[Closed] Anyone believe in UFO's?

Doesn't really matter if it arose twice in a geologically close time frame such as the primordial soup days does it? Those conditions were therefore correct for life.

Saying "life has only happened once" on this planet is totally pointless when it comes to discussing extraterrestrial life. It has no bearing on anything, I don't know why the guy even brought it up.

I think he basically argued because we haven't seen evidence of life occurring from scratch again, that it was some kind of miracle. It was just determinism. Right place, right time. Most likely there are other planets that are similar.

well maybe the conditions were right for it to arise but not thrive for long, then x years later they were right for it to arise and thrive? Anyway I agree that it has no bearing on extra terrestrial life.

For the scientifically challenged...

Some great comments on the bottom there. "Statistical analysis has confirmed human life sprang from a single organism - Adam."

More relevantly, and akin to what I was saying earlier, "There are at least 400 billion galaxies, each averaging 400 billion stars in the Universe, which could be one Universe or one among many. 'Unlikely' is meaningless on this massive scale."

OK. Evidence so far is that life has only occured once. There is absolutely no evidence (so far) that life has occured more than once.
We can only look at evidence we have.
If life exists somewhere else in the universe why hasn't it occured here in more than one form?
When discussing extraterrestrial life surely things like that should be considered. I know in fact that it is.

I need to find the journal entry for this.... http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/05/ribonucleotides/

It's getting there. 10 to 20 years and we will be able to categorically state that all genesis believers are idiots.

OK. Evidence so far is that life has only occured once. There is absolutely no evidence (so far) that life has occured more than once.
We can only look at evidence we have.
If life exists somewhere else in the universe why hasn't it occured here in more than one form?
When discussing extraterrestrial life surely things like that should be considered. I know in fact that it is.

Ummm let me see.

Changing environmental conditions, evolutionary principles and survival of the fittest.

Simply put evolution produces organisms that are best suited to it's environment. Newer and different basic life forms thus may not be as suited and would be out competed for resources.

It's the same reason why one species can evolve in a very similar fashion to a completely different species half way across the world if the environmental conditions are similar.

It's getting there. 10 to 20 years and we will be able to categorically state that all genesis believers idiots.

I said pretty much this earlier today on a different thread, it wasn't well recieved.

I said pretty much this earlier today on a different thread, it wasn't well recieved.

I can't wait. Imagine how great it will be to be Richard Dawkins on that day and be able to say "I told you so, your religious texts are a load of bollocks".

Unfortunately the holocaust denier types will still try to pick uneducated holes in it. Even if we do create life from scratch in a laboratory primordial soup.

If life exists somewhere else in the universe why hasn't it occured here in more than one form?

What do you mean by form? There are millions of forms of life on Earth from single cell organisms and bacteria to the great apes.
Do you mean specifically a DNA based "form"?

Do you mean specifically a DNA based form?

Yeah I think so, for example the reason things like PNA (peptide) haven't evolved is because the conditions simply are not there for it do so.

Of course there is UFO ... didn't you watch Aliens? 🙄

We already share this planet with species that have a significant level of intelligence, that are non-human, and in at least one instance non-mammalian, with a level of reasoning somewhere around that of a five or six year old child*. You could argue that those species are 'alien', so if 'alien' species co-exist with us, why not in a great many other places in the universe.
*And I'm not counting primates.

My favourite description, courtesy of the great Carl Sagan:

[i]"..the total number of stars in the universe is greater than all the grains of sand on all the beaches of the planet Earth."
[/i]

Think about that. That is a LOT of potential "suns" for potential "Earths"!

All life (that we know of) on earth is related.
It's all one tree of life.
You are related to everything on earth from all the apes to the smallest bit of bacteria. There's a few billion years of evolution between you and the bacteria and a few million between you and the apes but you share the same origin:
[url= ]tree of life[/url]
I don't think some of you can grasp this.
Survival of the fittest is a way for evolution to occur but its still the same life form on earth with the same origin.
It's all from one origin. We haven't found evidence of other life on earth.
Why not? is all I pose (and how much relevence does this have to finding life elsewhere?)
Extraterrestrial life should have its own origin and its own tree if it exists. The probability of it is between 0 and 100%.
If you want a valid view how about those of the head of SETI.
Paul Davies has a book called The Eerie Silence.
It even starts with what thepurist quoted earlier:
"Sometimes I think we're alone in the universe, and sometimes I think we're not. In either case the idea is quite staggering."
Arthur C Clarke

[url= ]Tree of life in more detail[/url]

Have you all not seen K-Pax? It's as true as anything else we have on aliens.
If you have you'll know there's no need for UFOs.
So to answer the original question and not just try to inform some of you, albeit rather hurriedly.
No.
And anything that is a UFO is an alien space craft. Hey presto, identified and no longer a UFO.

The probability of it is between 0 and 100%.

It's hard to argue with compelling logic like that. 😉

You are forgetting how different the earth was then to it is now. The conditions do not exist for life to suddenly spring up any more, unless that is....it does happen. It may well.....but that aside...

Evolutionary principles can apply to abiogenesis, if chemical molecules compete with each other to bind other substances then the one that is the best at it wins. Chemicals such as those that produce RNA compete for resources as well.

Think of life like water, it finds the easiest way to the sea. So life finds the easiest route to fruition. So one environment will favour the outcome of a certain building block of life. We don't have any other naturally occurring chemicals on this planet that can function as information storage pathways because the environment doesn't lend itself to their production, but lent itself at one point to the formation of RNA and subsequently DNA.

We now have oceans teaming with life, that changed the whole environmental make up of this planet. They themselves probably stopped any new DNA based life forms arising from their own lineage because of A) They changed the environment B) They competed and used up the available resources needed to do so.

As others have said though, multiple abiogenesis may have happened. They just didn't survive and it's highly unlikely we would ever find any evidence for it.

pullfaces - Member
On earth we have perfect conditions for life to appear and evolve but its only done it once. All life on earth is related and comes from the same starting block.
If, in the billions of years its only appeared here once, why is it any more likely to appear somewhere else?
Probablility is about something not happening. Its not happened more than once.
So likelyhood may be we are the only part of the universe that knows its here.

Well, it has occurred here in all manner of ways.

Just take this little island, in the south of which you have reasonable looking, sophisticated, intelligent life forms, then at the other end - Scots, throwbacks to another dimension where they eat their young.

Not read what has been said before but why base ET life on what caused life to evolve here? ET life could be anything - entities we have never imagined, be able to comprehend or even be able to see, hear, smell or in any other way register.

[img] [/img]

Scots, throwbacks to another dimension where they eat their young.

[img] [/img]
The other, other white meat.

If you take a lot of psychedelic intoxicants, over time you will come to notice a kind of pattern of physics related molecular consciousness which would appear to indicate some kind of vibrating energy quantum particle level of reality..

which is very very [i]very[/i] big... (and calm)

there may also be other stuff out there which already understands this fully and has evolved that way.. maybe.. and they probably like techno and positivity..

maybe.. possibly.. err drugs are baaad mmmkay 😳

EDIT: and they look like that Scottish bloke in the photo above

The drugs could be the alien forms entering your weak human body..

'specially the shrooms

It's getting there. 10 to 20 years and we will be able to categorically state that all genesis believers are idiots.

Don't tell me I've bought the wrong bike

[img] [/img]

mastiles_fanylion - Member

Not read what has been said before but why base ET life on what caused life to evolve here? ET life could be anything - entities we have never imagined, be able to comprehend or even be able to see, hear, smell or in any other way register.

chemically there's only one periodic table in the universe

that's an awfully arrogant assumption from a fat and terminally earthbound bag of water such as yourself surely..?

that's an awfully arrogant assumption from a fat bag of water such as yourself surely..?

Are you two friends or is now ok for everyone to insult each other on this forum unless they are called toys19?

It wasn't a personal insult though.. we're all fat bags of water

no the elements are the only ones its not really arrogance to state that anymore than it is arrogant to say gravity works everywhere

fat bags of water have discovered some universal truths
edit: speak for yourself i am thin bag of water

It wasn't a personal insult though.. we're all fat bags of water

true, some more than others..

fat bags of water have discovered some universal truths

LOL.. are you serious..?

we can maybe explore about 1mm into the infinite yet we have discovered universal truths as a result..?

does the earthworm know universal truths about high definition televisions.?

don't be so daft.. 😆

what if we live in a can of fizzy pop..?

Didn't NASA find a non-carbon (phosphorus?) life-form in Mono Lake a while back, or was that discredited?

slainte ❓ rob

we can maybe explore about 1mm into the infinite

We can "see" about 46 billion light years into the universe. Giving us a sphere around 92 billion light years in diameter to use as a sample.

That's a pretty big "millimetre".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Observable_universe

We can "see" about 46 billion light years into the universe

ooooh.. aren't we flippin' brilliant.. 😆

OK.. so we're earthworms that occasionally flop onto the pavement to look at the sky when there's some wet weather.. until we drown, or get eaten by a bird or run over by a Toyota Prius

Problem with that viewpoint yunki is that it gets really tedious really fast. Not that it's wrong though. No one has ever observed any element in the universe that is out of line with the periodic table. Well, you might say, what if we're just the equivalent of planarians and there's actually 100 periodic tables beyond our ken? Well....yeah? It's a total cul-de-sac of thought.

Yes we are rather. For hairless monkeys wearing trousers we are able to work out some pretty interesting stuff about the universe.

Yunki I suggest you learn some stuff about chemistry and how elements are made and constructed rather thna just imbibe them 😉
Perhaps you could explain to me how say gravity is not a universal truth?

it may be true to say we have only scratched the surface but that is not to say somethings we have found are universally true.

does the earthworm know universal truths about high definition televisions.?

don't be so daft.

wow.. just wow at the narrow mindedness..
awesome

are you guys for real..?

I always had you two down as the bright sparks on here..

maybe you are right.. maybe our little rock and it's tiny parasites can look up into the sky and say without doubt that 2+2=4 amen..

but maybe we are just trying to find explanations to fit our mayfly like existence.. with a beginning a middle and an end.. and maybe we are little more than parasites in the Earthworms gut.. wriggling about in the worm poo and professing to know all..

why does intelligence only have to exist in the neat little carbon package that we understand..?

yunki earlier:

[img] [/img]

exactly

Well, you might say, what if we're just the equivalent of planarians and there's actually 100 periodic tables beyond our ken? Well....yeah? It's a total cul-de-sac of thought.

fair enough.. that's an intelligent response.. all this 'yes it is cos I say it is and you're Keanu Reeves if you don't agree' riles me a bit though.. 😳

And so what if it is?

The rules and theories would still stand for "our universe".
Likewise if we are just one permutation in an infinite multiverse.

all this 'yes it is cos I say it is and you're Keanu Reeves if you don't agree' riles me a bit though..

Good. All the mystic hand-wavey "ah but how can you really know" bollocks riles me right back 😆

I'm with yunki on this one.

We know a lot about things close to us, yet are still discovering things we didn't know about the little lump of rock (speck of dust) we are scurrying about on.

We know some things about the vessel that contains our little speck of dust, but there is far, far more to be learned.

Beyond that, we know nothing - absolutely nothing at all - not a little bit, not even an inkling. To assume we do is extremely arrogant and by it's very nature, a very human trait.

F*** me - the world was flat a few hundred years ago.

In fact time only exists because we decided it does.