Quick Q: A friend has said after they tested +ve for covid, the NHS Test’n’Trace person told them they weren’t interested in outdoors contacts. Ie the fact that I’d been riding with them 72 hours earlier was deemed irrelevant.

Is this actually true? Do they waive the requirement for self isolation if the contact is outdoors only? I can’t actually find that info online.

Obviously I don’t know how they determine someone’s risk. Perhaps it was a timing-of-symptoms thing and my friend got the wrong end of the stick. Or perhaps they have some sort of contact risk algorithm that takes into account the situation, duration, timing vs symptoms, vaccination status etc?

Can anyone shed any light? Has anyone been asked to self isolate due to a covid contact whilst being outdoors?

i read recently they go back 48hrs from start of symptoms.

call 119 if you’re concerned, they can give you advice about outdoors contacts and track and trace. Although someone I know was told that track and trace weren’t interested in them after they’d been with a positive case indoors after 48hrs, so who knows what they’re actually for anymore!!

My daughter tested positive on Monday evening, T&T weren’t interested in outdoor contacts she’d had at a horse event the day before.

Quick Q: A friend has said after they tested +ve for covid, the NHS Test’n’Trace person told them they weren’t interested in outdoors contacts. Ie the fact that I’d been riding with them 72 hours earlier was deemed irrelevant.

Is this actually true? Do they waive the requirement for self isolation if the contact is outdoors only? I can’t actually find that info online.

I don’t think the criteria are readily available – probably because people would manipulate what they say to fit/not-fit them. I think it makes sense to exclude outdoor contacts, I’d be a little surprised if ALL outdoor contacts were excluded – e.g. if you have a tinder meeting and get amorous outdoors that might be a bit different from going for a bike ride. I suspect that they can’t handle the workload if they do the outdoor contacts too and they are much lower risk.

Actually if this is the rule – they should publish it – it would be an incentive for people to stay outdoors knowing the call won’t be coming… …but then the app has no idea if you are in or out?

If you are worried you might have picked it up and pass it on – there’s plenty of asymptomatic testing going on so you should be able to get a PCR test and some lateral flow tests to monitor yourself even if T&T haven’t called you.

My daughter tested positive on Monday evening, T&T weren’t interested in outdoor contacts she’d had at a horse event the day before.

We’ve never had T&P (Scottish T&T) get in touch about any of our outdoor events which would support this (it seems unlikely that we’ve never had anyone diagnosed a few days later given the current prevalence) – although the governing body still expects us to collect every individual’s contact details.

I believe outdoor contacts, unless you state that you involved in an activity that makes social distancing impossible it low risk enough that you don’t need to isolate.

the NHS Test’n’Trace person

You mean the Capita Test and Trace, nothing to do with the NHS.

I believe outdoor contacts, unless you state that you involved in an activity that makes social distancing impossible it low risk enough that you don’t need to isolate.

Down under they were using CCTV to try and find everyone the Chauffeur had been near (the one who lied about his vacination status and spread Delta from a flight crew he chauffeured to everyone he then came into contact with). Turns out he managed to pass it on to someone he just walked past in the street! Probably an exception, but pretty impressive how easily it was spread in that case.

I saw my 22 year old son on Tuesday for the first time in 7 months. Met up for a nice chatty bike ride, although noted he was struggling a bit on hills. He’s tested positive yesterday (wednesday) which explains the hill struggles.
I’ve done both LFT (negative) and PCR tests today, and keeping fingers crossed that he gets over it quickly and I get another negative result from the PCR test.

e.g. if you have a tinder meeting and get amorous outdoors that might be a bit different from going for a bike ride

you haven’t seen how I ride a bike

My daughter is currently isolating due to an outdoor contact with a friend who later tested positive (symptoms developed very quickly). Test and trace were made aware that the contact was outdoors (they were sat next to each other chatting in the park) but we still got the call… So it would seem that experiences vary!

cra[pita test and trace is totally useless and unfit for purpose. personally I would ignore it unless you knew you were in proximity to the person

Turns out he managed to pass it on to someone he just walked past in the street! Probably an exception, but pretty impressive how easily it was spread in that case.

Unlikely. It’s more likely they caught it from an asymptotic person.

cra[pita test and trace is totally useless and unfit for purpose. personally I would ignore it unless you knew you were in proximity to the person

This isn’t the app. This talking direct to the advisors

Is this actually true? Do they waive the requirement for self isolation if the contact is outdoors only? I can’t actually find that info online.

Depends  were you 2m apart? Were you wearing masks? Were you under 2m for 15 minutes or more. There is also other criteria they won’t release to avoid people being dishonest. You’ve done the right thing by contacting them, just keep an eye out for the reportable symptoms

Unlikely. It’s more likely they caught it from an asymptotic person.

Possibly, but in this scenario the D variant wasn’t active in the area (that they knew of), so they could trace all infections back to the one person.

There are reports/claims you can be infected with Delta by a ~2 metre “close contact” of just 15 seconds. With Alpha, T&T app was looking at ~15 minutes.

In March 2020, it looks highly likely I passed on Covid to work colleagues four days before I developed mild symptoms.

There are reports/claims you can be infected with Delta by a ~2 metre “close contact” of just 15 seconds. With Alpha, T&T app was looking at ~15 minutes.

Every interaction will be different, if someone with a high viral load happens to cough out a load of aerosol particles just as you walk by and inhale deeply you could in theory get infected in that one instant. All the T&T stuff is just based on averages from what is know at the time (which probably wasn’t a lot when it first came out).

This isn’t the app. This talking direct to the advisors

yes I understand that – all a part of T&T and its still totally useless as can be seen by the conflicting advice given from the minimum wage untrained folk doing the contact tracing and also the delays – what good is contact tracing days after the contact?

the uselessness of the service is a part of why england has such high numbers.

They follow a laid algorithm so everyone gets the same questions and answer. The figures come from tests separate to T&T.

Unless you’re dogging it shuttle be fine

They follow a laid algorithm so everyone gets the same questions and answer. The figures come from tests separate to T&T.

So why do people get told to do different things and why do some folk not get told they are a contact for several days by which time its useless.

come on Drac – its totally unfit for purpose and is totally ineffective.

So why do people get told to do different things and why do some folk not get told they are a contact for several days by which time its useless.

You’re assuming all situations are the same. It can take days because it depends when symptoms show, when they went for the test, how long they waited for results and of course people actually reporting it. It very much relies on the public reporting efficiently, getting tested in time and recalling who they’ve been in touch with and where.

you haven’t seen how I ride a bike

Riding a bike is very much like making love to a beautiful woman.

the uselessness of the service is a part of why england has such high numbers.

Scotland runs a separate system (test and protect) yet had higher rates than England and suffered from the same sort of issues around it taking too long to trace a contact.

and why do some folk not get told they are a contact for several days by which time its useless.

is it not useless, the vast majority are contacted probably just as they are likely to be reaching or peaking in infectivity; now it could certainly be quicker, and quicker would probably be more effective but its not useless and telling people (as you did here) to ignore it unless you know who infected you is really bad advice – its that sort of thing that makes T&T / T&P job harder – no they likely won’t tell you who the contact was for confidentiality reasons.

BEST CASE
TJ meets Bob on Monday morning. Bob has no symptoms, but caught covid 3 days before, and may not be in the early stage of infectiousness.
Bob gets symptoms on Tuesday evening.
Bob arranges a test, which takes place on Wed morning.
Bob gets his test result on Thursday morning and is called by T&T on Thursday afternoon.
TJ gets called by T&T on Thursday evening 4 full days after the contact.

LIKELY CASE
TJ meets Lucy on Monday morning. Lucy has no symptoms, but caught covid 3 days before, and may not be in the early stage of infectiousness.
Lucy gets symptoms on Tuesday evening, but does nothing that night.
Still feeling crap on Wed Lucy arranges a test, which takes place on Thur morning, because she’s not in a rush, knows its probably Covid and would rather go to the test centre 6 miles from home than the one that could fit her in the same day 25 miles away.
Lucy gets her test result on Friday and is called by T&T on Friday, but doesn’t recognise the number so ignores the call. She listens to the voicemail and finally calls them back on Friday. She doesn’t have all of TJs details. She promises to call back but doesn’t. T&T call he on Saturday where she provides a bit more information.
TJ gets called by T&T on Sat afternoon but doesn’t recognise the number so doesn’t answer. After repeated attempts the get hold of him on Sunday – when he says “its taken you a week to alert me…”

Spot on Poly.

Schooled.

I simply disagree. Its not fit for purpose. Taking a week to alert you makes it useless.

Of course part of the reason I will have nothing to do with it is because at work we were told to turn it off. It will also ping thru walls

Your faith in this useless app is endearing but IMO wrong.

I will say me saying “ignore it” was based on a misunderstanding of the OP and is pretty stupid having reread it

Its still completely useless tho

Now you’re talking about the app again. The OP, myself and Poly aren’t talking about the app.

Nope – I am talking about the whole system – its not fit for purpose and next to useless. the app is an integral part of the system but the whole system does not work properly

https://www.bmj.com/content/373/bmj.n1636

 but the whole system does not work properly

Apropos of boomers’ sense of righteousness,  a housebound patient at our surgery complained to me that he still hadn’t been vaccinated after months of waiting. Turns out he’d been called three times. “I don’t pick up numbers I don’t recognise” he told me…He too thought the “system” does not work properly…

That article supports just what Poly and I have said, that it relies heavily on people reporting themselves to track and trace.

And also points out serious stuctural issues with it and failings of the organisation

there is no system in place to monitor or ensure that everyone reports their results, the report says.

performance dropped to 17% during December 2020 when infections surged.

Oh there is definitely issues with it too.

Thanks for all the replies (well, the ones that aren’t rants about how rubbish the system is). The example in the OP happened a while ago. I was told I didn’t need to self isolate, so didn’t, and several lateral flow tests were negative. I’m doubly vaccinated.

I was actually wondering whether to let my son go to football training this weekend before our holiday next week and whether a positive test of one of the other kids would mean we’d be told to self-isolate. But it seems no one really knows for sure.

Nope – I am talking about the whole system – its not fit for purpose and next to useless.

Yep, my understanding was that the opinion of the epidemiologists modelling CV-19 in the UK was that T&T has had a negligable impact on the spread of the virus.

Is this actually true? Do they waive the requirement for self isolation if the contact is outdoors only? I can’t actually find that info online.

Can anyone shed any light? Has anyone been asked to self isolate due to a covid contact whilst being outdoors?

I can. Since Sunday both daughters 9 & 12 and myself have all tested positive. I’ve dealt with T&T for all 3 of us. They are using a script and filling the answers in to a database form.

For the kids they wanted to know all about which school they were at and which days they had been in and any contacts outside of school. My eldest had been to the park with 3 school mates on Saturday, they took all the details of these and parents phone numbers. They’ve all been pinged. She tested positive on Tuesday of this week.

I contacted the Deputy Head of the youngests school on Sunday when we got her positive result to tell her so she had plenty of time to close the bubble. The eldest reports results into her secondary schools Teams system and they were on the phone 5 mins after she’d logged it.

For myself I tested positive on Monday, movements for the previous week, with specific attention on the 72 hours up to first symptoms. I’d been for a pint both Friday and Saturday tea time at our local, outside only, with 3 mates Friday and 2 mates Saturday. They went into some detail about which pub, inside or out, any interactions with anyone I didn’t know either inside or out etc. Took all the details of who I’d been with. They have all been pinged and are now in isolation.

You can’t report kids on the app, so it’s done by phone. I missed the first call for my eldest (was still in bed at 8am) and the second call was 9.30 which I took.

Final question for all 3 – where do you think you caught it. Well, there are currently 17 positive cases in my youngests school class. Thanks Boris you thundering great tit.

South Manchester area for what it’s worth.

I was actually wondering whether to let my son go to football training this weekend before our holiday next week and whether a positive test of one of the other kids would mean we’d be told to self-isolate. But it seems no one really knows for sure.

Yup they’d need to as football is close contact. We had to get isolate an entire cricket team as one tested positive. Cricket isn’t as close contact.

Ollie that’s exactly how it supposed to work. Big credit to yourself for providing them with the information they need by being open abs honest