Short but sweet conundrum.

My sons’ school want to record videos of lessons to distribute to any adult with a school-given email address. Record Google Meet videos and make the folder of videos available to anyone with the correct email address i.e. familyusername@XYschool.com

The school is in the Middle East but usually follows GDPR protocols. If I’m right, this is needed if they have any operation within the EU.

I have expressly withdrawn permission but expect that this will happen anyway.

Is there anything I can do? Withdrawing my children is not an option.

Thanks all

What’s the problem exactly?

Why do you object so much?

Can’t see the issue.

Don’t see how GDPR is relevant or why you object TBH?

Who is being recorded, the teacher or the students. If it’s only the teacher, what’s the problem? If it’s the teacher and consenting students, still doesn’t seem to be a problem.

The lessons will be from the teachers’ perspective which means a grid view of all children with cameras on and their voices / interactions with the teacher all recorded.

Them being told off. Picking their nose. Giving ridiculous answers etc.

We are still teaching remotely so every lesson is over Google Meet.

I am open to being told I’m being ridiculous but, as a teacher and knowing the things your children say to me on a regular basis, I don’t feel it should be made available.

Case in point:

Me: what does your Mummy say?

Child: mummy did too much dancing and is lying next to the toilet

Record that? Send it to the school community?

Does GDPR not include things like privacy?

Of course I’m not an expert on the subject. If I were, I wouldn’t be asking for advice on a bike forum 😉

I reckon you’re assuming a level of interest from other people that probably isn’t there but if you feel uncomfortable can’t they just point the camera so your kid isn’t in shot?

I wouldn’t want my kids recorded, principally because when I was in infant school I didn’t like what the teacher said so pulled down my trousers and pants! I’ve got nothing to be ashamed of but not sure I would have wanted that incident put on the internet!

Assume if you have not given your consent your child’s stream will not be recorded?

Have a look on the internet and you will soon see its full of stuff – your stuff really wont matter.

to distribute to any adult with a school-given email address.

How many adults have a “school-given email address”? Who’s the intended audience?

The lessons will be from the teachers’ perspective which means a grid view of all children with cameras on and their voices / interactions with the teacher all recorded.

What’s this recording supposed to achieve, what’s its purpose?

Theoretically GDPR applies even if they don’t have an operation in Europe so long as they are processing personal data on EU citizens. Just because it applies doesn’t mean that they can’t do it or require your consent to do it. It probably should involve a data protection impact assessment.

I don’t understand what value sharing the view the teacher gets has unless there are behavioural issues or they are trying to reassure parents about what is going on. It would probably be more helpful to have a recording of what the pupils see – so parents can reinforce that learning?

Personally I’d have no strong objection to my kids being recorded like this – i think it might sharpen up some attitudes (possibly both kids and teachers) if they knew that parents might see exactly what was happening!

I’m with the other posters here. What exactly do you object to?

I’m still not clear on the audience. Is it school staff or other parents? If it’s school staff then that is entirely reasonable and a useful learning tool for them. If it is public and available for other parents I understand your concern so just don’t give consent

You sure they are getting the grid view? We record our Zoom webinars but none of the guests appear on the recordings only the panel members. You sure that’s not what they’re planning.

I wouldn’t want my kids recorded, principally because when I was in infant school I didn’t like what the teacher said so pulled down my trousers and pants!

I did that during the school play when I was 5 years old, in front of the entire school. I don’t remember doing it but I do remember being dragged off stage and given an all-mighty bollocking from my mum in the car on the way home.

To make matters worse, it was the Christmas nativity play and I was in the role of Joseph.

Oh stop being one of those people that makes everything impossible to do in the 21st century.

What exactly are you worried about? Who cares? Of what possible interest could the video of this lesson be to anyone with any nefarious intention?

I’ve got nothing to be ashamed of

Useless without pics.

As a parent I would feel uncomfortable about this, I don’t think your instincts are wrong. I would at least want to know what the purpose was and how the data would be stored and disposed of when no longer needed. I would feel differently if it was recording a few classes for training purposes over blanket recording all classes.

I wouldn’t really be worried about wronguns getting it, it would almost certainly be the most boring videos in the history of the internet. It’s just I don’t like the idea of all my kids smallest interactions being recorded. Some stuff should just be allowed to happen in the moment and that’s it. There’s no way we can even understand how this sort of data could be used in the future so better not create it unless there’s a pressing need.

Find out if the school has a data protection officer or SIRO and ask to speak to them. It’s a reasonable request and they should be able to respond to this. You could also ask to see what risk assessment or data security assessment they have completed.

As a teacher I don’t see the point. Is it to record you lessons? If so why the pupils?
If I read it right the pupils are at home. It can have a negative impact. As above child protection issues and those things statements and conversations recorded for all to see (don’t happen often I’ve only been involved in one in nigh on 20 years but no one wants that recorded).
Educationally they will be less willing to explore answers if being recorded, it’s massively important to get things wrong in order to get them right. Example from this week being fridges don’t make things cold because there’s no such thing as cold. Great learning conversations with lots of misconceptions but would definitely have been lessened if recorded.

there’s no such thing as cold

I worked for a woman who was definitely cold, she could suck any warmth out of a room. I used to give her a big cheery “good morning” every morning because I knew how much she hated it. She would just glare at me and stomp off in a huff. Her assistant used to spend half her time hiding out in other people’s offices because she hated the witch so much. Then the assistant got a better job and waited until 5:00 before cleaning out her desk, handing in her resignation, and fleeing for safety.

Example from this week being fridges don’t make things cold because there’s no such thing as cold.

Woah! Back up there! Say what?

We are still teaching completely remotely. Live lessons where I share presentations etc in a Google Meet (like Skype).

Children have cameras on and of course ask and answer questions, discuss topics etc.

The purpose of recording the lessons is to share them with parents and for the lesson to be accessible if a child has not attended the lessons. This isn’t to share best practice with other members of staff or similar. I would have no problems with that.

The lessons will be shared to any parent in the school. Every family has a school email account.

I am uncomfortable with my child’s every interaction being recorded and made available to the parents.

I can’t see the point in recording the children in the class.
I can see the problem with such a large proportion of a person’s daily activity being recorded in such detail.

This thread has a certain amount of “if you have nothing to fear you have nothing to hide” argument to justifying the recording of the students.

I would not be comfortable with this either (if the camera was on the children). Kids deserve a safe space, without every tiny details of their lives being recorded and shared. My girlfriend worked in a nursery and her job was to ‘observe’ the children and record every tiny interaction onto a iPad – on day 2, a 4 year old girl asked her to please put down the ipad and play with her..

Our school has started to video assemblies and put them on facebook – I think this is totally inappropriate. Of course we can opt out and our child will be excluded.

This is one of those things that you ‘know’ is wrong but it’s difficult to pinpoint exactly why, isn’t it. I think rather than us coming up with reasons for them not to do it, they should be providing a reason as to why it’s necessary.

If under more normal times you were to suggest putting up a viewing gallery in all the classrooms where parents could watch not only their own kid in class but everyone else’s, you’d need some serious justification for that to fly. The pressure on kids would be enormous, and it’s no-one’s business how children other than their own are doing. This is no different.

The purpose of recording the lessons is to share them with parents

Again, why?

and for the lesson to be accessible if a child has not attended the lessons.

Then the focus needs to be on the teacher not the kids, n’est-ce pas?

my wife works in a private school and all her online lessons need to be recorded for child safety reasons apparently.

I`m less keen on ‘distribute to any adult with a school-given email address’ though if it was my kid. i dont mind the kid being recorded and put on a file somewhere but distribution to others – no

If I lived in the Middle East I might not be happy with my kid inadvertently telling the wider public that Daddy went out to that funny cafe and got drunk again last night.

Its the distribution that worries me, every sicko on the planet might cotton on. Sad, but thats the fear of all parents. Weiro perv gets to know the kids names and their likes and dislikes etc.

Sadly I know someone like that, he worked in schools. He got found out, prosecuted etc, had no job for ages (serves him right), neighbours all hate him and want him jailed forever. Changed his name to get off public records, Court Service wont publish any information even though he’s guilty and sentenced. I’d chop his goolies off.

Its the distribution that worries me, every sicko on the planet might cotton on.

“every sicko” with a school-provided email address.

Which is a problem in itself. That’s not restricting anyone to their kids’ classes, it’s access to everything.

As a society we seem to be struggling with things like this. As many have said it seems wrong but cant quite put their finger on it.

But at the same time most people are happy to share everything on Social Media and either dont care or dont know just how much of their online lives is being recorded via their phones / PC / tablet.

Everytime they like something or buy something or search for something, look at something, its all recorded and used. Nevermind everyone who has a Siri/Google thing at home listening to them. Plus all the CCTV cameras etc.

We cant opt out of this stuff in any practical meaningfull way.

We cant opt out of this stuff in any practical meaningfull way.

It’s really not that hard, install a chrome extension and ignore social media – really people just do not care.

My kid (aged 4) does not have an online presence. No pictures on Facebook, no shared pictures from the school play, no pictures on the school’s online prospectus etc etc. We live in this strange world where people are losing out on jobs because of what they wrote on Twitter a decade ago when they were in school. What about in 15 years time when your kid is applying for a job, but there’s a clip online of him aged 13 getting into a schoolyard tussle with a kid of colour or saying something a bit risqué in class (as edgy teenagers like to do)?

It’s not something the children need or want, and I don’t think it’s something the parents particularly want. Why are we recording every facet of children’s lives?

TLDR: I think it’s entirely reasonable to be irritated by this – I would be too.

Trimix

As a society we seem to be struggling with things like this. As many have said it seems wrong but cant quite put their finger on it.

But at the same time most people are happy to share everything on Social Media and either dont care or dont know just how much of their online lives is being recorded via their phones / PC / tablet.

Everytime they like something or buy something or search for something, look at something, its all recorded and used. Nevermind everyone who has a Siri/Google thing at home listening to them. Plus all the CCTV cameras etc.

We cant opt out of this stuff in any practical meaningfull way.

This ^

Superficial

We live in this strange world where people are losing out on jobs because of what they wrote on Twitter a decade ago when they were in school. What about in 15 years time when your kid is applying for a job, but there’s a clip online of him aged 13 getting into a schoolyard tussle with a kid of colour or saying something a bit risqué in class (as edgy teenagers like to do)?

It’s not something the children need or want, and I don’t think it’s something the parents particularly want. Why are we recording every facet of children’s lives?

But they aren’t they are just recording online lessons.

Cougar

If under more normal times you were to suggest putting up a viewing gallery in all the classrooms where parents could watch not only their own kid in class but everyone else’s, you’d need some serious justification for that to fly.

But there is nothing preventing a parent looking over the shoulder or doing a screen recording anyway.

Again, why?

and for the lesson to be accessible if a child has not attended the lessons.

Then the focus needs to be on the teacher not the kids, n’est-ce pas?

Not really, I assume they are trying to recreate the classroom as close as possible for all the kids. According to the OP they are all 100% remote… and this appears to be to facilitate a more normal experience, even if it does catch Jonnhy picking his nose?

Erm, as a teacher at a British school in the ME I should probably reply here…

No, without your permission, country dependent, this is probably highly illegal.

We record all online Zoom class and 121 sessions for safeguarding but only with parental permission. If parents don’t give permission then they can’t access the learning.

Some class wide zooms are recorded so other children can catch up but again no permission, fine, but the session still goes ahead without you.

They are private sessions and not shared externally.

Recording you anyway, with without permission isn’t right. Culturally, ME counties are very strict about recording people on video without permission. It’s a big deal.

The stick to wield if they do it without your permission is to report them to the relevant ministry.

However, and a big however is….

What’s your problem? Recording sessions for safeguarding and to let those who can’t attend live is a good thing, no? If you were at my school you’d just be left without the live video option. You’d probably get a recorded video of the other kids in the class having a fun online class to torture yours with, at a push.

Schools are trying their best and safety and access are priorities. Don’t make it harder for them.

Why is It necessary to record teachers or pupils? The thing about “who do you think is interested or watching” is a red herring. The point it once its recorded and out there its out there forever and could be used at any point for any purpose that you might not like. People are giving consent to stuff all the time they may live to regret. People have put stuff on the web innocently in the past that has come back to bite them. So I don’t want anything put out there no matter how seemingly harmless it might be at the time. I don’t even like other people putting pictures of my kids up on their Facebook feed. What makes them think they have the right to put up pictures of my kids onto their FB feed without consulting me first? I don’t know who their friends are, what their security settings are etc. OK that cat is already out of the bag but look at the chaos social media has caused and the peoples lives that have been ruined by it.

Like it our not your digital footprint is important and can come back to bite you in so many ways you cannot even begin to anticipate all the possible scenario’s. So no I wouldn’t be happy especially since it serves no purpose that is beneficial to the education, safety or wellbeing of my child. Why….just why? I don’t see why any parent would give consent without a compelling purpose? And even then take the video but don’t share it widely and once it has served the purpose for which it was originally intended destroy it.

People are giving consent to stuff all the time they may live to regret.

If they give consent it can be withdrawn at any time. The problem is people are asking for consent when its not the most appropriate lawful basis for processing.

Example from this week being fridges don’t make things cold because there’s no such thing as cold.

Woah! Back up there! Say what?

@morecashthandash

I think he’s probably talking about heat being the presence of energy, but cold being the absence. Fridges remove heat, they don’t add cold. You can make a microwave that beams energy into an object, but you can’t make a freeze ray that beams cold into it.

A somewhat counterintuitive implication is that freezing is an exothermic process. In order for water to turn to ice, it has to emit heat, so the surroundings become warmer when ice forms, for example in hailstorms.

I actually understand that now 👍