I don't know, you seem to have decided you're the ****ing expert, you tell us.
How about not engaging if you can't do it in a civil manner? I said that I hadn't closely followed yesterday's anti-Trump protests, I don't think doing so was necessary to dismiss a nonsense conspiracy theory about the protests being part of "the plan".
There is a massive difference between claiming that Trump would exploit civil disturbances to carry out repressive actions and claiming that the protests against him were part of "the plan".
Anyway I very much doubt that Trump has welcomed these protests, which presumably he would do if it was "part of the plan", and I very much hope they signal the start of a grassroots fightback.
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What's that got to do with Trump pondo? I keep my personal opinions of you to myself.
Apologies Ernie for taking it out on you. Wasn't appropriate.Â
No worries MCTD and no need to apologise but thanks anyway. Tbh it was sufficiently out of character that I didn't take your comment very seriously. And apologies for rattling you, likewise I shouldn't be taken too seriously!
What's that got to do with Trump pondo? I keep my personal opinions of you to myself.
You posted a bunch of condescending sarcasm then, when someone took umbrage, asked them to keep it civil. Since you instruct on how others should post, be instructed. Or not, the choice is yours.Â
So nothing to to do with Trump then. I suggest you leave the business of moderation to the mods who can contact me via email if required.
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How about not engaging if you can't do it in a civil manner?Â
... about Trump? If you're prepared to pontificate about the quality of other peoples' posts, be prepared to be judged yourself. I don't doubt for a moment that your posts are anything other than an honest reflection of your thoughts, I don't think for a second that you're a troll, but it often seems like you address the forum like a contest to be won and rubbing the people you disagree with up the wrong way seems almost to be a strategy at times. Take it on board/don't take it on board, the choice is yours - it's not on the mods to judge quality of discourse on here.Â
Maybe "the plan" is felt to be a bit vaguer, more along the lines of them destroying institutions as fast and fully as they can but holding the option of declaring some kind of state of emergency if the populace kicks off in "unacceptable" numbers ??
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russia keeps banging on about a multipolar world taking over from a bipolar one. Is trump helping this along?Â
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/50501_protests
According to this Wikipedia page:
12 protesters arrested[a]
4 protesters wounded[b]
1 motorist arrested[c]
1 Police officer wounded[d]
1 Pro-Trump counter protester wounded[e]
12 arrests??? Trump's advisors need to have a word with the Met Police on how it's done if their plan to declare martial law stands any chance.
I am genuinely gobsmacked by the report of so few arrests. I have always associated American police with heavy-handed policing and the UK police with the softly softly approach.
A dozen arrests in just one big demo in London would be considered fairly low so it's difficult to believe that there wasn't much more than that across the whole of the United States.
It does seem that the protests might be the start of an organised grassroots fightback against Trump. It is hard to know how effective it is likely to be but in the past grassroots movements have been very effective in influencing US public opinion and government policies. From the Civil Rights movement and the anti-Vietnam War protests on the left, to the Tea Party movement on the right.
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A multipolar world is something thats spoken about quite often now in geopolitics. The current unipolar world we been in since the 1990s is most definitely run its course now, Trump has underlined that. With China and India increasingly getting more stronger .. its heading multipolar for sure.
I wouldn't include the tea party movement as a grass roots movement, it presented itself as a grass roots movement but was really funded and inspired by the oligarchs. IMO it was one of the points in recent history where the super wealthy realised there was no longer any real restrictions on their manipulation of the truth for their own advantage, that they could act with impunity to distort the political world and was a significant milestone leading to the current mess.
A multipolar world is something thats spoken about quite often now in geopolitics. The current unipolar world we been in since the 1990s is most definitely run its course now, Trump has underlined that. With China and India increasingly getting more stronger .. its heading multipolar for sure.
Anybody who can bring China, Japan and S.Korea together as President Trump has managed to do with tariffs must surely be in line for a Nobel Peace Prize
The deal was signed at the first high-level meeting between the countries’ top trade officials in five years. https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20250330-china-south-korea-and-japan-agree-to-strengthen-free-trade
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Interesting article on the BBC that had a few interviews in the heart of the USA on the effect and views on tariffs: Trump is still a hero to this group. This group need to have their views changed in terms of votes in the midterms before the Trump regime will take any notice:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cr4nr3230e7o
I wouldn't include the tea party movement as a grass roots movement, it presented itself as a grass roots movement but was really funded and inspired by the oligarchs.
Fair comment and yes the super-rich were indeed behind the Tea Party, but it was seen as a grassroots movement and to a degree it operated as one.
The point is that it got ordinary people out demonstrating, attending rallies, etc, and that had an effect on the wider public and the direction of government.
I included the Tea Party to suggest that influencing American public opinion through proactive demonstrations and rallies isn't just a monopoly of the left.
But certainly the anti-Vietnam War movement is probably the best grassroots movement that I can think of, and it most definitely influenced both public opinion and government policy.Â
The alternative of doing nothing also has consequences.
Anybody who can bring China, Japan and S.Korea together as President Trump has managed to do with tariffs must surely be in line for a Nobel Peace Priize
I still maintain China will be the big winner in this, America turning inwards and becoming soviet Russia, theyll all be driving cybertrucks rather than trebants but they'll fall apart just the same
I dont buy the conspiracy that Trump wants riots so he can go all police state, but I do buy the one that says plenty of the people in this administration will have made lots of money shorting stocks , knowing the markets would crash (tho perhpas not expecting them to crash quite so hard)
Its become know has the Trump Slump but if that morphs into the Trump Recession then those Ohio voters in the video might start twigging that he's clueless rather than their messiah
The part of me that is struggling with this is the seemingly universal advice being given urging other governments not to add retaliatory tariffs as it'll worsen the global situation.Â
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That just seems so unfair - basically penalising companies in every other part of the world trading into the US but not impacting US exports.Â
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I can see the logic but I do wonder if (with his huge economic advantage) this was Trumps plan all along.A one way street with governments and world leaders grovelling for a tiny bit of his love.
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Personally, I'd have negotiated a worldwide blanket 10,000% tariff on all imports to any nation from the US, including tech and services, until either Trump resigned......or appeared on stage in front of the world's leaders, de-touped, butt plugged and ball gagged, on his knees on a leash walked over to grovel by Melania....I'd probably have invited Merkel back to kick him in the bollocks. Or Jean Carroll if she fancied a bit of retribution.Â
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...But that's why I'm not given any important jobs.Â
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Whatever....world leaders are still being way too nice. Someone really needs to have their High Grant, Love Actually moment.Â
Its become know has the Trump Slump but if that morphs into the Trump RecessionÂ
He promised lower prices and is providing them.
Just on stocks vs goods.
The most cogent argument I've seen for the blanket tariffs is to leverage loyalty.
All the big importers (Nike, Apple etc) now have to go direct to Trump one by one and pledge total financial and political loyalty to his cause in exchange for tariff exemption.
He has no actual interest in 'American jobs', but this theory makes total sense.
He's already done this with the big US legal firms.
That just seems so unfair - basically penalising companies in every other part of the world trading into the US but not impacting US exports.Â
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It's a fact that the USA is currently the largest single consumer market in the world, and the rest of the world is shaped to provide those consumers with what they want. Remember when the Brexiteers announced that "They need us more than we need them?" in this case, it's broadly accurate. Trump's gamble that countries who export to the USA will either pay or will re-negotiate for better terms I think is probably about right as its in their best interests to do so and they have no other clout to effect Trump's tariffs. Long term it's probably 'better' that China/EU become their own consumer market, but that's not likely short term. Some banks and economic commentators are announcing the "end of globalisation", which has its own good/bad points, but we're just experiencing the US throwing its weight around in a way that previously has only been the plight of smaller countries.Â
He's already done this with the big US legal firms.
To be fair, a number have just rolled over on request but I think some are fighting back.Â
Trump's gamble that countries who export to the USA will either pay or will re-negotiate for better terms I think is probably about right as its in their best interests to do so and they have no other clout to effect Trump's tariffs.
Countries don't pay tariffs - importers do, either they get lower profit or they pass it to consumers! IF there are alternatives (including not buying at all) from low/no tariff locations, cost differences might make someone switch supplier but for a lot of stuff there is no short-term alternative.  Even if you move some manufacturing into the US they still need raw materials, which will often not be US-made so incur tariffs. US workers will expect better paid than Asian ones. Â
However, all of this is pretty much out of his Art of the Deal book. BUT Art of the Deal doesn't worry about Stock Market perceptions, doesn't try to negotiate diplomacy on multiple fronts, isn't worried about the long term relationship and trust - just the deal. Like Ukraine, and even Greenland he doesn't seem to realise that the US's "greatness" comes from its position as the leading player in international relations not an insular landmass. Â
The weird thing is, even if this does prove to be a very long-term benefit to the states that voted for him - the upside will be after his term is over! Â
sorry - duplicate - forum working as slick as ever!
Will there be a glut of cheaper goods to the rest of the world? Seems unlikely we can consume any more cheap Chinese gadgets than we already do, but perhaps this could help consumerise other parts of the world? There could be interesting side effects.
I still maintain China will be the big winner in this, America turning inward...
I'd agree. The diminution of USAID will only accelerate the process worldwide. Putting tariffs on Ukraine (but not Russia) will increase China's interests in Ukraine as well
China has had trade ties with Ukraine for more than a decade and Chinese companies are now assisting in the rebuilding of Russian-occupied areas of Ukraine; the idea that China and Russia can be split apart by the US befriending Russia is nonsensical
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Countries don't pay tariffs
no, but Trump has indicated that he's willing to negotiate 'fees' with counties to have tariffs lowered or removed - which is what i meantÂ
He doesn't care though. People are poorer , so what? He'll be out the door and into his little world where everyone agrees soon enough and if by some miracle America becomes richer and that wealth trickles down then he's a genius. He's never bought his own groceries or filled his car or paid his bills why would he care?
It has to go full downfall before he is impacted.Â
Every world leader turning their back on him at next UN/NATO meeting but then even Putin has friends and there will always be a line trying to placate the shining wit (spooner) instead of laughing at him.Â
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1month of the rest of the world not buying American goods or selling to America would be the great reset.
Have we done the Hitler's bunker thing yet?
https://twitter.com/gregbagwell/status/1909207626103111700
Every world leader turning their back on him
I wonder if his voucher for 'you an entitled to one state visit with a special tummy tickle from King Chaz (optional reach around by negotiation )'is still valid?
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If it is, I think the small print probably needs to include a complimentary open top drive down The Mall. I hear the gardeners have been working on a particularly attractive grassy mound...or Knoll if you will, just in case.Â
Trump visiting here was always going to be greeted by protests, but fallout from his taririffs could see car eorkers etc protesting too
If this play doesn't end in anything but economic disaster for the US I'm fearful come our next election the voice of the majority will want us to re-enact our own pitiful version (even though all circumstances are hugely different in every way but forget reality) and our own useful orange idiot will no doubt be the one stepping up to take us forward.Â
If this play doesn't end in anything but economic disaster for the US I'm fearful come our next election the voice of the majority will want us to re-enact our own pitiful version (even though all circumstances are hugely different in every way but forget reality) and our own useful orange idiot will no doubt be the one stepping up to take us forward.Â
USA has leverage as superpower/huge trading block-- we'd be crucified, remember trading blocks? good for negotiating trade with ecomomies vastly larger than the UK!
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Trump visiting here was always going to be greeted by protests
Getting in early with a prediction of him arriving to Prestwick, helicopter to one of his golf courses, helicopter to Balmoral, helicopter back to Prestwick and clearing off. He will not be anywhere near London, nowhere near the public and a million miles from any Jane Godley style placards.
USA has leverage as superpower/huge trading block-- we'd be crucified, remember trading blocks? good for negotiating trade with ecomomies vastly larger than the UK!
While no one wants to lose the chance to trade with the US, the orange buffoon has pissed off everyone else, given them no reason to trust him in negotiations and forced (in a good way) the RoW to look to each other.
He has weakened the US' position in trade negotiations rather than strengthened it. 50 countries might have been in touch since the tariff announcement, not many will be grovelling.Â
Trump threatening further tariffs on China
Trumpcession incoming
Trump threatening further tariffs on China
Trumpcession incoming
I think he's just playing a game of brinkmanship.. The only problem is this sort of game will ruin economies...
We've had covid, we have war with Russia and now we have an artificial global trade war. For no other reason than trumps ego.
I doubt China will back down - USA look increasingly vulnerable now Trump has bullied even his closest allies. China may just look to pour more fuel on the fire in the hope more countries start thinking The Enemy of My Enemy is My Friend etc ..
Biden stumbled over his words
Kamala was wooden
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Somehow this was the better option?
I doubt China will back down - USA look increasingly vulnerable now Trump has bullied even his closest allies. China may just look to pour more fuel on the fire in the hope more countries start thinking The Enemy of My Enemy is My Friend etc ..
I tentitavley agree... Trump has literally just made all USA international allies, enemies against him.
This is incredibly bad for the USA. I'm ure Trump will make bank on this personally..
I'd. Put money on it that he and his cohort will have been insider trading and sold off a shed load of stocks with the intention of buying them back at a 10-20% discount after a decent crash.
It's his MO.
But USA citizens are really screwed.. Job losses and pension losses ahoy.
It wouldn't surprise me if it gets violent once the penny really drops with the USA public.
He will not be anywhere near London
I am not sure that it counts as a state visit if London is left out of the itinerary. And it would be massively humiliating for Trump if the capital city was left out.
I expect what will happen is the same thing that happened during his last state visit to the UK. There will be huge demonstrations and Trump will simply deny, despite overwhelming evidence, that they occured.
Here Trump is claiming that he only saw thousands cheering him in London :
https://twitter.com/BBCNews/status/1135901727977172992
Whilst CBS News was telling their American audience about the mass protests in London against Trump's visit :
I don't think the point of anti-Trump protests in London will be to send any message to Trump, after all who gives a monkeys what he thinks, it will be to send a clear message to both America and the British government.
Yeh I think it was a bit premature of Starmer and by extension Charlie to give him a formal invite.
I'd like to see that rescinded but I'm not sure they have the stones.
Maybe they can just delay /pull a sickie until a state visit becomes really untenable and lost in the noise?
That would be my game plan anyway, if it was my call.
Somehow this was the better option?
Not only that, but a major talking point on much of Fox's opinion output last week has been the idea that Biden should be impeached for his cognitive decline...Don't look over there, look over here....
Somehow this was the better option?
Not only that, but a major talking point on much of Fox's opinion output last week has been the idea that Biden should be impeached for his cognitive decline...Don't look over there, look over here....
It's actually a good tactic for Trump.. Defund education etc.. A dumb population is more easily manipulated than an educated one.
Keep em dumb and angry and you've won.
It wouldn't surprise me if it gets violent once the penny really drops with the USA public.
The USA public that elected Donald Trump? Twice?
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