I’m scoping out a new bike purchase in the Ti gravel vein, probably from a UK firm (but I live in Canada). Canadian customs charges are such that a full bike (built including all parts) attracts significantly more duty and taxes than if it’s in bits. I asked about getting it without the wheels, got an answer that “we’re required by law to provide a fully built bike”.

…which is a new one to me… Anyone run into this before?

The same company had zero answer to a question about sizing, so I’m inclined to write off their whole ‘customer service’ experience and tell them to stuff it.

I suspect they have contracts with shimano/SRAM/etc that they will only sell bits they supply as part of a complete, built, bike. ‘by law’ is a little OTT if that is the case but I can see why they feel that way.

Could they not ship the parts and frame as separate consignments?
Lots of bike companies ship bikes form the manufacturing plants in the Far East this way, for exactly the import duty reasons you state.

“we’re required by law to provide a fully built bike”.

Just ask them which Law ?
🤔

You’ve asked for something and for whatever reason they’ve declined.

Who’s next on your list?

If it’s a UK supplier you’ve asked, the law would be The Pedal Bicycles (Safety) Regulations 2010. s5 doesn’t say they can’t supply an unassembled bike, only places some conditions on that.

But as Onzadog says, if they don’t want to sell it to you, they don’t need a reason.

Could they not ship the parts and frame as separate consignments?

Pretty much what I thought I’d asked for, but it seems beyond their powers of comprehension. 🙁

You’ve asked for something and for whatever reason they’ve declined.
Who’s next on your list?

Yeah, I’m afraid that may be the answer

Comprehension LOL 😀

So you’ve found a bike that you consider buying and you want the company to screw the taxman on your behalf?

When was the last time you’ve bought the car from the dealer with the wheels secretly delivered by a man with a van?

Ford American do something like that with the Spanish built Transit Connects. They put passenger seats in them for import, as there is low tarrifs on cars (for now) and high on vans, then remove them for sale.

Get it sent to someone in Britain for them to break down and send to you? They could even send the bits as ‘presents’ or second hand parts, which they would be even cheaper?

The taxman doesn’t get screwed. It is completely legal to buy a whole bike and import parts. The logic behind the rule is so you don’t put bike builders in your country out of work. We are so far past that it is irrelevant.

If you get someone to buy it for you in the UK you have to pay the VAT. That is often worth more than the import duty.

Get it sent to someone in Britain for them to break down and send to you?

Then he’s paying the vAT.

Dont forget that by shpping outside of the EU you’ve already saved the 20% vat. The shipping, tax and duty on import wont be as much as the vat saved.

Fellow Canadian here. In the past year, I’ve imported two bikes from the United States. Both times I only paid the five percent federal GST (no provincial sales tax on bicycles and bike parts in British Columbia!).

Canada Border Services Agency’s Classification Number for complete bicycles is 8712.00.00.90. Duties from pretty much all countries of manufacture are now exempt from the 13 per cent tariff. The former Conservative government implemented this in either late 2014 or early 2015.

Check this document (it’s a very large pdf file) for the applicable duties and exemptions.
https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/trade-commerce/tariff-tarif/2019/01-99/01-99-t2019-1-eng.pdf

I suspect the issue is that the bikes are coming from Taiwan (or wherever) fully boxed/assembled (with bars twisted round) and that is how they go out from the UK dealer. To send them out as knock down kits would involve them taking a bike out of a box and repackaging it into multiple boxes.

I recently bought a Scott from a UK seller and that came more or less fully assembled in a sealed box.

A company that can’t answer a sizing or geometry question on a titanium bike (assuming they are pricey then) is poor form. Move to someone who wants your business

UK Import duties also differentiate between full bikes and components. I bought a fatbike from Alaska and that was packaged in two boxes – simply because the standard boxes weren’t large enough. It was one consignment but was still only taxed at the lower rate.

Canada Border Services Agency’s Classification Number for complete bicycles is 8712.00.00.90. Duties from pretty much all countries of manufacture are now exempt from the 13 per cent tariff. The former Conservative government implemented this in either late 2014 or early 2015.

Thanks SurreyBCRider, this is new to me. I’ve gone through that doc a couple of times but can’t work out what Most Favoured Nation actually means for tariffs on a bike originating in the UK.

As for other points, I’m happy to pay Canadian tax on the bike, and I’m not even that bothered about VAT tbh. There aren’t any Canadian makers of decent Ti gravel bikes, so it’s not like there are local jobs disappearing as a result of my buying in the UK.

I suspect the issue is that the bikes are coming from Taiwan (or wherever) fully boxed/assembled (with bars twisted round) and that is how they go out from the UK dealer.

Really good point – that’s probably the crux of it!

https://nakedbicycles.com/the-bikes/x

Of course that’s neither cheap nor quick (I think the wait time is pretty long….)

Would an Alpkit Camino Ti do? If the standard sizes/Geo don’t suit you can pay a bit extra for custom. They are all built to spec and frames are sold separately.

maybe they don’t ship internationally much and it’s too hard/annoying/expensive to sort out a courier.

Have a word with Andy at Stooge Cycles and see if he can sort you out.

Enigma would be happy to sell you a bike without wheels. VAT free export no problem. We can help with sizing too!

I suspect the issue is that the bikes are coming from Taiwan (or wherever) fully boxed/assembled (with bars twisted round) and that is how they go out from the UK dealer.

I dunno. Most bike shops claim to check wheels for true/loose spokes and verify all other components are properly adjusted before reboxing and delivering.
I know one does because they put another customer’s 27.5+ wheels in my road bike box.

Dell (amongst others) import very large servers and SANs that would attract massive duty from the US into the UK. So on the customs forms they come in as “Computer software media” which attracts a much lower rate. Just happens that the software is stored on a very large box of electronics costing tens of thousands of pounds. Its exactly the same for all “british made” MGs and what now constitutes a London taxi which are all just Chinese cars in kit form to circumvent import tariffs. Splitting a bike into frame and wheels is hardly a crucifiable offence.

Nico74 – I once phoned the Canadian customs folk. They were helpful. They may be able to answer any questions that you have.

As for the bike company, they probably only sell complete bikes so that is all they are set up to deal with.

Nico74. When you look at the CBSA document and the Description of Goods column, also check the far right column for the country code. Then cross-reference to the country list at the beginning of the document. The UK is classified as a CEUT country, thus exempt from duties.

You can also call them at 1-800-461-9999.

Have you looked at the Reilly Gradient, Mark would be happy to send you a part build or frame set?

There aren’t any Canadian makers of decent Ti gravel bikes,

Nicko, what about Knolly’s new Cache

Move to someone who wants your business

This

yep as Scottfizz. My company would also decline business from Canada as its a PITA we can do without to ship large expensive items internationally, deal with the insurance when it gets lost, various tax forms etc and then the customer decides it doesn’t suit them and want to send it back etc etc. If a company has plenty of business and can sell to someone in Surrey or someone in Ontario, I know what they would do!