More out of blind optimism that genuine expectation I’m hopefully the tt season will start again later this year.

Last year I had an ftp of about 275 on the road bike, however it was around 240 max on the tt bike, a huge drop when I don’t have much power to give up in first place

This year I’m taking the approach of only riding on the tt bike on turbo from now on. But what’s the best approach to build up power to what it is on road bike. Im thinking initially hour long rides at maybe 80% ftp for a month or so to get the right muscles working then try and ramp up the intensity. But will i lose all my top end power if I do that?

Races will be 10 mile tts usually, if I can hold my road ftp for the duration of a ten mile event I’d be delighted.

Happy to be corrected but I think TT bikes are a trade between a position that lets you put out your max power and being as aero as possible

I sacrifice about 5-7% on the TT bike Vs road bike due to aggressive position that ultimately restricts breathing. I do train a lot in the TT position but can never squeeze the difference closer. It’s a balancing act between aero and power for many people and I can go way faster when in a position that limits my output.

I think this is why a lot of the modern TTers have big rises on their extensions – pedastalling I think the term is. You lose a tiny bit of aero as you increase your frontal area, but it opens up the hip angle enabling much more power to be generated. Getting your shoulders as low as possible isn’t the key like it was assumed to be a few years ago. Might be worth experimenting, or at least comparing the differences between your road and TT rigs.

I was looking for some photos to compare and contrast old and new styles, but Wiggins hour position is relatively high at the front, but has a totally flat back, so works on both fronts

Happy to be corrected but I think TT bikes are a trade between a position that lets you put out your max power and being as aero as possible

You are correct. But it shouldn’t be as big a drop as i experience. I think 5% or so is acceptable.certainly first season I did tts I could hold my ftp for the duration of the 20 odd minute race, suggesting less than 5% drop off on power.

Last year however (on a new tt bike) I did a ten mile effort at 250 watts average. My ftp at time was 275. That suggests me I’m losing around 14%. And I had done a fair amount of trainer road sessions on the tt bike before hand so not as if I’d not ridden in that position before.

It’s weird as today I happily cruised along at 200 watts for an hr, however as soon as I ramped up the power I couldn’t cope.

TTers have big rises on their extensions – pedastalling I think the term is.

I have those!! Don’t get me wrong, I’m way faster on the tt bike run a road bike so my position must be ok. But I’d go way faster if in can find those lost watts.

It’s hard to say – you might go way slower if you can find those lost watts. Perhaps you current position is very good.

You could try working the position on the turbo and see what the power looks like, but this would be futile for me. Some folk rate this highly though – do you find it OK to ride in position on the turbo? Riding it outside is good, once it warms up a little. Even if you can’t really get your warface on riding around you can still get a feel for the position.

I’m also about to put the TT bike on the turbo – but just to get a bit of adaptation round the back end, I won’t really think seriously about the position till I have a number on my back and can see what the speed looks like.
I’d be fairly optimistic for some tests this year – I did quite a few last year late July / Aug, even set a pb on a fast course down South. Some clubs were prepared to step up and do what it takes to run a covid-compliant event (Congleton were the ones who ran them near me); now that has been demonstrated it paves the way for more to go ahead this year.

Are we measuring apples with apples?

Same conditions (both on turbo or both outside and on same course in similar conditions)?
Exact same power meter (rather than just same make and model)?
Same test protocol?

@400w I was doing mid 20 10s, good position @ 370 that reduced to mid 18. Don’t be obsessed on absolute watts, position is paramount.

Are we measuring apples with apples?

Same conditions (both on turbo or both outside and on same course in similar conditions)?
Exact same power meter (rather than just same make and model)?
Same test protocol?

Good shout. Yep both indoors. Power meter both stages but different cranks admittedly.

Not really done a test protocol as such. I know that last year on turbo I could put out 270 watts for a full hr on roadie, and next week I managed 252 for a 24 min zwift tt using my tt bike on turbo

Totally appreciate that you can go faster with less watts in right position, but for some reason there’s an element of pride that wants me to be able to put out bigger numbers! Plus my position ain’t super aero, for example 250 watts on a reasonably flat course last year only got me sub 24 min by a few seconds

On my much less aero Planet X stealth I could put out more power but wasn’t hugely faster. The carrot is that if I can put out the same power as the Planet X (280 watts) as I can on the new bike I reckon I can go under my target 23 min this year. And my position on the Planet X isn’t massively different than the new bike. I’ve had an online bike fitting and everything!

What I can’t be assed doing however is (like last year) working my ass off, getting to a decent level (for me) on the roadie, then finding I can’t perform at all on the tt bike

Dunno what the set up on these bikes is like, but when I did some tris a few years ago on my road bike with tri bars, turning the seatpost 180° to give a steep seat angle gave me an aero position without having to change the hip angle.

Everyone is different, I’m generally 10-15w down on what I can achieve on the TT bike compared to the road bike. I also know of people that have no difference between road and TT. Although I always use the TT bike on Zwift it’s not that often I’m in position (although I know I should) it’s only when I fancy a change/remember, I find it to boring. I do however train a lot outside in summer in position (it’s far more dynamic which helps me while away the hours) which certainly helps. Basically what I’m rambling on about is if you want to improve your watts in position, train in position.

I have never been able to tolerate the TT bike on the turbo. Despite this for years there was no real difference between the road and TT bike for me outside. Looking back I never trained in position. What I did do was ride to all the early season races. So for me it was just about riding the bike.

More recently I only do a few and we take the car. I have had horrible reduction in power on the TT bike. Slowly came back as I did more races but its the miles that worked for me.

Dunno about your training in general. But I would still the some sessions (hard stuff) on whatever position gives you the most watts. Some disagree, but when I want to sharpen up I am on the road bike.

Dunno about your training in general. But I would still the some sessions (hard stuff) on whatever position gives you the most watts. Some disagree, but when I want to sharpen up I am on the road bike.

That was exactly my thinking last year, but it didn’t seem to work. The watts went up on the roadie, but as soon as I go back on the tt bike it was like I’d not put in any training at all.

Hence why I’m considering a different approach this year. I’m still in 2 minds however, the approach you suggest seems far more logical to me, but I didn’t see the results.

I had a spell when I was doing loads of hamstring and back stretching and felt loads more comfortable on the TT bike. I didn’t have a power meter back then so can’t quantify anything but I certainly felt faster. How’s your current flexibility?

Only a sportive road bike with a high front end (Cube Attain), but I raised the stem from being immediately above conical spacer to above the other 30mm of round spacers, I could have sworn that raised my power by ~20W+ on Zwift TTs.

Is there any value in training for now with the bars high in the road bike, doing both ~20min+ intervals and shorter 1-5min HIIT intervals, but then swapping to TT bike in your outdoor position a couple of weeks before an event?

Or will the time in the higher position, where you can open your lungs up more, yield no power gains that will then also improve your TT position power?