Post viral fatigue

When not focusing on the symptoms was first mentioned, I thought it wouldn’t work because I was sure non of it was in my head, now I can see where you are coming from. It starts in your head (stress, anxiety etc), then becomes physical.

I’m not sure how to tackle the exercise problem. It makes me feel better and tired at the same time, but it stops me sleeping.

Maybe I am overdoing it?

HOw much exercise are you doing?? Time and intensity?

20 min in HR zone 2 between 124 – 156 bmp roughly. I been keeping it at the low end of that though. A few hours after I am properly knackered but can’t sleep.

I did that yesterday and last night was sleepless.

I’d say kick it back to 10mins perhaps twice a week with HR no higher than 140bpm.

If you are finding you are sleepless I’d say pull back on what you are doing or take some sleeping aids, as sleep is where you recover and repair. If that ain’t happening then you are going to proper knacker yourself

Thanks mate, I will give it a try, sounds reasonable.

How are you getting on?

Hey flow – good to have an update. 🙂 One thing I would question though is using an HRM – are you not putting pressure on yourself? FWIW I’ve always found that I sleep badly after exercise and have accepted it although wonder if nutrition has anything to do with it.

Not much to report here, another blood test next week then follow-up with GP who will no doubt increase my thyroxine. Mentally I find it tough having had 2.1/2 years of worsening health. If I’d been listened to in the first place, treatment would not be dragging on. Feel very angry with various GPs for just wanting to hand out ad’s – laziness on their part. 👿

Will have an MRI scan on my shoulder in a few weeks time (following bike accident).

Next year’s gotta be better!

Hey flow – good to have an update. One thing I would question though is using an HRM – are you not putting pressure on yourself?

Yeah might be taking it a bit serious using a HRM to be honest. Although the idea was to use it to keep within my limits, I have found when riding I became pretty set on staying in zone 2. Probably should be taking it even easier.

Sounds like your doctor is finally getting there!

Next year’s gotta be better!

You would think so, but I thought it wouldn’t get worse in 2010, then 2011 came and shafted me good and proper!

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/has-flow-done-a-runner

Surely given Flow’s general attitude on here and to most peoples threads… wouldn’t his answer to this kind of thread be on the lines of just MTFU?

So he’s maybe guilty of a bit of keyboard warrioring in the past. Bygones I say.

Post viral fatigue is no fun at all… flow, good luck with the recovery, hope things improve and you’re back to your best soon.

Ditto.

Double ditto

How did everyone cope at Xmas?

I found I got pretty tired from traipsing around supermarkets on 3 consecutive days. Managed to prepare and cook the Xmas dinner, my son had to take heavy dishes out of the oven (have separated shoulder injury). Felt quite exhausted by the evening.

Managed a couple of little rides before though. 8)

Can I just wish you all a return to good health during the coming year.

It really makes a huge difference being able to share experiences and encourage each other and do hope this thread continues.

Happy New Year. 🙂

From me too.

Yes, good health to EVERYONE in the New Year… I’m determined I’m not getting ill properly again, ever! I do still have the odd moment of weakness currently, but manage to get by reasonably well by reminding myself to back off occasionally as I can’t manage 100% of what I used to be able to.

I’ve had a cold for the past week, been nice to have a distraction.

Happy new year to everyone. I’m determined to beat this in 2012. going to be a good year 😉

Just thought I would post an update, cue another C_G rantette. 🙄

Got the result of latest blood test and apparently my levels are where they should be so don’t need to have medication (thyroxine) increased. Oh, said I, well I sure ain’t feeling any better cos blah blah blah! Fobbed off, yet again. 👿

Apparently it’s acceptable to become breathless walking up the stairs, shivering when it’s warm, hair falling out so much that I’m like a moulting dog, huge weight increase – have gone from size 10 to size 18, eyebrows fallen out completely, permanent brain fog, forgetting words and struggling to finish a sentence, sleeping for 10 hours plus other things that can’t be mentioned!

Apologies for banging on about this but people need to realise that some GPs/NHS just don’t have a bl**dy clue about thyroid disorders and prefer to treat people as idiots.

And breathe …

I’m surprised at the amount of comments on this thread about being given anti depressants, but then not acknowledging that the illness they have is depression ?!?

Depression is an awful thing and has an amazing affect on the human mind and body. Some years ago when I lost my job and had financial difficulties I started getting a constant cold, sore throat, aches and pains, having to sleep for hours on end etc etc. Got fed up of it so went to the docs. He couldnt find anything wrong, but asked about how I was getting on. After I said the above he suggested I could have some anti depressants. That was enough for me to knock me out of my self pity and to MTFU and get on with it. Regardless to say I my health soon improved.

I’m just recovering from Pneumonia, in fact 4 months in to recovering from Pneumonia. In this time I haven’t once been well enough to ride my bike. I can see how easy it would be to get depressed about it all, in fact to some extent I am I guess chasing a cause myself for why I dont feel 100% as I am awaiting the result of a chest Xray, but I know it will probably come back clear and I just need to start exercising slowly and accept it will take time.

I’m surprised at the amount of comments on this thread about being given anti depressants, but then not acknowledging that the illness they have is depression ?!?

Laziness obviously! Much easier than listening. I would dare to suggest that some people can eventually become clinically depressed due to not being taken seriously. The thyroid forum I use makes shocking reading where people have been ill for decades.

I’m not going to rely on the NHS to treat me for thyroid issues, thank goodness for the web and being able to do one’s own research.

The symptoms are the effect of your previous worrying, or residual stress. Brain fog is a classic anxiety symptom, its called depersonalisation or derealisation – can’t remember which, but it’s not important. The classic mistake is to think that these symptoms are the cause of how we feel, but in reality they are symptoms of your worrying and analysing.

I remember someone telling me once that the way you think affects you both physically and psychologically. Anxious sufferers then become scared, or afraid of the symptoms and analyse for their deeper meaning. But there is no deeper meaning except the constant analysis keeps you feeling the same way physically and psychologically.

Give up analysing and do non anxious things. Mayby antidepressants might give a kick start but you can recover without them as well.

Cinnamon – I wasn’t aiming my comments at you personally, or indeed at anyone else in general my Dad had Thyroid problems which took about a year to be worked out, luckily they have been now.

It was more people who have had a bad virus/ilness and some times do not realise they are falling in to depression which is an awful thing and cansome times manifest itself with physical symptoms. Whilst searching to a solution to all their problems, people should at least consider the fact that they may have depression.

Certainly if the GP puts you on anit depresants that should give you a big hint…

My past glimpse of depression was enough to keep me now trying to remain positive and avoid the initial falling in to depression, however it can be all too easy to fall in to depression without realising it or knowing you are suffering from it.

Perhaps not every illness can have a name attached to it? A continuous learning curve for the medical profession.

I do believe that ADs are being handed out a little too easily and naturally appointment time constraints have a lot to do with it.

Not everything is black and white after all and the appropriate tests for conditions are not necessarily being done.

For example, with an underactive thyroid a blood test is done from which there is only reading that GPs are interested in. If other things were looked at, ie certain vitamin deficiencies, ferratin levels, antibodies, then an accurate snapshot could be obtained.

Funky dunc – I totally disagree about the depression link to this. I’ve had it for 18months and I am far from depressed but still far from ill

Brain fog is a classic anxiety symptom, its called depersonalisation or derealisation – can’t remember which, but it’s not important.

May I disagree with this? Brain fog to me is very real – the loss/impairment of a cognitive function is not to be under-estimated. I now struggle to socialise as it’s easier to avoid people rather than forgetting words and chain of thought. Self-esteem has taken a real dive and self-confidence no longer exists.

The good news is that I am not alone, it’s a classic symptom of being hypothyroid and, thanks to the web, experiences can be shared.

Bushwacked – how are you doing?

CG – you sure it’s just your thyroid?

I’m OK, just been out on my BMX today for the first time in 15 months which felt good. Still got loads of problems to sortout but I’ve booked myself on for some specialist treatment with the Optimum Health Clinic that I’m really excited about..

Plus they’ve just released a paper about this condition which is receiving a good amount of positive feedback from the medical community. I’ve had a read and makes so much sense.

OHC RESEARCH PAPER

😆 @ BMX – I blame that jedi bloke. 😉

Had a quick look at that paper but will need to read it in small chunks. Saw the word thyroid mentioned though.

Good luck with your treatment and do report back. It’s been an incredibly frustrating time for you and I think one has to have one’s eyes open to other approaches.

As regards your question, well I have all the symptoms but, admittedly, they can apply to other conditions too. I’m going to be experimenting with other treatments/tweaking supplements as it’s obvious that I can’t rely on the NHS. Apart from fixing my shoulder separation of course. 😉

LOL! Yeah, its all Jedi’s fault!!!

The paper is a good read – doesn’t tell you how to combat it in great detail but fully backs up what I was starting to believe. Plus the case study relates to a ldy who had thyroid issues as part of her condition.

My view is that, to use a computer analogy, I caught a virus (My trigger was Swine Flu back in 2009) which corrupted some of the programming in my subconcious, and affects the bit which controls the chemicals in your body (HPA axis). (I looked into the effects of certain natural chemicals on the body when too many of them are released in to the blood over a period of time and it read like a list of my symptoms)

Once my body has successfully fought the virus, the coding was still corrupt. So even though I have healed and my blood tests say I’m fine, I am left with corrupt code which reacts at a subconcious level to stimuli and creates the physilogical effects. Problem is the medical profession, bless them, can’t test for this so they say its all OK and it must be depression. But so little is known about the interaction of the mind and body but they must interact somehow for the body to function.

I believe this is why every CFS case is slightly different but overall the same. Also why people sometimes get better when pacing, as you are gradually saying to the body that its OK to do a little extra, once you do a little more, you get used to it and then do a little more and gradually your body adapts over time and doesn’t see things as a stress. Where as going out and doing an hours ride from nothing, the body freaks out and says “what you doing!!??!!” and you relapse.

The big problem is I know I can ride a bike for a long time but try telling that to the part of my body which controls how I react at a subconsicous level!

Going for some specialist treatment in London tomorrow – very excited

Hi Bushwacked – can I wish you good luck tomorrow and please do report back. Presumably you will need more than one visit?

I’m actually feeling reasonably positive due to taking control of my situation. Am now supplementing my medication, substituting hormonal stuff and am trying to slowly eliminate gluten from my diet. The bread has almost finished. 🙁

Going really well so far, last day today 🙂

Relly good treatment course in London, it now makes totaal sense, now wheres my Megavalanche appliction form 😉

Hey good news Bushwacked. 8) Curious to hear more, if you care to divulge e-mail in profile!

Megavalanche? 😯

More info please, glad to hear you are doing well.

Hey flow – how are you doing?

Hi,

well, apart from the cold I caught off my friends kids I’ve been fine.

The treatment course is based around the maladaptive stress response and the way they explain it makes total sense – basically you are walking around in a constant stressed state – although you may not realise it due to feeling fine most of the time. Think of it like a frog put in boiling water will jump out, but if you put a frog in cold water and boil it up it won’t move – same with this – you gradually build up your levels so it feels normal but actually you are hyperstressed at a subconcious level.

The key areas they say are that

1. You are in a constant stressed state and this has become the norm – hence why you don’t recover after having a restful nights sleep.

2. Thought processes don’t help as they keep you in that stressed state which produces all the chemicals / hormones which cause the physilogical symptoms

3. The way to overcome it is calming the mind down and retraining the subconcious to react differently to bring that constant state of stress down over time to something normal.

Think of it like riding your bike at Max HR all the time rather than an average of 130-140bpm. Over time you’d burn out if your were always at MaxHR, but at 130-140bpm (which most people would ride at) you would be able to last for longer. So you have to adapt a different way to ride / think

Does that make any sense???

The best bit of the time spent with them was meeting other suffereres with different symptoms but all having the same condition. The differences made you realise that it was down to this stress response as you could see everyone’s anxiety about doing the wrong things, eating the wrongs things, over doing it etc. That was the biggest eye opener.

“Funky dunc – I totally disagree about the depression link to this. I’ve had it for 18months and I am far from depressed but still far from ill”

Your last post suggests that you are now dealing with stress, anxiety, depression problems surely ?!?!

Did I mention anything about Depression?

That was enough for me to knock me out of my self pity and to MTFU and get on with it. Regardless to say I my health soon improved.

Can I just say I think this is really unhelpful and misguided. Most of us have tried to MTFU many times and only ended up making the fatigue much worse. Suggesting that CFS is basically just self-pity is pretty insulting. Also, the fact that many people are being treated for depression to me indicates that GPs don’t really know what to do, and that having a debilitating illness causes depression, rather than the other way round.

Flow, sorry just picked up this thread and suffered from the same symptoms as yourself, are you still suffering? whats the latest?