Hi all, seeking a bit of advice about a situation which recently occurred.

A friend of mine does a self-employed teaching job which means he’s with children a lot of the time. The kids range from 8ish to 16+, as well as adults etc. He’s all DBS checked etc.

He’s been involved in putting on some special events, which has needed group get-togethers, with the kids spending a couple of hours in age/ability groups.

My 9y/o attended the first recently in a group of about eight, all of around the same age, and came back having thoroughly enjoyed himself.

However, some of the things he said troubled my wife and I slightly.

For example, he said that one of the kids said that the teacher had slapped her on the face last time. Now, I’m fully prepared to put that down as exaggeration or misunderstanding; however, he also said that the teacher had ‘accused’ two boys who were standing close together of being “gays kissing”, called some of the other kids “idiots” and threatened to “beat them up” if they kept making mistakes. He apparently called another kid a “prick” and said “I’ll effing smack you” to another. He didn’t say any of this directly to my kid, but he was in the room when it happened. I have no doubt it was meant jocularly rather than threateningly.

Now, even allowing a broad margin for ‘banter’ and ‘adult trying to look cool with the kids’, am I wrong to be thinking that that language seems inappropriate?

My relation with him is a fairly recent thing, and is tied up with a couple of activities we do together, which I have a lot invested in (not financially, more like time and effort). I count him as a friend – he’s got some slightly ‘laddish’ points of view about things but otherwise I have no concerns.

I’m fairly sure if I raised this with him, not only would my kid no longer be able to participate in the activities, but I’d also end up not being able to in the things I do with him too.

I don’t want to overact or cause him problems with his job, but on the other hand I don’t want my kid exposed to behaviour like that.

WWSTWD?

Now, even allowing a broad margin for ‘banter’ and ‘adult trying to look cool with the kids’, am I wrong to be thinking that that language seems inappropriate?

No, not at all it shouldn’t be tolerated especially in that sort of environment.

I don’t want to overact or cause him problems with his job, but on the other hand I don’t want my kid exposed to behaviour like that.

WWSTWD?

Speak to your friend and withdraw the kid from the activities, I’d be also tempted to report it.

Presumably he’s not the only adult involved with running  these activities?

Speak to one of the other teacher / leaders and outline your concerns. Let them deal with it unless it explicitly involves your kid.

Raise the concerns anonymously with your local authority LADO?

Raise the concerns anonymously with your local authority LADO?

This plus do you know any of the other adults involved in running it – talk to them? If it’s an organised group then other adutls have a legal duty to report concerns to the LADO too (proper ‘you’ll go to jail if you don’t’ legal duty which it may be worth reminding them of if they corroborate your lad’s story).

IMO?

Those attitudes stink and why would you want to be friends with someone that has them?

They guy should not be anywhere near kids with those attitudes and as for hitting a child thats a criminal offense as is the homophobic abuse.

Presumably he’s not the only adult involved with running these activities?

Yes, he is.

Raise the concerns anonymously with your local authority LADO?

I don’t think it is necessary a safeguarding concern in the sense of risk of any physical harm – I don’t think that really would have happened as appears to have been suggested – it would have been witnessed by other kids and it would quite rightly have ended his career. My view is that whilst inappropriate, his language wouldn’t reach the threshold for being considered abuse, but I’m not an expert so happy to be corrected.

What would you do if this dick bloke wasn’t your mate? Do that.

You already know that if any one of those things is true, it’s highly inappropriate behaviour. The likelihood of them all being untrue…

Have a word with the friend to tell him to watch his own behaviour. Yes, this might mean withdrawing your son from the activities if the mate’s attitude towards him changes. DBS checks are on a “nothing known against” basis rather than anything deeper, so don’t mean more than a person hasn’t been cautioned or charged.

Basic rule of safeguarding in Scouts is that you are never 1 to 1 with a child, and should never really be just one adult with a group of kids.

There’s a lot not sounding right here

I agree with morecash – something very wrong here. Red flags waving

Yes, he is.

That’d be a warning sign for me.

What sort of activity has a single adult supervising a group of kids?

My view is that whilst inappropriate, his language wouldn’t reach the threshold for being considered abuse, but I’m not an expert so happy to be corrected.

It is as someone safeguarding trained and a welfare officer for a sports club these are very much on the level of abuse.

Now, even allowing a broad margin for ‘banter’

A bit of ‘banter’ can be great, but the things you describe are not acceptable on their own, but together are intolerable. If I were you I would speak to him and tell him he needs to change his ways, if the price to be paid is having to find somewhere else to do what you enjoy, then so be it. Hopefully, he will value your opinion and see the error of his ways.

Its not just about your kid – its about protecting all kids. either he needs to change his attitudes ( unlikely) or he needs to be stopped.

Sounds a bit like the guy that ran my local youth club in the 90s. He was actually a pretty cool guy, used the same sort of language the youths used and actually got the best out of them. Really changed some kids lives and turned more than a few of them away from a not very nice path they were going down. That was in a really rough area though and fitted in well.

You really do need to report this. How would you feel if your inaction resulted in harm to a child?

Now, even allowing a broad margin for ‘banter’

A bit of “banter” in the pub with your mates is generally somewhere between acceptable and a thin excuse to be a ****. In the environment you describe it’s totally inappropriate. Cause problems with his job? Jesus, if everything you’ve been told is true I’d want him sacked for gross misconduct with immediate effect and I sure as shit wouldn’t want him anywhere near my kids (if I had any).

I would suggest having a word with him, but IME “lads” aren’t likely to change their behaviour because they don’t see anything wrong with it. He’ll probably call you a triggered libtard snowflake if you said anything. I’ve known “friends” like this over the years and excising them permanently from my life was one of the best things I ever did.

used the same sort of language the youths used and actually got the best out of them

With 16-year olds, perhaps. Threatening to ‘effing smack’ an 8-year old, or in front of a group of 8-year olds, not so much.

What Drac and Morecashthandash said. I am both a Scout section assistant and welfare officer and alarm bells are ringing in both camps. It would be wholly unacceptable in a cycle club and in Scouts.

Sounds a bit like the guy that ran my local youth club in the 90s. He was actually a pretty cool guy, used the same sort of language the youths used

He called them gay, idiots and threatened to beat them up? Yeah he sounds really cool and example of why safeguarding was brought in.

I think you know really, but some action required. Be it raise it with him, withdraw your child / report him /all of the above.

Thank you all for your input, it is much appreciated.

If the circumstances you have described are (largely) correct:
– report without hesitation; at the very least this will exonerate him if there is no truth
– your ‘friendship’ and shared activities count for nothing so end them now
– will his behaviour continue at the same level or will it escalate?
– the only focus should be on the safety and welfare of children
– why should you be concerned about his future employment?

The points above are all predicated on the circumstances being as described; the only way to establish that is by him being investigated.
I believe you would be failing in your duty as a parent and a responsible adult by failing to report; having a matey chat with him is not the way forward.

Try going at it from a different angle. Tell him your kid really enjoyed it and ask him how he manages to engage a group of youngsters. If he boasts about the banter and slapping that gives you the opportunity to discuss it. If he gets all shifty then that’s the time to get your lad away.
Edit – I originally wrote “get your lad out” but that might be misconstrued.

Jakester……..

You said in one of your last posts that you “don’t think its necessary a safeguarding concern…”

I would imagine that a number of people on this forum have actual REAL WORLD experience of handling disclosures.

Some posters have already mentioned LADO (meaning Local Authority Designated Officer.)

Please take their advice and pass this information on to someone who can take your concerns seriously and deal with them appropriately. If you need some advice, grab a member of the Senior Leadership Team at the school gates tomorrow when you drop the kids off. They will point you in the right direction.

MODS…… Please look at this thread closely……

Think about it this way…… Jakesters kids have DISCLOSED their concerns to him and now Jakester has DISCLOSED his concerns to us.

Does STW have a safeguarding policy and how does it suggest Jakester should be helped?

Jakester, your job is to pass this on.

To all involved in this post……This is CLEARLY a safeguarding issue…….