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1. andyl - Member

   Does anyone have any background info on these roadworks in Bristol putting islands up whiteladies and extending out the pavements? Did they even bother to consult the emergency services as surely now there is no chance of anything getting up/down during rush hour?

   Also is it true they are making the crossroads by Toolstation up down only with no turning up to Cotham or into Clifton? It was at these lights last week I saw a bike clip the back of a Jag sending the rider flying (and swearing). The car driver got the blame at the time but I realised after watching the flow that they completely messed up the delay on the lights and did not allow enough time for traffic to get through the junction. Everywhere I look the roadworks seem to be creating a lot of potential for accidents.

   Posted 4 months ago #
2. Philby - Member

   I live just off Whiteladies and its a flaming nightmare at the moment - trying to cross from Sainsbury's to Cotham Hill this evening on foot was difficult to put it mildly. I think the logic is that the buses don't get caught in a traffic jam when the stop as all the cars can't overtake thereby giving the bus a clear road when it sets off again.

   A complete waste of money IMO - just like the parking permits in Kingsdown which has caused all the non-residents who used to park there now parking in Cotham and Redland - Hampton Road which is a busy commuter route now has cars parked on both sides of the road when not long ago they were parked on one side only. And of course this has led to road rage in the affected sections of Hampton Road as gridlock develops when drivers won't let other drivers coming the opposite way through.

   Which is why I very rarely use my car for trips around Bristol.

   Posted 4 months ago #
3. Edric 64 - Member

   Working with councils on bus shelter maintenance etc the thinking is that its safer for buses to stop in the road rather than pull in .Its not just being done in Bristol

   Posted 4 months ago #
4. coffeeking - Member

   It was at these lights last week I saw a bike clip the back of a Jag sending the rider flying (and swearing). The car driver got the blame at the time but I realised after watching the flow that they completely messed up the delay on the lights and did not allow enough time for traffic to get through the junction.

   
   I just can't invisage this, but I think you're saying the car was travelling through the junction and the bike rode through and hit the back of the car? It's the responsibility of the person entering the junction to check that the junction is empty and they can clear the junction *before* entering it, regardless of light sequencing. So if the car hadn't exited before the lights for the bike changed, the bike is at fault for not ascertaining safe passage before entering?

   Posted 4 months ago #
5. b r - Member

   the thinking is that its safer for buses to stop in the road rather than pull in .Its not just being done in Bristol

   Yeah, like a bus is a small vehicle that can't pull into traffic easily..., unfortunately they seem to be doing this elsewhere - first place I actually saw it was in Innerleithen where the bus stops and the traffic stops, or alternatively ends up having to struggle to get past against oncoming traffic (plus cause difficulty for pedestrians as traffic is on the wrong side of the road).

   And why, if you were short of time you wouldn't be on a bus?

   Posted 4 months ago #
6. TooTall - Member

   I live just off Whiteladies and its a flaming nightmare at the moment - trying to cross from Sainsbury's to Cotham Hill this evening on foot was difficult to put it mildly

   Oh, the middle class Bristolian angst! The horror!

   Be honest - it would take more than furtling around with traffic islands and junctions to improve Bristol traffic.

   Posted 4 months ago #
7. pjt201 - Member

   b r - Member
   And why, if you were short of time you wouldn't be on a bus?

   Why should drivers have all the rights? If we can get the buses moving faster then maybe, just maybe, more people will use them and we would have less cars on the road. People driving into the centre of bristol for work every day is just ludicrous. there are so many public transport connections that there's absolutely no need. if you do want to drive, then there are 3 park and ride sites that you could use.

   the only bad thing about the whiteladies road improvements is that the engineer decided that they need to put keep left signs on all of the islands they've built. massive waste of time/signage and it ruins the streetscene imo.

   oh, and re the op's bike crash. If the bike clipped the jag, then surely it's the cyclists fault. he hit the car, not the other way round.

   Posted 4 months ago #
8. ebygomm - Member

   Where it all goes wrong is when the buses sit at the stop for minutes to keep on schedule. The town centre where I work is a nightmare because the buses do this. It wouldn't be a problem if they just stopped to let people on and off.

   Posted 4 months ago #
9. andyl - Member

   Apparently a bus broke down just before sainsburys the other day. Resulting gridlock went all the way down past the triangle. I still don't see how this is beneficial at all to traffic flow. Buses will always be able to force their way out. That is day 1 of bus driving school isn't it? Emergency services are now screwed for getting up or down.

   As for the bike crash:

   Car coming down whiteladies, temporary stop light up near exit to toolstation car park (50m or so away from crossroads). Bike coming down from Cotham and heading to Clifton crossing whiteladies. The car went through on the green but was slowed slightly by someone turning into toolstation hence there being a small gap to the car in front. Lights must have just changed and the bike went flying through and just clipped the back of the jag that was passing through the crossroads. Guy on the bike was hurtling through the junction and the cars waiting got no where near the jag - I don't think they even got off the mark by the time the bike was meeting the jag so blame to me is poor roadwork traffic management and the cyclist not slowing down for what is obviously an increased danger due to the roadworks.

   Posted 4 months ago #
10. number562554 - Member

    As a pedestrian I cross over Whiteladies Rd every day en route to work at the junction mentioned by Tool Staion(Tyndalls Park Rd and St Paul's Rd I think it is)at the same time as dozens of kids from Cotham School using it and have seen several cases of screeching brakes and narrowly missed children. Some kind of improvement here was desperately needed. I hope whatever the end result is it's safer for pedestrians whatever effect it has on traffic flow.

    And trees and tulips in the middle of the road? Smashing. What's not to like.

    Posted 4 months ago #
11. andy_hamgreen - Member

    surely the entire length from the triangle up whiteladies road and blackboy hill is going to be pedestriansied for promenading up to the downs - isn't that the plan ?

    Posted 4 months ago #
12. pjt201 - Member

    andyl - Member

    As for the bike crash:

    Car coming down whiteladies, temporary stop light up near exit to toolstation car park (50m or so away from crossroads). Bike coming down from Cotham and heading to Clifton crossing whiteladies. The car went through on the green but was slowed slightly by someone turning into toolstation hence there being a small gap to the car in front. Lights must have just changed and the bike went flying through and just clipped the back of the jag that was passing through the crossroads. Guy on the bike was hurtling through the junction and the cars waiting got no where near the jag - I don't think they even got off the mark by the time the bike was meeting the jag so blame to me is poor roadwork traffic management and the cyclist not slowing down for what is obviously an increased danger due to the roadworks.

    So entirely the cyclists fault for going too fast through the lights and not looking then? can't see how that's the fault of the roadworks. Sounds like the cyclist assumed that the jag was going to be out of the way by the time he got there, not an assumption he'll make again I suppose.

    If anything I feel sorry for the car driver there as it sounds like there will be damage to his car and he has little hope of claiming that from the cyclist.

    With respect to the improvements, again roads aren't just for cars. congestion already is a problem on whiteladies road and that causes issues for the buses, if this improves bus journey times and makes the streetscene (apart from the abhorrent keep left arrows) more pleasant for pedestrians then that's surely a good thing.

    Posted 4 months ago #
13. andyl - Member

    yeah more I think of it more of the blame goes on the cyclist. But the poor delay on the roadworks made the situation occur.

    Later that day I was coming down from the same direction as the cyclist and 4 cars and bus were still heading down across our path when the lights changed for us to go.

    Posted 4 months ago #
14. pjt201 - Member

    andyl - Member
    yeah more I think of it more of the blame goes on the cyclist. But the poor delay on the roadworks made the situation occur.

    Later that day I was coming down from the same direction as the cyclist and 4 cars and bus were still heading down across our path when the lights changed for us to go.

    No, no blame on the roadworks at all. It's up to the road user to look to see if where they want to go is clear! The same thing used to happen before the road works were there with people turning into toolstation etc. The junction isn't a yellow box junction so there's nothing wrong with people queueing through it.

    Posted 4 months ago #
15. andyl - Member

    Pretty sure it's a yellow box at that cross roads.

    Posted 4 months ago #
16. longwayhome - Member

    If we can get the buses moving faster then maybe, just maybe, more people will use them and we would have less cars on the road.

    
    The way to get busses moving faster everywhere would be to have conductors to take the money, allowing the driver to get on with driving.

    Simples!

    Posted 4 months ago #
17. andyl - Member

    Surely and Oyster card system would work well too?

    Posted 4 months ago #
18. longwayhome - Member

    That would require quite a bit of investment from First ...

    which isn't going to happen. They're too busy making a packet out of the lack of competition in Bristol.

    Posted 4 months ago #
19. ransos - Member

    A complete waste of money IMO - just like the parking permits in Kingsdown which has caused all the non-residents who used to park there now parking in Cotham and Redland

    Which is why residents in those areas will vote for a permit scheme when they're asked.

    Fait accompli, innit.

    Anyway, this seems to be an example of prioritising public transport above private cars, which is as it should be.

    Posted 4 months ago #
20. bristolbiker - Member

    That would require quite a bit of investment from First ...

    which isn't going to happen. They're too busy making a packet out of the lack of competition in Bristol.

    Having trialed the system last year I believe First is introducing smart cards on all bus routes from March (IIRC). Obviously won't be as integrated/embedded as the Oyster card system is to London, but it's a start. Drifting off topic a bit, I know......

    Posted 4 months ago #
21. wallop - Member

    The best way to get more people on Bristol buses would be to reduce the fares a bit.

    It's a sh1t service, timetables are irrelevant, all the drivers jump red lights and it costs a fortune.

    And don't even get me started on the recent introduction of bendy buses. 'Cos, like, Bristol streets are ideal for them

    Posted 4 months ago #
22. noteeth - Member

    It's a sh1t service

    My favourite First moment was getting an early morning bus into town, with a Spanish driver who didn't know the way!

    We had to direct him. The resuting hilarity was the only compensation for the stupidly high fare.

    Posted 4 months ago #
23. andyl - Member

    I've got a Kingsdown parking permit. Brilliant when I am at the Uni. The put the price up 50% for the coming year though. Wonder what it will be in a few years. Does mean I can use my car during the day which is great but it's only any use when going out of Bristol as driving and parking around Whiteladies is now worse than ever.

    And yes, bus fares in Bristol are ridiculous and you can't save money by buying a return during peak times on the buses I have used.

    Posted 4 months ago #
24. aka_Gilo - Member

    I spent the first 18 years of my life living on Tyndalls Park Road. Lovely part of town but I don't miss it.

    Use public transport in Bristol? No chance, unbelievably unreliable and stupidly expensive. I walk or cycle everywhere, car(s) only get used on occasional evenings and weekends.

    Posted 4 months ago #
25. project - Member

    I havent cycled in Bristol for probably 25 years, nice to see the road planners stil have not got any idea how to route roads around town, and as for the bus drivers worst ive ever seen, and im a bus fan.

    Posted 4 months ago #
26. Philby - Member

    Oh, the middle class Bristolian angst! The horror!

    No working class Yorkshireman who happens to live in Bristol.

    I hope the Whiteladies scheme works as my friend says the similar scheme on Fishponds Road has created gridlock at peak times.

    The only way to get people onto public transport in Bristol is to improve the regularity of the service and reduce the fares. Fortunately I am able to walk or cycle to most places I need to go, but most of Bristol's residents who live further out in the suburbs and other commuters don't have that choice.

    Posted 4 months ago #
27. mattsccm - Member

    Not relevant to the OP but thats never stopped this forum, I reckon that unless a bus stop can allow the bus to pull in completely, the road should be built in such a way that all traffic is forced to stop behind it. Why over take, buses don't stop for long. Any traffic build up behind shold then be allowed for as well. I am not pretending this is fool prof so much as questioning the need to over take parked buses just to save a few seconds or minute.

    Posted 4 months ago #
28. bommer - Member

    Bristol buses are the reason I ride my bike to work every day...still get to have 6 and a bit miles of gloucester road fun though

    Posted 4 months ago #

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