[Closed] EU Referendum - are you in or out?

Sadly @mrlebowski you are going to have to wait and see, even if we vote Leave we'll be dragged in (via IMF as well as EU) but much less so than if we Remain

#jambafact..

London Zone 3 - how's that for you? Probably about as diverse as you can get....!

Great, yes definitely diverse. I wonder where most of the STW Remainers live though?

Islington, obviously.

That's the answer you were implying, right?

I wonder where most of the STW Remainers live though?

Great, yes definitely diverse. I wonder where most of the STW Remainers live though?

Small ex-pit village in the Tyne Valley, about ten miles west of Newcastle. Predominantly middle-class white. Not very diverse.

Straw poll down the pub the other night suggests it is a pretty even split between Breleave and Bremain here.

Bedfordshire here. No idea what neighbours think as i don't really care. Most friends are remain as they all can see the reality of the situation and the economics, does seem to be a correlation with having kids too

Great, yes definitely diverse. I wonder where most of the STW Remainers live though?

Zone 2 here, but less diverse than Lambeth.

Milton Keynes baby !

Formerly Brentford prob a bit more diverse here ?

I see that the handwashing has begun

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/21/boris-johnson-and-michael-gove-are-preparing-to-lose-the-eu-refe/

Cardiff suburbs here. Surrounded by immigrants in our street, and damn proud of it.

Nissan are taking legal action against the leave campaign after they repeatedly refused requests to stop using their logo and misrepresenting their statements.

I wonder where most of the STW Remainers live though?

mdavids - Member
Nissan are taking legal action against the leave campaign after they repeatedly refused requests to stop using their logo and misrepresenting their statements.

As are Toyota and Unilever I think.

And somewhat bizarrely, while she isn't suing (I think), Victoria Beckham is also pointing out that contrary to the 'leave' camps publicity, she favours remaining in Europe.

Not that the last one should really influence anyone.

At this rate Farage will be along to say his views have been misrepresented and taken out of context and he always favoured remaining, pass the claret would you...

Edit: actually I'm being unfair to VB. I've never met her, she's probably a nice person and a dedicated mother, and she is definitely entitled to a) have an opinion and b) not have it misrepresented for political gain. Sorry Mrs B.

I see that the handwashing has begun

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/21/boris-johnson-and-michael-gove-are-preparing-to-lose-the-eu-refe/

Remember Boris being on the fence before this all kicked off? I believe he's using the whole thing as a catapult into a top cabinet position or even PM. Brexit or Remain he's going to come out on top.

Brexit: Pretty obvious, as he fronted it. Cameron will step out, Boris will step in.

Remain: If it is Remain it will be close, hence Boris and his gang cannot be ignored. To placate them they will be handed a few top cabinet positions, with Boris taking the top spot offered.

I'd guess he's hoping for Remain as the ride will be a little less bumpy.

EDIT: Thinking about it, I hardly associate Boris with Leave... Gove, IDS and Farage are much more at the forefront of my mind

Remember Boris being on the fence before this all kicked off? I believe he's using the whole thing as a catapult into a top cabinet position or even PM

Remember Boris being on the fence before this all kicked off?

I seem to remember him being questioned on the fact that he wrote two articles. One supporting Stay and one supporting Leave, before he picked a side and published the Leave one. Basically he just picked the side that is the most politically expedient for him.

No shit Sherlock. You don't think this is about anything other than Boris do you?

Nein. Non. Chan eil mi. No. Nej. Ei. Nee. Não. Dim. ???. Ne.

Gove has motivated hundreds of thousands to vote Remain by saying he'll resign from government if the vote goes against him. 🙂

Gove has motivated hundreds of thousands to vote Remain by saying he'll resign from government if the vote goes against him.

Having heard him on the radio this morning he talked me into remain better than anything else I have heard, now he has promised that I'm going to see if I can somehow vote twice.

first one of these Ive seen. interesting, but not unexpected.

[img] :large[/img]

EDIT: HATTIP: Ben Cooper on Twitter

Just remember boys and girls, come Thursday the rules are:

Vote early, vote often

And with regard to that map Stoner, isn't it interesting the places you tend to find 'immigrants' (ie cities) are pro-EU, while quite a few of what I understand to be the net recipients of cash (farming areas, south west England, Norfolk) are anti-EU.

I love the way you can spot Liverpool, Manchester, Leeds, Sheffield and York.

When do the phones open?

Just convinced three guys who weren't going to bother to go out and vote. Years of FPTP have left us with incredible voter apathy. Took a while to explain how their vote counts differently this time to a GE. Three Remains in the bag. (I think anyway... 🙂 )

Just convinced three guys who weren't going to bother to go out and vote

One of the strangest anomalies is within the farming community. Most farmers have little to no contact with migrants (unless employing cheap labour and they would be Remain you might think), and are net recipients of EU money in the form of agricultural subsidies. However, on the British Farming Forum the straw poll is currently 29% remain and 71% Leave. To be fair the main arguments do not revolve around the immigration card but rather the wish for greater self determination. I am guessing it is a kickback against all the restrictions they see are placed on farming because they think that they are over a barrel because of the subsidies they receive. They seem to think that if there were no subsidies they would be free to do things they can't do now. Trouble is most of them have not realised that ALL industries have the same red-tape and restrictions and don't get a penny of subsidy.

I had a farming acquaintance coming up with stuff anti eu recently.
His latest one was about not being able to use roundup as they hadn't decided on if to renew the license.
It seemed to go quiet when i mentioned that there have been links made with various types of cancer in literature and coincidentally one of the cancers linked to glyphosphates was the reason that both my father and grandfather died (both farmers).
I don't object to picking specifics but at least be accurate and acknowledge the reasons

Yet at the same time the NFU stance is Remain. I can see the farmers' view though - especially the little guys who have an increased burden of paperwork.

I can see the farmers' view though - especially the little guys who have an increased burden of paperwork.

One of my drinking buddies is a Leaver and a independent free-range chicken farmer. From his point of view the EU is a lot of red tape and regulations that he has to follow, whilst farmers in other EU countries (apparently) get away without following them and still get to import their eggs at cheaper prices.

I'm not sure how much of that is perception versus reality, but I can sympathise.

But for me (as a non-farmer) that sounds like an issue of enforcement of existing animal welfare & farming regulations within the EU - not necessarily a reason to leave it.

whilst farmers in other EU countries (apparently) get away without following them and still get to import their eggs at cheaper prices.

So what's the solution to that? Enforce the regs in other countries..

2011: The ethnicity of Rutland residents is made up as follows: 97% White, 1% Mixed/multiple ethnic group, 1% Asian/Asian British, 1% of Black/African/Caribbean/Black British and other ethnic groups

The MP flipped from Out to Remain. Most people I speak to are a bit equivocal but slightly in favour of remain. The impact on the stock market rather than migration seems to focus minds.

[i]Reasonably diverse here -
Ethnic Group (2011)
White 57.93%
Asian or Asian British 26.62%
Black or Black British 8.98%
Mixed 4.44%
Other 2.03%
Total 100.00% [/i]

Not here:

All people 100.00%
White 98.71%
Mixed or multiple ethnic groups 0.28%
Asian inc born-here 0.64%
Africa 0.18%
Carribean or Black 0.08%
Other ethnic groups 0.11%

STOP THE PRESS!!

David Beckham says 'Vote Remain'

I think you're about 12 hours too late for stopping the press in that one - maybe more.

But it doesn't really matter anyway, does it?

well that's the last time I vote for David Beckham!

*flounces*

Maybe it's because Becks knows full well which way all the pit-bull owning, badly tattooed, meatheaded ****-wits who said he should be killed for getting sent off in an Engerland match will be voting? He's just winding them, and Jammers up 😆

What's the possibility of the Govt simply ignoring the referendum if it goes the wrong way?

I've just had the misfortune to read the daily fail. Nice stuff. In no way just rammed full of petty, nasty, small-minded racism. Maybe if you wanted an unbiased, informed opinion on matters, you'd want to read their star columnist:

Convicted criminal, arms dealer, and utterly corrupt, monumentally arrogant, uber-privelidged Thatcherite ****

Enjoy

http://www.****/debate/article-3651503/JONATHAN-AITKEN-saw-Normans-Nazis-defiant-patriotism-Kent-stomping-ground-help-EU-too.html

The first subhead was simply titled 'Luftwaffe'. Nice company you're keeping Jammers 😀

is he going to hold back the immigrants with the simple sword of truth and the trusty shield of British fair play. It would be comical if wasn't so tragic.

Hilarious - EU Referendum The great debate on bbc1 from Wembley arena tonight. I wonder who the support act is?

Oh dear, Mr Gove...

[url= http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/eu-referendum-john-barnes-brexit-remain-leave-michael-gove-sky-news-a7093951.html ]Form an orderly queue at the lawyers???[/url]

John Barnes responds to the Brexit supporter claim...

And £600k to give back to a (former???) BNP member...

[url= http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/eu-referendum-vote-leave-donor-bnp-brexit-vote-polls-gladys-bramall-a7093616.html ]3rd biggest Vote Leave donor linked to BNP - but hey, we're not racists[/url]

[url= http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/elderly-man-punched-in-the-face-for-handing-out-remain-leaflets-a7093386.html ]And we're not very nice to pensioners, either :-([/url]

Hampshire Farmers Vote Leave[img] [/img]

Nope. That field is and unless there is some really funky electoral fraud it doesn't have a vote

On my "this week's" drive to work, I've been crossing the Cotswolds. Plenty of farmers' fields have a "Vote Leave" sign in it. All very well and not surprising, it's the Cotswolds...the ****-ness coefficient is high. And for every 10 fields with one of those ^^^ in it, that's maybe 2 votes, perhaps 4. With the builders I persuaded to vote Remain today & yesterday (it didn't take much persuading before they saw sense to be fair...they were all "we're not bothered"), I've probably cancelled out all the posters between the M5 and my destination - approx 20 miles of Cotswolds. If they persuade their wives to do the same, then that's more than cancelled out the posters. Easy when you put half an effort into it really.

DD - I hate to burst your bubble but in all likelihood the builders you 'persuaded' might have just agreed to avoid a drawn out debate. I've been doing this for the last 3 weeks at work. I neither have the time or energy to discuss this issue with people at work so as soon as someone attempts to discuss it i just agree with them whatever their view and try to close down the discussion before it begins.

By the way, come up here to Derbyshire. There are plenty of farms around here and there is a sea of leave posters in their fields, each farmer with wives and dependant employees and suppliers to persuade.

Well nearly a week in Cologne has certainly convinced me about how far the city and EU has fallen, the number of immigrants has probably doubled since I was last here so by my count roughly ten spotting's a day as opposed to five. (can't count Turks as they've been here for years). Shocking stuff, had to navigate around a group of black men playing jazz by the riverside, probably never even heard of Wonderwall, hmph...

My dads farm has 12 Remain posters on the road boundaries and 2 in the back of his van. Wiltshire if you're wondering.

I hate to burst your bubble but in all likelihood the builders you 'persuaded' might have just agreed to avoid a drawn out debate

Well, that's ok, you haven't. I'm still polishing it now. It was actually a lively few discussions...over tea/lunch... what do you think I did, disturb them while they were busy working? Jeez. 😆

Hampshire Farmers Vote Leave

A Hants farmer votes Leave or have you spoken to all of them?...

Boris Lie 151 - Dyson is the biggest manufacturer of vacuums in Germany!

MALAYSIA.

Maybe it was a slip of his stupid tongue.

Be happy Vote OUT.

😆 @ Channel 4 J. Snow interviewing people of N.East ...

Wembley drinking game - one finger ever time Andrea says "take back control". I guarantee you won't sober up in time to vote.

I'm already wrecked by Aspall Cider, arguments don't seem any less lucid.

It's rowdy in Wembley. 😀

How come everyone making a leave argument turns out to be an immigrant?

Rone incorrect. Dyson has the biggest market share in the German Vacuum market.

That's not how it was articulated. Surely he means sales not manufacturer?

*drinks another two fingers*

So the counter argument- how are young people/people in the lowest working class supposed to find work with increasing competition to jobs?

Why are remain shouting and shouting over? Unstable idiots shout down people.

Wembley drinking game - one finger ever time Andrea says "take back control". I guarantee you won't sober up in time to vote.

I'm out of the game.....i've drank so much i'm going to have to get my stomach pumped..........

Unstable idiots shout down people

Indeed they do.
Hora.

So the man who moved all his manufacturing out of the UK so that he can pay lower wages and make more money for himself thinks we should vote to leave?

Right... best vote to leave then

Hora... did you know that the word gullible isn't actually in the Oxford English dictionary

Do you think they will do an encore of Waterloo?

Hampshire Farmers Vote Leave
A Hants farmer votes Leave or have you spoken to all of them?...

Its not my friend who farms in hampshire. He's in.

So the man who moved all his manufacturing out of the UK so that he can pay lower wages and make more money for himself thinks we should vote to leave?

Hit it. He has no argument does he?

I also think it's hilarious you can buy a Made In Germany Miele vac for half the price of a Dyson and it's twice as good.

She's like a dalek

TAKE!

BACK!!

CONTROOOOOOOOOL!!!!!!!!!

It's a puny panel. The BBC has tried too hard to make things rounded.

We need a bit more theatre.

BJ - take back control x 2 in one sentence. I'm fed up of Australian points system too

I still think Remain will win, the momentum is with them and the financial markets rarely get it wrong. That said there are a few 'silent Berexiteers' about so I live in hope.

I have a new game : Everytime i hear "[i][b]Take Back Control[/b][/i]" I'm punching myself in the face, hopefully i'll eventually knock myself out and come round on Saturday blissfully unaware on what the outcome is.

[b]TAKE .... BACK... CONTROOOOOOOL!!!!![/b]

[img] [/img]

The thing that frustrates me most about all of this is that both sides are making policy promises that they can't keep.
This isn't a general election.
This is a vote for in or out, not for a political party's hyperthetical policy if we remain or leave.

I'm going to take back control of another Peroni.

That's my thinking too. Brexit lot have made an awful lot of promises that they know they can't conceivably keep. On account of their entire campaign being based on a pack of lies.

So if they win (God help us all!) then the morons who voted for them are going to be looking for them to come through for them, instantly end immigration and put £350 million a week into the NHS. But as anyone with anything between their ears knows... that's not going to happen. And then there's the economy imploding

So what then?

History has shown us that people of their disposition, prone as they are to blatant hysterical lying, with no care for the consequences, Continue to unashamedly detract attention with further whopping lies, and desperately look for people to blame. Minorities come in very very handy there. And since you've based your entire campaign on xenophobia and racism, well that's the obvious way to go....?

And all of a sudden you're in Berlin, circa 1936......

[quote=binners ]xenophobia and racism......?

House!

I was a vote outer, but decided I am going to join the masses and vote to remain. I think it will be great fun seeing how it all pans out over the next 5 - 10 years. Cameron is going to reform Europe, control immigration ... and as to Turkey joining and that ridiculous rumor regarding an EU army.

I think the UK economy will go from strength to strength by staying in the EU. The member states are all doing really well so we can hopefully have a slice of the cake too 🙂

hh45. You're being sarcastic surely? the financial markets rarely get it wrong? Where were you in 2008. But they know they'll get bailed out so they don't care if they get it wrong - they're covered either way.

That's my thinking too. Brexit lot have made an awful lot of promises that they know they can't conceivably keep. On account of their entire campaign being based on a pack of lies.

Never stopped you voting Labour...

History has shown us that people of their disposition, prone as they are to blatant hysterical lying, with no care for the consequences, Continue to unashamedly detract attention with further whopping lies, and desperately look for people to blame. Minorities come in very very handy there. And since you've based your entire campaign on xenophobia and racism, well that's the obvious way to go....?

[img] [/img]

Vote Leave

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The economy wouldn't implode with Brexit - it would do fine. short term volatility yes but not anything worse. markets are always jumping around and apart from an oil shock or similar it doesn't have much impact on us.