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I can't begin to imagine the ball ache involved in trying to hook up to a charger whilst towing a caravan
I agree it is a big factor. I would be pretty relaxed north of the border from what I have seen. We have had this on our minds recently and there are some hurdles. Chargers heading to a recent holiday in Norfolk on the A roads looked like they would be quite tricky to negotiate. Some services it can be difficult or even impossible to drive from the caravan parking back to the main car park. Any trip for us would be the shorter variety and I would have to do some checking for spaces on line.
Yes, some places in Wales you might be looking at leaving the van in a lay-by with a sign in the window telling the cops you're EV charging, then driving to find one. But again, if you can leave the motorway with 150 miles you can get basically anywhere in Wales, you can pitch up then either trickle charge at your site or head out for an AC somewhere. Far less convenient, ofc, but doable. At least for now. That said, caravanners will probably be the last cohort to move to EV so the providers have a good few years to get their act together.
I'm finding my EV6 a bit bulky but that may be because im used to the higher driving position in a Sportage, that said compared to the vehicles above its a skinny 1995mm wide.
That said our tiny Fiat 500 is still 1893 wide so only 12mm narrower.
@winston in a sane world we'd start by taxing lifestyle vans to death as they are much bigger, heavier and often highly polluting.
Think something might be a bit wrong with your data there? According to this site an EV6 is around 20cm wider than a Fiat 500 with or without mirrors
Not that I'm nit picking, it just sounded odd given how big an EV6 looks!
One of the nieghbours in my close has just got an Alpine 290.. cute little thing!
Trying to convince him to bring it to a track sometime soon to really see what it can do!
Nice array of racing/driving aids and dials on the steering wheel, including an "overtake boost", which gives you more power for 10 seconds!
DrP
One of the nieghbours in my close has just got an Alpine 290.. cute little thing!
Parked next to the convertible Bentley.....natch.
There's a R5 (not the Alpine version) near us in the green colour - looks very nice. Still think that the bright yellow looks best though.
Parked next to the convertible Bentley.....natch.
He's also got a stake in a lovely Porche, and sold a Yaris GR to get the Alpine....
Funnily, he NEVER drove the Yaris GR at all. If I had that, and his money and time (benefit of no kids eh!), I'd have been razzing up and down race tracks all round the planet!! It must have just sat in his garage depreciating by thousands before being sold..
Great guy though, and it's his first EV so we've been chatting about the 'mindset' needed for EV ownership.
He DOES seem up for a trip to Spa and the Nurburgring next year though, which could be fun!
DrP
One of the nieghbours in my close has just got an Alpine 290.. cute little thing!
Trying to convince him to bring it to a track sometime soon to really see what it can do!
Nice array of racing/driving aids and dials on the steering wheel, including an "overtake boost", which gives you more power for 10 seconds!
DrP
Awesome little thing, didn't realise you could get a factory towbar added. Very neat.
Not particularly interesting, but drove my first ever EV today.
Our company has a Kia E-Niro pool car - it's perhaps 5 years old (70 plate).
I had to visit a supplier about 10 miles up the road so tried it out.
Once I got past familiarising myself with the important controls, it was very much just like driving an automatic car. It seemed pretty rapid, although I just tootled along it it apart from a couple of foot-down squirts. It didn't feel like a car that wanted to be 'hustled' along.
I played around with the regen levels a bit - it made quite a difference to how the car drove.
Ride was very jittery. It bounced over the top of the road which I feel would be a bit wearing on long country road journeys. I have heard this mentioned in a lot of EV reviews, as the manufacturers try to balance car control with the added weight of the batteries.
It looks like you can get a 2nd-hand one with ~50k miles for around £12500 which seems pretty good value for money. Just a shame they look so bland.
My Polestar 4 was delivered yesterday.
Initial thoughts - Magnesium is more dirty white than silver 🙄
Setting up my phone as the ket only took me a couple of attempts and is liberating if not a little unsettling when you just walk away from the car without actively either switching it off or locking it.
The performance is mental (Dual Motor Long Range). Far too stupidly quick IMHO, but it was the best deal.
I took it to Edinburgh last night (100 mile round trip) coming back in the dark and the pixel lights are weird, deciding where to point based on what the cameras tell it.
The lack or rear window is ok, I quite like the rear view mirror screen, but it's no use for checking how suave I look in my sunnies.
Lost all sound - including indicator clicks that needed a soft reboot of the infotainment centre and the profile stuff needs a bit of work, but on the whole I'll give it a solid 7.5 out of 10 for initial impressions.
Lost all sound - including indicator clicks that needed a soft reboot of the infotainment centre
On any new car (or an "old" car for that matter) that sort of shit is unacceptable - makes you wonder what else could go wrong 🤷♂️
Lost all sound - including indicator clicks that needed a soft reboot of the infotainment centre
On any new car (or an "old" car for that matter) that sort of shit is unacceptable - makes you wonder what else could go wrong 🤷♂️
I had that on my Volvo XC40 - so same Google underpinnings. Really weird that ALL sound goes via the infotainment system.
Dealer said it just happens - it's Google...
Only once thankfully.
Ride was very jittery.
Manufacturers seem to be pitching these things as premium, which usually means big wheels and really low profile tyres which are terrible. You can often get smaller wheels (with bigger tyres) as an option from new, but not many people choose them. Customers are idiots.
I'm a self-confessed petrol head - but this sort of thing gets me interested. I'm more likely to buy something like this than a £50k Polestar as I don't do many miles. Without the constraints of the usual engine drivetrain it gives designers so much more freedom. Now all they need to do is pop a convertible 2 seater body on this floorplan and it would make a great, fun little 'sportscar'...
Regarding the Polestar 4 width. I’ve had mine since Feb, and fingers crossed no alloy scratches yet. It’s about the same width as an Audi Q5 suv, so not massive, but here’s the thing-the doors are long AND wide, so any car park (particularly older multi story style), when hemmed in is an absolute nightmare to get out of when parked. I’ve resorted to letting everyone out first, then parking slightly over so there’s enough room for me to get out. Not a new thing, but I always park the furthest possible distance away from other cars just so I can get in/out.
Apart from that, and it randomly not letting me in when it’s raining I think it’s ace.
Manufacturers seem to be pitching these things as premium, which usually means big wheels and really low profile tyres which are terrible. You can often get smaller wheels (with bigger tyres) as an option from new, but not many people choose them. Customers are idiots.
I am not 100% sure, but the internet seems to suggest standard wheel size was 17" with the option of 18s. And I think they are the standard ones - they are the wheel you see on virtually all Niro EVs of that age.
They don't seem 'rubber band' silly in terms of tyres fitted & it wasn't crashy like I'd expect in a car with low profile tyres; just a stiff & jiggly ride quality.
My Leon estate has 18" wheels with quote low profile tyres (225/40) and has better ride quality, even though it supposedly has stiffer springs & is lower than standard because it's the FR trim level.
My in-laws have the newer Kia Niro but that's a hybrid rather than full-ev. I've sat in that a few times & the ride quality is definitely better. Not sure if that's the fact that it's not a full-ev or just because it's a newer more refined design.
Anyway - just an observation really & probably not something that would put me off buying one although if I was considering getting one I'd want to take it on some local roads on an extended test drive.
Corsa e with 17" wheels occasionally has a skippy feel to it. Cheap new tyres didn't make much difference but part of me thinks some of it might be due to the 36psi in them to accommodate the 1600kg? My ioniq EV doesn't skip tho with a 16" rim, deeper tyre, 36psi and a similiar 1600kg. Wheelbase is longer tho.
I have officially had it with my Lexus RZ – we have had a couple of longer journeys over the last couple of weeks – both around 130 miles each way.
Journey one – Daytime, 100% battery at the start, cruise control on and 70mph all the way (apart from the last 30 mins when I was happy we'd get there on a charge and went a little bit quicker). Got there with approx 20% battery left. Charged it at our friend's house and it had 85% charge for the return leg (night-time so lights were on). I thought I'd be okay given the 80% drain on the outward leg, but took it a bit easier just in case (65mph on the cruise-control). However it became clear we weren't going to make it so about halfway home we switched off the radio and heating. With about 15 miles to go I was getting very nervous about making it so slowed to 40mph. Got home with 2% charge left.
Journey two – Again, daytime outward journey, used about 80% again, charged back to 100% and came back at night. Started the journey with heating on (individual seats, not the entire cabin) and ended up limping home at 40mph for the last part of the journey with all luxuries turned off again, and got home with <10% charge left.
THe car has a claimed 245 mile range – it is shocking that it can only manage just over half of that and it's crazy that we are being reduced to sitting in a cold car and taking longer to complete journeys.
My e-Tron was wider than the Polestar 4. I'm looking forward to it feeling quite svelte 🙂
It wont because the P4 mirrors hardly folder in at all compared to most other cars and you judge width from the car itself not the mirrors. Most cars you can account 250mm for the mirror fold in for P4 it’s 130mm.
For perspective it’s wider (mirrors folded) than a RR Cullinan and that’s massive.
My e-Tron was wider than the Polestar 4. I'm looking forward to it feeling quite svelte 🙂
It wont because the P4 mirrors hardly folder in at all compared to most other cars and you judge width from the car itself not the mirrors. Most cars you can account 250mm for the mirror fold in for P4 it’s 130mm.
It feels narrower to me when I'm parking it in the EDI multi storey. YMMV
I have officially had it with my Lexus RZ – we have had a couple of longer journeys over the last couple of weeks – both around 130 miles each way.
Journey one – Daytime, 100% battery at the start, cruise control on and 70mph all the way (apart from the last 30 mins when I was happy we'd get there on a charge and went a little bit quicker). Got there with approx 20% battery left. Charged it at our friend's house and it had 85% charge for the return leg (night-time so lights were on). I thought I'd be okay given the 80% drain on the outward leg, but took it a bit easier just in case (65mph on the cruise-control). However it became clear we weren't going to make it so about halfway home we switched off the radio and heating. With about 15 miles to go I was getting very nervous about making it so slowed to 40mph. Got home with 2% charge left.
Journey two – Again, daytime outward journey, used about 80% again, charged back to 100% and came back at night. Started the journey with heating on (individual seats, not the entire cabin) and ended up limping home at 40mph for the last part of the journey with all luxuries turned off again, and got home with <10% charge left.
THe car has a claimed 245 mile range – it is shocking that it can only manage just over half of that and it's crazy that we are being reduced to sitting in a cold car and taking longer to complete journeys.
Well, yes, but almost every site seems to say 215max and 155highway in colder weather and it has been cold in the evenings.. Given the very strong winds we've also had recently, I'd wager this also has a bearing. It has the aerodynamics of a block house, so the faster you go the worse it will get.
Turning the heating off barely makes any difference, at least if you have a heat pump, on a longer trip. It probably won't be the difference between stopping and getting home.
Turning the heating off barely makes any difference, at least if you have a heat pump, on a longer trip. It probably won't be the difference between stopping and getting home.
It certainly makes a difference in my car.
I have officially had it with my Lexus RZ – we have had a couple of longer journeys over the last couple of weeks – both around 130 miles each way.
<snip>
Not great, you've checked tyre pressures etc?
I have officially had it with my Lexus RZ
I think I'd be pretty cheesed off with that to be honest - only getting ~50-60% of the claimed range on a new car.
Stupid question, but you have checked things like tyre pressures?
Have you gone back to the dealer & spoken to them about it?
If I had a diesel that was supposed to be getting 60mpg, I'd probably be OK with it getting 50mpg. But if I was only getting 35mpg I'd expect there to be a fault and not for it to be 'just one of those things'.
Assuming you are driving 'normally' on a mix of 'normal terrain/conditions', at what point are you being mis-sold a car?
I think I'd be pretty cheesed off with that to be honest - only getting ~50-60% of the claimed range on a new car.
Stupid question, but you have checked things like tyre pressures?Have you gone back to the dealer & spoken to them about it?
Tyre pressures are all okay. There is a software fix apparently, but everything I have read about it says that it basically doesn't do anything. Unfortunately the main dealer is almost an hour's drive away so I won't do it until it needs a service.
And yes - driving normally (for the vast majority of the time) on a mix of roads - 14,000 miles in a year and the average over that time is 2.8kwh.
I nearly completed a 200 mile round trip in my 38.3kwh useable hyundai ioniq my2020 last weekend. Consisting of mixed roads, hills, fast A, Mway, B, C and a few goes at reversing in to parking spots. On arrival at the destination the trip computer said 100 miles of distance and the range remaining was pretty much 100 miles. 5.1m/kwh, just over 2hrs driving. A mixture of adaptive cruise control and manual control of the the cars energy systems.
My return journey was slightly different at the start but overall 95% was a reversal of the outbound route. Weather was ok.
I opted for adding 5kwh at Skipton as I was nearing 25% battery remaining and then for the last 8 miles i opted for the A roads rather than the dual carriage way to nurse the car home! Made it back with 6%.
If the ioniq had a 50kwh battery it would be heavier and probably nearly as efficient.
My range capabilities are above the published numbers by hyundai.
Turning the heating off barely makes any difference, at least if you have a heat pump, on a longer trip. It probably won't be the difference between stopping and getting home.
It certainly makes a difference in my car.
In Mrs OD's car normal heating on/off makes no difference. A/C heating or cooling makes about 5 to 10 percent depending on how fast you are going ie it's a lower proportion of total energy usage at motorway speed as opposed to 30 mph. We tend not to have A/C on that much anyway - only in bursts when it's really hot
More generally we get at least the advertised 4 miles per KWh efficiency from the car (often more) and it's a 3 year old Kia Soul - so I'm surprised newer cars are not hitting their marks especially by so much
Also, I have just checked, and on my recent trips I mentioned above, the App says I had >90% efficiency scores.
Recently took delivery of a Renault 5 for bike carrying purposes, spec'd with tow bar to add a rear carrier which I think can also be retrofit. We had dealer fit ours which involves taking a jig saw to a brand new car to make a hole 🤣 you'd think a factory option would be better developed. Anyway seems to work well enough did a long trip to try out both bikes and car, range wise we were looking at 150 miles with bikes at 70mph but would be nearer to 200 at 60mph. I put on charge when I stopped for coffee which jammed 10% more electrons in before we'd sat down, nearer 50% by the time we'd left, no apps just contactless. All relatively stress free and as nice to do long distance as our previous car Mercedes C Class, and pretty much better everywhere else.
no apps just contactless
I think you pay more for contactless at InstaVolt compared to using an app
That looks really smart ! We may go for a 5 next year if replacing my wife’s A1…
out of interest, how does the bike carrier stack up with loading limits with those 2 heavy e-bikes on it ?
It certainly makes a difference in my car.
Interested in this. Our car has an energy monitor screen (most do if you dig around, I think) and it shows that whilst we might be using 10-12kW driving along the motorway, we are using about 2-300W in mild conditions and 5-600 in the hottest and coldest we see. So it's maybe 5% at worst. The only time it is significant is when you are in slow urban traffic on a short trip - then you are using 5kW driving and about 2kW whilst the car's warming up, so 40%.
If you have an energy monitor screen, let us know how much power the A/C is using. It's worth noting that in our car the actual fan consumption goes under the car electronics, not the heating.
@fooman that 5 looks superb. One is on the list to replace Mrs OTS's Hynudai Kona in the the near future.
How much the heating affects your range is a function of the battery size, journey length and efficiency. Large battery and generally poor efficiency, means that an extra 2-4kw of usage over an hour or two will be 3-5% of range, but small car with high efficiency means that the 2-4kw used might be around 10% of the range.
FWIW Johndoh. Your consumption figures are similar to my iPace. I get 3miles/kWh. A twin motor BMW or merc would get around the same. Is yours a twin motor model?
FWIW Johndoh. Your consumption figures are similar to my iPace. I get 3miles/kWh. A twin motor BMW or merc would get around the same. Is yours a twin motor model?
Yes - and it also has the larger wheels that affect the range too.
Ohh, and the car has four driving modes; Sport, Normal, Eco and Range – we almost always have it in Eco mode (and it was in that mode for the journeys I mentioned above).
That looks really smart ! We may go for a 5 next year if replacing my wife’s A1…
out of interest, how does the bike carrier stack up with loading limits with those 2 heavy e-bikes on it ?
I went for the 3 bike rack which has 60kg capacity and weights about 15kg so 75kg in total on the tow bar sounds about right. They are just big trail bikes not ebikes, mine is longer than the rack is meant to hold but works ok. The rack is actually a Peruzzo Pure Instinct, not seen one before but seems solid, my bike XL Nukeproof Reactor is a little too long on paper but fits ok. I doubt you'd get 3 big bikes on, but I figured that'd be the case and went for the 3 bike carrier out of caution. You can get base and strap extensions from Amazon, probably get a GeoMetron on with those.
Good to know, thanks
I have officially had it with my Lexus RZ – we have had a couple of longer journeys over the last couple of weeks – both around 130 miles each way.
Journey one – Daytime, 100% battery at the start, cruise control on and 70mph all the way (apart from the last 30 mins when I was happy we'd get there on a charge and went a little bit quicker). Got there with approx 20% battery left. Charged it at our friend's house and it had 85% charge for the return leg (night-time so lights were on). I thought I'd be okay given the 80% drain on the outward leg, but took it a bit easier just in case (65mph on the cruise-control). However it became clear we weren't going to make it so about halfway home we switched off the radio and heating. With about 15 miles to go I was getting very nervous about making it so slowed to 40mph. Got home with 2% charge left.
Journey two – Again, daytime outward journey, used about 80% again, charged back to 100% and came back at night. Started the journey with heating on (individual seats, not the entire cabin) and ended up limping home at 40mph for the last part of the journey with all luxuries turned off again, and got home with <10% charge left.
THe car has a claimed 245 mile range – it is shocking that it can only manage just over half of that and it's crazy that we are being reduced to sitting in a cold car and taking longer to complete journeys.
Check which battery is feeding your seats and radio. In my EV6 they are powered by the 12V battery rather than the main drive battery and have no effect on range.
For info, on a full charge I get about 290 miles in the summer and about 220 miles in winter. A mixture of commuting, town driving and motorway driving results in about 3.8m/kWhr in summer and about 3.0m/kWhr in winter.
Keeping it around 60-65mph on motorways is noticeably more efficient than 70mph.
THe car has a claimed 245 mile range – it is shocking that it can only manage just over half of that and it's crazy that we are being reduced to sitting in a cold car and taking longer to complete journeys.You do know that the 245 miles will be against a standardised test cycle. Average speed for most test cycles is about 45-50kph. Doing 70mph (112kph) will give you about 6 times the drag. (So probably 5 times the energy consumption, depending on cooling load etc)
Yes, i know it's a massive simplification as the test cycle includes accelerations, decelerations and tops out at over 100kph. (But only for 5 minutes, which is about 20% of the test.)
I think it's crazy that people can look at a standardised test result and try and shoehorn it into their specific use case, and then complain when they fail, rather than using it as a benchmark against other vehicles in the same class.
we almost always have it in Eco mode (and it was in that mode for the journeys I mentioned above).Eco mode usually makes the biggest difference at low speeds and city driving (even then it won't add much).
In most cars it minimises AC/climate use, dulls throttle response and will try to optimise motor usage (you have two) towards an economic/minimal loss profile and you take a hit on response times and performance.
Driving at 70mph it can't really save you anything, it's going to take xxkW to drive at 70 whichever mode you are in. Even if it goes into a lower suspension setting (improved aero) it's only going to save you a couple of percent.
I've been doing a lot of miles back and forth in a big pick-up at the moment - circa £150/pw in diesel, so have been curiously eyeing the ID7 (GTX Plus). Decent range, sporty enough, apparently a nice place to sit. I was picking up some very reasonable lease deals when searching - £450/ish a month over 2 years with £3.5k deposit. This was for 'in stock' vehicles. They all seem to have disappeared almost overnight and looking at £7-800 now for factory orders, which is much less appealing obviously
Depends on mileage, but this isn't far from your numbers
You have to move quickly though as deals come and go.
Twin motor cars are just significantly less efficient at most things unless they can disconnect the motor. Coupled to a very unaerodynamic shape, you’re doomed to failure.
What I will say is that city or highway makes little difference, neither does eco vs dynamic. And on the motorway at 70, I get around 20% less than pootling around.
Mine also has the truck wheels (22s) :-/
SUV in aerodynamics of a brick shocker!
@johndoh if you are worried about running out of charge why don't you stop and charge for 10 minutes instead of trying to limp back home?
SUV in aerodynamics of a brick shocker!
@johndoh if you are worried about running out of charge why don't you stop and charge for 10 minutes instead of trying to limp back home?
Blimey , my Id Buzz has the aero of a breeze block and returns a fairly good range, compared to the Lexus.
That actual range is quite shocking , but highlights the fact that you should do extensive research when selecting an EV to check its real world range. Just having a google , and it seems 180 is doing well .
i spoke to a dealer a few months ago and asked why they didn’t show the real world mileages of their EV’s. The answer was because they’d never sell them if they did 😂
3-4 months into owning/running an EV I think there is a change on mindset needed about expected range. After many decades of ICE driving you are almost hardwired to thinking urban is bad and the sweet spot is cruising at 50-55mph. Realising that EVs are actually at their best around towns in terms of efficiency and motorway speeds are their total efficiency kryptonite takes a bit of getting your head around (even though it makes total logical sense and it's the quirks of combustion engines that has made you think the way you have for so long). Hills and wind also make a difference. I live at 200m and work at sea level and the prevailing wind is also on my tail in the mornings. My commute in manages about 0.8m/kw average more than my way home.
As autumn turns the temperature down (this morning's commute was 3 degs) it's interesting watching my 80% charged predicted range drop a little. The car reckons I'll travel about 20miles less from 80% now than it did in August - so 168miles instead of 188miles.