Looking to get a car.

Would like it to be:

Mildly practical – hatchback would be good. Not looking for a two seater (while I love MX5s I’m looking for more seats and boot space)
Sporty / Enjoyable to drive – good handling mostly
Easy to live with (i.e central locking, air-con, bluetooth)
Cheap to run – so decent reliability, parts not too expensive, tax/insurance not in the “oh my lord” range
Fuel economy not massively important as don’t do a huge amount of miles but frugal on the fuel is always good
Not too old or too high miles.

Can spend up to £4k-ish and not looking at the bottom of the price range. I’ve already got a Leyland Daf van and a Ducati motorbike which need money spending on them a fair bit. Would rather pay a little more up front to avoid the hassle of garage bills (within reason)

I’m thinking a Renault Clio 200 or maybe a MK5 Golf GTI – though think I’d get a nicer Clio for the same money

You’ll be looking at a very leggy mk5 GTI for £4k

BMW 123d Coupe?

Mazda3 ?

A Ford Focus is exactly what you have described

Too cheap for a Clio 200 that’s not been upside down in a field. They also drink fuel like there’s a hole in the tank

SEAT Leon.

EP3 Civic Type R. £4k should get you a fairly decent unmolested one. Not exactly huge inside and nor are they the last word in fuel economy but they have back seats, a decent boot and they are tremendous fun to drive.

EP3 Civic Type R. £4k should get you a fairly decent unmolested one.

Not a chance now – 4k is rust-bucket/trashed territory for these now. Nice EP3s are getting on for 10k.

4k could buy you a decent FN2 Type R though (the one Clarkson hated!). You’d need to drive one though as they aren’t to everyones taste. Parts aren’t too bad either and if you’re in the Midlands I can recommend a cracking indy Honda garage.

Alfa 159 sport wagon. The 2.4 jtdm motor

If you’re looking at a £4k hot hatch that now gets you something from the mid noughties at the bottom of the market. Evo always seemed to love the Renaultsport Megane at the time. A Focus ST or Astra VXR would both be a laugh but aren’t exactly cheap to run.

Mini Clubman Cooper S big enough?

You any good on the spanners?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Project-Lexus-v8-engine-swap-Volvo-740-estate

Mk1 TT 225 Quattro; pushing the definition of not-a-2-seater a bit, but buy a good on and look after it and it won’t drop in value.

Easy enough to mod the front suspension and replace the rear ARB to reduce the understeer to how it was originally intended to handle – just don’t lift off at 110mph+ on corners!

1.8t engine decently frugal, parts cheap, and every VAG indie knows how to work on them. Bone fide design classic and starting to feel a bit of a modern classic now. Can you tell I love mine? 😁

I also recommend a Leon or even Ibiza if you can find an FR. I have a newer Leon 2tdi it shifts and handles very nicely. Not quite as economical as I had hoped but I may have been a bit too aggressive so far to get optimum MPG,

My experience of a well looked after RenaultSport 182 Cup is anything to go by I wouldn’t touch a 197/200. I’m sure the owners club will tell you they are super reliable though. But then again, Mazda rotary owners will tell you they’re the best thing since sliced bread.
Id be sorely tempted by a mini, whatever variety suits your budget at the age you want. They really are very good. Very nearly just bought one but ignored the practicality and just bought yet another mx5 instead. Because they’re just so good.
Or a Swift Sport, they’re a right hoot by all accounts.

Swift Sport is a good shout!…

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202109197534452?include-delivery-option=on&model=Swift&onesearchad=New&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=Used&sort=price-desc&radius=1500&make=Suzuki&postcode=de43au&price-to=4500&max-engine-power=150&zero-to-60=8_TO_12&advertising-location=at_cars&page=2

For £4k and given your general requirements I’d say your looking at a sensible (1.2-1.6) hatch, something common (fiesta, focus, Corsa, astra, auris, Mazda 3) somewhere between a 13 and 66 plate?

You’re not going to score a classic hot hatch or something with lots of poke within that £4k budget unless it’s a wreck.

Swift GTI

Megane 225

Clio 182

Polo GTI

Corolla with the tsport lump

Celica 190 (poor man’s integra).

Fiat Panda either 100HP or 4×4?

Mk1 fiesta ST.

Shrink an inch every time you rattle down Howe Street.

Fiat Panda either 100HP or 4×4?

I had a 100hp for about 18 months. It was fun for a while but they’re really small and uncomfortable. They’ve got the suspension travel of a skateboard and the seats are very flimsy.

I’d still consider a 4×4. Check the Panda 4×4 club on YouTube. It looks like they have loads of fun going nowhere fast. They go to some amazing places.

4 grand doesn’t get you much these days. I’d look for a Focus ST170 or as said above a Fiesta ST. Plenty of those in budget and they’re actually pretty sensible cars with just a bit of poke and easy options for upgrades. Better engine and box in the the Fiesta.

I’d go Mazda 3. Think it ticks all the boxes. They are decent to drive, though not necessarily a pocket rocket (though you didn’t specify quick, just good to drive)

For that sort of money, I keep hearing my late uncle’s advice ringing in my ears… Anything less than 5k is a banger.

With that in mind, if I wanted a car for that and wanted to forgive in a nice place, I’d look at an Alfa 159 Sportback (and then hope I could get spares).

More realistically I’d aim for reliability and spares and probably head for a Focus with a petrol engine. Even if that price range meant it had issues, it would be cheap to fix.

Celica 190

It’s a shame Toyota never produced a GT4 version.

On that note, is an ST205 in budget? Nice to drive, if a bit thirsty, and a stock one should hold it’s value.

It’s a shame Toyota never produced a GT4 version

They did a TRD for the Japanese market. Bit more power, stiffer suspension and am lsd

There’s the Toyota Caldina GT4. Import only and probably a stretch to get one for £4k, but 260bhp and 4wd in a car the size of a VW Polo sounds like fun.

Mini Cooper S will be a bit thirsty on E10 fuel if the chap my daughter is seeing is to be believed. He reckoned fuel consumption dropped by 10%-ish on it.

If you can find a good one locally a mark 1 Saab 9-3 Turbo S will fit the bill. (Has to be Mk1 for the hatchback). You can use the 2 to 3K change to fix it up as bits fail. (Steel coolant and power steering pipes will be rusty if they haven’t been done).

For that sort of money, I keep hearing my late uncle’s advice ringing in my ears… Anything less than 5k is a banger.

I disagree. Everything I’ve ever had was under 5k until a couple of years ago. I’ve had loads of boring reliable cars and a few bangers when I felt like it.

I’d say currently, in 2021 on Plague Island, most 5k cars are actually 2.5k cars being sold by chancers. Bad times for buyers.

@sharkattack

I’ve had some awesome cars for less than 5k, pretty much all of them apart from my last two in fact. Some of them have needed almost zero money spent (VW Passat TDi), some lots (Rover 620 SLDi). My van cost less than 5k and I miss it almost daily (RIP Jimmy), but the fact remains that cheap cars are cheap for a reason. They are either old, tired or a combination of both.

Anything in that bracket is a gamble and you have to be prepared for cost to fix stuff (t.ex gearbox on the shitbox Rover) or abandon it when it goes wrong. That Rover… Even my mechanic (who loves the business) drew the line at fixing it after the last MoT fail.

Anything less than 5k is a banger.

Is bs. Sure, cars at that price range will be older and leggier than more expensive things, but there’s no need for them to be bad. Our current car cost less than that at 5 years old/48,000 miles

EP3s for £4k are sheds. I was looking at the start of the summer. FN2s are much more plentiful at that price range.

mk5 Golf GTIs have rocketed in price. I paid £4k for my massive spec one about 5 years ago now and theres no way I could buy the same car now, 5 years down the line for £4k, mad as that is.

I’ve recently bought a pretty sorted little R53 Mini Cooper S for £3k. £4k will get you something really nice, maybe even a JCW. Try one, they’re massively addictive.

FN2 type R.

EP3’s are way too sought after, Mk5 GTI’s are good but attract VW tax and are a faux-classic these days, so any at £4k are sheds as above.

Disregard the contemporary reviews, or at least take them with a pinch of salt – The FN2 is a very good car. Its simply, very reliable, gets you the wonderful K20 Engine, yet has build quality and longevity that a golf/leon/clio etc can only dream of. Interior is superb, they are very practical and massive with the back seats down. Yes, they are firm. But no unreasonably so.

I’m a bit of a pervert though so I’d buy one of these: https://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C1326691

Last Caldina I looked at was £8k. It’s somewhat larger than a Polo too.

I’ve had some awesome cars for less than 5k

In 40+ years of motoring I’ve only paid more then £5k once. Anyway, if I’ve learned anything from STW recently it’s that you’ll be needing a V6 if you expect to spend more than 10 or so minutes on a motorway, so you’ll be needing whatever car with a V6 you can find within your budget.

FN2 Civic Type R are pretty good value for money at the moment.

They do rust though.

Just so I’m not recommending something I haven’t got – I bough this last Dec as a stop-gap after my daughter wrote my wife’s car off. I only intended on keeping it a few months with the intention of getting a new motor on a PCP deal. I like it so much though I decided to keep it, and it’s the only car I’ve had that I’ve spent money on over and above normal maintenance…

…I did have all the underside stripped and sealed a few weeks ago, so yep watch the rust! But it’s still in good nick for a 13yr old car.

Thanks for the tips guys.

The Civic is tempting, as is the Swift Sport. The Mini is probably the closest though – I know a local mechanic who was head of a BMW dealer’s servicing department and works on them all the time. Could get him to give any one I’m interested in the once over before buying.

Left field choice that has come up through searching is a VW Eos 2.0 turbo which has the Golf GTI motor in it. Seem to be quite well reviewed too. Not sure on the practicality though.

However, just tested +ve for COVID so am in house jail for 10 days, so will need to put the car buying off for a wee bit

If going for a Mini, just avoid the temptation to get a newer turbo R56 one. The 2007 > 2010 N14 engines are a ticking time bomb and even the later N18 isn’t entirely bulletproof whereas the gen 1 supercharged ones are pretty bulletproof engine wise.