Meanwhile in the state that SKS strongly supports, the one you aren't allowed to criticise or you're a racist:
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/01/18/middleeast/israelis-palestinians-vaccination-intl/index.html
Johnson is clearly worried that some Tory MPs (most likely the new ‘Red Wall’ lot) will vote with labour, hence the 3 line whip.
I get that - my point was that the Tories may, for example, choose to wait for the media interest to wane and do nothing.
my point was that the Tories may, for example, choose to wait for the media interest to wane and do nothing.
I think that'll probably be the plan. But this is all mounting up, isn't it? Marcus Rashford is already on the hi-profile warpath about the next school holidays where we're likely to see a repeat of the last two:
The government saying free school meals won't be provided, right up until the point that a 23 year old footballer shames them into a U-turn. Again.
Whats different at the moment, and will be more so shortly, is that people who never imagined themselves on benefits, now are. And a hell of a lot more are about to be. So the Torys usual line about undeserving scroungers just isn't going to wash any more.
A lot of these new benefit claimants will be natural Tory voters who are about to find out the yawning chasm between a cushy life on benefits as depicted by Tory Central Office and the Daily Mail and the subsistance level of poverty and foodbanks that are the reality
I think that’ll probably be the plan. But this is all mounting up, isn’t it? Marcus Rashford is already on the hi-profile warpath about the next school holidays where we’re likely to see a repeat of the last two:
The government saying free school meals won’t be provided, right up until the point that a 23 year old footballer shames them into a U-turn. Again.
Whats different at the moment, and will be more so shortly, is that people who never imagined themselves on benefits, now are. So the Torys usual line about undeserving scroungers just isn’t going to wash any more
I think that Rashford has, no pun intended, presented Starmer with an open goal.
I think that with the public now paying a bit more attention to this area, Labour has a huge opportunity to show the Tory narrative about benefits for the lie that it is.
Today is a good sign that they intend to do just that
Binners had already mentioned it further up the page.
I don't read every word Binners types... I tend to look at the pictures more.
So the Torys usual line about undeserving scroungers just isn’t going to wash any more
Let's hope so.
It's absolutely where Labour should be pushing... that they would run the country for all... that many of us are one pandemic or shift in global demand away from needing the government to run the benefit system, like the rest of the state, correctly, efficiently, and for the good of us all, not just those already being helped. They shouldn't be talking about Israel right now, obviously.
Today is a good sign that they intend to do just that
I've been bitterly disappointed with Starmer so far, so I really hope that this is a sign of things to come.
I don’t read every word Binners types… I tend to look at the pictures more.
Fine, but it would perhaps be better if you didn't post with such certainty if you're not going to do any basic fact-checking.
Father Jack makes a more coherent argument than you.
My case reclines upon the divan.
Looks like theres a good few Tory MP's planning to ignore the 3 line whip and vote for the labour party motion tonight.
So whats Johnson going to do? In the past that'd be an immediate removal of the whip affair. Thats going to be a great look. Removing the whip from MP's who vote against forcing another 500,000+ people into poverty
The BBC is also leading its news broadcasts with this today and Starmer was on ITV this morning and said:
If [Zahawi] is going to call it a stunt, he should probably come with me to a food distribution centre to see these families this morning and explain to them what is a lifeline to them is a ‘stunt’, because it certainly isn’t from their point of view.
I actually think in their heart of hearts quite a lot of Tory MPs know that cutting this money to people who desperately need it in the middle of a pandemic is the wrong thing to do, they know that, they probably want to vote with us but because of the tribal way we do politics they can’t.
The prime minister’s now saying in answer to the question ‘do you think this uplift should stay or not’, he’s saying ‘I don’t want to say yes and I don’t want to say no so we’re going to abstain’. He’s got no view on whether it should stay or not – that’s pretty pathetic.
I think in their heart of hearts they [Tory MPs] would actually vote with us today if they had the option to do so.
Labour lost the last 4 elections on the public not trusting them with the economy. This is where they need to change public opinion.
Tories are presenting them with all the ammo they need at the mo. They should go harder after the dodgy deals - no holds barred.
Tories are presenting them with all the ammo they need at the mo. They should go harder after the dodgy deals – no holds barred.
And point out that Tory dithering on restrictions had caused the economic damage of the pandemic to become far worse than it needed to be.
They should go harder after the dodgy deals – no holds barred.
Absolutely. But instead of saying 'the tories are printing money to give to their millionaire mates, and instead we'll give it to the NHS', they're saying 'we won't give money to anyone because we'll impose abitrary limits on spending because you the public don't understand economics'. There is an open goal there waiting for Starmer and Dodds to kick the ball into it, but they're arguing with the referee about the rules and listening to the opposing fans telling them not to do it. Madness!
Have you thought about making a short public information film where you get some cuddly children's TV characters to explain in words of less than two syllables your new economics model to the electorate?
You could call it something catchy like 'just read the book you bunch of ****ing thicko's!'
...making a short public information film where you get some cuddly children’s TV characters to explain...
I'd be well up for doing this for Universal Basic Income. I'll have a go at some three word slogans as well...
"None go hungry"
"Freedom to learn"
"Everyone made secure"
"Employees not slaves"
"Needs before wants"
Okay.. I'm clearly not the one to do this!
“None go hungry”
What, not even scoungers? No way!
“Freedom to learn”
Students?!!!!?!
“Everyone made secure”
Security breeds complacency! Keep the plebs hungry for it!!!
“Employees not slaves”
Don't start with your BLM shite now!!!
“Needs before wants”
Everyone needs a new X4 every other year!
Moron!!!
Secure is a good word
"Secure for life"
Have you thought about making a short public information film where you get some cuddly children’s TV characters
I don't need to, plenty of people have already explained it in simple language. Here's one..
Here's another..
Powerful stuff in this. If only we had an equivalent to Sanders in UK politics. Starmer shoud pay close attention.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jan/20/joe-biden-action-bernie-sanders
The latest polling is showing a 4 point labour lead
https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1354742161804324873?s=20
You know that will trigger someone to watch new polling results obsessively until they find one with labour behind don't you?
Obviously.
Anyway, let’s hope this is a tortoise and the hare situation, not a little blip. Fingers crossed…
You know that will trigger someone to watch new polling results obsessively until they find one with labour behind don’t you?
On the contrary, Binbins has managed to find the only recent poll with Labour in the lead. There's a summary here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_next_United_Kingdom_general_election#2021
Polling results now are like being 3 points ahead in rugby after 10 minutes - it's the last 10 minutes that are interesting and the final score that counts. I appreciate I've come a little late to this thread as the 3,408th post, but all Sir Keir needs to do for now is keep showing himself to be competent and reasoned, and carry on asking awkward question to BJ. Then in three and a half years' time start rolling out 'greatest hits compilation' clips of Brexit lies vs actual consequences, and Covid cock-ups - if that doesn't sway the swing voters the UK (or what's left of it) is doomed to become a one-party state.
Sir Keir told Nick Ferrari: "I understand he's going to see a vaccine centre, going to talk to the NHS and I'd expect the Prime Minister to do that.
Does Starmer even know that the NHS in Scotland has nothing to do with the PM? I rather think he supports BJ on this because he'd do the same Union-flag flying thing himself.
Sir Keir needs to do for now is keep showing himself to be competent and reasoned, and carry on asking awkward question to BJ.
I think we can all agree that he is competent and reasoned, yet doesn't seem to be landing many blows on a PM who has presided over 100,000 deaths. What he hasn't yet done is give us any idea of what his Labour party is for, seemingly preferring to leave it to a 23 year-old footballer. If he thinks winning at PMQs is going to make an iota of difference to his party's fortunes, he's going to be sorely disappointed.
On the contrary, Binbins has managed to find the only recent poll with Labour in the lead. There’s a summary here:
I don't actually go looking. It just popped up in my Twitter feed so I thought I'd share it.
With predictable results.
Do you need reminding that this time last year, at the fag end of Magic Grandads calamitous tenure, Labour had just handed the Tory's a whopping great majority and were 26 points behind them in the polls?
I don’t actually go looking. It just popped up in my Twitter feed so I thought I’d share it.
With predictable results.
Predictable that I might be interested in whether the poll represents a trend or is an outlier? Why yes, guilty as charged. But you feel free to hold your telescope to your blind eye.
Do you need reminding that this time last year, at the fag end of Magic Grandads calamitous tenure, Labour had just handed the Tory’s a whopping great majority and were 26 points behind them in the polls?
It's interesting that you feel the need to defend Starmer by comparing him with his predecessor.
I'm not 'defending' him as he doesn't need defending. I'm pointing out that he's shifted the poll ratings by 30 points in less than twelve months
I think we can all agree that restoring the potential electability of the Labour party from the political basket case it had become under the last regime is a good thing, yes?
Being a student protest group instead of an effective opposition and serious alternative government hasn't really worked out well for anyone other than Boris and chums, has it?
What he hasn’t yet done is give us any idea of what his Labour party is for
He can't because there are at least two descreete factions in labour, bluntly put, the corbynites and new labour under Starmer.
Until the party splits into at least 2 different logical parties or they unify themselves, it will still make them unelectable.
At the moment, Labour are at war with themselves, they have been for a long time, and that divde will cost them enough votes to never see the PM's office.
Some things strike me from this page,
1) Starmer / Johnson broadly seem equally popular.
that's where we're at, UK.
There's more...
2) Unbelievably, people approved of Johnson all through lockdown #1, as if he was bravely doing his very very bestymost that he possibly could... but this isn't the case any more.
3) Starmer has been universally approved of since aappointment to labours top job
4) nobody approves of Farage, Davey, or the Greens.
5) Sturgeon is universally approved, no doubt aided by turning up regularly and not being shit at telling everyone how covid is being handled
6) nobody liked Jeremy, ever.
all that aside
7) universally, Johnson + Sunak is preferred above Starmer + Dodds.
Taking (1) and (3) into account, I think Starmer may need another chancellor.
Maybe he needs a "colourful character".
boris vs keir, trend since mid 2020
I think Starmer may need another chancellor.
He absolutely does. Contrast her appearances with that of Miliband. But I don’t see any reshuffle happening unless it is forced. Labour need to keep looking like a steady ship if possible, and avoid anything that allows the papers to portray them as an ongoing series of mutinies.
When I've seen Anneliese Dodds interviewed she actually talks a lot of sense, but she doesn't seem to have any 'presence' at all.
Unfortunately the age we live in requires someone with more impact. Say what you like about Rishi Sunak, he knows about self-promotion and managing how he's perceived by the electorate
yet doesn’t seem to be landing many blows on a PM
Its odd as Boris seems to have somehow survived every blow since campaigning for the 2019 GE began! I think the only blows that he wont survive are a vote of no confidence, (fingers crossed) another GE or he decides hes done and walks. Things that he and his party have been caught doing would have been resignations before
I agree with every word of that Binners.
I’m not ‘defending’ him as he doesn’t need defending. I’m pointing out that he’s shifted the poll ratings by 30 points in less than twelve months
They were losing by a lot, and now they're losing by a little. I guess you're easily satisfied.
There’s no election to lose right now. I’m hoping when the next election has come and gone, that we will have more Labour MPs than we have now. Many more. Enough to be in government would be ideal, but I still fear unlikely.
That's the issue; ‘presence’ shouldn't register in politics, but it does.
A bad business manager can go very far on bluster and bullshit if he says the right things to the right people.
There’s no election to lose right now.
In which case the opinion polls from the end of Corbyn's tenure, and the recent one Binners spaffed himself over, are essentially meaningless.
They were losing by a lot, and now they’re losing by a little. I guess you’re easily satisfied.
Clearly not as easily satisfied as you. Like a lot of you those on the left, you seem an awful lot happier with a Tory government with a massive majority, the Labour party as popular with the electorate as a fart in a lift, but with your precious idealogical purity intact.
Anyway... that poll shows a 4 point lead, so your statement is factually inaccurate anyway
What he hasn’t yet done is give us any idea of what his Labour party is for
The only thing I and many others have heard is 'we support the government'. That'll be his political epitaph I fear.
