Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 109 total)
  • VW campervans and alternatives
  • maxray
    Free Member

    So after minimissmaxray expressed an interest in the idea of going on adventures in a campervan it has brought thoughts of getting a vw camper back to the fore.

    I know a few people have them on here so, pros and cons/ where is good to look for a decent one and could we realistically use one as a main car (we don’t do high milage each year).

    Or what alternatives are there that dont look awful! 😀

    Cheers,

    spooky_b329
    Full Member

    What sort of budget?

    Blazin-saddles
    Free Member

    first thing to decide is your budget and requirements, do you want a self convert, ready to go, factory done, project etc…

    Winter is a good time to buy as prices tend to be lower. Be careful, there are a lot of dogs out there. Some of the stuff on Ebay that’s listed as a campervan is comical at best and plain deadly at worst.

    Doing a self convert is very rewarding and can save a fortune but does take a lot longer than you think. Some jobs are very easy, some are very tricky. If you have the skills/time a panel van to camper is normally the best way forward as you can pick the best base van you can afford and take it from there.

    We went from this…

    To this….

    Some interior shots mid build….

    Fresh Goods Friday 696: The Middling Edition

    Fresh Goods Friday 696: The Middlin...
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    maxray
    Free Member

    No specific budget to be honest, want to get an idea of where to aim be it a cheaper initial purchase with work to do or pay a higher amount and hopefully have less to go wrong 🙂

    maxray
    Free Member

    Ah, nice! Hadnt considered going the whole hog and converting one myself. Now that really would be a great project to undertake. Theres a fair bit of milage in our current car, at least 12-18months I would guess so time isnt a problem.

    I do really like the shape of the old VW’s though.

    mactheknife
    Full Member

    my favourite website for this is http://www.campervanlife.com

    There is so much info on there ref conversions.

    Enjoy

    maxray
    Free Member

    Well I hope I didnt intend to achieve much today 🙂 cheers mactheknife

    VanHalen
    Full Member

    you dont want one of those new rubbish ones.

    get a proper van or dont bother. i own a type 4. i did used to own a 1969 bay. its was the best vehicle ever i only got rid as i was on a pretty poor wage at the time. i`d happily have another. used as a daily driver. only properly broke down (unfixable where i was) once in 3.5 years which isnt bad for a 41yr old vehicle.

    this wasnt mine but you get the idea.

    Marge
    Free Member

    Blazin saddles: That is lovely…

    Am I right to understand you did it yourself? How long did it take & was it all done in one go?

    Were there any issues between changing number of seats for the registration documents?

    maxray
    Free Member

    Yeah agreed Van Halen. Definitely swaying towards the early types.

    Spongebob
    Free Member

    I’m interested to see a bit of a breakdown of figures and labour timings for that Blazin.

    Surf-Mat
    Free Member

    If you want it as an “only” car, it has to be a T5 – most car-like van to drive by miles. Excellent gear box helps, and they handle well for a van. Bigger engines pokey.

    Old campers look great but are a complete PITA to own. Constant maintenance, hideous mpg and so slow that they are dangerous.

    Bro in law has done a 2/3 conversion on his T5 130- so it’s almost a camper but not 100% – all done professionally. Looks pretty good.

    What ISN’T good is the stupid alloys many stick on them – saw 22 inch ones at the weekend. Ruins a good van.

    AlexSimon
    Full Member

    VWs are definitely in a class of their own looks-wise and for holding their resale value. I’d love one.

    But I’ve never had enough money to get one that I’d feel confident with on long trips.

    So I’ve owned a ’95 Hiace Jumbo (no poptop but the bed was big enough for 2 adults and a child). It saw us do 10,000km over 6 months in New Zealand.

    Now I’ve got a Mazda Bongo. They look rough, but I absolutely honestly love it. It’s completely car-like, reliable and practical. Not quite as wide as a VW or Hiace and the engine is under the front seats which means you can’t have captains seats or a walkthrough.

    My in-laws offered me money to buy a new car a year ago and we spent ages looking at what to buy before deciding that the Bongo was still the car for us.

    Waderider
    Free Member

    I’m going to interrupt this thread with a partial rant. Please see beyond Volkswagon, the blinkered fanbois and the unreasonable hype.

    The older VW in particular are underpowered, polluting, tiny tinny boxes were you sit in the crumple zone. The T5’s are good but the price premium is high. Unless you’ve got a lot of disposable keep the saving for bikes I say, and buy a van where the market value actually reflects the material value.

    All replies will be ignored. Especially from VW driving, iPhone owning fashionistas with no imagination. As you were 😀

    maxray
    Free Member

    Hmm too van like really, how slow is dangerous? I had a 1 litre Nova saloon back when I was a teenager which surely must have been slower. 🙂

    We are not in a hurry to get to places, so I still think an early VW is preferable to a van conversion. Any old car is going to be more “dangerous” than a modern vehicle surely?

    Surf-Mat
    Free Member

    Wade – TBH I agree about the older ones. They look cool and that’s about it. T25s were a bit better (my dad has one) but still average. T4 slightly better again but still not great. Only the T5 is genuinely a cut above the rest although a Vito and some other similar competition run them very close.

    Marge
    Free Member

    From what I’ve seen Vito conversions are rare & even more expensive (but I live in another country so perhaps it’s a different situation)

    spooky_b329
    Full Member

    My pick for a van conversion would be the latest style Fiat Ducato/Citroen Relay. 6 foot wide inside for a sideways bed, straight walls that don’t lean in making for a very spacious van with plenty of room for high level cupboards, low floor, smart and cheap.

    Though I did see this beauty in Brighton yesterday afternoon, lovely and had a nice big V8 or similar as well 🙂


    IMAG0128 by Ollie and Sally, on Flickr

    maxray
    Free Member

    Parking that on our road would be a nightmare! 🙂

    meehaja
    Free Member

    first up, decide what you actually need. Do you need a camper van or a van with a bed? Campervans are expensive, and often carry lots of equipment that you might not really need?

    I bought an empty panel van, fitted a rock n roll bed, kitchen unit with cooker and plenty of storage and this meets all my needs. Its easier than you’d expect (if i can do it…)

    As for VW vans:

    Splitscreens are overpriced and definitely a classic car
    Bays: look cute but see above.
    T3: oldest ones are 30 years old, some good ones out there, good entry into classics and cheap to buy, but rust and low MPG is an issue
    T4: Some good ones, lots of rough ones. Lots reaching the age where things start going wrong
    T5: Nice, but a bit smaller i think? Still pricey.

    BillMC
    Full Member

    I had a type 2 and it took every penny I had, plus some. A nightmare of a vehicle, it would have been cheaper to stay in smart hotels or on campsites where tents are already erected eg Eurocamp. Stay well clear of the early ones unless you have a bottomless pit of ££££s.

    VanHalen
    Full Member

    you dont buy an old van for MPG or motorway speed or safety. you buy them because they are a hobby, FUN and to top it off ,bloody lovely

    practicality wise the only thing my watercooled VW has that my old aircooled didnt is a heater( which was killer in mid winter granted but it was fixable i just couldnt afford to at the time) the T4 doesnt bring the same smile to my face to see it or drive it or hear it or even fix it as my old van did.

    the old van was more expensive to run but its a 40 year old van, of course its going to be more expensive and temperamental!

    van tinkering is a hobby that may old van haters seem to forget or dont appreciate is necessary. if you dont like getting our hands dirty then look elsewhere. they also dont like being sat for months and months. use them daily and maintain them and they keep working.

    for me the choice is what makes you smile against what is most practical. id go for the smile factor every time.

    i could buy a road bike for my commute it would be faster and more practical but then my commute would be boring. i ride a smaller xc frame so i can razz the bmx track on my way in. its less efficient, takes me longer, its harder work but at least its fun.

    molgrips
    Free Member

    If you want something practical don’t get an old one, they are just rubbish… If you want to gaze at it lovingly then spend thousands and thousands on fixing it up so you can flash about pretending to be oh so quaint and lovely then fine, go for it 🙂 It all depends on whether you want something for holidaying, or an automotive restoration project.

    Saw a nicely restored one in a camper van shop the other day – £18k! 😯

    To be honest though, all campervans are cripplingly expensive. Anything affordable is almost always sh*t ime. Mostly I see old L or M reg rusty vans with rotting accomodation on the back going for £6k which is an outrage.

    Converting yourself is far better, but plenty of work. Have considered it myself, but then I got a nice caravan for £1k 🙂

    maxray
    Free Member

    I think I have a similar way of thinking to you Van Halen to be honest.

    I can see the practicalities of modern vehicles etc but am up for the challenge/hobby element of it too, I had been thinking of getting a VW Karmann coupe but it was the show of interest from the little un that started me looking at the T1s and 2s.

    Surf-Mat
    Free Member

    TBH the Defender we have on the way (being delivered next week) is sort of similar – noisy, slow, bad on fuel, hideous emissions, etc but does the job it’s meant for very well.

    In the case of a Dub, that’s pootling around very slowly looking cooool maaaaan 😉

    VanHalen
    Full Member

    i dont understand where people can spend thousands and thousands of pounds?

    i guess if you buy a shitheap or just take it straight to a garage maybe?

    old vans are very very simple. easy to fix and work on as there is so little to actually go wrong. the only things i didnt do myself was brakes (just in case i did it wrong) and welding (no welder or garage). parts are cheap and easy to get hold of.

    i do however, totally agree that most vans are overpriced and full of rotting crap interior (and extrior) – a t25 with rust and crap interior for £4500? you are taking hte piss – no thanks. you have to weed the good from the chaff. see alot. go to a few shows. look online at whats available on the various forums for sale. underneath is key to an older van. if you cant get to see the chassis rails walk away. be suspect of a recent respray (the chances are it will be done on the cheap). lift up the carpets and cab mats. drive the van. listen to the engine (well listen to alot so you know what you are listening for. ask questions of owners of both good and bad vans) etc. the more research you do and the more you look about the more chance you have of finding a good one.

    accept that if you own it or a long while something teminal (engine, gearbox, front beam) will happen. (mine was gearbox) but all these parts are available for fairly cheap if you look about and are all pretty straightforward to fit.

    its a minefield but if you get a good one it will be almost as rewarding as riding the bike.

    molgrips
    Free Member

    it will be almost as rewarding as riding the bike

    That’s a matter of taste isn’t it? You’re talking about your particular hobby of restoring vans, which isn’t a universally accepted route to fun and good times 🙂

    VanHalen
    Full Member

    the restoring part is crap. buy something that works first. dont buy a shed with dreams of show winning glory. thats for those without children/wifes/bike habits and a large bank balance. you buy a van to use it not stick it in a shed and wheel it out on dry days. my van was nowhere near as bling as the one i posted but it was the secone best toy i`ve ever had (the bike comes first)

    but owning an old van thats not falling apart too much. starts every time, looks nice, is usable and universally loved by pretty much all is great. there is a great scene, everyove is friendly to you and random people from all walks of life will come up and chat to you and help you if you need it. i made some great friends having an old van and had some completely random strangers drive 30 miles out of their way to get me a magazine and munchies on hte m5 when my t25 engine expired in a puff of blue smoke and engine bits.

    you dont get that from a modern van.

    *takes off rose tinted glasses and goes back to work*

    molgrips
    Free Member

    but owning an old van thats not falling apart too much. starts every time, looks nice, is usable and universally loved by pretty much all is great

    To you 🙂

    Modern van every time for me.

    Surf-Mat
    Free Member

    Dad’s 1.9 T25 actually blew up – proper Hollywood style “leaping from the fireballed van” style and somehow photographed and in the local paper!

    His 2.1 T25 has been okay so far…!

    molgrips
    Free Member

    Nice, Mat. Did you find out why it blew up? I suppose would be one advantage of not wearing a seatbelt (hypothetically.. not saying he wasn’t or anything)

    Blazin-saddles
    Free Member

    For those that asked about ours….

    Bare van T5 130LWB, aircon, cruise etc 17k miles on ’08 plate was £11,500.
    Reimo Elevating roof with bed was £3500 fitted.
    Windows etc. were £250.
    Lining carpet and glue etc £120.
    Eberspacher D2 heater £500.
    Bed is a Bluebird Customs rock and roll £350.
    Smev hob/sink and oven/grill £500.
    Fridge is an IndelB top loader compressor £400.
    Furniture is all Blazin-saddles bespoke and cost around £450 in materials
    Electrical system around £500-600 all components.
    Then outside styling parts, wheels, sidebars etc £1500.
    Uprated stereo kit in double din sat/nav headunit etc £700.

    Total spend is around £21k so far and once the leather upholstery is done will be around £22,500.

    The Camper could obviously be done a few thousand cheaper without all the toys and some refining on design.

    All in I had a spare 6 weeks at the start of the year and got most of it done then. The roof I subbed out as the price difference between DIY and fitted wasn’t great enough for me to risk cutting a sodding great hole in my roof in the wrong place!

    Marge- Yes, all done by my own fairish hands. did most of it as a mock up 1st and then used it a couple of times to see if there was anything that needed changing before chopping up the £120 a sheet wood.

    Changing number of seats was no problem, neither was reclassifying from van to motorhome. just changed it on the logbook with DVLA.

    CoolLesterSmooth
    Free Member

    I had a 79 VW Moonraker conversion. Loved it to bits, sold it at a profit and I still can’t work out if I’m happy or sad that its gone.

    Great fun, you can fix the engines with a hammer but I swear you can sit and watch them rust.

    Naranjada
    Free Member

    Interesting thread. I’ve wanted a van for some time now but have struggled with what to get when considering that it will be used daily, what I need it for, reliability, MPG, driveability etc.

    Current thinking is that of the VWs the T4 was/is probably the most reliable in 1.9TD form; no dual mass flywheel (DMF), simple and robust mechanics. They are capable of interplanetary mileages but are known to be rust-prone. The later T4s and all models onwards went down the DMF (or should that be DNF?) route and started to get more ‘advanced’ in their mechanics, likely driven by such foolish predicates as comfort, safety etc. From what I have read this has made them more expensive to maintain and more prone to breakdown. In general T4 1.9TDs return mid to high 30s MPG if driven with a light foot.

    Otherwise Toyota Hiace van is widely seen as the most reliable thing in the world, ever. The van is pretty ugly, even in its latest guise, and the Jap import Granvia campers are saddled with a 3000cc diesel unit that has a drink problem, but if you want reliability they seem to be unbeatable.

    Currently got my eye on a LWB T4 on ebay that has been converted professionally from panel van to camper. 5ish days to go and one £5k bid.

    phiiiiil
    Full Member

    Not quite as wide as a VW or Hiace and the engine is under the front seats which means you can’t have captains seats or a walkthrough.

    …but it does mean you have an excellent storage heater directly underneath the living space after a long drive!

    Northwind
    Full Member

    I had to write off my camper plans on cost- insurance mainly- but maybe next year. The main thing I found, though, is that there’s basically nobody out there who’s bought a Bongo/Freda and isn’t completely in love with the things. Expensive to run, sure, but cheap to buy as these things go, available with a factory poptop, and very flexible- be a camper, a van or a people carrier. And seemingly good owners’ clubs support etc.

    Van Halen wrote,

    “and had some completely random strangers drive 30 miles out of their way to get me a magazine and munchies on hte m5 when my t25 engine expired in a puff of blue smoke and engine bits.

    you dont get that from a modern van.”

    Sounds brilliant :mrgreen: I’d be gutted if I bought a van and it failed to explode now.

    postierich
    Free Member

    Old vans are rubbish 😀

    VW Camping by Richard Munro, on Flickr

    Surf-Mat
    Free Member

    Nice, Mat. Did you find out why it blew up? I suppose would be one advantage of not wearing a seatbelt (hypothetically.. not saying he wasn’t or anything)

    I think it had been serviced by a blind chimp or something. Fuel appeared to leak onto a hot engine and blew up. Doh!

    Mate’s T4 2.5TDI also caught fire – again I think it was poor servicing.

    Rich – while I don’t “get” old vans, I do appreciate beauty and that van is stunning.

    maxray
    Free Member

    yup that looks ace. Did you do much of the work on your yourself postierich?

    postierich
    Free Member

    No work of any worth! I have a chap local that does it for a living at reasonable prices, changed bits and pieces myself all superficial stuff had it 4 years now and give it a couple more years and i will probably update!
    Autumanal Shot last week decided to Camp for the night spur of the moment with my daughter!

    Camping Oct 2010 by Richard Munro, on Flickr

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