Digging deeper is no myth, just different to what you think it is.
Define it then, cynic-al. Athletes have a psysiological limit beyond which no amount of mental grit will produce anymore power. On the contrary it will simply put the athlete into the red and the athlete will slow down.
Have you ever done or watched a VO2 max test? Whether it's you on the bike or someone else it doesn't take many runs to find the point at which the body's ability to absorb and transport oxygen is reached and the athlete goes into the red.
Trying to push harder when already at 180bmp and breathing hard soon resulted in a loss of coordination, a break down in style (especially on skis), my head starting to swim, balance going. All these problems resulting in slower progress than recognising the signs of being at the threshold and maintaining that level.
And this would explain why you're not a professional athlete, household name or hero to the masses. Pros dig deep, everyone else finds excuses.
No, Don, the reason I'm not a professional athlete is that some people have higher physiological limits than me. On the same test protocol and at similar heart rates Bernard Hinault (similar weight and build) produced 450W. I really doubt he suffered anymore than me to arrive at that result.
All the doping methods that have proved so succesful in recent years have increased the psysiological limits rather than the mental limits. For example, more red blood cells (EPO and other hormones or blood transfussions) means more oxygen to the muscles which can then function at higher rates for longer
I really doubt he suffered anymore than me to arrive at that result.
I imagine he could just dig deeper and ignore any pain and suffering though.
I've done a couple actually, 430W IIRC.
It's about more or different things than you think, is my point.
EDIT...are you a sportive racer?
Edukator speaks the truth. If you've ever raced with a HRM, and ridden in a break, using the same HRM to gauge your effort, going just into the red when on the front, then recovering in the few available seconds until it's your turn again, if you've ever been spat out of the back of the leading bunch watching your heart rate climb past what you assumed was your maximum but still unable to do anything, the idea of 'digging deeper' is a nonsense.
There are physiological limits, and those limits cannot be stretched or altered or redefined by any mental process.
Read this: http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/?pg=fullstory&id=9207
Note this:
[i]PEZ: When we were organising this interview, you referred to pro cycling as "disgusting" - why ?
DW: Because it's run by small minded people who put winning at any price above all normal moral and ethical considerations.
And nothing has changed - only the money has improved.
The size of the bloody ego of the average Elite athlete borders on pathological.
Ironically, all of the true greats - Lemond, Kelly, Hinualt, Indurain have that "extra" that makes them more than just their wins - they have humility.
Doping is rife; has always been and is now far more effective.
[b]Anyone who can't understand that EPO, HGH and the rest give so great an advantage that without it all you can hope for is the leftovers, just doesn't understand physiology[/b]. [/i]
cynic-al - Member
EDIT...are you a sportive racer?
😆
430W eh, unless you're a real porker that makes you a national champion at least, cynic-al. Chris Boardman was measured at 442W.
Reply to your edit, cynic-al:
I've done a few cyclosportives. 102nd from the third wave in the Etape du Tour 97. My main sport is/was winter triathlon with top ten results in the French national championships and world cup events. With only 350 sustainable Watts on tap.
Average 387, max 428.
What educkator said
If you can put out an average sustainable power of 387W I would expect a maximum power of two or three times that, more like 800W. If your max is 428 I really doubt you can sustain more than 250W up a Col, cynic-al.
I'm not arguing against the laws of physiology (tho I'd win if did 😀 ) just saying digging deep is not just about when one is riding on The limit.
I was just quoting figures from my ramp test. Happy to concede I'm nothing special!
mental strength may count in training but you cannot beat the laws of physiology with mental strength.
Granted a winner will have both and the winniest may have immense digability but digging deep if there is nothing to dig into is useless
I'm nothing special!
Send back the BH certificate NOW.
stop this willy waving armchair 2nd cat wannabe neverwasbeen ego stroking and stick to the Pro's.
Sorry Junk, the blue plaque has already been fitted to the house, I couldn't.
willy waving armchair 2nd cat wannabe neverwasbeen ego stroking
T-shirt waiting to happen!
while waiting for the t-shrt read this:
[url= http://velonews.competitor.com/2012/07/news/ashenden-understanding-usadas-armstrong-charges_227833 ]http://velonews.competitor.com/2012/07/news/ashenden-understanding-usadas-armstrong-charges_227833[/url]
"pro" just means you get paid. There are plently of amateurs out there that perform a lot better than many pros and are successful in their chosen profession too.
http://velonews.competitor.com/2012/07/news/ashenden-understanding-usadas-armstrong-charges_227833
i did read it and it talks about how they decide it says nothing about the LA case.
I fell I have earned the T-shirt now as i had to dig deep to finish it
chapeau to you sir!
What have you achieved in life, Mr Smith? And how many of your 2nd wanabees would have run rings around Armstrong on the same doping protocols, but had the integrity to say "no" to dope.
i won the flower show calligraphy competition age 13 and in the same year i won the air-rifle comp (against the adults too),
that's got to be up there with a tour-giro double?
so lance tries a restraining order so he can have his day in court with some legal muscle and where the burden of proof is higher.
[url= http://www.statesman.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/austin/courts/entries/2012/07/09/lance_armstrongs_lawyers_file.html ]http://www.statesman.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/austin/courts/entries/2012/07/09/lance_armstrongs_lawyers_file.html[/url]
case dismissed, judge pissed at 80page complaint
[url= http://www.statesman.com/news/texas/armstrong-suit-to-block-doping-charges-dismissed-2413887.html ]http://www.statesman.com/news/texas/armstrong-suit-to-block-doping-charges-dismissed-2413887.html[/url]
I did like the fact the judge made a point of saying the document read like a press release not a court filing.
Basically, USADA are saying there was organised doping within US Postal, as they have banned the 3 doctors involved in US Postal for life.
So, organised doping within Lance's team, and he didn't know about it, when he was team leader? really?
It’s our word against his word. I like our word. We like our credibility
US District Judge Sam Sparks said the original lawsuit seemed more of an attempt to win over public opinion than to focus on legal argument."This court is not inclined to indulge Armstrong's desire for publicity, self-aggrandisement or vilification of defendants, by sifting through 80 mostly unnecessary pages in search of the few kernels of factual material relevant to his claims," Sparks wrote on Monday.
Here we go again.....
Menthe à l'eau avec des glaçons?
An interesting comment after Rémy got arrested yesterday. Roughly translated from TF1:
"it's a waste of time testing athletes, the only way to catch them is flagrant délit (caught in the act), the gendarmes have been following him since the Tour 2011 and were waitng for him on the car park of the hotel when he met the dealer. The products they are using can't be detected".
Edit: for the non-francophones, Erwann Menthéour was a racer that wrote a book on the Britany racing mafia/dope scene, his nickname was "mente à l'eau".
