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Is that the same guy that was complaining about people getting changed last time round?
Andy Weir, from Ridelines Mountain Bike Tuition, said: “I understand your frustration, Allan, but I don’t think signage would be the solution.
“There are signs saying no dog fouling and yet there are people who live in this town who ignore that signage as well.
“People who are going to be disrespectful and ride their bike on the pavement are not going to pay any attention to a sign.”
“It is people who are disrespectful,” said Mr Weir, “I don’t think it is fair to label the mountain biking community as being disrespectful.”
People being d@@ks and other people overreacting shocker!
You should have read all the vitriol in the letters page of the local paper when Pedal For Scotland was on.
Remember the vicar who was putting tacks on the road during the Etape Caledonia?
As a society, we need to be more empathetic to others and try not to be selfish d@@ks. Irrespective of what you use to travel about on/in.
As a society, we need to be more empathetic to others and try not to be selfish d@@ks. Irrespective of what you use to travel about on/in.
We've hardly got good role models though have we.. Or at least we have 100%..but they don't sell advertising or copy
This is pretty much how I remember Innerleithen around 2005 when I first got into mountain biking.
https://www.mbr.co.uk/news/how-mountain-biking-saved-innerleithen-396588
I'm not saying that people bringing money into a place should be allowed to act like a@@e holes, but Innerleithen is a nicer place these days due to the money brought in from mountain biking.
I agree that our politicians are not the best role models, but have they ever been?
Your best role models should be your parents. Although knowing some of the folk who work at my company, this does worry me somewhat.
I'm not perfect but I do try to be a good role model for my kids. Although I should crash less, as they keep reminding me 😂
Looks like an ex-policeman and ex local councillor complaining about stuff for the sake of it, yes there are idiots on our side who just don't think of others that much, but it's not really a pandemic, and sure those heading to Innerleithen aren't cycling around the town on pavements that much?
I'd be asking why Mr Johnston he thinks people are riding on the pavement. I'd guess because they don't feel safe on the roads. Signs are not the answer.
I'm kind of amazed you can get 800mm bars down the pavement in innerleithen!
MR Ride Lines has a point though... the dog shite in peebles/innerleithen is getting out of control
My first visit was in 2004/2005 to use the uplift. The town seemed a bit run down then. We stayed in a bungalow that had water running down some of the bedroom walls when it was raining.
Been up a few times most years and it's evident that over that time its flourished.
In my opinion the Main Road is a bit of a problem to ride down. Cars are constantly parked down one side with just enough room for passing cars. It's the only time I've been clipped with a wing mirror by a car that tried to force me onto the payment to get past whilst a line of traffic was coming the other way.
Surely the best way forward to keep cyclists safe and off the pavement. would be double yellow lines the full length of the Main Road
People who live there should be able to go about their daily business without the need for special measure such as full length double yellows.
The town has done well out of MTBs but that's not it's reason for being.
It is incumbent on us to be better. There will always be those who grumble but don't hand them ammunition.
It's a small town with not much room.
Agreed. But you should be able to cycle safely on any road and if that means having to park and walk a couple of hundred metres due to yellow lines. All options should be on the table to be considered. Not just signs on the pavement.
By the way the woman that clipped me with her mirror turned right into the housing estate at the end of town and parked up. Can't see what her rush was. I should have reported it but wasn't worth the hassle
Cars obeying the 20mph speed limit would be a good start.as well.
Some do and sone do not and the difference is considerable.
But in answer to the post, yes its a minority.
And Andy from Ridelines nailed it but the wrong headlines go in the local paper!
Dog shite is terrible.
Games week this week I wonder how much litter and empty glass bottles will be left around town!
This is a very non biking crowd.
The real solution is to ban the cars, pedetrianise the place? Amd make lazy ****ers walk a bit further.
Which is the solution for every town and city to improve both the town / city, and the basic health of half the population. Not just Innerleithen.
Surely the best way forward to keep cyclists safe and off the pavement. would be double yellow lines the full length of the Main Road
Which would make one road better and the rest of the town a nightmare. I know what you are saying but geneuinely its a pokey wee town thats never designed for this volume of cars (or cars at all really) chucking them all into the side streets will just make all the side streets dangerous.
And without trying to victim blame*... if its narrow enough someone clipped you with their wingmirror why did you let them past. Inner leithen is a primary position job the whole way I generally find people are happier with just not being able to get past AT ALL ratehr than a stressful can't really but might be achievable overtaking situation.
A one way system or pedestrianizsed zone might be a compromise but that would be a bit of a head scratcher to actually achieve. And I can really even think of a decent car park location.
Anywayz less cars isn't a bad idea but your solution just moves it out of your way as a visitor busy side streets are more dangerous for the residents.
Which is the solution for every town and city to improve both the town / city, and the basic health of half the population. Not just Innerleithen.
Thing is for a city that is a solution, it has the headcount for public transport to make sense. the cost of the bypass required would be prohibitive.
*obviously i have no idea exactly what went down, please don't take offence.
Surely the best way forward to keep cyclists safe and off the pavement. would be double yellow lines the full length of the Main Road
There has been a lot of development of cycle paths (sorry, mixed use) in Innerz and Peebles, some of which goes round the back streets. The main Street could easily be largely avoided going from Red Bull CP to Golfie. I guess for the majority of visitors that would need..... Signs.
Is this him?
Brilliant 🙂
I often ride at the Inners trails as it's near to me, and I can't say I've ever noticed an issue of folk riding on the pavement on the High Street or any other street, they're just too narrow.
Assuming the 'bike park' development goes ahead at the Golfie then this problem is already on the way to being solved isn't it.? My understanding is that the golf course clubhouse is being moved further up the road, the current clubhouse will be taken over by the bike park and the car park extended. This will hopefully mean everyone riding at the Golfie will be able to park at the Golfie and those riding on the other side of the valley can use the FC car park. The only people riding along the high street should be the relatively fewer number who want to ride both sides of the valley in the same day.!
I think part of the problem is that there are currently no facilities other than what's on the high street. Why isn't there a cafe at the Inners car park.? Assuming that local businesses had the opportunity to be involved I would have thought putting the facilities that bikers want at each of the 'trailheads' would reduce the volume of cycling traffic on the high street to a level that's more palatable to residents just trying to go about their business.??
Why isn’t there a cafe at the Inners car park.?
Nobody wants to build a cafe where the car park is 3ft under water several times a year
Nobody wants to build a cafe where the car park is 3ft under water several times a year
Well that's true but hardly an insurmountable problem.. few thousand tonnes of hardcore would raise the car park to the same height as the road and solve the issue.. Feels more like it's yet another example of the FC wanting to reap the rewards of MTB tourism without putting any effort in. Will be curious to see what happens with that side of the valley if/when the Golfie development is done and the majority of the business is over that side.
anyone know where Mrs Wilson lives? asking for a friend......
park and
walkride a couple of hundred metres
Bikers could do us all a favour by doing the same when riding at the Golfie but instead they park on the road side near the bridge turning it into a single track road. Andy is right, people are dicks, not bikers per se but as a lot of the bikers are visitors it's incumbent on them to be sensible and responsible.
If that's the person who I think it is, I've had dealings with him at an event, where an organising team member's husband had to ask him to leave, as he was standing in her face being a provocative a**e trying to intimidate her.
And that was after I almost told him to F off, as he wouldn't leave me alone to do the job I was being paid to do at the time.
He's a classic NIMBY who hates seeing others having fun, and thinks the street outside his house is for his own personal use, and not to even be walked on by anybody who doesn't live on the street.
I do agree with some of the points about riding on pavements, as I have witnessed people riding at speed along the pavements, but I've personally got no issue with people riding at slow/walking speed on the wider sections of pavement if they're going to a shop/café/flat on that section and it avoids the need to cross the road twice.
It's all about being considerate to others, and applying some common sense, but unfortunately there's those people who just want to get from A to B as quickly as possible without thinking about things like the possibility of someone stepping out their front door not expecting a rider to be spinning along the pavement.
few thousand tonnes of hardcore would raise the car park to the same height as the road and solve the issue..
Where do you plan to put the compensatory storage?
H1ghland3r
Free MemberWell that’s true but hardly an insurmountable problem.. few thousand tonnes of hardcore would raise the car park to the same height as the road and solve the issue.. Feels more like it’s yet another example of the FC wanting to reap the rewards of MTB tourism without putting any effort in.
OK so, first of all it's a flood plain so if you raise the car parok so it doesnt flood, somewhere else floods instead, or worse. And if you used just loose stone, it'll start washing into the river on day one causing even more problems, river defence is engineered. Building stuff in a flood plain is hard work and a bad idea at the best of times, floodproofing a car park is just a bit crazy
As for the second part, accusing the fc of not putting any effort is not on. There'd be none without them. Theyve poured money and labour and tolerance into the valley and it's mostly others that profit.
FLS only lease the land the car park is on, so they are very limited as to what they can do with it.
There's also been the various plans for biking at Innerleithen over the years, which made FCS and now FLS very cautious about investing there.
No organisation is going to invest large sums of money, when there is the potential for them to lose that investment in a couple years time.
LoL so the caberston clubhouse area will be like DYFI at the weekends? The golf course closing?
I am all for investment and keeping things afloat in the tweed valley. I just worry for the trails. I have seen them really wearing down since 2018. The extra laps, riding all season etc.
I used to live in Peebles and also got pretty fed up of mountain bikers 😀 I got the feeling a lot of people actually from there were tired of the weekend invasion so to speak.
I used to live in Peebles and also got pretty fed up of mountain bikers 😀 I got the feeling a lot of people actually from there were tired of the weekend invasion so to speak.
Like it or not it's a 'tourist' location - and with any benefit comes downsides.
Same with Inners, I mean there are now 4 bike shops there. It's a 'town' of 3,000 people of they've 4 bike shops plus other retailers, pubs and a whole host of accommodation.
duplicate due to timeout
Mr Johnston added that he has anecdotal evidence of people being hit by cyclists and being abused when they get in the way.
Sure you do Allan.
Unfortunately people are dicks. Allan being one.
Like it or not it’s a ‘tourist’ location – and with any benefit comes downsides.
Same with Inners, I mean there are now 4 bike shops there. It’s a ‘town’ of 3,000 people of they’ve 4 bike shops plus other retailers, pubs and a whole host of accommodation.
All at a decent level too. On the up!
Like it or not it’s a ‘tourist’ location – and with any benefit comes downsides.
I used to live up the road (Heptonstall) from Hebden Bridge, and it attracts probably similar numbers of cycle tourists. Sometimes I saw riders (both MTB and roadies) behaving a bit like entitled dicks. Heb. has a largely pedestrianised centre, and the amount of folks I saw slowly weaving past folks left me wincing. It's takes a second to dismount and walk. Another issue was ignorance (not in the pejorative sense) of local sensitivity. TC Hype released a video of an area literally on my doorstep and the next few weeks saw the relatively hard to find entrance to series of (illegal) trails through a wood opened up and strewn with litter. It got fenced off not long after.
Tourists can be a blessing and a curse
TC Hype released a video of an area literally on my doorstep and the next few weeks saw the relatively hard to find entrance to series of (illegal) trails through a wood opened up and strewn with litter.
Thats a different argument, riding "secret" local trails and plastering them all over youtube but in a way that anyone with half a brain cell can easily figure out where they are.
Totally agree. I lived in Innerleithen for about 10 years (before I got into MTB!) and it was a bit of a hole. Much much improved now and it's a buzzing little town whereas before the main street was dead come 5pm.
K
Thats a different argument
Yes it is, but the end result is the same; non-locals coming to a place and not treating with the respect that locals would like. Mountain bikers getting a rep for being arseholes takes just a minute, rebuilding trust afterwards takes ages.
Yes it is, but the end result is the same; non-locals coming to a place and not treating with the respect that locals would like. Mountain bikers getting a rep for being arseholes takes just a minute, rebuilding trust afterwards takes ages.
True, especially if the mountain bikers are shouting "rad" and "sick" and "stoked" at the tops of their voices as they "get steezy" or whatever the yoot of today say as slap their way down loamy hand cut trails that criss-cross multiple busy footpaths at top speed like they do in my old local woods which have featured a few times on said YT channel.
hand cut trails that criss-cross multiple busy footpaths
Doesn't really apply to any of the Inners/Golfie trails.
I do however think that some times people visiting are a little oblivious to blocking the footpaths and being a bit unaware of folks trying to go about their lives.
But you tend to get that with groups of people whether they're biking or not so no big deal.
He’s a classic NIMBY who hates seeing others having fun, and thinks the street outside his house is for his own personal use, and not to even be walked on by anybody who doesn’t live on the street.
Probably but
We’ve hardly got good role models though have we.. Or at least we have 100%..but they don’t sell advertising or copy
What sells advertising is clicks and interactions and the more bile and hatred that generates the better. A local (not to me but in my FB feed) rag recently completely misquoted an article on bike infrastructure... but they do the same for cats vs dogs or anything else that drives hatred as that's what sells.
I've said this a few times now when this topic crops up, but i think the issue is that Innerleithen and the local council is more than happy to rake in the extra cash that mountain biking has brought to the area but won't bother their backsides to invest in additional infrastructure to support the increase in tourism.
On most weekends, parking near the golfy side is a challenge if you're not there early. Cue having to park over at the red bull carpark and cycle through the town which is where these incidents seem to be happening. If a nice big free car park was built at golfy (or even further up the road where the quarry is), with cafe/facilities the problem would be solved immediately as everyone avoids going through the centre of inners.
If a nice big free car park was built at golfy (or even further up the road where the quarry is), with cafe/facilities
Funded by who? SBC are skint like no money for jotters in school skint. And look at the lengths rad dudes go to to avoid paying a couple of quid for parking.
It does come back to respecting that it's a working town with a relatively high MTB focus. But visitors of all types (and to all places) need to be better at visiting. Locals know how much the town has profited but they also see the day in day out disrespect, that some folk have for places they are only in for a few hours.
We need to be better and we need to bring our standards up.
It does come back to respecting that it’s a working town with a relatively high MTB focus. But visitors of all types (and to all places) need to be better at visiting. Locals know how much the town has profited but they also see the day in day out disrespect, that some folk have for places they are only in for a few hours.
Amen to that. I live near a small Scottish seaside town. It's a thriving place 12 months a year but it does pick up a healthy amount of tourism in the summer. Businesses obviously benefit from this and people are not stupid.
But.......the local facebook group (I know, never a sane place whatever town you live in) seethes with the disrespect - the litter, the stupid parking etc that exclusively happens in significant quantities in the tourist months. Can't live with them, can't live without them.
Isn't the old mill site being turned into a huge development centre with car park/eeeb rentals/massive bike shop etc? That will be the place to park for a round of golf. I would just settle for them fixing the charger by No1.
People will be people - those visiting an area have no real interest in how the locals get by and seem to think the place they are visiting is there for them. Winds me up how much people think consideration and common sense doesn't need to be used when visiting a place.
Always great to spend money in those places, but not a suitable reason to treat it like it is there purely for their entertainment.
Likewise, the locals will be happy with the increased money coming in to the area, but the downside with that is that there are far more people there and they don't live in the area so have no real idea of whatever issues/concerns are going on.
Double-edged sword really. However, I do think a bit more consideration by the people visiting the area would be a big start at improving things.
My mild rant isn't just about Innerleithen, it covers all areas that have an increase in non-locals (tourists and anyone else really) visiting and using the area.
I think a few things have happened in the past ten to fifteen years in Innerleithen. The MTB events coming back to the town again from 2008 and getting bigger each year, and e-bikes making the Golfie trails much more accessible to entry level riders (before it was challenging to get up to the top and few were prepared to pay in sweat)
The latest talk about putting in a parking lot at the Golf Club is just that - more word salad business case stuff (was it from DMBiS?). I have commented on this before the Golf Club own the land and the club house it would take a compulsory purchase order signed by Ministers etc etc. I am not saying it won't happen, but not soon.
Peebles does not have the same issues - the main trail centre is away from the town and has facilities.
It does come back to respecting that it’s a working town with a relatively high MTB focus. But visitors of all types (and to all places) need to be better at visiting. Locals know how much the town has profited but they also see the day in day out disrespect, that some folk have for places they are only in for a few hours.
Absolutely this.
it would take a compulsory purchase order
Apparently the Golf Club are fully in favour, they need the cash that a land sale would generate. It's part of the same Borderlands funding deal that the Innovation Centre is being paid for, but AFAIK depends on some commercial input too.
All those saying put a cafe in the car parks, what about the local businesses that have built up a customer base? Loulabelles, No.1 and the like? I know Loulabelles have a coffee van they put out for weekends and such but this is Peel vs Hub all over again. The easy solution is decent parking where its needed but close enough to town that folk can stroll over for food. That's fine for the DH and a work in progress for the Golfie.
I live near a small Scottish seaside town
I live in one, parking is an issue all year round even when there are no tourists.
Also that article, really? The guy may be a dick but digging up nearly 25yo dirt on someone is kinda sad.
Dick Barton
People will be people – those visiting an area have no real interest in how the locals get by and seem to think the place they are visiting is there for them. Winds me up how much people think consideration and common sense doesn’t need to be used when visiting a place.
Always great to spend money in those places, but not a suitable reason to treat it like it is there purely for their entertainment.
Likewise, the locals will be happy with the increased money coming in to the area, but the downside with that is that there are far more people there and they don’t live in the area so have no real idea of whatever issues/concerns are going on.
Double-edged sword really. However, I do think a bit more consideration by the people visiting the area would be a big start at improving things.
My mild rant isn’t just about Innerleithen, it covers all areas that have an increase in non-locals (tourists and anyone else really) visiting and using the area.
It's a bit more complex as locals themselves form different demographics.
The real complexity is then trying to as you say get a balance but extremists on both sides are always going to be determined to prevent that.
If you own a nice 14 bedroom "cottage" as your second home then your interests are probably quite different to someone renting a flat and trying to bring up 3 kids on minimum wage.
(I'm being deliberately extreme)
How do you balance employment opportunities vs people flooding in?
I've recently been looking at Surrey Hills a bit differently... I guess as I noticed Gomshall Mill pub closed then I realised the one at Abinger Hammer had closed ages ago... and compared to my impressions in the past the A25 corridor is all looking a bit run down. Meanwhile, Coldharour seem to want in on the act.
Mentally I'd sort of correlated this with Inners area... that seems to my outside (MTB tinted) eyes to actually be doing really well.. I get the impression the local MTB haters are more in a minority as they see on one hand employment and incomes and on the other a possible becoming like Gomshall..??
this particular chap does seem to be able to find something to moan about whatever the situation.
but undeniably there are people who are making it easy for him. the other day i saw people riding on pavements on the high street and leithen road, and in both these cases i honestly couldn't work out why they were doing it, other than thoughtlessness.
so yeah, perhaps some better signage reminding people to stay off the pavements would help. it certainly wouldn't do any harm.
whilst andy weir's point is reasonable re people ignoring signs, i find it a bit easier to challenge that sort of behaviour from other riders if there's signs up to reinforce the point. so even if some people won't pay attention to them, it doesn't mean its not worthwhile to have some.
the other day i saw people riding on pavements on the high street and leithen road,
I've just done a street view on Google Maps for those places and find it quite funny that there's barely a a car in sight in any direction. I'm guessing it's not always like that? 😀 (Some people just default to riding on the pavement - maybe less regular riders, or not confident in traffic?)
INNERLEITHEN signs stating: ‘No Cycling on the Pavement’ may put a spoke in the wheel of riders who disregard the law.
Isn't that a good thing? I like having spokes in my wheels.
Inners is a tough one as the main road from Peebles to Galashiels runs through the middle and it's a very small town, maybe some better signage between trail area's would help? It's not the easiest to navigate around the main road if you're not local and might help separate out the bikes/cars/pedestrians.
It is though a definite issue, I drove through at the weekend and a group of 7 bikers rode along the high street pavement before riding out between parked cars into the flow of traffic. I can't say if the driver of the car they sort of merged in front of had to brake as I was going the other way but it looked pretty close. Having previously lived there for 6 months I can confirm this definitely wouldn't be an isolated incident.
First thing I saw on Saturday morning was a group of half a dozen on bikes outside the Coop blocking the pavement completely..
This has just been posted on a local page by a councillor...
The police community action team (CAT) have agreed to look at a few issues that have been raised by local councillors concerning cycling on pavements in Innerleithen, and anti social behaviour in and around the swap and share shed. For these issues to be properly looked at however we need any instances to be reported by telephoning 101, as that will build up a picture of the scale of the problem.
I wish I could buy out the golf course land. Also the whole Golfie. Charge Ebikes a season pass. Start a key club.
It’s not the easiest to navigate around the main road if you’re not local
Ah come on. If people can use Strava and trailforks to find and navigate their way around the trails they can use Google maps to avoid the high street. It all comes down to laziness and thoughtlessness, there's no excuse for adults cycling along and blocking pavements or parking badly.