It’s win win for Erdogan, he gets to feign outrage at the killing of a journalist (when he has disappeared plenty of his own dissidents)

Plus he gets to damage MBS, who he hates & Trump, who hes hated ever since the Muslin ban & especialy after forcing him to release that pastor that saw the Americans squeezing the Lira & taking turkey close to an economic crisis.

Meanwhile if this is true (& turkey apparently have surveillance of the Saudi embassy pretty well covered) & they release a recording of this phone call, MBS (& Trump/Kushner) in more trouble.

Pro-govt Turkish newspaper Yeni Safak says when Khashoggi entered Saudi consulate, Crown Prince Muhammed bin Salman rang him personally & asked him to go to Riyadh. Khashoggi refused. Within seconds of putting the phone down, his butchering & murder began. Devastating if true.

— John Simpson (@JohnSimpsonNews) October 21, 2018

We are heading for a new world record in the number of times an official version of events can change.

Making the GRU look like a bunch of professionals.

Relevant joke:

Turkish prisoner to prison librarian: “Have you got this book?”

Librarian: “No, but we’ve got the author”

he gets to feign outrage at the killing of a journalist

I am not sure it is feigned. At least one report said the two were acquainted and even without that I would guess any self respecting dictator wants to be the only one abducting and murdering dissidents in their own country.

I was quite surprised when I realised how much Levantine Arabs (Lebanon, Syria, Iraq, Jordan) hate Gulf Arabs, especially Emiratis and Saudis. It all goes back to before oil,

Indeed. All the way back to the death of the original god-bothering paedophile and the argument about who would succeed him as heading up the stupid superstition. Sunnis hate Shias and Shias hate Sunnis. Same old dreary reason for conflict all about absolutely nothing.

Religion.

some choice for the “rogue” hit squad, beheading or life in a turkish jail (wonder how much has changed since midnight exress ? )

Sunnis hate Shias and Shias hate Sunnis

It all started going wrong for Sunni and Shi-ah after the release of their fifth album ‘All I ever need is you’ in 1971.

A lot of people seem to be saying “Turkey are also total shitbags and they are playing it for their advantage”. And of course they are. But the thing is, Saudi are the shitbags that can do no wrong, that we arm and empower and allow to sponsor terrorism. It’s not about a Turkey vs Saudi shitbagularity contest, it’s about what we do with relation to either, and both.

How crap are the Saudi secret service though? Having to 1, buy a saw right before murdering somebody and 2, having a disguise that was purchased from a fancy dress store. Where did they train, chuckle vision?

Even  worse than the Salisbury Russian !

Yeah, but Ankara has a lovely clock tower.

It’s not about a Turkey vs Saudi shitbagularity contest, it’s about what we do with relation to either, and both.

If we stopped dealing with nations that are shitbags or ones that don’t abduct or imprison without trial the list is pretty short and we recently told most of them to F off…

this type of thing happens all the time. Journalists critical of authoritarian regime gets murdered. What is so special about this guy. I can understand from his bio and experience why he upset the Saudi royal family but not so sure about all the international outrage compared to the Russians murdering some people in the UK.

What is the expected gain for anyone? The regime won’t suddenly become tolerant and western. If the West pushes Saudi closer to Russia or China is that beneficial?

turkey just keeps drip-feeding leaks to keep this in the news & undermine any statement the Saudis make

MIND BOGGLING STUFF

•Saudi Crown Prince’s Advisor Al Qahtani was beamed into a room of the consulate via Skype.
•Insulted at Khashoggi over the phone.
• Turkish intel source: At one point Qahtani told his men to dispose of him. "Bring me the head of the dog",

(Reuters)

— Ragıp Soylu (@ragipsoylu) October 22, 2018

What is so special about this guy. I can understand from his bio and experience why he upset the Saudi royal family but not so sure about all the international outrage compared to the Russians murdering some people in the UK.

differences:

Russia:

we impose sanctions
we expel their diplomats
we don’t sell them weapons
we start cracking down on the oligarchs in London
USA passes a new law to sanction them
Prince William might not have gone to the world cup
etc

Iran:

They get put on THE AXIS OF EVIL
Sanctioned out the wazoo
we arm all their neighbours
etc

Saudi Arabia:

we don’t sanction them
we supply all the weapons they can eat
we invite them for official visits to meet the queen
we kiss their arses all over town

there are loads of shitbaggy countries yes, and frankly I doubt Putin is going to be quaking in his boots at our  terrifying sanctions. But part of the British / USA / Western self-mythologising is that we don’t ally ourselves with the type of people who (publicly) do this type of thing.

Personally I think Saudi Arabia can get in the sea, but we still need to condemn this shit.

It all started going wrong for Sunni and Shi-ah after the release of their fifth album ‘All I ever need is you’ in 1971.

Oh, well done sir! Took me a second or two, though! 👏🏻🤣

Saudi Arabia:

we don’t sanction them
we supply all the weapons they can eat
we invite them for official visits to meet the queen
we kiss their arses all over town

We we have a pretty shocking history in the Middle East. The Saudis haven’t changed what they have been doing for generations yet we have been friendly to them. We don’t really need to as oil is plentiful recently, we have military bases nearby but not in the country, we sell them some stuff but have to pay huge bribes..

Government is about continuing the country which involves dealing which undesirables. while the moral aspect is right and I think most people would agree on a personal level, if fuel jumps in price convictions fall away pretty fast.

Turkey are using this to influence the war in Yemen. I just struggle to see what the desired outcome is for the USA/UK. we are on the side (providing logistics and equipment) of the Saudis in Yemen…

Are we just looking to be seen as moral before we go back to business as usual?

We are reacting, that is all, I’m 100% certain that UK gov want it all to blow over asap so we can continue selling them weapons, with a clean conscience 🙄

Erdogan is using this for maximum leverage

And he is extracting maximum revenge on Trump for the currency war

Gina Haspel flew into Ankara overnight – a sign of panic from Trump admin that MbS, who is the keystone of Trump's Middle East policy, is about to be implicated. Has she been able to talk Erdogan down? https://t.co/V5YrDpEn5e

— Bethan McKernan (@mck_beth) October 23, 2018

One of those situations where you know someone is lying to you, and they know that you know that they are lying to you, but you both nod and smile at each other . . . .

OK, this instance might seem to be “complimentary-bullshitting”on a grand scale, but in relation to the amount of power held by the people involved, it’s not really. We’re talking about people who can “make people disappear” any day of the week . . .and probably have done.

I am sure the Saudi don’t lie to Trump. They know that he can’t do nothing about it.