Our front room gets really cold in winter (it has high ceilings). I tried converting the utterly useless gas fire last year to an open coal fire but that has been pretty useless too. So I have had some quotes for a wood burner. Right.

First one insists on using a flue liner and / or doing a pressure test. Second one is far more relaxed and suggests putting in a flap above the burner and sweeping the chimney regularly. Is the second chap right – is this generally OK or is there a much greater risk of chimney fires / the world stopping turning?

The reason I ask is that the roof is in such poor condition we can’t have anyone going up on it. It needs doing but trying to eke it out a bit longer. Builder has very strongly advised letting no-one near it (and I trust him). That means a flue liner isn’t going to happen.

Any views on flue liners gratefully received. Thanks.

Flue liners generally don’t last long with stoves – if you plan on being there a while pay the extra for a concrete lining.

M_F – that surprises me as the buggers are really expensive. But that is going to need a roof visit, I’m sure……

We were advised around 8-10 years for flue, 15-20 for concrete so went for the concrete option – cost about half as much again as the flue.

My missus insisted on us having a flu liner. Why not try it without and see? Use some of them Carbon monoxide things to see if it’s a problem?

Prepares for a flaming…

“Prepares for a flaming… “

I suppose there’s no smoke without fire!

I’ve got a log burner straight in to a brick chimney.
What’s the problem supposed to be ?

According to the first chap, deposits of something flammable up there owing to the roughness and coolness of the existing chimney which then catch fire. Or something.

What’s the problem supposed to be ?

LArger volume cavity, smoke cools, less draw. Creostote soaks into bricks. Chimney fire.

THink thats the theory anyway.

A flu will help maintain a good draw, getting rid of “the nasty’s” into the atmostphere quicker.

No issues for me,

Did a smoke test which passed and installed the stove and had no issues what so ever. Get a liner (if you have too) as the concrete option will me messy and if not done correctly can more problematic in the long run. Also consider the different cowls on the roof (chimney) which can aid with better airflow.

Chimney fires are normally caused due to burning wet/poor quality items which leave a residue inside the chimney. Have it swept once twice a year and use decent wood (hardwood with coal) and you’ll have a lovely warm room. Our 5kw Morso Squirrel (1412)IIRC, heats the house no problem and we have 3m ceilings through out the property.

We also use a Carbon Monoxide meter just for back up.

Good luck and enjoy.

PS consider if you’re in a smoke control zone on the planning/building control section of your local council.

I’ve got the front of the fireplace sealed by a steel sheet with a hole in it to suit the pipe out of the back of the stove.
I’ve never had any trouble with it drawing, as soon as I shut the door it roars away.
It’s a bungalow, so the chimney is only about 12′ high if that makes a difference.
Every now and then I have a clear out and burn a load of paper. It proper roars then and the flames come out of the top of the chimney. I reckon that burns the creosote off before it accumulates to dangerous levels. 😀

Edit;
“Chimney fires are normally caused due to burning wet/poor quality items…”
Once the fire’s hot enough, I burn any old rubbish; rotten logs, painted timber, on the fire it goes.

I ‘think’ that according to section J of the building regulations it is now ‘compulsory’ to have a flue liner. Otherwise it will not be HETAS certified. It is worth checking as if anything goes wrong your insurance might not pay out!

Cold stone chimney originally designed for an open fire – fire puts out say 12kw and 9 of those go straight up the chimney, keeping it nice and warm and drawing well.

Put a 5kw stove in there and theres probably only 1.2kw going up the chimney as the stove is so efficient at putting heat out to the room. Chimney runs much colder, slow flue gas, condensation, tars form on the inside of the chimney potentially catching fire. Problem is exacerbated by regularly slumbering the stove.
Much more chance of smoking back into the room aswell.

Fitting without a liner to see how it goes is fine but not presure testing first is a bit silly, both for you and the installer. If it goes pear shaped the buck stops at him.
Stainless liner is fine for a stove but fit decent 904 rather than 316 grade and insulate it. No need for concrete lining.

Are both the chaps looking at your chimney HETAS registered?

The only thing that would involve building regs would be if you had a liner installed, the HETAS man can sign this off without involving building regs, an unregistered HETAS person may be suggesting not to do a lining so as not to get HETAS involved. Oh and a carbon monoxide detector is part of the new installation!

Mind you I had three HETAS engineers round to quote for my new stove/back boiler and only one of them bothered to mention the fact that I needed to put a vent in as my fire is going to be over the 5kw limit (14kw actually)

We’ve got 2 multi fuel stoves. No flue liners, the guy fitted them said they wouldn’t be needed. Had the chimney sealed at the pots and loads of smoke bombs put in, no leaks so all’s good…………….. 😯
The second one we got fitted this year, last winter the other one was never allowed to go out for about a month.

Mmm, toasty (RIP Molly though 🙁 ):

New one just fitted:

Dave thinks steel liners are great!

smoke bomb it and see if it leaks anywhere
no smoke equals sealed chimney, bung it in with a plate
smoke in the attic, through the walls? line it
cheap liner for 10 year, expensive for 20-25, concrete for longer

based on no more than seeing lots of peoples installations as a firewood seller

I have an open fire a) because wood grows on trees, b) its a rented place

Iirc Drac of this parish used to make the case for not getting the chimney lined………….until it all went a bit pear shaped.

Get it lined.

I do worry when I see pictures of these fireplaces and am quite worried by how people have installed them.

http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_PDF_ADJ_2010.pdf

My own brother in law to be has installed a little Aga stove in their house and has fitted no proper Hearth and it goes straight out onto a flammable surface!

PePPeR – good link o section ‘J’ which was the point i was trying to make, HETAS has to comply to this as does everyone else. Bear in mind the last stove I installed was 2 weeks ago. So my research is pretty up to date. Pleas be careful on this and use a decent fitter!

Thanks everyone. There’s a lot to think about it in there, but I’m getting the sense that a liner is the way to go, which given the state of the roof means we’ll have to sadly ditch the wood burner and try to think of something else. The fire angle / insurance is sobering. How else do you keep a cold room warm in winter?! Ideas please.

Certainly the first bloke (who recommended the liner) was certified with everyone inlcuding HETAS, not sure about the second. Both said air intakes were fine as fire would be less than 5kW.

We live in a house rented (sort of) from my employer. We are allowed to do quite a bit to the house but didn’t want to invest too much cash.

We popped a Esse 300 inset stove in there as it required virtually no changes to the house. Tiny firebox though so I have to split the wood quite small. No liner was required. There is a new 301 model out with a bigger firebox which would be nice but as it puts out 5kw I think the ventilation rules change.