Why don’t we install ALL top caps like this??

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  • Why don’t we install ALL top caps like this??
  • DrP
    Member

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1AKTNZglpg

    Can’t insert video…meh…

    Was looking at the One-up EDC website, and the tap/thread way of installing top caps IS a bit more faff initially, but… lighter, seems more senible rather than bash a SFN in the tube, and the only downside is it won’t work on carbon…

    Why aren’t we all tapping out steerer tubes?

    Premier Icon nickjb
    Subscriber

    I guess some people don’t like to invalidate their fork warranty. Seems like a step backwards to me as a way of mounting a top cap, although the storage is nice.

    finbar
    Member

    Bmx forks have had threaded top caps for years (not sure if they still do, mind) – but manufacturers tend to makes frames AND forks together for complete bikes, so they can thread forks to the right depth themselves.

    It’d be much more of a faff to co-ordinate with Fox, Rock Shox etc.

    Premier Icon nickc
    Subscriber

    Why aren’t we all tapping out steerer tubes?

    I thought a-headsets were invented so we didn’t have to tap our steerer tubes any longer.

    Premier Icon rOcKeTdOg
    Subscriber

    Star nut or wedge is much easier than all that faff

    Premier Icon DezB
    Subscriber

    Star nut or wedge is much easier than all that faff

    But where would you do put your special tool?

    orangeboy
    Member

    nickc

    Subscriber
    Why aren’t we all tapping out steerer tubes?

    I thought a-headsets were invented so we didn’t have to tap our steerer tubes any longer.

    Posted 2 hours ago

    Brings back memories of dies and poorly cut threads.

    jonm81
    Member

    Why aren’t we all tapping out steerer tubes?

    Because by the time you buy the tap, the top cap and the tool kit that goes inside it costs about £100.

    A SFN is £1.99 from Halfords.

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Subscriber

    But if all forks and top caps were like that then you wouldn’t need to buy anything.

    Ah shit, this’ll be 2019’s revolutionary new part won’t it, new forks with a .63% bigger width and a thread.

    markwsf
    Member

    <tongue in cheek>

    As a GP – you know when patients come in to see you and say “I’ve googled it – I have XXXX problem and I think the solution is YYY” ?

    Speaking an engineer – just like that.

    </tongue in cheek>

    For OEMs it’s much easier to bang in a Star-Fangled-Nut than tap threads.

    For consumers, it means you can put the SFN further down if you want to if you cut your stem down, )rather than have the whole stem threaded)

    Finally – internal threads would significantly weaken the structural integrity of the stem – it both removes material and created stress raisers at the “bottom” of the threads, so for the same factor of safety stems would be thicker therefore heavier. Realistically, most stress is on the bottom of the stem where it joins the steerer, so this is probably irrelevant anyway.

    I seem to have undermined my original point, but never mind.

    pdw
    Member

    Nah, I think you’re right.  If you pre-threaded the whole of the steerer so that it could just be cut to size, then on larger frames you’d have threaded steerer at the bottom of the stem.

    Premier Icon rOcKeTdOg
    Subscriber

    If you pre-threaded the whole of the steerer so that it could just be cut to size,

    Forks are expensive enough now without the extra cost of doing that to them all

    Premier Icon bigblackshed
    Subscriber

    You see those fine threads that have been carefully cut in to you steerer tube?

    They tend to get complete trashed when a hamfisted IT manager gets involved.

    Then you you end up putting your expensive proprietary multi tool in your rucksack like everyone else.

    Expensive solution to to a problem that doesn’t exist.

    Premier Icon sillyoldman
    Subscriber

    <i>But where would you do put your special tool?</i>

    In your £8 lightweight drybag obvz.

    Premier Icon Rubber_Buccaneer
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    If you are tempted by the EDC DrP don’t buy the tap borrow mine. I may even have a spare top cap so long as you like black. You’d just need to buy the multitool to stick in your steerer

    Stevet1
    Member

    Bmx forks have had threaded top caps for years

    Tree bike co. bars have threaded ends to screw their bar end plugs into as well.

    Image result for tree bike bars bar ends

    philjunior
    Member

    It would take a lot more torque than a SFN to preload the headset bearings, and won’t tolerate much misalignment which the SFN copes with well. The bolt in a conventional top cap allows the top cap to sit still while the bolt rotates, which makes it easier to tighten appropriately too. I’ve got a bung in one of my carbon steerers that has a much larger thread, and every time I disturb the headset it takes a couple of goes to get it tight enough again (this also applies when a shop has disturbed the headset), and that’s still a smaller diameter thread than this arrangement

    And stress raisers in the steerer.

    And different internal diameters on different materials/intended uses of steerer make threading the internal face a ball ache, and would make for 10 different cap nuts for the new “standard”.

    Premier Icon Rubber_Buccaneer
    Subscriber

    I’ve fitted the OneUp EDC top caps to two sets of Pikes and a Lyrik so far.  Simple enough to do, simple to adjust the headset and so far no death in a ball of flame.  Instructions say to have a minimum amount (3mm I think) of steerer above the stem and the thread is only cut to a limited depth so I’m not fearing any steerer snappage in my lifetime

    been pretty impressed with mine, installed on two bikes…. I like it 🙂

    DrP
    Member

    As a GP – you know when patients come in to see you and say “I’ve googled it – I have XXXX problem and I think the solution is YYY” ?

    Speaking an engineer – just like that.

    Chuckle…true!!

    My issue is that my steerer is about 3mm BELOW the top of the stem.. hmm… THat’s what happens when you get a new frame with a longer head tube!

    I’m going for one of the EDC pumps… can swap from bike to bike a bit more easily!

    DrP

    Premier Icon vincienup
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    FWIW, I think the pump is the better solution for someone with multiple bikes especially.  I guess the hardcore ‘nothing that isn’t pocket size’ won’t agree but that’s fine and healthy… 🙂

    Premier Icon wwaswas
    Subscriber

    *sits back to wait for the “I’ve just tried to cut some threads in my carbon steerer tube” thread*

    plyphon
    Member

    As above, BMX has had threaded streerer tubes for years.

    I’ve cut many without mangling the threads. In fact I think they thread them a bit lower down so you don’t have to cut through the thread.

    The threads also aren’t fine threads, they’re quite substantial. Works great. I used to remove the topbolt afterward the stem is done up to give it a cleaner look.

    Maybe the length of streerer tubes on forks or something stops that working on MTB.

    Premier Icon wwaswas
    Subscriber

    I suspect it’s more to do with the fact that BMX forks tend to be made out of scaffold poles and MTB and Road either out of lightweight alloys or carbon – neither of which will hold a thread as well.

    Also, when the whole point of aheadsets is that you don’t need a threaded steerer adding one back in seems a bit of a retrograde step.

    bigyinn
    Member

    All that cocking about just to save carrying a tool in your back pack? Oh and the extra money for the work to be carried out and the potential warranty invalidation for your forks?

    Well I’m sold. Blank cheque ok? Don’t worry about the numbers, whichever looks nicest to you is fine.

    All that cocking about just to save carrying a tool in your back pack? Oh and the extra money for the work to be carried out and the potential warranty invalidation for your forks?

    It’s more “not having to carry a pack at all”

    And you do it yourself, as opposed to paying money to have the work done..

    And in the unlikely even that it did invalidate the waranty, you could always trim the top few mm of seeter off before returning them. Mine are well out of warranty anyhow, so makes no odds.

    And if you manage to stress the top 5 mm of your steerer enough that an internal thread casues a crack, you’ve probably installed the fork upside down (not mentioning any Scottish STWers in particular here)

    Premier Icon DezB
    Subscriber

    <span style=”font-size: 0.8rem;”>It’s more “not having to carry a pack at all”</span>

    Yes, wait til you’ve installed the water bladder what I’ve invented to go in your seat tube! Then no need for any pack 😀

    <div class=”bbp-reply-author”>DezB
    <div class=”bbp-author-role”></div>
    </div>

    <div class=”bbp-reply-content”>

    Yes, wait til you’ve installed the water bladder what I’ve invented to go in your seat tube! Then no need for any pack

    </div>

    I’ll probably go with a water bottle…… having said that, I’m almost sure someone has actually done something along those lines in reality

    Premier Icon DezB
    Subscriber

    Wattle bottle? Pah! My invention intravenously feeds water through the saddle as you need it. Just takes a small body mod and you’re away.

    sirromj
    Member

    Wattle bottle? Pah! My invention intravenously feeds water through the saddle as you need it. Just takes a small body mod and you’re away.

    Why stop there? Let’s have it dual function and perform a colonic irrigation at the end of the ride 🙂

    damascus
    Member

    Why would it affect the warranty of your forks? When you chop 5cm off them when you first set them up, adding a thread is hardly any different.

    <span style=”font-size: 0.8rem;”> </span>

    Premier Icon nickjb
    Subscriber

    Ask the manufacturers. Windwave posted on facbook that it would impact on the warranty. There were several follow up posts saying it was the same for other forks.

    bigyinn
    Member

    Are we being told that we must be like the roadies with mud and carrying anything in a backpack is verbotten? Waterbottles? No ta. Been there done that. Supping on a bottle with sheep crap on the spout or having to do an emergency stop halfway down your favourite descent to chase the bottle that decided to eject at warp speed, never again.

    I’ll stick with my camelbak which holds my food, my tools, my phone, wallet and 3l of water.

    trail_rat
    Member

    its much more convenient for the sheep crap to be on the camelback nozzle i agree.

    much prefer bottles but my ibis hasnt got a bottle cage in a useful place 🙁

    Premier Icon BoardinBob
    Subscriber

    One Up tool on my main bike for a few weeks. Absolutely brilliant. Now ordered one for my other bike and any bike I have going forward will have it. Haven’t ridden with a bag on my back in years and I don’t miss one. Absolutely pointless for anything less than a very remote winter ride.

    trail_rat
    Member

    not even for a remote summer ride ?

    Premier Icon BoardinBob
    Subscriber

    Not really.

    one up tool

    bontrager rapid pack round the waist

    bottle cage on the frame

    dakine hot laps on the frame

    everything I need

    Premier Icon cookeaa
    Subscriber

    Are we being told that we must be like the roadies with mud and carrying anything in a backpack is verbotten? 

    Nobody’s telling anyone to do anything, it’s just a growing number of people seem to be questioning the “trailcentre uniform” requirement to lug 5kg about on your back when all the nooks and crannies of your dandyhorse might provide adequate stoage for certain essentials… The lack of a camelbak certainly won’t make you “like the roadies”, honest.

    Of course if you’re still perfectly happy with the bicycle backpack, crack on fella.

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