Need to spec brakes on a bit yet ordered Raaw Madonna V3....
Had Shimano XT 4 pistons for the last eight years and have been happy with them. This year I was having to bleed them every other ride after a summer of riding in the parks.
There's the Shimano XT and XTR brakes out and I'm tempted by them. I already have the i-spec (no idea which version🫤) so that might make swapping the gear shifter over a little easier, but I'm sure there are better/ more interesting options or there.
No overly interested in SRAM. The only brand that has ever really let me down (Guides) and too many friends have had problems with the new Maven offering.
Preferably want mineral oil....
Formula Cura 4?
Lewis?
Budget TBC.
What you got?
Budget TBC?
Trickstuff Maximas then
Hayes Dominion. Love the bite point feel on them and the lever feel itself too!
Keep looking at the Hel adv’s, and they are even more tempting with the 20% off at the moment
Hayes Dominion. Love the bite point feel on them and the lever feel itself too!
Same.running them for over a year. No issues. Excellent stoppers.
Unless you are spending Trickstuff money, Hayes Dominion.
In fact, I would pick them over a Direttissima & have a hard time justifying my Maximas over them.
The only negative, is spares prices.
I’m with you, I dislike SRAM but only have a working set left, which is good 🤣 I have the Cura 2 pots on my enduro bike, with green stuff pads and they are excellent, just a little underpowered (I’m 75 kg) but still do long descents ok. It was a late night order and I did intend to order the 4 😆 which I would expect are excellent…
I have XT on my eeb with Galfer greens and they are outstanding and got an absolute hammering this year with no complaints. Easy to set up to preference, nice and progressive and very easy to bleed. £200 ish for a full set is pretty good too… 🙂
Noting the SRAM reluctance, I’ve just got an SL eeb that has the code silver stealth and HS2 rotors and oh my goodness they are powerful.
My Levo has Code Stealth Ultimates and they are fantastic stoppers tbh.
Also, I'd read a fair bit about Shimano being too on/off and all bite. I've fitted XTR's to my latest build and find them really powerful, easy enough to modulate if you don't grab at them and also nice and easy to fit/bleed
Also, I'd read a fair bit about Shimano being too on/off and all bite.
Think the on/off thing comes from people who swap bikes often.
You really get used to it and I wrote like the on-off of the brakes..... I mean, I only brake when I want to show down anyways. Not much of a dragger.
Love my Hayes Dominion. Bestest brakes I have had, period.
If I needed to replace my Hope Tech 4 E4s which have been brilliant for the last 3.5 years, I'd buy the Evos without hesitation.
I run: 2 bikes with Hope E4, Hope V4, two bikes with Shimano xt and one with SRAM level on MTBs.
If I was spending money on new brakes it would be the new big boy hopes.
The rest are fine, the xt have wandered a wee bit.
The SRAM levels are on a commuter that sees the odd bit of single track and have 100% perfect much to my surprise.
I'd replace them all with hope if money was no object.
If I needed to replace my Hope Tech 4 E4s which have been brilliant for the last 3.5 years, I'd buy the Evos without hesitation.
I've got a set of (Tech 3??) Hopes that I've had for a couple of decades. They've never been bled, have been swapped about bikes, have a scored phenolic piston from me being hamfisted with a screwdriver - and still work. Maybe not up there with the brakes on my best bikes and hardly get used on the bike they are currently on, but still admirable.
I would have got some Evos for the Stanton, but they weren't quite in the shops when I did my build - will be definitely trying some if my next potential Radical Chilli Dog build goes ahead
No love for a Shigura set up?
I have the MT5 and SLX and they’re good, but son has MT7 and SLX and they’re surprisingly better (I set them up on both bikes so no idea why).
TRP DH are also highly recommended by people I’ve met with them.
TRP DH are also highly recommended by people I’ve met with them.
Also have TRP brakes on the Ragley (only Slate Evo's) and they are decent. Shimano lite aren't they?
I've got the TRP DH Evo on the new Levo SL and they feel nice but they're lacking outright power compared to by E4's. They work really well but on the steep, sketchy stuff they just don't have anywhere near the same level of bite. I can't comment on bleeding or longevity yet.
This is what I'd buy and this is the best price I can find...
https://startfitness.co.uk/products/hope-tech-4-evo-gr4-four-piston-hydraulic-brakeset-no-rotor
I think people maybe overthink brakes sometimes. Yeah you definitely notice good stoppers, but - unless you're riding big long/seriously steep descents, how good do they need to be?
I'm not rad, but I'm not slow either. My 28kg Kenevo has crappy old SRAM Code R's on it. I know they aren't the best brakes I own by a long shot - I can't ever remember not being able to stop when I needed to though...
Either Hayes Dominions or Hope Tech4 V4s or their new equivalent. Power wise they're about the same, but the long dead spot in the Dominion levers started to become noticeable, and less preferable, compared to the T4V4, which I now have on both bikes. I never thought I'd be back on Hopes after some pretty rubbish months back in the day, but here I am!
I think people maybe overthink brakes sometimes. Yeah you definitely notice good stoppers, but - unless you're riding big long/seriously steep descents, how good do they need to be?
I'm not rad, but I'm not slow either. My 28kg Kenevo has crappy old SRAM Code R's on it. I know they aren't the best brakes I own by a long shot - I can't ever remember not being able to stop when I needed to though...
I agree. It’s about feel too.
I noticed Jack Moir went over to TRP after being a SRAM fan forever but not liking the Mavens.
Apparently Oisin O’Callaghan recommended them to him.
I'm in a similar position for my new build. Despite having problems out in the Alps a couple of years ago with my 4 pot XTRs, after a full rebleed and those 3 layered 203mm rotors they were excellent so I'm thinking 4 pot XTs on my new build (or swapping the XTRs over and putting some XTs on the old bike...).
That said, I've read a lot about the Dominions and a mate has some and rates them. I had some Mavens on a hired e-bike at Golfie a few weeks back and they suffered absolutely zero fade through repeated top to bottom runs - they impressed me. Other option is Hopes which seem to be on a par with Hayes pricing wise - the biggest thing going for the Hopes is that in my experience they're dead easy to bleed if needed vs Shimanos which require you to be some kind of witch doctor to be able to do it properly.
XTs with 203mm rotors are currently top of my list I think...
Also have TRP brakes on the Ragley (only Slate Evo's) and they are decent. Shimano lite aren't they?
I used Slate EVOs on two bikes for a year or so. IME less immediate on/off compared to Shimano - not better or worse, just different - but didn't have the same outright power as 4-piston Deores. Still adequate though.
I then bought a secondhand bike that came with 4-piston XTs which are on another level for power. I soon after swapped my other two bikes to the same, complete with XT or XTR rotors. Currently using standard metal finned pads and will try Galfer once they're done. Big test will be next summer when I hope to be back in the Alps and have cooked every brake I've used over there, but for my UK use they've been faultless and no wandering.
XTs with 203mm rotors are currently top of my list I think...
IME they can be great. I've not experienced any of the wandering bite point I've heard about. Unsure how much difference fancy rotors make but I've gone with a mix of XT and XTRs for the supposed extra cooling benefits.
Formula do silver so they are obviously the best: https://www.lordgunbicycles.co.uk/formula-cura-disc-brake-3?option=39052&destination=GBR¤cy=GBP&srsltid=AfmBOopxM33TUiIWrd-080gGDirwuIYZ-6jJB1tVFTZ4H6zIT7Lfz3vdrkI
firstly congrats on choosing the best bike ever. I absolutely love my V3 Madonna.
When i first built mine I had some base level Shimano 4 pots that i had used for years. They just worked.
Then i had a flutter and bought some Trickstuff Maximas. An insane amount of money for brakes. But they are worth every penny.
The feel, the power, the workmanship. Clearly a big upgrade from the cheap Shimano's, but having used and felt various other brakes over the years, they are unmatched (which they should be for £1300!!!).
Thats my 2cent's worth!
My hayes are good but the 2024 XT's on the eeb are just as good and get a lot more abuse. spolit these days
Not sure if these have been mentioned, but the Hel brakes are really good from a small business in Devon with a pedigree in MotoGP
https://mtb.helperformance.com/collections/complete-brake-systems
Another vote for Hope Evo GR4's. Having recently bought some I've very impressed with the power and I'm a big fan of how easy Hope brakes are to live with long term. These replaced some Tech 4 E4's. I've recently had a bike with Sram Maven's and I own another bike with Formula Cura's. The GR4's get my vote.
I know it's a running joke that Saint hasn't been updated in more than a decade, but I got a pair last year when I decided to treat myself to new brakes - and they've been amazing.
Almost went for TRPs, but I read that the lever doesn't pull very close to the bar - and I do like a short reach.
Cura 4 are awesome, tons of power and don't fade. I like the feel of them too. Much better than the xt 4pots they replaced
unless you're riding big long/seriously steep descents, how good do they need to be?
Spent all summer in the bike parks around Piemont. 500-800m descents, 5-7000m descending in a day is easily done.
Formula do silver so they are obviously the best
And they're kinda sexy.
Mate had the 2pots and was happy till he bled them with DOT fluid. 🫤
Hayes Dominions
Look a bit lumpy, imo.
I'm on a set on of Mavens at the moment, but they are coming off. There's just not enough modulation when there's not much traction.
I'll be off the bike until December due to a bad shin bone bruise, after an off about ten days ago. Steep little muddy shute, and I lost the front end after I breathed on the Mavens a bit too hard. They are great in the dry, but too digital in the slop.
I'll be swapping back to Code RSCs (or Rs) this month which I just can't fault (other than bleeding them) and I definitely prefer the lever feel to that of the Saint's on my DH bike...
TRP are great. I've been running Slate Evos for a couple of years - very reliable, very easy to bleed, etc. no wandering bite point, take Shimano-style pads, and I've not noticed them being down on power.
Easily comparable (or better than) the Tech 3 E4s on another bike. I'm running them with 2.3mm 203mm rotors front and rear.
Lots of mentions of Hope GR4s but what do we think of the TR4s? I dont have a downhill bike or e-bike so have been tempted by the TR4s recently.
Hayes Dominion A4 all the way - been running them on two bikes for years without a single issue. Superb brakes.
Honorary nod to the Formula Cura 2's on my old, old bike, which too have been fault-free. Not quite as powerful as the Hayes 4-pots but they're great brakes.
Shimanos - so many reliability problems over the years, their reputation is ruined for me. Wandering bite points, leaking o-rings, constantly needing something fettled with them: I'm done with them.
I've never tried a SRAM brake that I didn't find hateful. Each to their own / you do you and all, but not for me.
For those with Dominion A4s, do any of you get rubbing? I can't get them to run free for more than five minutes, gave up and been to two different shops, still rub. Love the feel of them but they seem delicate. Same across two bikes, mine and my partner's.
Thinking of trying GR4's but waiting for a bit more real world feedback before buying..
Lots of mentions of Hope GR4s but what do we think of the TR4s? I dont have a downhill bike or e-bike so have been tempted by the TR4s recently.
Have them on my trail bike, absolutely delighted with them.
Had Shimano XT 4 pistons for the last eight years and have been happy with them. This year I was having to bleed them every other ride after a summer of riding in the parks.
Were they the same set of brakes for 8 years? had they had the seals and internals replaced?
Everything fails or needs servicing eventually, so theres no brakes you wont hear stories about.
IME -
Hope - can get them completely rebuilt by Hope for a reasonable price and they hold their second hand value better than anything.
Shimano - you can buy spares pretty much anywhere and it's often cheap enough to just swap out a lever or caliper if theres an issue.
SRAM - i like the feel of Codes and worked well for me for a good few years. Guides a bit underpowered. Mavens seem immensely powerful. Personally I think the weak point in the bracket - knock them a few times and it gets hard to get the balance between staying in place and rotating in a crash.
Were they the same set of brakes for 8 years? had they had the seals and internals replaced?
Yes, same pair. Have not replaced anything on them other than the oil. They've done me well.
Although thinking about it I think I've had them seven years. I bought them in Finale in 2018 after the Guides the bike came with (bought new in 2017) decided to stop working halfway down Ingegnere (piston on the rear brake had expanded and the same happened to the GF's front not long after).
Would be happy with another set of XTs or maybe XTRs, but am leaning towards the Cura 4s.
Find the Dominion levers a little ugly. Daft, but this matters to me.
I noticed Jack Moir went over to TRP after being a SRAM fan forever but not liking the Mavens.
Or after he was no longer required to use them as part of his sponsorship comitments 🙂
I love the idea of hopes but £400/end is quite spendy for me. Thats double the new XT ones, or the dominions
Intend Trinity DH or Enduro.
Might be the only person not stopping mid decent this week suffering from arm pump
I noticed Jack Moir went over to TRP after being a SRAM fan forever but not liking the Mavens.
Or after he was no longer required to use them as part of his sponsorship comitments 🙂
YT Mob let riders user anything they want. They made a song and dance about it while choosing what components to race on.
I love the idea of hopes but £400/end is quite spendy for me. Thats double the new XT ones, or the dominions
400 per end? £368 per set with the link I posted. Plus rotors and adapters obviously.
I love the idea of hopes but £400/end is quite spendy for me. Thats double the new XT ones, or the dominions
??
As far as I can see the undiscounted prices per end are
Shimano XT £200
Dominion £230
Hope Evo GR4 £240
Did come to update and point out there is a new batch of Trinity brakes released in the 28th but now price is being discussed, it looks like they're off your list.
but am leaning towards the Cura 4s.
I'm going to go against the grain here and say I'm not a fan of the Cura 4's.
Had a set that came on my Geometron and tried to persevere with them for a couple of years but ultimately fitted some hope T4v4's which I've been very happy with.
I still use the Cura's on my hardtail and they've been reliable but I just don't like the feel of them on long steep descents, they just feel a bit dead at the lever. (the hardtail gets a lot less of this)
Previous to the Hope T4's I'd not have even considered a Hope brake due to bad experiences in the Alps with them in the M4 era.
I love the idea of hopes but £400/end is quite spendy for me. Thats double the new XT ones, or the dominions
??
As far as I can see the undiscounted prices per end are
Shimano XT £200
Dominion £230
Hope Evo GR4 £240
Who pays non discounted for Shimano? The new ones can be had for £250 F&R complete set. The old ones are even cheaper
I love the idea of hopes but £400/end is quite spendy for me. Thats double the new XT ones, or the dominions
??
As far as I can see the undiscounted prices per end are
Shimano XT £200
Dominion £230
Hope Evo GR4 £240
Who pays non discounted for Shimano? The new ones can be had for £250 F&R complete set. The old ones are even cheaper
How do you get the cost of a Hope brake up to £400 per end? It's easy to pick them up at 10% discount, and older ones are less....
But yes, Shimano are a bargain. Those Codes even more so - I thought they were a killer deal when they were £130 and end last summer.
I've got those Code RSC's. They came fitted to a bike and I wouldn't buy them out of choice.
When they work, they work really well but they've had a lot of time and attention spent on them. The plastic piston in the lever is really sensitive to temperature changes and can run slow making your lever feel floppy. This can be replaced with a metal one but I'm not going to bother. It's difficult to balance the caliper pistons and get them all moving correctly. Mine have been removed, polished, lubed etc. just to prevent noise and rubbing.
The Hope's on my other bike make the Code feel useless so when I've got the cash I'm moving the E4's to the trail bike and going GR4 on the bikepark vessel.
Credit to the PSA thread, but relevant here…
I've got those Code RSC's. They came fitted to a bike and I wouldn't buy them out of choice.
When they work, they work really well but they've had a lot of time and attention spent on them. The plastic piston in the lever is really sensitive to temperature changes and can run slow making your lever feel floppy. This can be replaced with a metal one but I'm not going to bother. It's difficult to balance the caliper pistons and get them all moving correctly. Mine have been removed, polished, lubed etc. just to prevent noise and rubbing.
Would agree with all of that (though I've had real trouble balancing Hope 4 pot pistons in the past as well), but it's hell of a lot of brake for £150 both ends. I've switched to Hope on my most recent bike, but Mrs B likes the feel of the Codes enough she insisted on another set (I get lumbered with keeping them working sweetly)
My old Tech 3 E4's were terrible for rubbing and I could never get the pistons balanced or running smoothly.
The new stainless ones are faultless so far. In 2 years of hard riding I've never touched them.
XT trekking £50.an end. They just don't have a 2 finger lever, but just put them an inch further onboard. I'm sure this would offend many people. Not me.
I'm offended.
Shifter levers are then way out of reach of my thumbs.