Tubeless Tyres – Anger Management Issues

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  • Tubeless Tyres – Anger Management Issues
  • daveevs
    Member

    Ok, so I’ve drilled, de-burred, taped, pushed down flat, soaped up and pumped like a dog on heat, but the blasted thing will NOT inflate!

    What’s going wrong?

    My bathroom looks like the scene of a dirty protest, but hey, the wheel’s gleaming.

    Yours deflated

    Swiftacular
    Member

    Its not a Speccy 2bliss is it? i can relate.

    MrNutt
    Member

    doesn’t sound like your using UST, are you?

    Premier Icon Sandwich
    Subscriber

    Soap may be the problem, proper rim lube (ooer) should be used 😈

    don’t forget to wear your diaper

    Premier Icon househusband
    Subscriber

    doesn’t sound like your using UST, are you?

    Seconded.

    Never had any issue inflating a tyre with the UST logo.

    daveevs
    Member

    No. Vanilla tyres (selection of) and Stans…

    Premier Icon Sandwich
    Subscriber

    Oh no not the Badger thread 😀

    gusamc
    Member

    Put tyre on
    then, with luggage strap/rope etc, put it around centre of tyre and force centre of tyre into rim well, whilst simultaneously encouraging tyre bead out to rim edges.
    then try to inflate before releasing strap (ie let bead set)
    might work

    Swiftacular
    Member

    UST’s are a completely different story, but never had any success with ghetto/tr tyres.

    thefallguy
    Member

    try to listen when you are pumping where the air is escaping and hold that area to the rim , should help. i used to use co2 to get them inflated when I first tried but the milk goes off in the cold, works to seat the tube initially though.
    I use spesh captain and mud-x’s on a 4.2 rim with a stans kit, works fine once sealed, tyres inflate a lot easier on a 5.1 rim though.

    Two words——Air compressor.!

    Premier Icon coolhandluke
    Subscriber

    I have had terrific success with Ghetto tubeless! Kenda surprise tyres, 20″ BMX tubes, 729 rims, bottle of Stans.

    Watched the Utube vid and off I went.

    Pumped them up 3 months ago, they leaked a bit (bubbles told me) so I swished some more and since then not felt the need to pump tem up at all.

    Currently got about 20PSI in them.

    ibis
    Member

    there is a reason they invented u.s.t. me thinks!!

    daveevs
    Member

    Thanks for the pointers!

    Have just cruised the mean streets looking for an air compressor, but all the garages have the new style digital crap.

    It’s only flow rates. If I can force more air in than comes out the sides, it should snap into place.

    Got a Swampthing onto a Bonty ACX rim quite easily with Stans, but this is being a sod.

    Premier Icon nickc
    Subscriber

    Two words… Inner tubes!

    daveevs
    Member

    Nick,

    While I appreciate the irony that a race-tuned yah yah multi £k bike can be defeated by the humble thorn, there has to be a better way…

    Premier Icon nickc
    Subscriber

    There may be a better way, but tubeless ain’t it. Like you I got bored with the faff and goop. Life’s waaay simpler with tubes.

    Premier Icon jim the saint
    Subscriber

    1. Check around the ‘hooky’ bit of the rim and remove anything that’s wedged in there that would stop a tight seal.

    2. If your using a track pump remove the valve core from the valve in the rim strip and push the beads into the middle of the wheel.

    3. If that didn’t get a seal then you need to put more tape under the rim strip. If a Stan’s kit is going to work then the tyre should be quite difficult to get on the rim. I think I’ve had to put 5 or 6 layers of the yellow tape on a 317 once to get a tight fit.

    4. Some swear by using a soapy solution on the tyre bead but I find that if you follow the first three steps then you shouldn’t need to.

    Premier Icon aracer
    Subscriber

    Not sure I should still be recommending this one, given I can see the potential for injury should it go wrong (hence you follow these instructions entirely at your own risk), but here goes:

    What I’ve used for years is a home made compressor, consisting of a lemonade bottle with a presta valve inserted in the bottom. Another presta valve inserted in the cap with the valve core removed, and a bit of tubing zip tied onto that, then a plumbing valve in the tubing finishing in an old valve chuck off a track pump. Reinforce the lemonade bottle with wrappings of duck tape to help it take the pressure. I pump this up to 100psi with a track pump, put the chuck on the tyre and open the valve – never had a problem with seating (though always use the other techniques of getting the tyre seated properly and soap as well).

    One other trick is to inflate with a tube to seat the beads – you only have to break one side to get the tube out, hence only have to worry about getting one side back on.

    Oh, and I’ll second the suggestion about removing the core of the valve on the wheel.

    Premier Icon nickc
    Subscriber

    Those kinds of posts just reinforce the the whole notion that tubeless is just soooo half-arsed.

    MrNutt
    Member

    nickc, that should read:

    “Those kinds of posts just reinforce the the whole notion that ghetto tubeless is just soooo half-arsed.”

    as UST works brilliantly and tyres can be put on & seated using a hand or track pump!!

    Premier Icon nickc
    Subscriber
    Premier Icon BlobOnAStick
    Subscriber

    I had this problem 2 days ago after successfully running pikey tubeless for months. I use the cut 20″ inner tube approach.

    I solved it by running a strip of foam draft excluder round the rim before installing the tube over the top of it. I think it gives just a little bit more diameter to the rim to make the seal.

    Also, I removed the valve core initially to get the airflow into the tube up. once seated, I injected the solution into the tyre through the valve and re-installed the valve core. Worked a treat!

    Ben

    Ooops – just realised that’s just what Jimmy the saint said above!

    Premier Icon aracer
    Subscriber

    Those kinds of posts just reinforce the the whole notion that tubeless is just soooo half-arsed.

    You mean because I’ve put a bit of effort into solving the problem, such that it’s not a problem at all now, and takes me less time to fit a tyre than it does faffing around fixing a puncture on the trail*? By the same logic, building a bike up to your spec, or even changing components to suit is just sooooo half-arsed when you could be riding the factory build as sold in the shop.

    * noting that I change my tyres far less often than I used to have to fix punctures.

    Premier Icon nickc
    Subscriber

    put tube in, blow up tube….

    You’re right, what was I thinking….. 😉

    Premier Icon aracer
    Subscriber

    …stop to fix punctured tube in the cold and wet at the side of the trail.

    devs
    Member

    Use CO2 cannister to seat tyre. Blow up to 60psi. Leave for a while and bounce, manipulate or even ride if you want. Deflate. Put sealant in through core. Reinflate with track pump. Simple. If you have to use CO2 with the sealant in the tyre, Have the valve at the top so all the sealant is at the bottom. I ghetto’s some Swampies and they are great, particularly in ice and snow. UST is simpler and more confidence inspiring though. Having said that, next time I buy wheels i’ll go for the best deal whether it is a UST rim or not as a ghetto system is simple enough after the first time. I’ve already got me some Highrollers to ghetto as my hardtail summer tyres.

    Mr_Krabbs
    Member

    i used notubes years back, but ripped a tyre on a downhill and face planted as the tyre can off and got caught in the wheel. i would never use it again.

    that said I now use proper UST tyres on proper UST rims. all the benefits (of which there are many) but none of the faff.

    i do enjoy the grumpy old dinosaur comments that these threads bring.

    ex-pat
    Member

    Ok, so I got fecked off with punctures after the local farmer buzzed a blackthorn hedge along one key connection trail.
    So, not wanting the above, I fitted inner tubes that had goop in them – as purchased on CRC.
    And, apart from one outage where I had the mofo thorn from hell that looked like I’d dropped onto a rhino they’ve been ace.
    And in that event I just did the old fashioned tube change to a ‘normal’ one until could get home and put another goopy one back in.
    I was regularly pulling thorns out post blackthorn run…

    ex-pat
    Member

    Oh, and now in Aus, which strangely doesn’t seem to have thorns wot like the UK has.

    Spiders, snakes, scorpions, sharks*, jelly fish*, bees, hornets, killer rabbits, dingos, crocodiles, more spiders, Yes. Thorns, No.

    Cheers
    AndyC

    *Probably not a ride issue.

    righty
    Member

    i am running super ghetto null without rim strips and just use an old valve. I dont even mess around with soap suds and they still seat ok. I also dont use removable valve cores i just put on 90% of the tyre and then just pour the required amount of sealant in, then put the tyre on inflate and if no obvious leaks put it in a bath tub of water and you will see the small leaks which you address my moving the wheel around till it seals.
    went riding in wales this last weekend and my mate punctured 5 times on thorns and i didnt have a single problem- so do persevere, it is worth it

    my top tip is get a compressor- about £60 at machinemart or aldi it makes the job a lot easier

    I was sceptical about ghetto tubeless, but converted when I had an intolerable series of punctures: it’s working for me. It must be frustrating if you can’t get it to work for you.

    Maxxis tyres are generally reckoned to give the best results
    Kendas are OK
    Panaracers rarely work apparently

    You have removed the valve core for initial inflation havn’t you? It’s impossible with the valve core left in.

    Don’t put any sealant in until you’ve managed a full inflation using soap suds – up to 60psi. This step is needed to “seat the bead” into the rim i.e. to shape the tyre to fit the wheel rim. Only when this deflates, do you add sealant. Even if you later “burp” the tyre flat on the trail, it should re-inflate with a mini pump simply because the tyre bead retains it’s fit with the rim. [but always carry a spare inner tube just in case it doesn’t!]

    The trick with the strap around the tyre circumference sound good, though I’ve not had to resort to that.

    This is the hardest bit so keep trying; it’s worth it.

    snaps
    Member

    I’ve used UST, Stans & ghetto, all work & I’ve not had a punture in over a year!
    Tyres I’ve tried ghetto that worked are Maxxis, Michelin, Halo & Tioga
    Tyres that didn’t work were Schwable, Panaracer & Specialized
    After the ease of the ones that work, I only spend a few minutes trying to seat a new type of tyre, if it dosen’t go on & seat easy I just change it for one that will.

    Premier Icon aracer
    Subscriber

    Tyres I’ve tried ghetto that worked are Maxxis, Michelin, Halo & Tioga
    Tyres that didn’t work were Schwable, Panaracer & Specialized

    Experiences obviously vary – I started off ghettoing Fire XCs and Trailblasters (that was 7 years ago!), and now have RRs and NNs with Eclipse rimstrips or Stans rims. All have worked fine. Meanwhile I had problems with Michelins blowing off the rims.

    After 7 years I’ve still yet to have as many punctures as I had in a single year with tubes – it’s 2 or 3 years since I’ve had to use a tube, though did have to stop to let the sealant do its job a couple of times last year.

    Premier Icon takisawa2
    Subscriber

    Just done a tubeless conversion on mine.
    X719s with Michellin 2.2 DTC All-Mountain tyres.
    Bought 2 Schwalbe 20″ tubes with the threaded valve stems & a small bottle of JustRiding Along wheel milk.
    Slit along centre of tube, stick valve through rim hole & secure with collar, stretch tube around rim allowing it to fold over each side.
    Put tyres back on.
    Loads & loads of soapy water around tyre bead.
    Remove valve core.
    Pump up QUICKLY while pressing tyre against rim at valve point to help seal.
    Once some air is in continue pumping QUICKLY until you’re completely fecked.
    Remove pump. Turn wheel 30 deg.
    Add 50ml wheel milk.
    Re-insert valve core.
    Keeping valve at 9pm / 3pm so liquid is in bottom tyre pump again QUICKLY, pressing tyre against rim to help seal.
    Give wheel a good sloshing round so the milk starts to seal. You’ll hear the air leaks start to go quiet. You’ll also notice wheel milk leeching out from various points all over the tyre.
    Eventually it will seal completely.

    Did both of mine last week & both are still rock hard.
    Pressing tyre against rim at valve point seems to be the key.

    Hi Guys,

    I use the bmx innertube method, innitially i was sceptical but to be honest they’re very good – but there only very good if you have a) a compressor b) don’t change your tyres often c) dont mind not ever getting punctures or snakebites again.

    I use normal tyres on the split 20″ tubes with my own latex solution. Been running now for almost a year on two bikes with no issues. I would say though that I run the same pressure around 40psi. I dont buy the lower pressure thing as your tyres just roll – you do however get less rolling resistance and better grip at the same pressure though…

    Latex solution is modelling latex £10 litre of concentrated latex – you just water it down until its the consistency of single cream. ( maybe add some screenwash to staop any freezing in the winter)

    The split innertubes actually stops any burping as the ineertubes ends up sticking to the side of the tyre.

    Premier Icon molgrips
    Subscriber

    Ok listen up folks. Here’s the word…

    1) Yellow Stan’s tape.
    2) Stan’s rim strip
    3) Stan’s sealant in and spin it around
    4) CO2 cartridge
    5) Swill
    6) Ride

    That’s really all it takes. You DO need to ride though and it has to be a proper one not just a run up and down the road – if you don’t, it won’t have time to properly seal the holes and will deflate in a few hours. Over the course of a ride you’ll see very fine latex foam on the sidewalls, as the latex seals.

    I can change tubeless tyres in barely longer than it takes to change tubed tyres. And it DOES make your bike go faster – noticably so.

    Premier Icon molgrips
    Subscriber

    PS on most rims it’s not possible with a track pump, so don’t even try. You’ll just get tired arms. It IS possible on Stan’s own rims though with no bother at all.

    Premier Icon stuartlangwilson
    Subscriber

    I’ve done ghetto with panaracers, track pump, and valve cores still in. It was a bit of a faff admittedly.

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