Coming to a shop near you soon, TFT I guess.

Luftkappe!

I’m going to get one because:

1. My Yari knocks it’s nuts off sometimes, this is meant to help/cure that.
2. It’s small bump compliance is shit.
3. It’s cool
4. It’s inexpensive cool.

Of course TF Tuned do also have an actual coil kit coming out in January

legend – Member

Of course TF Tuned do also have an actual coil kit coming out in January

More weight, less tunability, more money no doubt.

Wouldn’t feel the need myself for my Lyrik or 120mm Pike, but I can see the appeal for longer travel Pikes – if it works as promised.

P-Jay – Member
More weight, less tunability, more money no doubt.

Yes, not needed once setup, possibly.

You should also add: 3 less sealing areas, better mid-stroke support and better small-bump performance

TBH this doesn’t seem like a competitor for coil conversions- it’s for people who want to improve the air. which is fair enough really, they each have their own advantages.

I was reading about this, the only bit that scares me is the risk of my Pike not being set up spot on and thus getting the wrong coil as a result, any ideas?

Yeah give tf tuned and cr conception the sag range value youre after and if they get it wildly wrong….send it back….cr conception do 10 spring weights….this was only an issue back in the day when manufacturers supplied at most…five springs. Downhillers dont have an issue with coil shocks so why forks?

The thing is…If you run your air fork at 20 percent sag, but a coil at 22 percent….the coil is still going to feel more supportive in my experience.

In the converse scenario the coil is still going yo give you better small bump compliance and grip.

The luft thing is a stronger negative spring, thats it. If you want improved midstroke for the same given sag value- you need to combine it with the AWK kit. That would cost the best part of 200 euros though and you’d be running three more seals over the coil

http://www.fahrrad-fahrwerk.de/awk

Coil Pikes dont weigh that much either…around 2100g – eg the same as an old model solo air lyrik.

Oh and with coils…the bloody solo air stick down issue doesnt occur…

i knew coils were going to make a comeback.
apart from weight, i can’t see what’s desireable about and air spring curve over a coil one

buckster – Member

I was reading about this, the only bit that scares me is the risk of my Pike not being set up spot on and thus getting the wrong coil as a result, any ideas?

We used to be perfectly happy with 5 rockshox spring rates to choose from, and of those 5 extra soft was only suitable for a baby… your margin for error is unlikely to be bigger than that. It certainly can’t be worse than Rockshox recommendations 😆

Imo, if money is no object – the way to go is dual rate ti springs to control the rate around the sag point and the rate around the midstroke, and hydraulic bottom out adjusters like manitous that control the last one to two inches of travel (but located on the spring side instead of damper side) and a gas charged closed damper.

a gas charged closed damper, that means like a charger or a roughcut does it?

No, the bladder on a charger or roughcut isnt pressurised like a lot of coil bladder shocks or motorbike forks. So they can apparently still develop cavitation issues and pull in air through the seal head.

I’m guessing this or the coil conversion won’t work on dual position forks? I wouldn’t be bothered if I lost the dual position function

A coil conversion should work absolutely fine. With the air kit above i’d guess you’d also need to change the top cap, but don’t think it would be much more exciting than that

Coila will be ok – air wont.

Did you put the luftkappe in a Yari OP?

new bike looks to have one an I want to know if its worth it or just look to getting a lyric

(v impressed with the luftkappe in my Pike)

Kimbers I’m running one in my Yari’s and really rate it.

I usually hate RS forks and not normally a fan of air forks but they’re working well at the moment. Small bump compliance is good.

cheers!

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/fast-suspension-eurobike-2017.html

timely

but are they saying it has an elastomer in it 😮

So how exactly is this any better than a set of Dual Air forks with an adjustable negative spring? And if not, why did we all laud their disappearance?

I thought from reading all of the dual air revelation rct3 tuning threads that we concluded that a neg air spring smaller than a pos air spring was necessary to prevent dive.

Is that now different due to air volume reducers? Can you put old dual air springs in new forks?

I think dual air was arguably a bit too complicated for mass market- I liked it, but it confused a lot of people. Not least because the recommended settings were so routinely terrible.

I’m still on dual air revelations. The main problem is reliability for me. More seals to go wrong. The negative chamber was always prone to leaking air. I need to service mine now as they loose half the pressure out of the negative chamber by the bottom of the first descent!

kimbers – Member
Did you put the luftkappe in a Yari OP?

new bike looks to have one an I want to know if its worth it or just look to getting a lyric

(v impressed with the luftkappe in my Pike)

Certainly did!

There’s another, longer thread which I can’t find at the moment.

But it’s very good – it’s not especially fancy when you boil it all down – it’s a taller piston to reduce the air volume of the spring – so really it does the same job as tokens – typically you install the LK, and take out a token or two – so to my uneducated mind the net result is the same. So how it makes a difference I don’t know – but it’s a proper, real world, noticeable difference.

Other benefit is is removes the need for the rubber bump-stop so it’s a lot less harsh on top out.

Witchcraft or Snake Oil, I don’t know – but they work.

balfa – Member

I’m still on dual air revelations. The main problem is reliability for me. More seals to go wrong.

Sure, but at the same time no transfer port to block up and suck the fork down.

But it’s very good – it’s not especially fancy when you boil it all down – it’s a taller piston to reduce the air volume of the spring – so really it does the same job as tokens

No, it’s more complex than that – it’s a hollow domed piston, which keeps the seal between positive and negative chambers in the same place (or moving between the same limits, to be precise) whilst decreasing the positive spring volume (just like tokens) AND increasing the negative spring volume.

It’s great on both my Pikes. I found I preferred to run similar pressure and more sag than before rather than pressure and equal sag. But I tend to ride more through my feet and hips when it’s gnarly, I’m not so heavy on the fork as some.

Note that the Yari’s Motion Control damper causes quite a lot of spring rate ramp, like a Lyrik with a few tokens added, so there is the risk with a Yari that adding a Luftkappe could be too progressive depending on your weight, strength and style.

Note that the Yari’s Motion Control damper causes quite a lot of spring rate ramp, like a Lyrik with a few tokens added, so there is the risk with a Yari that adding a Luftkappe could be too progressive depending on your weight, strength and style

I emailed Vorsprung and theyve just said much the same thing actually, and if its a 180 yari then not to luftkappe, but he reckons with 160 or 140 yari its better than pike/luftkappe

which is encouraging as then I might not feel the urge to sink 250 quid into one of those fast damper ugrades 🙂

@cheifgrooveguru

Thanks for clearing that up.

I took 2 tokens out of mine (3 down to 1) the effect of the change was that the initial stroke was much plusher which mean riding fast over rocks was much smoother, once you start adding bigger rocks into the mix or heavy braking it’s firmer so you get a lot less dive which really helped the handling – if I had to complain it would be a hardly ever use the last 20mm of travel, even at BPW and Les Arcs I’ve always got some left in reserve.

Obviously I don’t want to use all of it more than once in a blue moon but I reckon I use a bit more without bottoming out at all.

Based on your info I reckon I could lose the last token.

Note that the Yari’s Motion Control damper causes quite a lot of spring rate ramp, like a Lyrik with a few tokens added, so there is the risk with a Yari that adding a Luftkappe could be too progressive depending on your weight, strength and style.

The ramp up on my Yari’s was nuts; running no tokens and it’s ace; lovely easy breakaway but enough ramp up to stop then bottoming out too much. Running 25% sag at 140mm travel on my Switchback.

I’m 4 months into a new bike with 160mm Yaris on it. Despite some vigorous runs down the DH at Cwmcarn (among other things) I’ve still never used the last inch or so of travel.

As standard the 160mm Yaris come with 2 bottomless tokens so I’ve removed one and been out for a little run since but still not used anymore travel yet. But then I haven’t done anything higher speed with drop offs yet so the jury is still out. Going to BPW next Friday so will see how it goes there. Still got a token I can remove if necessary.

Wondering in the future about a luftkappe/ charger damper but don’t have the funds for both of hose at the moment and still got a few settings to play with on the Yari yet. Been running them with no compression clicked on as I don’t feel they need it.

I’m 4 months into a new bike with 160mm Yaris on it. Despite some vigorous runs down the DH at Cwmcarn (among other things) I’ve still never used the last inch or so of travel.

Once you take sag into account that means you’ve only been using about 100mm of fork travel! See how taking one token out helps but don’t be surprised if you need to remove the other.

How much sag are you running? Check it by trackstanding by a wall, bouncing, let it settle with your elbow gently touching the wall, then slide the O-ring down. Do it a few times and take the average. (For the shock do it seated and standing and take the average).

I think I was running about 25% before removal of the token but haven’t checked it since I let the air out then pumped it back up. Need to do as you say his week and have a play / check the sag then see how it is at BPW on Friday.

Now available for fox

Luftkappe – Fox Float 34 & 36

couple of things in the Luftkappe instructions i dont fully understand…

NOTE: Make sure the Luftkappe piston is close to or touching the sealhead when you reinstall the sealhead. If it’s pushed a long way
into the stanchion before the sealhead is reinstalled, you can trap too much air in the negative chamber, which will result in your fork
“sucking down” even when pressurised as it is not able to extend far enough to equalise pressures between positive and negative
chambers.

given that you need to push the shaft all the way in to fit the circlip…?

and

Note: ensure footbolts are done up with the fork fully extended. If they’re done up with it partly or completely compressed, the fork will
suck down into its travel.

given that the videos ive seen on changing the airshaft (Al, mbr) fully compresses the fork before installing the footbolts…?