XX1 / X01 Cassette Wear

Just swapped the chain after around 600 miles of use from brand new on a x01 cassette, in 42t cog the chain is slipping under heavy load ( ie getting out the saddle to climb techy steep uphills) it’s absolutly fine just sitting and spinning on road hills (even mega steep ones out the saddle) but put any major force onto it off road and it makes the dreaded noise like the chains about to snap!

Now when I swapped the chain for an identical xx1 chain I left two more links in as I felt this may have been just a tad to short first time! I had to adjust the b tension screw accordingly though to compensate the extra links

Absolutly all gears shift spot on, there’s no hesitation in any gear change and it’s crisp like new up and down the cassette, it doesn’t slip or attempt to to do it climbing I’m any other gear apart from 42t

So just wondering is the cassette shot? If so that’s shocking after 600 miles, or is it to do with the extra links maybe? Or will the chain wear into the 42t after a few rides?

Something tells me it’s about the setup given it still shifts beautifully!

Being aluminium the 42t will wear faster. do you use it a lot?

To be fair yeh suppose I do give I ride in Peak District troughout the year come rain or shine ( mostly rain) it’s steep around here so it does get used

But on my last xx1 on the old bike I got 3 chains out of the xx1 cassette and it still shifted like new ( same environment) the only thing I’ve done this time is add 2 links to the chain and adjusted the b screw

Will at worse case the chain wear in to that 42t cog?

I thought the x01 black cassette was suppose to have a bit more wear resistance to xx1, well certainly not on my testing it hasn’t so far

I got to 750 miles swapped the chain, and it was fine.

What wasn’t fine was the cassette had seized to the free hub and we had to break the x01 cassette to get it off. It required that much force to remove it, the splines come apart.

Did get a replacement. SRAM claimed we’d not greased it. Twaddle.

hmmmm so possibly to do with the extra links? cant really think why this would affect it in 42t though? or would the chain being longer cause a skip type issue in the 42t cog when thats already done 600 miles? basically would the cassette have got used to the amount of links on the old chain? ( i know its a long shot that, but im really trying to work out how on earth its worn so fast!)

cant believe its shot after 600 miles, i reckon on the old xx1 cassette i did 1200 miles easily and changed roughly the same time, and whats more it was still running like new and no skipping when i sold it!

Presumably you used the same sized chainring with the XX1 cassette? Ie you’re not now using the 42 more than you did previously? It does seem quick, even doing complete rides in that sprocket I’d expect more life than that.

yeah always run 32t up front, recently just changed it for a new one (as went to xx1 chainset up front, but that mashed nicely with the older chain too, no issues at all)

nope not using the 42t any more really, just mix and match throughout rides really, always similar terrain/rides

i guess theres really no other explanation than its just worn then 🙁

i tried similar climbs just in the 2nd cog (36t) to test and that didnt skip on the same bit of climb

guess ill just have to keep running it and hope it meshes in eventually to the 42t

whats annoying is its absolutly as clean/crisp shifting as ive ever had it, could really understand it if the rest of the gears were skipping all over the place and if it even struggled to shift into 42t, but it doesnt and it will gladly sit and spin up steep inclines seated in 42t, just out of the saddle and sounds like that dreaded breakage noise is happening

Similar issues. Did probably a bit too much on one chain ~2000km and when I swapped the lowest three gears on the XX1 cassette were slipping with even the smallest bit of load. Cassette had to be swapped.

I’m also noticing extreme wear on the front ring. After ~1000km I am getting signs of wear on the front ring. It feels like drag on the chain line or that the gears aren’t adjusted properly. I couldn’t figure it out the last time but when I went and changed the front ring it disappeared. About 1000km into a new ring (plus new chain and cassette) and this dragging is coming back.

I really like XX1, but it’s longevity is pretty terrible.

yeah but at least you got 2000km out of it with only one chain? i dont think thats too bad personally (if you didnt change the chain at all)

changing a chain after 600 miles however is a bit pants, sounds like really i should have been changing it around 300 miles, which is even more ridiculous 🙁

Similar issues. Did probably a bit too much on one chain ~2000km and when I swapped the lowest three gears on the XX1 cassette were slipping with even the smallest bit of load.

That’s not similar, that’s the exact opposite, and exactly what one expects!

I wonder if rotating the chainring 90 degrees would make any difference, might even the wear slightly.

I’ve done 500 miles on mine, got a new chain, need to measure the old one, not keen on replacing cassettes if I can avoid it! It sounded rather gritty at the weekend certainly, but my complaint of XX1 is that it’s always sounded pretty crap, even on the stand it just isn’t very smooth.

agreed njee – 2000kms is spot on for a cassette on 1 chain 😆 you’ve been lucky sir!

chainring is brand new njee (but worked perfectly for the 2 rides i had it on the old chain) and theres no trouble with the shifting now (with the front chainring, as in its not showing any sign of being worn in the 2 rides i used the old chain on it)

i know what you mean, we were climbing something pretty steep/gritty and horrid saturday and both our bikes sounded shocking gear wise, but as soon as it evened out the terrain it did go in all fairness (just sounds a bit louder than i remember my 1×10 setup being)

it never sounds great in the workstand either, but i must admit when i clean the chain/chainring/cassette it does feel like new riding TBH

its like the first 5 miles last night (with brand new chain before i noticed the dreaded slipping), it really did feel like brand new drivetrain, gears were insanely fast and quiet and shifting just precise, and even when the slipping did occur it still shifted fine to get me up the hill, and then to top it off even the mega steep roads in the 42t it didnt even attempt to skip then, i guess im just going to have grin and bear it as i cant afford to change the cassette just now, ill keep using it and put the new chain to the exact length of the old one to see if that helps, and hopefully it will just mesh soon enough to stop it slipping

wheres the cheapest place for xx1 cassettes these days? anything beat 210 from CRC? im not having x01 again anyways, id already decided the black looks shite after about 2 rides!

chainring is brand new njee (but worked perfectly for the 2 rides i had it on the old chain) and theres no trouble with the shifting now (with the front chainring, as in its not showing any sign of being worn in the 2 rides i used the old chain on it)

The part about rotating chainrings was more aimed at ir12daveor, as he was saying it’s starting to wear again.

wheres the cheapest place for xx1 cassettes these days? anything beat 210 from CRC? im not having x01 again anyways, id already decided the black looks shite after about 2 rides!

€229 from Bike Discount, if you can get a voucher from CRC it’ll be near as dammit the same though.

Did you ever sort out the not dropping onto the 10T sprocket properly – mine doesn’t like it too much

229 is a ‘decent’ price! but the postage is now 15euros on that site (not sure when it went that steep, unless im missing something?!)

still cant afford to stump 200quid up at the mo, id have sort of expected it a few months down the line from now maybe going into winter and id have budgeted along the way for it, but just now its completely out of the blue and im screwed to pay for it 🙁 run it into the ground it is 🙁

yoshimi – kind of yeah (i dont have that bike anymore and not experienced it at all after 3 months on the new one – touch wood!), but yeah the lbs took it apart, and sprayed lubed/cleaned all the pivots, and storing it in 10th cog overnight helped to keep the spring where it should be for the next rides too, its a very sensitive setup thats for sure, i was also told to try and keep the mech as clean possible, so a good spray of silicone lube into after most rides seemed to help, by the time i sold it i hadnt noticed it doing it anymore so it was one of the above!

I did that with the XTR transmission on my Fuel. It lasted another 2 years on the original chain/cassette, could be worse!

njee – im sorely tempted if it does carry on to put my old chain back and do just that, it was shifting flawlessly before i decided to swap the chain, so at least i know that one will work with no dramas in 42t cog – thats the really annoying thing, everything is working better than ever (even with old chain) as id just had a new cable fitted which made it like new, and gears have been so precise since the lbs did it for me, then you think your helping save money by changing the chain ‘early enough’ and nope, its back to not working again and a bit bemused by it all! a new chain should have just made everything work better not bloody worse 🙁

ive now reduced the new chain to exact length of old one, so maybe who knows with it being identical now it may magically start to work (holds no hope though!)

To try to be optimistic you could have a new chain that is on the tighter end of new tolerance and it might get a bit better as it wears.

I recently had slippage on my campag when I replaced the chain. I rode carefully while I waited for the new cassette and by the time it arrived it was all working perfectly. I could barely get the chain measurer on the new chain.

FWIW I don’t think mileage is an accurate reflection of how hard a chain has had to work – conditions, power, lube and cleaning have a huge impact as well as the quality of the original chain. SRAM might be different and higher quality contril but I have a sneaking suspicion that not all Shimano XTR chains are created equal.

Can you trust yourself to remember not to stand in the 42?

Trouble is there’s not much of an alternative – if you’re standing in the 42 you need all the power you can muster! Smaller chain ring? Spread the wear a bit more evenly. I rarely use either the 42 or the 10 on an average ride, which suggests to me I’ve got the right chainring.

I’ve had the same issue, 42 tooth cog has completely worn after the same kind of mileage as oscillate (approx 600-700 miles ) the most frustrating thing is the rest of the cassette looked and worked fine. I tried a new chain after about 500 miles, but it was already slipping on the 42 tooth, so I put the old chain back on, hoping to make it last until the X1 group came out. The chain has now stretched too much, so I have had to buy a new cassette (and chain ring ! ) as they are too far gone now. Turns out the X1 isn’t much cheaper anyway, plus crc doesn’t have it stock,or didn’t when I went to buy one. I’m pretty disappointed with the longevity to be honest, it was used through the wetest/muddiest winter everknown, and I do spin up hills in the 42, but for that kind of money, it’s pretty poor.
I also snapped a tooth off the x sync chain ring after not many miles (thin one) and as far as I know, I didn’t hit it on anything. I’ve also had issues with the rear mech not being able to get into the bottom 2 cogs ( as discussed with oscillate on another thread ) although, now the trails have dried out, it is working better. The XO1 came on the new bike I bought and for the most part it’s great, but there are definitely teething problems, expensive teething problems !

could be down to terrain, maybe not a fair reflection mileage, but mileage all the same and no different conditions/trails/climb to the xx1 cassette i had before that went into 1200 miles and still running perfectly

typically a night ride of maybe 15-20 miles will have around 3000feet of climb, and weekend rides can range from 20-40 miles with 4000-6000 feet typically (depedent on weather conditions etc), but its all peak grit and paste and genreally shite! that said i only had this stuff at end of march so its not endured a winter like my last xx1 did, i cant massively compare it to other people but i can compare it to myselfs last xx1, and somethings gone wrong for me with the black x01 cassetee

i dont use it all the time the 42t, its not constantly in that gear, im a fairly strong climber, id say the gears are pretty much evenly spread through a ride, yes it gets used maybe a touch more due to the nature of the climbs we have, but often im climbing in 36t or the next one down

in future i will be trying to use it less, but it kind of goes against the point of the system really to me

ill try and stay optimistic, as above ive now made the length of the chain identical to my old one, so maybe it will mesh in better once its ridden a few times, if it doesnt, old one will go back on until i can muster up 200 for a new cassette (and possibly/ideally a new chain again 🙁 )

and diggery, sounds the same then really, so much for the black coating giving the x01 a harder wear rate 🙄

cheapest xx1 – this takes some beating[/url].

The price of these cassettes is making me think twice about 1X11 on a new build. It could be very pricey to keep it running. Shimano 2X10 bits come in much cheaper – and I like 2X10…..

Anyone change to 1X11 and love it so much they wouldn’t go back no matter how pricey the spares are?

Not really sure what you mean by that, I like it, so I’d not change back, but if spares suddenly quadrupled in price whilst 10 speed didn’t I’d change back. It’s not really that much of a change from 1×10. When I built the bike I decided if I could afford the parts it will inevitably need.

What I “think’ I mean is….. XT quality is good enough for me and I can replace an XT 10spd cassette for 40 odd quid – A fifth of the price of the XO1 11spd cassette.

For me, I’m on the fence which I’d prefer between the two systems and was really enquiring if there are folk so enthused by 1X11 that a £180+ cassette is a non issue. I guess if you insisted on XTR for your 2X10 setup the running costs would be more comparable.

What I “think’ I mean is….. XT quality is good enough for me and I can replace an XT 10spd cassette for 40 odd quid – A quarter of the price of the XO1 11spd cassette.

Aye, but it’s not like people have bought into it at XT level prices, then they’ve shot up – if you weren’t prepared to spend the cash you’d not have it at all.

As you observe XTR is similar price, in fact if you factor in cranks and that XX1 is cheaper.

Aye, but it’s not like people have bought into it at XT level prices

A few full bikes I’ve been looking at have not been that different in price setup up with 2X10 XT and X01.

the cost of replacement xx1/x01 cassettes is what stopped me from going to a 1×11 drivetrain. £220 for something that would probably need replacing once a year is just too much. The bike would end up costing the same for a yearly service as a sports car, and that would be crazy.

I’m currently on 1 x 10 using shimano xt and a one up components 42 tooth cog, and it works very well, not sure what longevity is going to be like, have probably only covered 100 miles on it so far, but no issues yet.

I know it sounds like im moaning, but genuinely xx1 is the best gearing ive ever ever used, i absolutly love it, it just works

the only thing im moaning about is the wear of the cassette (i knew full well what it costs to replace), but when its suddenly thrown up on you to stump up 200 odd quid out of no where its a fair chunk, and i hadnt budgeted for it just yet, thats my problem really, but these things happen

and by christ that wiggle price is bloody cheap (well you know what i mean!)

Cheapest I have found:

http://www.hibike.com/shop/product/pf9a848931f471b53b3bd08b7815333e3/SRAM-XX1-XG-1199-11-speed-cassette-MTB-cogset-10-42-teeth-RETAIL-pack.html

I’ve done about 1600km on my X01 cassette & it seems fine still. Just changing the chain now as I snapped the SRAM one at the weekend – putting an Ultegra 11spd chain on instead. I’ve never had much luck with SRAM chains in the past & Shimano have always just worked.

Cassette doesn’t look too worn, the black coating looks shyte after the first gritty ride, but that’s life. I’ll put an XX1 on it next time.

As for the cost, generally they are around the £200 mark, which I can live with. You don’t buy/build a high end bike with your eyes closed, everyone knows they are expensive.

I’d rather not spend that kind of money, every 600 miles !!!

There is some selective reading on here, futon river crossing you very rarely have to change cassettes every 600 miles. This is a rare occurrence hence why there is a thread about it. Nowhere else have i seen any mention of this happening. Luckily X1 will be out soon to hopefully drop prices further.

OW, my X01 is running like a dream, ill change the chain soon at the 500 mile mark and rotate 3 chains like that till the cassette dies.

This is why I can’t take 1×11 seriously, I like the idea but SRAM are just taking the mickey with the cassettes, it’s a consumable part and I just can’t see the justification for them to make it the way they do which is what makes it so expensive. If they had designed the freehub connection more sensibly so that they could make the cassette the way that every other cassette is made then there is no reason that the bit that wears out in the system would cost anymore than £60-70 at the budget end.
It’s the fact that they designed the cassette as a load bearing part of the freehub mechanism that meant they have to machine the cassette the way they do.

Seems to be a bit of a ‘thing’ with SRAM where they have an idea and design through the problems as they encounter them until they get a working product rather than taking a more ‘high level’ approach and designing the whole system logically.

Same thing happen to my xx1 cassette, i got 11 months out of it (with two chains) approx 1000 miles.

I’m now running the black x01 cassette.

I didn’t know it was worn until i went to use the spare wheels it was on 🙁

Dead

It’s the fact that they designed the cassette as a load bearing part of the freehub mechanism that meant they have to machine the cassette the way they do.

Errr…. You know they first did this on Red road cassettes, then XX, then XX1, it’s not a new technology, it just allows a very lightweight cassette with theoretically good durability. Perhaps some issues there admittedly, but as stated it’s not really much more than XTR.

I remember older XTR 8sp cassettes used titanium for the larger sprockets, it’s a shame SRAM don’t make the 42t from Ti, as I imagine it would last longer than Alu, even if it did add to price.

EDIT: Just going through my emails.

I got mine in Dec 2012 and changed it in March 2014 along with the rear mech (bent)and new front ring.

So probably did 1500 miles on my original XX1 drive chain!

The shifter is still working!

Leonardi racing used to do 36T replacement cogs for XX when SRAM did not so it might be worth asking if they do 42T replacement cogs for XX1?

In fact here you go, I shock myself somedays LOL

http://www.leonardifactory.it/shop/2252-replacement-kit-for-sram-1099-xx/

Errr…. You know they first did this on Red road cassettes, then XX, then XX1, it’s not a new technology, it just allows a very lightweight cassette with theoretically good durability. Perhaps some issues there admittedly, but as stated it’s not really much more than XTR.

I am perfectly aware that they designed these cassettes for the Red group first, difference is that it was purely a weight saving measure then and you could fork over the huge sum of cash for it or use the regular £50 cassette which continued to work perfectly well without chewing lumps out of your freehub and emptying your wallet. For some reason SRAM thought it would be a good idea to take that option away from you for no good reason that I can think of and force a new freehub standard on you that is of dubious benefit over the regular standard.
As a very simplistic example they could easily have redesigned the freehub to be a narrower diameter thereby allowing you to have your 10 tooth sprocket, and a £50 cassette. Your only issue then is the yearly bearing change due to the smaller diameter bearings. But then that’s a small cost that doesn’t necessarily line SRAM’s pockets.!

Can’t comment on XO1 but I’ve had XX1 since the middle of December and ridden 1400 miles/ 139 hours on that bike using just one cassette that still looks almost new. In that time I’ve mostly used one XX1 chain, briefly tried a KMC X10 SL (but didn’t keep it on long as it was pretty “crunchy” in the mud) and put on a new XX1 chain recently that works perfectly with the cassette. Very happy with 1400 miles/ 140 hours with the cassette looking new and working perfectly with a new chain when ridden in all weathers. For comparison I would only get ~800 miles use out of a Shimano XT or XTR cassette in the same conditions before shifting got frustrating (slipping or awful shifting)