For ****’s sake. Please can someone divert this conversation away from talk about investment and the dire state of the NHS and working life in general.

Couldn’t agree more.
I was planning on retiring last month having recently turned 60.
The reason I’ve put it off until mid Feb is due to not being sure what travel restrictions would be in place, & no confidence in those chancers in Downing street changing things whilst I’m away.I had planned to go back to Nepal this week for 6 weeks trekking…
I’l be finishing mid Feb,travel restrictions or not & I’m looking forward to it.
I currently work 4 on 4 off & I have no problem filling my days,can’t see me being bored when I finish.
Two tales from the canal bank last Winter.
1) It’s lockdown a nice midwinters day & I go for a walk,I get talking to someone in the canalside beer garden of a pub that’s closed due to the lockdown.We keep our distance & have a chat he tells me that he’s retired a few months earlier age 62 & despite the lockdown he’s loving it & can’t wait for eveything to open up so he can enjoy retirement even more.Not regretted it for a minute,however he says that his wife retired 5 years ago & just spends all day watching television,that’s no good.I told him I was planning on going in September & a few things that I do,he said go for it,you won’t be bored.
2) Lovely late Winter/ early Spring day & I’m down the canal again.It’s roughly mid day & this bloke’s packing up his fishing gear,we exchange pleasantries & he goes on to tell me that he loves it down here,in fact he’s never away from the place.He goes fishing 3 times most weeks & rides his bike along the tow path as far as Appleby Bridge or even Gathurst about 12 miles away.When he tells me this I ask,’Don’t you work then’? He says,no mate I retired a couple of years back.Turns out he’s 58,retired at 56,he was a shop fitter went into work one day,decded there & then that he’d had enough & finished.He said he was fishing at first light,had a great morning,it had cost him 3 rounds of bread for the breadcrumb bait he was using & 5 miles each way in petrol for his car.I told him I’m finishing soon age 60 & he says I should have gone at 55!
He reckoned the hardest part of the process was actually retiring.
I had a meeting with the financial advisor a few months ago,she did the sums,my outgoings, as expected were less than £1100 a month plus holidays.

I want people telling us about how they fill their later years with joy and fulfilment. How they wish they’d done it earlier. How little money they actually need.

I retired in march. My income will be ( until I am 60) £8000 pa

MY plans and sums got rather buggered due to my partner dying

I have no mortgage and have a chunk of capital ( lump sums from pensions / my dead partners pensions)

I can easily live on the £8000 pa – I do not have expensive tastes. I do not own a car and am not materialistic at all

My chunk of capital will be used to pay for expensive trips ie next winter I am going to go to the Yukon for 3 months. I know people there. the air fares will come out of my capital, I will easily be able to live on my income

the following summer will be spent cycling around europe for several months. Again I will do this out of my income and should have no need to tap into the capital

While I am out of the country for long periods I intend to holiday let my flat – getting up up to the high standard I want will come out of the capital but then the income from rentals will be used to top up my capital funds. rinse and repeat for as many trips as possible

As above plans got somewhat buggered otherwise I would have been away to south america this autumn/winter.

But “cutting your cloth according to your means” means that for example the South america trip would be done on local public transport and staying in cheap accommodation not using expensive tour companies and accomodation aimed at westeners

cycling around europe next summer means cyling not flying, camping not hotels and cooking for myself not eating out

Its perfectly possible to enjoy a good adventurous retirement on a small income.

Its perfectly possible to enjoy a good adventurous retirement on a small income

With respect I think that is far easier to do when you have a house and capital as backup. I am trying to advise an elderly relative at the moment who lives on her state pension and has close to nothing in savings. Even though she lives frugally, every time she has an extra bill – boiler breakdown, washing machine packs up etc, it sets her back really badly. She can only spare £10 or £20 here and there and that takes an awful lot of months to cover the £500 boiler repair.

If she had a backup pot, this would remove that stress and give her options.

Hooli – I totally agree – I am in a very lucky position in many ways ( though Id rather have my partner alive and have a much smaller capital pot – her death led to much of the capital coming my way)

Just trying to demonstrate that it is possible to live fine on a much smaller amount than £33000 pa

Well I’ve taken the next step and signed up with an estate agent to sell my house – going to be moving to the Rhondda valley (as in the moving to Wales thread).

Probably play some golf with my mate in Caerphilly but will be biking an awful lot more than at present as the obviously hills are right outside the house and it is about a 14 mile cycle to Afan. Try and get some fitness back before it is too late…

Not planning on buying any more bikes for a while – I have a few Turner mtbs (inc one for the girlfriend) that should last a while, and a Tripster, although I might fit CYC X1 Stealth ebike motors to two of them.

Mix it up with some walking in the Beacons, etc.

Big sports center across the road and a Bowls club for when I get older.

Girlfriend works in care so plenty of jobs around for her.

Based on my keeping track of my expenditure for the last 3 months and banging up a decent spreadsheeet to manage everything easily, my expenditure should be WAY less than when I was employed.

I think for people on here the articles in the press about how much you will need to retire on are not applicable – if you are primarily an outdoors person your entertainment costs are going to be a lot less.

Now we’re talking 🙂

I mentioned it a while back but one of the most useful things I did was to “shape” my spending over several years (actually done it until my wife receives her state pension which is the last significant financial event for us, that we can predict!)

I finished in July but not sure yet if I am between jobs or retired. I was an IT director and although I generally enjoyed it it is not a job you can easily just do part time. It can be a bit consuming so you are either in or out. At the moment I don’t think I have the enthusiasm to enter that field again and the danger is that I actually have just about enough to live a good lifestyle now without working (Mrs Surfer works and wants to carry on for a bit longer yet) and as I have said before (I was 57 last week) it is about stages of retirement. I run, cycle and walk as much as I can and want to do more of that. In 10 years time I will receive my state pension but for the next 3 or so years I will draw heavily on my SIPP/ISA but then our outgoings reduce significantly. The “4%” rule wont work for me if I go now so the next few years looks more like:

7%
6%
5%
5%
6%
4% for 4 years then 1% forever

There is risk that taking larger amounts earlier erodes the capital but assuming overall 4% growth pa means that by year 11 my savings will actually start to grow again and by the time I am 71 will be larger than they are now.

I can only do this by remaining invested in equities (I also have a couple of DB pensions) which of course brings its own risk.

I applied to Prince Albert Angling Society in May 2020 knowing there was a 2 year waiting list but I had my acceptance email through this week so I’m getting ready for a bit of winter fishing. I’ve got Hatchmere (Delamere) on my doorstep so I can pop out for an hour or so with the spinning rod and try and get into the pike. I can also be on the Dee at Farndon in 20 minutes or further upstream at Erbistock or Llangollen for some fly fishing. Great hobby for clearing your mind.

i just need to find some more cycling buddies as the ones I usually ride with are still working.

We’ve just come back from 2 nights in North Wales as the weather looked settled so we booked a last minute midweek break.

Don’t miss working one bit.

I’m just trying to work out whether I’m between jobs, semi-retired or fully retired.

I have basically climbed loads since my last contract ended – great for my mental state but it’s simultaneously building and destroying my body. I live in one of the best bouldering areas in the country ( 10 mins to Caley and Shipley Glen, 30 minutes to Almscliff, 40 to Brimham) and loads of bouldering gyms within 30 minutes. I have become obsessed with pushing my grades now I’ve got the time!!

I may ease back on that a bit and do more on the bikes and hiking.

I also am learning the guitar. In the past I’ve painted to a reasonable amateur standard, but got out of the habit – partly lack of space with two home offices – should really get back into that

If I decide I am actually retired I will take up some part time voluntary work ( I’ve already got a few weeks lined up) as I like the structure of having a job

I’m terms of money – I think is dependent on what you spend and what commitments you have. Paid off mortgage and no responsibility for kids make it much easier to cut cloth accordingly. Also having savings for unforseen costs as mentioned above really helps. As does budgeting. I’ve been tracking monthly spend for over a decade – including depreciation on vehicles – and so have a really good handle of what I spend.

Prince Albert Angling Society

Made my eyes water…

I’m just trying to work out whether I’m between jobs, semi-retired or fully retired.

Ditto – I retired from my last job in July @ 55 (got fed up with fighting the short-sighted corporate ethos), but haven’t yet put my pension into payment. I’m doing a few odds & sods for my previous employer which is keeping the wolf from the door for now. It still feels like a holiday at the moment.

For ****’s sake. Please can someone divert this conversation away from talk about investment and the dire state of the NHS and working life in general.

It’s been just over a year since I asked “Retirement: what’s it really like?” and just under a year since I retired. Covid has meant that I’ve been slightly less adventurous than I had hoped but overall it’s been good and I don’t regret it at all. I’ve walked a lot, cycled a lot, and fixed up a load of things around the house and garden. When not completely locked down I’ve really enjoyed my days volunteering for the local Wildlife Trust. I’m probably fitter than I’ve ever been, certainly faster on the road bike than ever before. The one thing I regret and will try to change is that I spend far too much time on here, with the result that I haven’t read as many books as I’d hoped.

The money side has been fine – probably Covid helps with that as it has reduced opportunities to spend, but I think we’ll be OK even when the pandemic is over. As many have said, if you have paid off the mortgage and your children are independent, you really don’t need much to live on. I’m very lucky in that I have a pretty good DB pension that kicked in when I was 60, which means that I haven’t had to touch either savings or my SIPP.

Prince Albert Angling Society

Made my eyes water…

Yes, I’m not looking forward to the initiation ceremony.

Another thing about retirement I’ve found is the weather is not as crap as I thought it was, and quite often you get a day that is rubbish in the morning and good in the afternoon (or vice versa) so you can shape your day accordingly.

a day that is rubbish in the morning and good in the afternoon (or vice versa) so you can shape your day accordingly

Definitely this. If you look out the window and see some unexpected sunshine, you can just get a bike out and ride. I have loved the freedom to do that.

Two weeks to work before retiring on the first of December; looking forward to it greatly. 😁😁

got to agree with the weather thing.
after 37 years of cycle commuting, inc nights and shift, the weather was a proper bastard sometimes. having to set off at 5am in winter icy rain was the worst.

now i wait for the rain to stop and then go out.

I am 5-6 years away yet, by then mortgage/car will be paid, eldest 22 so hopefully starting to earn, youngest 18. But then I start thinking…..ok 18yr old may need a few years uni funding, our house will be 25yrs old so may need a few bits doing (eg kitchen) etc so maybe I need to work another few years to pay this etc. In all honesty, I hate my job but can stick it out for 5 years as I see the end in sight, not so sure I want to do another 8+ but may need to financially. My biggest fear is stepping off the treadmill of a well paid job……let’s see where I am at in 5 years time.

I’m loving reading your stories. I’m 42 so a few years off yet but I’m interested in what planning and prep you did, especially if you retired at 50-55.

I have ~15 years left on a mortgage but can overpay, 2 kids @10 and 12 and a few investments and pensions here and there. What are the big decisions you made? What went well for you and what would you have done differently?

thanks!

I had a meeting with the financial advisor a few months ago,she did the sums,my outgoings, as expected were less than £1100 a month plus holidays.

I guess it’s really linked to how much you earned when working and whether you’re on your own etc. For us, after a lifetime of each of us earning probably +3x average wages no way would we want to have to live on so little. TBH my OH probably spends somewhere near that on her horses…

Mid-50’s and we’ve postponed retirement, waiting for Covid/Brexit to ‘settle’ – purely due to both working from home for the considerable future, uncertain short-term finances (for the UK) and the main reason is that while we’re both earning very good money and can still do everything outside of work we want/need to – why not. Next step will be reduced days per month.

We are ‘lucky’ though, as we’ve always put into pensions and will have a good income, whenever we decide to take them (60 at the latest).

Ditto – I retired from my last job in July @ 55 (got fed up with fighting the short-sighted corporate ethos), but haven’t yet put my pension into payment. I’m doing a few odds & sods for my previous employer which is keeping the wolf from the door for now. It still feels like a holiday at the moment.

With respect, you’ve not ‘retired’, you’ve changed jobs.

Deary me.

What went well for you and what would you have done differently?

What went well

Transferred to a private fund – income is variable, and wife gets 100% of pension when I pop my clogs. When she goes, the money is still there for other people to fight over. Company pension gave fixed income (plus inflation) and 60% to the wife, and the fund died when we were both gone

What would I have done differently

Set the ball rolling earlier than I did for the pension transfer, it can take a couple of months

Put more money into the pension.

Colleagues that put in extra (can’t remember how much, but it wasn’t poverty inducing) had a decent amount of tax free lump sum available more than me, circa £20k more IIRC

Id say work out what you actually need in retirement, budget wise. Working extra years to boost a pot more than you need, you will never get back.

Biggest problem is figuring out how long you’ll live. I could pop my clogs tomorrow, never touching a penny of my pension, but there’s something like a 3% chance I’ll live to 100, which is 50 years away….

Id say work out what you actually need in retirement, budget wise. Working extra years to boost a pot more than you need, you will never get back.

Lend us your crystal ball…

For ****’s sake. Please can someone divert this conversation away from talk about investment and the dire state of the NHS and working life in general.

I want people telling us about how they fill their later years with joy and fulfilment. How they wish they’d done it earlier. How little money they actually need.

Okay here you go then. We retired a few years ago at 52. We had missed out on lots of holidays etc when we were young in order to finance early retirement (a couple of nice redundancies helped too). Not doing the “live for today” thing when we were younger was a gamble, but a calculated one and it’s paid off big time. The advantage now is we can afford to do the holidays we missed out on, and also do them for longer eg we spent a month in France and Germany in our van a couple of years ago, and planning a month in Canada next summer. We’re quite happy in cheapish accommodation (it’s a just a bed to crash on for the night) so longer holidays aren’t much more than shorter ones.

It also reduces the number of flights we will take, which admittedly is something we’ve only started to think about in recent years. And in fact having more time means we’ve been doing more by train rather than plane. And as going by train is so much more enjoyable than flying it’s a win win.

Covid has put things on hold obviously, but we’re just home from a few weeks down on the south coast spending time visiting assorted friends and family down that way. Very laid back, relaxed trip. Great catching up with people in real life, plus plenty days in-between to just chill and wander around.

I can hand on heart genuinely say I’m happier now than at any time in my life. Retired five years and haven’t been bored for a single second.

Oh and we bought bodyboards last summer so get to behave like daft teenagers in the water!!

Lend us your crystal ball…

This! Someone up ^ there gets by on ~£13k per year, the recent nonsense articles talk about £31k for a ‘comfortable’ lifestyle.

For people like kennyp who retired in early 50s – are you living on savings and investments now, before your pension kicks in? Did you pick a £number you could afford to live on and divide by the number of years you think you’re likely to live?!

The transfer to private fund makes perfect sense btw! Hadn’t heard that before.

Only you can work out how much you want/need in retirement. Personally, I’m planning my pot to last until 90, as I will always have my RAF pension & State pension to fall back on.

We are both in good jobs with decent pension provision, so fully aware our position is better than many. 60 is our target, but if investments perform well, that could come forward a few years. My job has an incremental pay scale, so my best earning years are just prior to retirement, which makes staying working longer an easy option. I am already 50% part time, so taken the first steps on the path…

For people like kennyp who retired in early 50s – are you living on savings and investments now, before your pension kicks in? Did you pick a £number you could afford to live on and divide by the number of years you think you’re likely to live?!

We had planned to go mid-fifties, but redundancies and some other stuff allowed us to bring that forward a bit. We reckon that our life expectancy is probably mid-80s, though obviously who knows what lies ahead. We also reckon that from mid-70s onwards our expenditure will drop dramatically (I know, care home fees etc etc but would much rather have fun now) so basically plan to live well (without being silly) for the next quarter century, then see where we are.

The transfer to private fund makes perfect sense btw! Hadn’t heard that before.

Be very, very, very wary of this. We transferred out our DB schemes and into SIPPs and it’s worked very well, but both worked in financial services for a long time and comfortable enough with the pros and cons, plus have plenty contacts. It can be a great thing but give it an awful lot of thought before you do. In most situations it’s far better to stick with your existing pension. The general advice is don’t.

The general advice is don’t.

Not sure if that was the point being made. I understood it as being move your DC pensions to a SIPP, which in my view is good advice. Ref moving DB pensions, this is quite tricky now given the mis-selling that has gone on but I would say often it would be prudent to transfer them also, assuming you are very careful and understand the implications fully.

To use me as an example. I have an old DB pension that is worth around £250k (I cant get the exact figures so this is an estimate based on the benefits) I will get a lump sum of around £30-40k tax free then receive around £400 per month for life. I would have to live around another 40+ years to get my moneys worth. In reality I would rather add the £250,000 to my SIPP and pay myself around another £1000 per month for the next 25 years. I am 57, in 25 years I will be 82 (or dead) and much less active and likely living comfortably on a fraction of what I would like to live on now. Having “large” amounts of income in later life is a waste.

In some ways DB schemes are almost as restrictive as annuities (which were the biggest scam ever) and it pains me to say it but thank goodness for pension freedoms…

as annuities (which were the biggest scam ever)

They really weren’t.

It’s simply that people don’t realise how difficult it is to guarentee a set income each month for life from a lump sum, given you don’t know how long you’ll live and have no control over the stock markets.

For every annuity where the insurance company made a profit as the recipient died early there is one where the recipient lived longer than average and they probably made a loss.

It’s simply that people don’t realise how difficult it is to guarentee a set income each month for life from a lump sum

They didnt get the opportunity do try. People were forced to take annuities and the market was uncompetitive and stacked in favour of the actuaries. With consideration to inflation, spousal benefits etc the annual income from each £100k was derisory and forced many people to work right up until they were to receive their state pension.

If they are so good will you be taking one?

Id say work out what you actually need in retirement, budget wise

or conversely decide when you want to retire and then adjust your spending accordingly?

In some ways DB schemes are almost as restrictive as annuities (which were the biggest scam ever) and it pains me to say it but thank goodness for pension freedoms…

Hmm, takes a look at one of my DB schemes with it’s inflation linked minimum 5% pa uplift…, and the others have equivalent uplifts and spouse pensions.

And looking at my Mum, she’s +20 years into her DB pension and 5 years getting the spouse 2/3 from my Dad (he got 20 years before passing). My MIL got 5 years of 2/3 from my late FIL, who’d had his running for +25 years too. All guaranteed, no depending on investments etc.

My granny probably had the best, 40 years of her DB pension and 35 years of my Grandads’ 2/3.

Personally I’ll leave my DB’s where they are and just have my DC’s ‘exposed’.

or conversely decide when you want to retire and then adjust your spending accordingly?

That’s now my approach. I’m currently 40 and I’m hammering away what I can to my pension for the next 5 – 6 years, at that point I’ll switch to saving into ‘not a pension’ to give me money to bridge the gap from retiring somewhere in the region of 50-52 and getting access to the pension at 57. The 50-52 time window is the fixed point, the finances will be what they will be

With respect, you’ve not ‘retired’, you’ve changed jobs.

Well a pension from 55 might allow a change in direction. I have no desire to retire from “work”, because I enjoy science too much. It’s my passion, vocation an hobby. Taking my pension might allow a salary cut to do so elsewhere. Once I get the two dependents off the payroll! I’ve not looked at cashing in a DB, but it closes next year anyway, so makes decisions a little easier.

They didnt get the opportunity do try. People were forced to take annuities and the market was uncompetitive and stacked in favour of the actuaries.

The market had plenty of insurance companies competing with each other, so I’d say that was competetive. If it was such a rip off, it would have been easy for a new entrant to enter the market, under cut the others and clean up, yet that never happened.

If they are so good will you be taking one?

That’s a good question, to which I don’t know the answer.

The option of draw down carries plenty of risk and either requires someone to actively manage your portfolio for you (which will cost and only be applicable to large portfolios) or requires you to manage it yourself. The latter scenario, I would guess, is only of interest to a very small percentage of retirees.

Whilst having options is good, I personally think the recent pension freedoms are probably a bit too free and will end up with a lot of people running out of money early and/or being badly advised / defrauded of their nest eggs looking for better returns.

I personally think the recent pension freedoms are probably a bit too free and will end up with a lot of people running out of money early to being badly advised / defrauded of their nest eggs looking for better returns.

unfortunatly I think you are right and I know one person in that position.

unfortunatly I think you are right and I know one person in that position.

Being able to budget and also sit on a large nest egg avoiding temptation are two things which aren’t universally present in human nature!

The market had plenty of insurance companies competing with each other

Really? Its almost as if large financial institutions were in a “competitive” market, bless em.

That’s a good question, to which I don’t know the answer.

Its a bit different when you have a 7 figure pot.

Being able to budget and also sit on a large nest egg avoiding temptation are two things which aren’t universally present in human nature!

Totally agree but I dont think the only alternative is to be fleeced

And looking at my Mum, she’s +20 years into her DB pension and 5 years getting the spouse 2/3 from my Dad (he got 20 years before passing). My MIL got 5 years of 2/3 from my late FIL, who’d had his running for +25 years too. All guaranteed, no depending on investments etc.

My granny probably had the best, 40 years of her DB pension and 35 years of my Grandads’ 2/3.

Interesting and without knowing more detail its difficult comment other than your Gran had a fantastic innings and if she took her pension at 60 had a wonderful 40 years until she received her telegram from the Queen, outliving her peers life expectancy by up to 25 years!

The point is life expectancy (although improving) was far less years ago than it is today. Having a pension that pays out for life sounds wonderful until you die a handful of years after taking it. My father retired at 64 and died at 72.

Having a pension that pays out for life sounds wonderful until you die a handful of years after taking it. My father retired at 64 and died at 72.

But basing your judgement on an outlier case is also rather unwise, 81 is the current average male life expectancy in the UK.

I’m 50 and apparently have a 3% chance of reaching 100. Do I want to be trading shared at 90 in FB’s metaverse (or whatever share trading looks like in 40 years time) – probably not.