours a couple of weeks ago, Octavia iV. First impressions are it's great!
The claimed electric range is a bit dubious, a full charge puts 31 miles on the battery, in full electric mode I reckon it's much less than that. Not got an accurate measurement though.
But it doesn't really matter, for local pottering about it's fine, charge only needed every other day mostly.
I've done some motorway runs and used hybrid mode. Apparently achieved 70mpg, but again it's early days yet so I'll see how that plays out.
The car is lovely, equivalent to an SE L. Got some great gadgets on it, acc, lane assist, speed limit recognition, auto boot lid and the interior is lovely! Immediate happy convert to auto box as well, what is the point in manuals!?
Got a charger on order, but install date not for a few weeks yet unfortunately.
Good choice.
My delivery keeps getting pushed back. May now but I suspect it’ll be later. Reckon July.
Thanks, managed to find one that worked in stock at one of the other sites for the local dealership and was able to get hold of it.
Supply situation is mental, whilst we were there sorting things out there was a couple in that'd sacked off an ICE order because it had been over 8 months and still no delivery date. Went for a white one as otherwise they thought December at best.
Took delivery of ours a couple of weeks ago, Octavia iV. First impressions are it’s great!
The claimed electric range is a bit dubious, a full charge puts 31 miles on the battery, in full electric mode I reckon it’s much less than that. Not got an accurate measurement though.
Range will probably be a bit lower at the moment. I’ve had my A250e for almost a year now. I was regularly getting 40 miles out of a charge during the spring/summer, but generally only hitting 30-32 miles at the moment.
Any recommendations or advice on ones to avoid on home chargers? I've got requests for quotes out on zappi, ohme and VW are sending me a link for pod point.
I've only got a 60A fuse on the incoming supply but have got a request for info on uprating that with the DNO as I'm guessing that's a bit weedy.
days of cheap motoring are long gone, are EV users just accepting this is how it’s going to be ?
The price of fuel is going up.
Are all of your journeys going to give 55mpg? Folk always remember the highest they get but not the average mpg when working out costs.
Road pricing is some way off, I'd not worry about that yet but rightly so the Government have to think about how they'll fill the 36bn black hole in the finances of no fuel duty or VED.
Moving to EV isn't just about the financials (although it is cheaper for me with home charging), its about the car itself and the better quiet ride or its about wanting to do your part and reduce the sh*t we all breathe in or pollute the planet with.
Re: charge points. My podpoint just works, install was great. It doesn't have any smart features, all the timing etc is managed by the car, if that's what you want I can recommend one.
I’ve only got a 60A fuse on the incoming supply but have got a request for info on uprating that with the DNO as I’m guessing that’s a bit weedy.
I have the Andersen A2 with the optional adaptive fuse . It will throttle back when there are other big currents being drawn in the house.
There is no need for an earth rod either.
The installer arranged for the DNO to upgrade main fuse to 100 amp which they did a month after install. Very neat unit , 8.5m cable and it all gets hidden inside main box (and cleaned on integral brushes as you wind it back on)
so it’s gonna cost an awful lot more to run
Yes you have to want an electric car. And want to pay the extra for it.
Or hope you have a convienantly placed free public charger near by
Doing the figures for an EV. Home charging is ok but I’ll have to charge out on the road a fair bit. I’m seeing 30-80p per kw
Show your working? For me, I am getting 4.5 miles per kWh on motorway trips (weirdly this varies a lot less in winter than the urban driving does). At a Gridserve charging point it's 45p/kWh so that's 10p/mile. I'm always starting off with a full battery at 5p/mile so that still makes it comparable with a good diesel on a long trip, but I appreciate that if you are always on the road you may not be able to do that.
Don't pay 80p/kWh, you don't need to. Ionity is 80p (I think) but if you are on the road a lot it's well worth a subscription via your manufacturer - My Hyundai in my case, or VW We Charge in yours - and you'll pay 45p/kWh and a flat £5.99/mo or 25p/kWh and £13.99/mo. But there are plenty of Gridserve chargers around and there'll only be more. And prices will come right down as more chargers go in.
Yes you have to want an electric car.
Nah it's not expensive for most people who have a driveway. Costs me under £2 to drive the 80 miles to my parents and back, versus about £20 on diesel. The diesel is ten times the cost. And the lease we are paying is no more than a similar diesel car.
No. I’m fitting home a solar/battery system, which along with an EV/off peak electricity deal makes it much cheaper.
What are you going for? I’ve vaguely half thought about this. Really though I don’t think an East / West facing roof in Scotland is going to do particularly well without doubling up on panels and putting them on both sides. Which sounds very expensive.
Nah it’s not expensive for most people who have a driveway. Costs me under £2 to drive the 80 miles to my parents and back, versus about £20 on diesel.
Similar cost saving for us, my commute costs at least £12 (probably nearer £15) in diesel and now usually costs under £1.50, unless I’m nightshift when it costs up to £4.50
I’m not quite sure what that’s going to go up to when my fixed energy deal expires in a few months. It’s also much more convenient than having to put diesel in every few days.
And prices will come right down as more chargers go in.
The price is dictated by wholesale electricity costs. Volume will reduce it a bit but fundamentally it's a traded commodity.
The price is dictated by wholesale electricity costs. Volume will reduce it a bit but fundamentally it’s a traded commodity.
The wholesale price is yes but public chargers are putting a huge markup on that. The markup will come down.
The wholesale price is yes but public chargers are putting a huge markup on that. The markup will come down.
I buy electricity and supply it to public chargepoints. Would you care to guess what the current markup is?
Dunno. I was talking about the markup between the charge point suppliers and the end consumer. I'd assumed that was high be ause Gridserve and co are expanding and EVs are currently being bought by richer people so they are milking it whilst they can before widespread adoption and competition forces prices down.
Do tell.
And the lease we are paying is no more than a similar diesel car.
What car is this? I can't find any electric car leases for the same cost as their diesel counterpart. I have been looking recently.
I'm not going to disclose which chargepoints, but once you account for borrowing and maintenance costs, we're currently making a loss. You need to remember that the domestic electricity market is capped at a lower unit price than you can buy electricity wholesale.
I assume everyone is leasing ? Be it company or private schemes ? The 'all in' schemes look interesting (maintenance and insurance).
With covid, things have changed a bit for us. We're both WFH at least part of the time, and I've switched back to cycle commuting when in the office, so buying any new car is a waste at present.
Had I been in the office 5 days a week, then I'd probably have got a city electric car as we get free recharging at work, but still kept the ICE cars for longer journies. As it's happened we've picked up a cheap Aygo for daughter to learn in and to bail petrol head son out whilst he replaces a blown engine. Plan is MrsF or me uses that for the commute/shopping as MPG in town is in the high 50's.
What car is this? I can’t find any electric car leases for the same cost as their diesel counterpart. I have been looking recently.
my experiance also .
for those that look at not only the point of use cost but the total life time cost of owning a vehicle
MY spreadsheet for costs said at my milage it would take 12 years to get to break even.
The more you drive the less time that takes but the car is the main issue - not the propulsion method.
"picked up a cheap Aygo"
Hard to argue with that for low cost low impact motoring for those that do low milage. Ended up doing the same my self.
Thanks for the insight @ransos
I can’t find any electric car leases for the same cost as their diesel counterpart.
Mine is an Ioniq and is costing £206/mo for 10k miles over 2 years. It's not that cheap now though, so my experience might be out of date! It was significantly cheaper than any of the other cars I'd actually want at the time.
Cheapest EV on Autotrader now is a VW up at £227, with a similarly specced petrol at £199.
£287 for a Golf base spec, £329 for an ID.3 which I suppose you could consider higher spec if you wanted to, since it's equivalent to an auto.
Can anyone recommend a resource that'll show expected charging times e.g.
If I got car X at 77kw battery its full charging times from below are...?
a) 3 pin plug
b) 7kw charger...
...etc
Thanks
the other thing i found when shopping over the last 3 months is .....
can get a heavy discount on brand new diesel/petrol models.
no ones budging on electric models from RRP (widening the payback time)
Also being quoted anywhere from 6 months to "unknown" on electric models. - and being fair - also on some diesel models - but for the most part diesel and petrol much more availible.
hence buying of an aygo style car till things calm down.
MAny of these issues go away if leasing and the payback gap does come down if your going from a leased diesel car to a leased electric car by the mechanics of leasing... but if your used to buying/owning for a long time then its fair jump in monetary terms to go to a lease.
I did a 600 mile round trip in the e-Tron on Friday down to Cheshire and back.
Proper 4 seasons in 1 day stuff, with heavy snow on the A702 south of Edinburgh.
On the way south, I turned up at the Ionity charger at Gretna services to find it fully occupied (4 chargers) with 2 others waiting. Only had to wait 15 mins before plugging in though.
It was interesting that there were 4 Porsche Tacyans, a Mercedes EQC and another e-Tron charging or in the queue; all at the premium end of the scale. I guess hardly surprising when it costs 69p per kwh.
The next stop was at Charnock Richard on a, Ecotricity charger. It's interesting that the on screen display shows a 120 kW charge speed, but it only charged at 50 kW, which is what is also reported on Zapmap. At 30p it was pretty cheap.
I suspect that charging added 2 hours to the total journey time - not bad, but not great either. We definitely need more faster chargers.
It was interesting that there were 4 Porsche Tacyans, a Mercedes EQC and another e-Tron charging or in the queue; all at the premium end of the scale. I guess hardly surprising when it costs 69p per kwh.
The other possibility is that they are heavy users for work e.g. reps etc, because they will be paying a lot less than 69p.
Can anyone recommend a resource that’ll show expected charging times e.g.
If I got car X at 77kw battery its full charging times from below are…?
a) 3 pin plug
b) 7kw charger…
…etc
Thanks
A 3 pin plug granny cable, typically delivers about 3kW per hour, so the charge will take 77/3 = 25 and a bit hours from dead to brimmed.
7 kW - 11 hours
etc. etc.
Except charging isn't completely linear, it slows down as the battery reaches capacity, but for route planning etc., simple division works. Just remember that you're very rarely charging from empty.
https://www.electrical-installation.org/enwiki/Electric_Vehicle_and_EV_charging_fundamentals
The other possibility is that they are heavy users for work e.g. reps etc, because they will be paying a lot less than 69p.
Quite possibly, or on subscriptions free with the car etc. Either way, there were no Zoes or Leafs waiting.
richardkennerley
Full MemberTook delivery of ours a couple of weeks ago, Octavia iV. First impressions are it’s great!
The claimed electric range is a bit dubious, a full charge puts 31 miles on the battery, in full electric mode I reckon it’s much less than that. Not got an accurate measurement though.
I have had one of these for a couple of months now. I have a 15 mile each way commute and I very nearly do it on one charge there and back. I have a hilly Cumbrian run but back roads so 60 mph max. I am more careful accelerating in this to keep the battery energy usage at around the halfway point on the energy/rev counter dial. I have only had two days above 8 degrees and that seems to step the range up.
I think the car is great and the switch between battery and engine is seemless and sometimes I would not realise it had happened but I can see the revs on the dial. I have done about 2,500 miles in it with three 200 mile trips and one 100 mile trip pulling a caravan over the A66 from Cumbria over the pennines to Scotch Corner route and the petrol usage is about 7.5p per mile. I have electric on top of that of course although it is free at my place of work. I am paying 16.7p for my electricity as we more than likely charge during the day and my wife often does the school run in this car, electric use works out less than half the cost of petrol.
On the long runs I think it works out similar in total cost to my old diesel Qashqai