Blimey??!! This thread is still alive?! ... thought we've moved on. Enough with the butthurt and focus on whats ahead rather looking back 3days ago. Shaping Britain back is not an overnight fix.
We ARE focusing on what's ahead...!
Indeed imnotverygood. But what I've been gobsmacked by, along with many others, is just how many of them there are
I haven't read much of this thread, but I am going to post up what I am going to keep repeating, for every leave voter=stupid post either here or on other social media, which I see:
Although I voted remain, I can't agree with the tone of this and the statements alluding that leave voters opinions are somehow less worthy than we remainers are. They have been lied to and misled. Leave voters do tend to come from different, less privileged backgrounds, than remainers have tended to be lucky enough to enjoy. We remainers need to understand that deprivation and an unrepresentative political system are very clearly, the source of many issues. It is a massive mistake for remain campaigners to see themselves as somehow superior. This will only deepen social divisions. To avoid sorry events such as this in the future, we need to be supporting disadvantaged communities a lot, lot more. We have not been doing this up until now and I myself have failed to stand up for the rights of those who are less fortunate than myself. I am very, very sorry for this. Our country is now paying the price.
Although I voted remain, I can't agree with the tone of this and the statements alluding that leave voters opinions are somehow less worthy than we remainers are. They have been lied to and misled.
They were lied to but couldn't be arsed to fact-check. Hell mend them.
Listening to some german minster on bbc world service. Seems the germans are very relaxed about this and are willing wait until the internal wrangling settles, I'm really hoping, the brexiters are proven as utter bunkem and another ref or early general election is called.
I think they are also hoping that's the ultimate conclusion too. They are aware this is bad for everyone. The French seem less patient.
[i]They were lied to but couldn't be arsed to fact-check. Hell mend them.[/i]
Did you check all the remain facts? I didn't.
How does your attitude help?
It doesn't really come as surprise, but certain contributors on this thread are revealing their true colours & it is a pretty nauseating spectacle.
@binners is changing his 🙂
I've lost count of the number of times he has railed against the political classes and the "Islington/metropolitan elite" who are so out of touch with ordinary people.Now the ordinary people have spoken...
going now. byyeeeeeeee!
You don't have to be racist to be worried about the effect of 250k people coming to the country every year (but it helps)
I think we need all this out in the open. The Brexit campaign hasn't turned people into xenophobes or racists. The right wing media and right wing of politics has been drip feeding people with racist shit for years. Divide and rule.
What this whole debacle stands for is the abject failure of mainstream politics. If we had a system that in any way, shape or form represented the actual concerns of real people over the last couple of decades, rather than the interests of big business, and a privileged elite, then we certainly wouldn't be where we are now.
It's all been shit! But the direction we're heading in now, with mainstream politicians lending legitimatacy to some pretty nasty right wing bigotry, because it temporarily suits their self-interested agendas is a new low
2 things.
We have to move forward - we can't stay where we are right now and unless there's some kind of Lazarene resurrection, we aren't going back. But that shouldn't stop us from analyzing how we got here (and I don't mean the promises made as part of the campaigns, i mean the social meltdown that has caused a significant proportion of people feel that we are better off without the benefits of the EU in order to deal with the problems they see in our country)
And in order to move forward we need the best politicians and negotiators from all sides to quickly settle differences and work out a route forward. I'm still sore about the result, as many of the Remain campaigners must be. But whether the result of the vote comes about because of a proportion of voters cutting off their noses to spite their faces or genuine logical decision making; if the Remain camp now get the arse and refuse to be involved, then they'll be doing the same, and the country will lose twice over. And then we'll definitely be ****ed.
Carney's showing the path forward - we all need to take a leaf from his book; he must feel he's been given a shit hand, but he'll play it to the best of his ability.
You don't have to be racist to be worried about the effect of 250k people coming to the country every year (but it helps)
Net migration from the EU in 2015 was 184000, net migration from the by UK citizens was -39,000. In terms of EU migration then we're at about half that number. Net migration from out with the EU was 373,000. I can see with Leave are now trying to back pedal on the immigration front....
86% have currently voted oui to a rapid Brexit in the Figaro poll (I voted non). The political class is divided. Spiegel is reporting that the SPD want Britain out quickly but Merkel is standing on the brakes.
The longer it drags on the better IMO. You may remember I thought Cameron's speech "excellent".
Don't blame the media. Sixty kids in my daughters reception class due to mainly Polish intake, and I like the Poles. I didn't like the system that allowed this to happen on such a scale and so voted Leave.
They were lied to but couldn't be arsed to fact-check. Hell mend them.
Absolutely correct. Quite a lot of banging on about not trusting "any of them ****ing politicians" but then listened to politicians and willfully ignored expert analysis.
The more you try to rationalise what has gone on, the more you keep coming back to the conclusion that sheer stupidity is to blame.
If you're an expert you are ignored because you are 'talking down' to people.
What else could the experts have done? Drawn graphs in crayon and explained that when the big red line goes down, that is bad?
This is the biggest manifestation so far of what I have referred to for years as "the shithead tendency". If you try to reason with some people one on one they just get more frustrated when they realise they are totally wrong. They then usually threaten to kick your head in.
How do you influence people who refuse to be influenced by reason and then start to actively take pride in the fact that they have to resort to threats of violence?
How have we created a situation where wanton stupidity is considered somehow noble? Where anyone who is intelligent and well-informed is pilloried as a liar and elitist if they present a case against the views of the idiots.
We are in dangerous territory here, wanton stupidity is very easy to manipulate - as has been proven in the last week.
I agree with Binners.
Now, I'm off to watch my old friend Dom Raab on QT. He's exceptionally bright, hard-working and focused but if fellow Brexiters think he's a soft-hearted hug-a-hoodie Tory that will look after their communities they've got another thing coming.
And that is why the mainstream politicians stoking up racist views, to suit their ends, really are playing with fire. But they're too arrogant to realise that the nasty sentiments they're talking up won't be easily put back in their box.
The direction of travel we're presently heading in politically can not possibly end well. It's hateful! And we, as a nation, should be better than that!
ctk - Member
You don't have to be racist to be worried about the effect of 250k people coming to the country every year (but it helps)
I didn't vote but if I had it would have been out like most of my family and work mates voted..don't think any of them are racists. The people are fed up with the way this country is going, you might not see it or feel the impact in your areas but the people have spoken so accept it. All of a sudden there's a mass number of political experts on here and truth is nobody knows, might benefit you and others might suffer. But I find it utterly offensive the way the remainers are name calling and acting! 🙄
The Ref for Tories was about power at the top , they never expected the Leave to win . Now they are ****ed .
The Ref for Tories was about power at the top , they never expected the Leave to win . Now they are ****ed .
Without a doubt. I'm going to enjoy the squirming and back-pedalling.
Did you see the look on Goves and Borises faces at the press conference they finally reluctantly made? The last thing they wanted was this. And Dave has called their bluff to double their problems, by leaving them, not him, to activate article 50.
I do love the fact that our countries economic future has basically boiled down to a parlour game of one-upmanship with a bunch of over-privelidged ****s! While th Labour Party sits watching with its thumb up its arse!
Sixty kids in my daughters reception class due to mainly Polish intake, and I like the Poles. I didn't like the system that allowed this to happen on such a scale and so voted Leave.
What if there had been a baby boom 5 years ago and all these new kids had British parents? You'd be campaigning for more teachers, I expect.
So the difference is that these kids are *Polish*. They don't belong here - is that what you are saying?
The Tories weren't the only ones who didn't expect leave to win, Chris. Farrage said as much the night before and Labour were so convinced of a remain win they didn't really campaign against leave. Even those voting leave didn't expect leave to win on the tiny sample size of people I know. And they are all equally baisé(e)s
Corbyn deserves some credit. It's what he wanted and he played his part beautifully. Whether he can now capitalise on it will be interesting.
Corbyn is a bystander. He hasn't got the brains to cspitalise on anything. As today's resignations have shown, I'm not alone in this opinion
I didn't vote but if I had it would have been out like most of my family and work mates voted..don't think any of them are racists. The people are fed up with the way this country is going, you might not see it or feel the impact in your areas but the people have spoken so accept it
None of which will be solved by leaving the EU. If people wanted to give the politicians a kicking for being untrust worthy arseholds who, in general, don't care about you, they picked a ****ing stupid issue to chose to express their anger.
I am Welsh. I live in Wales. Wales is a big net beneficiary of EU cash. But Wales voted out. Lots of people cited immigration as a reason to vote out. But only around 2.6% of Wales' population was born outside of the UK. Yes there are areas with a localised polish contingent due to say a meat factory or similar but immigration hardly features here. Yet they still cited immigration as a reason to vote out. I wonder why?
I went to feed a friends cat thie weekend. She is away on hols - the friend not the cat. On the door mat was a leaflet from the leave campaign. A leaflet I had put to one side when I received it myself. This time I read it. It's Wales specific because it's in English and Cymreig. And.... there is was in black and white - immigration, Turkey, control of our borders, etc, etc. together with the £350 million/week claim..... And they say that remain was project fear.
they all created a hell of a mess .
Love le jeu de mot Edukator. 😆
Corbyn is a bystander.
I suspect he may end up one, but to go from nothing to opposition leader and help take us out of the EU at his age is mind-boggling.
I wonder who'll play him in the movie.
[quote=Edukator ]86% have currently voted oui to a rapid Brexit in the Figaro poll (I voted non). The political class is divided. Spiegel is reporting that the SPD want Britain out quickly but Merkel is standing on the brakes.
The longer it drags on the better IMO. You may remember I thought Cameron's speech "excellent".
Well thankfully that's the only place they get a vote, and it's not really up to anybody else in the EU how quickly we leave either - given the new political situation, the conviction with which we're being told to do it quickly should tell us all we need to know. Merkel seems the most sane person around (and I'm certainly including all UK politicians in that comparison).
Remind me, what did you think particularly excellent about CMD's speech - can't be bothered trawling back...
[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36637037 ]BOJO WANTS TO INTENSIFY COOP WITH EU[/url]
I thought he wanted to tell them to F off??
Man is a clown.
If this Brexit does go through then at some point in time we are still going to have to sign up to the single market & pay. Only this time we really will have no input.
If you prefer to believe that this is the beginning of the end of the EU & will lead to it's break up then thank you for helping create the biggest global sh1t storm in the last 100 years. £2t off global markets, £120b off the FTSE, the pound at its lowest level in 25 years (?).......all done on your 1st day on the job!
Congratu****lations!
I can't wait to see what you achieve tomorrow???
Molgrips- I'm dealing with the situation that presents itself, and thats a school infrastructure that can't cope with the influx from EU immigrants above the numbers that the school normally deals with. If you think I should be fine with this then I suspect you're not a parent. Are you looking to slur me as a racist ?
is BJ on drug or something ?
apparently nothing is changing .
@ Thebees , how many are we talking about ?
round here classes are about 30 , so unless there were 30 poles , school should have opened another class anyway .
As somebody who mostly associates with university-educated 30-40 somethings and lives in a pleasant enough (Remain majority!) borough, almost *all* of the people I know (including my older and elderly relatives) appeared to be in favour of Remain.
The bookies seemed to be expecting a Remain win.
I was hopeful that Remain would win.
On Thursday lunch time, however, I headed to a large supermarket in the northern town where I work. I looked around at my mostly white fellow customers who appeared to be a mix of "classes" and had a sudden thought that leave might well win after all.
My circles of friends and colleagues are certainly not privileged and mostly not wealthy/well-off, but they are mostly educated, well-travelled, have some disposable income and know / work with people of different ethnicities and nationalities without any issues.
If I felt detached from the general public close to where I was brought up, then a bunch of high-flying politicians (especially the likes of Boris, but even Corbyn to some extent) must be like a different species to the working class folk of Northern England.
Persuading the down-trodden to vote to their own detriment to leave The EU -although the masses really should have looked into it more deeply, the info was out there- and then not be in a desperate rush to leave the "awful" EU (because it isn't actually that awful?) and not appear to have a plan in place for leaving is just clever manipulation with an amatuerish Follow-up that has resulted in a mess and a potentially terrible outcome
I think it is time for a police investigation into the whole sorry affair. Some of these politicians (starting with Boris) should be prosecuted for what they've caused, and for what? Nothing by the looks of it.
Boris really didn't want to win it did he? First Dave completely miscalculates calling the referendum & then Boris leads a campaign he doesn't actually believe in. These boys are good! What a cock up.
I can't wait to see what you achieve tomorrow???
Dont PANIC George is back tomorrow he says to give us all a statement and make us feel warm and secure.
thebees - a class of 60 is not a great situation. Do you think the austerity measures might have had as much to do with it as the immigrants though? Supply as well as demand?
I understand you wanted to kick out, I just question the direction given all the figures I've seen have suggested immigration helps us pay for more services generally, while creating some pinch pints such as the one you describe.
I think you've been let down by your council and Westminster- not Brussels (or was it Strasbourg?)
Take back control! They kept saying, and now it seems they have no clue what they are doing.
What if there had been a baby boom 5 years ago and all these new kids had British parents? You'd be campaigning for more teachers, I expect.
In that case, wouldn't there have been a full five five years advance warning to put enough resources in place, train teachers, build schools etc.?
So. We are back to immigration talk. Local schools can't cope with an influx of people. People who are working and contributing to the economy. Should we get rid of the people or make the schools bigger?
Is it the people who we should blame? Or the inadequate planning and service provision?
How do we solve the problem? Stop workers coming by leaving the EU and all that entails... or adapt the services to suit demand?
Lots of people cited immigration as a reason to vote out. But only around 2.6% of Wales' population was born outside of the UK. Yes there are areas with a localised polish contingent due to say a meat factory or similar but immigration hardly features here. Yet they still cited immigration as a reason to vote out. I wonder why?
Maybe they've seen whats happened in other places, English cities etc. and thought 'lets stop this before it happens here'?
But a couple of million Syrians rock up in Germany in six months and somehow their children get taught, Ninfan. Where there's a will... .
BoJo, the complete text:
Nowhere on the ballot paper did it say it was a vote against immigration.
The leave campaign said it, but it was a pack of lies. UKIP are not in power. Immigration won't change.
Cant do links , but N Surgeon tweet about Dc and GO in hiding , Leave campaign with no plan , sums it up quite well .
But a couple of million Syrians rock up in Germany in six months and somehow their children get taught, Ninfan. Where there's a will... .
Yep, hasn't created any problems or bad feeling there has it?
Corbyn deserves some credit
The funniest thing I've read so far....in a tragic sense!
Did you see the look on Goves and Borises faces at the press conference they finally reluctantly made? The last thing they wanted was this. And Dave has called their bluff to double their problems, by leaving them, not him, to activate article 50.I do love the fact that our countries economic future has basically boiled down to a parlour game of one-upmanship with a bunch of over-privelidged ****s! While th Labour Party sits watching with its thumb up its arse!
This. Sad but so true.
Edukator, you seem a bit naive on the subject of Syrian integration in Germany. It's a ****storm over there !
Gordon Brewer put it well this morning on the Scotland politics show.
"Bismarck once said man cannot control the current of events, he can only float with them and steer.David Cameron has proved this adage wrong by creating the current,steering the country onto the rocks and then jumping ship, leaving others to work out how and where the country goes next"
[quote=ninfan ]Maybe they've [s]seen[/s] fallen for the propaganda about whats happened in other places, English cities etc. and thought 'lets stop this before it happens here'?
It wasn't only the angry poor who wanted to leave.
I happen to know that a lot of comfortably-off old people (mostly men) in a fairly posh, almost entirely white British, Cheshire village voted to Leave the EU. They were quite triumphant and light-hearted about the result.
The reasons seemed very wrong, superficial and simplistic to me. There was no thought given to the economy or the future, just getting one over on "Europe", "immigration"/racism and "350 million pounds a week"
David Cameron has proved this adage wrong by creating the current,steering the country onto the rocks and then jumping ship, leaving others to work out how and where the country goes next"
Its almost supervillain esque
i wonder what he will do next, my money is on something in the EU
[quote=cchris2lou ]Cant do links , but N Surgeon tweet about Dc and GO in hiding , Leave campaign with no plan , sums it up quite well .
I liked this one
[img] 
[/img]
She certainly seems to be the only one raising to the challenge of this mess .
Has anyone mentioned treason yet?
Naive about what's happening in Germany, thebees? You're accusing the wrong man. Ich weiss besser was in Deutschland geschieht als in UK, und auch was in Deutschland besser läuft als in UK.
[img] 
[/img]
Right. **** this. We're ALL up shit creek and we need a paddle. Now, not in three months.
Fellow Remain voters: Enough already. Yes, we're all pissed off but navel gazing ain't gonna help. Not all 17 million Leave voters can possibly be racist northern pensioners without an O level to their name. Maybe they have a point about this quitting the EU thing? Maybe not. Whatever, we are where we are and no amount a whinging is gonna change that. Allegedly we're the intelligent ones, so get your thinking caps on.
Leave voters. Well done. Good game. We hear you. Now you need to get stuck in to the aftermath and not just piss off back to Wetherspoons. (Just banter, ****s!). And the first person to say they "want their country back" gets deported to ****ing Gibraltar. OK?
Politicians.
David. **** off. Shut the door behind you. Now.
George. You may be a **** but you're our ****. Plus you know the passwords for our Junior Savers account. Get your calculator. Drop the face-like-a-slapped-ass routine. You're on.
Boris. Sorry mate. That photo of you abseiling by your scrotum over the London Olympics while waving a Union Jack can't ever be un-taken. Plus, you'll never be able to appear on Question Time again without some sturdy Glaswegian nurse asking where the **** her 350 million quid is. Not only will she have a very good point, she'll be wearing a T shirt that shows you gurning in front of that ****ing bus! No captains hat for you I'm afraid.
Theresa. You're in charge love. Get the biggest shoulder pads you've got. We need Ming The Merciless in drag and you'll scare the shit out of 'em.
Nicola. Yep. Fair cop. You probably could get us on a technicality, as could London. But we ****ing love shortbread. And oil. And to be honest you're probably the best politician we've got, so we need you on side. Sort your lot out and we promise never to mention that Jimmy Krankie thing again (although it is pretty uncanny) and we'll make you a Dame once we're sorted. Bring Ruth Davidson. She kicks ass.
Opposition party. We'll need one. Someone take Jeremy and John back to the British Legion Club where you found them. Take Nigel as well. Give back their sandals, buy them a pint, then go to Heathrow and collect David Milliband. **** it. Lets gets Ed Balls as well. He keeps George on his toes. I think he works on the lottery kiosk at Morrisons now?
Oh. And Mark Carney. Give him a knighthood and tell him to keep that shit coming. We definitely need more of that good shit!
Everyone set? Right. Hold the Easyjet. We're going to Brussels and this ain't no hen party.
#weneedaplan Share!
A little something doing the rounds on FB.
I posted this on facebook a couple of weeks ago. Re-reading it in the aftermath of the anti immigration bile and hatred from the past couple of days makes me very sad
Some pretty grim talk about around the EU stuff about immigrants, and how bad immigration is. Reminds me of a story…Sometime around 1947 a young man, about 16 years old, left his home country. In his home country he faced poverty, religious persecution and what was basically civil war. Some of his friends had already made the journey and one of them wrote him a letter saying they had arrived safely. The letter encouraged him to make the journey too as his friend told him there was work available there.
With very little money to his name, the young man had to find some to afford the journey. He only had one possession of any value which was a three wheeled bicycle. He sold it to someone in his village and then had the money to make the journey overseas to join his friends.
Despite suffering from pneumonia at the time, he made the journey overseas in search of a better life. Arriving in the new country, he had nowhere to stay so he spent his first night alone, sleeping in a field.
The country he arrived in had already experienced a big influx of migrants from his home country, and he was viewed with suspicion because of his nationality and religion, often suffering discrimination or abuse.
Despite that he set about making a new life for himself in his new home, finding work and somewhere to stay. After some time he met a local girl and soon they were married. Over the years they had 8 children. The man worked hard to provide for them all. After many years of hard work he had his own business, employing family and locals in his adopted home. His children grew up, grandchildren were born, the family expanded.After many years the man decided to return to his home country where he lived out the rest of his years. Some of his children remained in his adopted country, some accompanied their parents back to their father's home.
If it wasn’t for that young man making that journey back in 1947, I probably wouldn’t be here today. That young man was my grandfather.
It pains me to see such negative views on immigration particularly when the “facts” used to castigate immigration are often completely untrue or misunderstood. Mostly it’s around money and benefits with the misconception that migrants are bleeding the country dry. In fact, based on recent figures, of the 5.3 million people claiming benefits in the UK, 93% of the claimants were British. The statistics show without any doubt whatsoever, that migrants contribute far more to the economy than they take out.
Hating or distrusting someone because they’re foreign, speak a different language, have a different skin colour, worship a different pretend man in the sky from you just seems absurd to me. We’re all human beings, plain and simple. The opportunities we give to EU immigrants here in the UK, are also available to you if you wanted to move within the EU. So for example tomorrow morning you could decide to pack up and move to Spain without a single issue. No forms to fill in, no permission to ask, no barriers at all. Maybe it’s just me but I think that’s a fantastic thing. You can buy a home, get a job, start a family etc with no problem. All possible because we’re part of the EU.
Is the EU perfect? Absolutely not, but show me this mythical perfect utopia that people seem to think exists elsewhere or could exist? The economic and social opportunities afforded to us by the EU more than outweigh any negatives.
binners - Member
And that is why the mainstream politicians stoking up racist views, to suit their ends, really are playing with fire. But they're too arrogant to realise that the nasty sentiments they're talking up won't be easily put back in their box.
I hope that you are wrong binners, but fear that you may be right.
Add to that the sheer scale of the lies and deceit that has characterised this and the Scottish referendum and you see the complete contempt that these guys have for those they are supposed to serve. It really is truly shameful.
[and to think that some folk want them more involved in running the economy and our lives 😉 ]
I didn't expect the back pedalling to start [i]quite[/i] that quickly!
I bet gideons been on one hell of bender.
I just watched the QT EU special. It seemed to me that my mate Dom Raab and UKiP's Paul Nuttall rather floundered. While Anna Soubry came out of it pretty well: regardless of their nationality, whoever contributes something positive to our society is OK with me. The Leavers don't seem to have grasped this.
ninfan - MemberBut a couple of million Syrians rock up in Germany in six months and somehow their children get taught, Ninfan. Where there's a will... .
Yep, hasn't created any problems or bad feeling there has it?
as you may know I'm in Germany and have been for over 8 years.
i've been sat on trains travelling from Vienna to Munich that have been delyed by hours due to the refugee crisis. i've been sat in 3 hour long queues at the Austrian/German border due to checks. i've read reports about what happened in Köln and elsewhere. i've heard first hand about the situation in the refugee homes from people that have worked there.
Merkel's handling of the situation was less than ideal.
yet here in the south at least, there is a majority of people that still have sympathy for and want to help the refugees. and personally i would rather have a family from Syria living next door than some right wing neo-nazis.
i find the whole referendum thing sad. i felt like shit on friday morning.
i fear for the cultural well-being of not just the UK, but the rest of Europe.
[quote=ninfan ]
What if there had been a baby boom 5 years ago and all these new kids had British parents? You'd be campaigning for more teachers, I expect.
In that case, wouldn't there have been a full five five years advance warning to put enough resources in place, train teachers, build schools etc.?
Primary schools are struggling for places around here, where there aren't many immigrants (a dozen or so who aren't white British at our school - it's now slightly less monocultural than it was, which I consider a good thing). Don't blame immigrants for a lack of planning.
Our village school was oversubscribed from within the catchment this year, mostly I think due to all the white British incomers to the new build houses #bloodyimmigrants
the only person more pleased by this result than Farage is ninfan he will be trolling the hell out you all for months on this
nick1962 - Member
Phew!
Sarcasm aside nick, eu funding for that kind of thing creates jobs in the uk, not to mention spin off benefits such as increased tourism and the knock on effect of other productions being filmed in the UK. All positives.
the only person more pleased by this result than Farage is ninfan he will be trolling the hell out you all for months on this
I have to disagree Junky, I can't imagine @ninfan is anywhere nearly as pleased as me.
1m of any new nationality arriving within 10 years and thus becoming the number 1 nationality from virtually no where is too many too fast in particular in a time of economic stress. Of course Poles have been coming here to live for a long time as have Indians, ****stanis, Jamacans etc. Sadly this reaction to the level and type of immigration was very predictable, I've been warning on here of it for 4 years now. If a government is granting visas and the population does not approve they can vote on the matter, when its out of our hands its quite something else.
Stuart, Gove and Boris where very controlled at the press conference, statesmen like was the description used by the press. No need to gloat or be triumphant about a stunning victory, in fact to do so would have been counterproductive.
As for motives this was not about internal Tory manouvering, Boris would almost certainly imo have been the Tory leader in 2019 anyway, Osbourne has no carisma. This referendum was about the EU, it's totally crap and we recognised that.
@alpin the other problem you have in Germany is that, what, 40% of the refugees are from Syria. The German government has already said no one from Afghanistan will qualify for asylum and had to pay people to leave. Then you have all the Moroccans, Tunisians etc a number of who you have tried to deport but their country won't take them back.
@Edukator we don't really care what the French (quick exit) or Germans (slower exit) want. Its up to is to decide, Cameron has already said it's the next PM's decison so that's October at the very very earliest and more like Dec 16 as the soonest or possibly even another year or two. Merkel and Hollande will meet on Monday, lets see what's actually said. I am dreaming of a good slap for Junker in the form of warm words from Merkel, she has a lot to lose from a bumpy exit. There will also be the matter of the €13bn hole in the EU budget if we leave without a trade deal, in any case the EU is going to be getting far less revenue and thats going to have to be amde up by the likes of France and Germany
it's totally crap and we recognised that
The EU isn't perfect but it is, to any rational observer, vastly better than the alternative.
A nice gentlemanly stroll towards Brexit sounds great, but the longer it takes to start negotiations the longer uncertainty continue and the more business here stagnates . Don't get me wrong we need to get, this stuff done right, but, 2 years is an impossibly short time to unlock 43 years of shared laws, trade, regulations and partnerships
There's huge panic already in the science sector as to how we will fill the funding shortfall from EU grants. I can't imagine any new ones being awarded until our final status is decided, will the government step in to help out in the meantime? I know there is real concern at the Sanger centre and the EBI, people want to know if they'd be better just moving to Heidelberg to garuantee the funding
I know there is real concern at the Sanger centre and the EBI, people want to know if they'd be better just moving to Heidelberg to garuantee the funding
And with the nice stroll/sweat um approach to getting out it will just set in stone some of the moves. Even if the UK gets favourable terms for this stuff nobody will still be there to take it.
Warning ecomonoic and expert content
http://www.bbc.com/news/business-36636853
Sterling was trading at $1.3440, down more than 2% from Friday's close. Against the euro it was trading at €1.2165, down 1.3%.
His statement comes amid forecasts of further falls for the pound.
Jeremy Cook, chief economist at World First, said: "We are still looking for another 10% fall for the pound against the dollar in the coming months as data confirms the economic slowdown and monetary policy expectations increase."
The pound fell further against the yen on Monday, a currency considered to be a safe haven, to 137.16 yen - down from about 139.64.
The trading week has started, I assume nobody thought it was a good idea to get in front of cameras on Sunday night to try and inject some sort of calm into the situation and layout some sort of plan...
3 more months of this?