Viewing 40 posts - 41 through 80 (of 89 total)
  • roadies – pedaling technique question
  • paulrockliffe
    Free Member

    That photo might be a little misleading as he’s nailing it round a corner and probably adjusting body and foot position so as not to fall off?

    oldgit
    Free Member

    Nope I’m sticking by my guns.
    If there was anything in this I’m certain that the likes of Armstrong would have adopted it.
    Also a quick Google of the ‘Superman’ does indeed show all toes down.
    The only time it’s heels down is cornering a la Briggsy, or dying on an Alp with your butt hanging off the saddle.
    With the worlds fastest testers, sprinters, climbers and the old world hour record holders in the Superman all toes down I’m going to be hard pushed to be convinced by a mountainbike forum.

    Shibboleth
    Free Member

    cynic-al – Member

    LOL shame there’s no tension in the chain

    There goes Al demonstrating his complete lack of knowledge about all things cycling. What happens, Al, basically, is that the ‘cyclist’ turns the ‘pedals’ clockwise, which pulls a ‘chain’ round the top of the ‘chainring’ which in turn pulls the ‘sprocket’ resulting in forward propulsion. The chain is only under tension at the top. 🙄

    oldgit – Member
    If there was anything in this I’m certain that the likes of Armstrong would have adopted it.

    You’re absolutely right Old Git. Lance would never dream of dropping his heals…

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    Shibboleth
    Free Member

    I agree with you about the superman technique though, definitely heals up…

    😉

    Goz
    Free Member

    I wouldnt take any advice from this forum for road riding 😀

    Coleman
    Free Member

    Breaking News!
    Mountain Bikers don’t even know how to pedal properly! 😯

    njee20
    Free Member

    Conclusively proved by Wilko’s efforts up there, poor bugger’s not even on the pedals!

    oldgit
    Free Member

    You’re absolutely right Old Git. Lance would never dream of dropping his heals…

    Cornering…look you can see he is eyeing up the corner.

    And just in case you post another pic, they’re cornering.

    Shibboleth
    Free Member

    You fool, he’s on a perfectly straight road! There’s an old git on the pavement shouting at him to point his toes!!

    cynic-al
    Free Member

    Shibboleth – Member
    There goes Al demonstrating his complete lack of knowledge about all things cycling. What happens, Al, basically, is that the ‘cyclist’ turns the ‘pedals’ clockwise, which pulls a ‘chain’ round the top of the ‘chainring’ which in turn pulls the ‘sprocket’ resulting in forward propulsion. The chain is only under tension at the top.

    You can see a kink in the upper section of chain.

    There goes another noob dis-respecting his elders 🙄

    traildog
    Free Member

    Sorry, but that picture of Lance is definitely when he’s cornering. You can even see the curve in the curb and the fact that he’s turning his bars, and starting to lean into the corner.

    I’m not sure where this idea that modern riders have lower seats comes from. When I went for a fitting, I was told that saddle height has hardly changed over the years. Pros need to be setup so they can do the masses of miles required without injury.

    Shibboleth
    Free Member

    Lance:

    George:

    Fabien:

    Cadel:

    paulrockliffe
    Free Member

    Canceller is toes down and Evans is cornering.

    Shibboleth
    Free Member

    traildog – Member

    I’m not sure where this idea that modern riders have lower seats comes from. When I went for a fitting, I was told that saddle height has hardly changed over the years. Pros need to be setup so they can do the masses of miles required without injury.

    It’s probably only millimeters, but look at photos of the likes of Indurain, a straighter leg at the bottom of the stroke seemed to be far more prevalent. Modern pros seem to ride with a more pronounced bend at the knee. (In my experience)

    Shibboleth
    Free Member

    paulrockliffe – Member

    Canceller is toes down

    In relation to his leg??? Definitely less than a 90° angle there Paul…

    crikey
    Free Member

    Grabsch?

    crikey
    Free Member

    Eddy?

    Big-Dave
    Free Member

    Sheldon on ankling:

    http://sheldonbrown.com/gloss_an-z.html#ankling

    he wasn’t keen.

    Ankling tends to aggravate an old tendon injury in my left ankle so I’ve had to make a concious effort to try and keep my feet fairly level when pedalling. With clipless pedals I don’t actually see the point in ankling.

    TheSouthernYeti
    Free Member

    I think I ride toes down naturally and only drop my heels to stretch out my calves every now and again.

    I don’t know what it means though.

    crikey
    Free Member

    Jan?

    Shibboleth
    Free Member

    Obree…

    oldgit
    Free Member

    Shibboleth what internets are you using, I couldn’t find another pic of Evans with heels down. And none of those other pics are heels down?
    Same as all the other riders, I think the evidence points to heels down. Google a tour peloton image.

    Back in the 70’s they did bang on about optimal saddle height. From my experience back then they did try and get as high as possible – amateurs that is. But then again they used to mash monster ratios. TBH I’ve haven’t considered this for years, but I suppose this new fangled cadence thing might have riders looking at saddle heights in a new way.
    But to be brutally honest I’m just talking bolios.

    oldgit
    Free Member

    Okay crikey has convinced me toes down it is 🙂

    Shibboleth are you playing with my head? Obree has his toes down.

    Shibboleth
    Free Member

    In relation to the angle of his leg, his heel is down. The angle is less than 90°. Evens is a prolific heel dragger, hang on…

    crikey
    Free Member

    Nah, I’m only idling time away as I try to wake up. 🙂

    I’ve always had a very flat footed style which I put down to riding a lot as a kid on slippy flat pedals, and I’ve just carried on riding that way. I have friends who ride very toes down and I think it’s simply a personal preference.

    What is interesting is the way I seem to be able to ride things with my seat up on the mountain bike that have others dropping the saddle; whether this is due to me being a bit lower to start with is something we’ve commented on before.

    Higher cadences seem to be easier when toes are down though.

    crikey
    Free Member

    The ankling thing has been questioned in the past; there is some piece of evidence/research that suggests that the power in pedalling is almost totally produced on the down stroke, and that the pros just press on harder that us lot of weaklings, but I can’t remember where it is..

    Shibboleth
    Free Member

    OK, so there’s a slight bend here… Why do photographers always stand on bends?!?

    Here is is straightening up after a bend…

    rusty90
    Free Member

    From my experience back then they did try and get as high as possible – amateurs that is. But then again they used to mash monster ratios.

    High saddle – check
    Monster gear – check
    Ian Cammish, with toes distinctly down

    dirtygirlonabike
    Free Member

    TSY, I’d have been able to tell you if you rode toes down, but I was overwhelmed by the sight of you in your pink see through lyrca and looking at your feet was the last thing on my mind my eyes were fixed on my front wheel all the time instead. 😀

    Interesting thoughts on here, I was curious as I’ve spent a lot of time working on my cadence this summer and watching how others ride. Those I’ve seen ankling have tended to be pushing a much harder gear than me on a seated climb.

    Druidh, seeing as I know your riding style, when you point your toes downwards, are you still pushing a bigger gear for short/sharp climbs (the ones I’d spin up and you’d ‘stomp’ up?) and how much of an angle do you take it to? Can’t say i’ve ever noticed you ankling – I must pay more attention to your feet instead of wheel sitting 😆

    cynic-al
    Free Member

    Gone quiet Shibboleth?

    Here’s a guy ankling:

    oldgit
    Free Member

    Where you getting those shots from?
    Obree, I read heels down as past the axle like the Evans pics.
    In relation to the leg it’ll adjust as you move back and forth on the saddle.

    TheSouthernYeti
    Free Member

    I’ll post a picture of me pointing my toes down in the lycra if you like?

    rusty90
    Free Member

    Shibboleth
    Free Member

    I wouldn’t say I’m ever conscious of deliberately “ankling”, in fact I’d never heard it referred to as such, but I’ve started to think about it a bit more since I started taking a mountain biker out on road bikes.

    I rode roadbikes long before mountain biking, so have a natural, fluent pedaling style, whereas this other rider had never ridden clipped in, and whilst a fairly experienced and skillful mountain biker, his pedaling looked very awkward on the roadbike.

    Personally, I think if you’re making good circular rotations rather than mashing, a slight heel-down technique is a perfectly natural result in the lower part of the stroke (assuming good ankle flexibility).

    The only time I consciously think about my pedal technique is when I’m grinding on the flat when I’ll try to put more power down throughout the pedal stroke. When climbing, my ankle does whatever it wants to do, however my toes point down as I make a more exaggerated pull up on the back of the stroke.

    I’m a fairly high-cadence pedaler too, no idea what difference this makes if any.

    I might see what toe-pointing does next time I ride, although I suspect it might be a short cut to tendonitis!

    whatnobeer
    Free Member

    Photos from time trials aren’t really representative though as you have a different set-up and tend to sit right on the nose of the saddle in order to produce more power.

    I tend to pedal toes down except if I’m putting in a big effort while staying seated, in which case it is a more of a flat footed effort.

    Shibboleth
    Free Member

    whatnobeer – Member

    Photos from time trials aren’t really representative though as you have a different set-up and tend to sit right on the nose of the saddle in order to produce more power.

    Of course it’s representative. You just have to consider the heel position in relation to the leg, rather than the horizontal.

    crazy-legs
    Full Member

    You ever used a Wattbike? As well as measuring power, cadence, HR, all the usual stuff, it can measure how that force is applied and show it as a curve on a graph.

    Have a look at this and play the video on that page too.
    If you can find a video of Jamie Staff on it, then play that cos the man is awesome! He was at a exhibition show with one of these things, a come and try it where the general public can have a go on it for 30 seconds. Jamie (riding in jeans and trainers) comfortably smashed even the best club cyclists in all their lycra and cycling shoes. 😉

    The ankling diagram I posted earlier is actually a) quite old and b) a bit of an exaggeration to show the effect and it will vary a lot with gear choice, cadence, power output and whether you’re climbing or riding on the flat (or cornering).

    iDave
    Free Member

    Most modern pro riders don’t have a huge change in the joint angle at the ankle through the entire pedal stroke. With greater technological ability to analyze pedaling comes great awareness of good and bad technique. Most recreational riders base their style on something they read in cycling weekly 10 years ago. Or something their mate told them once.

    Photos of riders in corners, on steep hills, during time trials etc don’t tell the full story.

    whatnobeer
    Free Member

    It’s representative of how people ride in TT, but not in normal road race or club runs. Thats all.

    crikey
    Free Member

    Most modern pro riders don’t have a huge change in the joint angle at the ankle through the entire pedal stroke.

    That seems to suggest to me that ‘ankling’ or the scraping idea is not particularly important?

Viewing 40 posts - 41 through 80 (of 89 total)

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