This article got me thinking

BBC News – The surprising links between what you eat and how well you sleep
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-60291027

I can definitely see a parallel to life Chez Morecash at the moment. Neither of us sleeping well, feeling constantly tired, eating rubbish to keep going, gaining weight, leading to poor sleep (snoring/sleep apnea?) so feeling constantly tired, and so it goes on.

Complicated in my case by issues with anxiety and depression.

Anyone any experience of breaking the cycle, and also helping a reluctant partner break the cycle? Have a feeling this may need to be added to the list of stuff to mention to the GP next week.

MTFU, self discipline and self control not always easy to master in a busy household with active teenager(s) to factor in the mix, so that might be where tips and advice may be most needed.

Can you come off sugar/carbs and booze? And not eat late.

It 100% makes a difference to sleep/digestion/inflammation etc.

The biggest single difference for my well-being appears to be a diet based around not having the above.

(Everyone is of course different.)

Went through a period of really bad sleep- which makes any cycle really hard to break.

Ultimately my whole adult life I’ve been incredibly active and recently due to work and a child I’ve let it slide.

Lucky both me and the Mrs recognised the signs and as a team we set aside time to exsure exercise was had(running) Because you exercise you sleep better , because your not tired and craving stimulants you make better food choices.

Nasty cycle though and requires committment from the household rather than jealousy regarding folk escaping the mad house.

Added bonus of clearing headspace too.

Won’t work for everyone but I know my triggers now and know how to reset.

Have you been checked for diabetes?
Other signs can be blurred vision, irritability, finding it hard to concentrate, as well as drinking/peeing a lot.

A lot of the problem with food is sugar and processed carbs because it’s really moorish. It’s hard to cut out though.

Anything you do is going to need some discipline. When you go food shopping do you make a shopping list? Plan proper meals and don’t buy the crisps, biscuits, sweets or whatever it is that’s not good for you. Try and work out how you can fit some exercise into your lives. Even a half hour walk in the evening will help. Can you do it together? When we go for a walk it often gives us a chance to talk about stuff which otherwise we might not do until bedtime which can then affect our sleep. I spend quite a bit of my time waiting on kids at football or the pool and I try to go for a walk but when you’re tired it’s easier to sit and stare at a screen. But you realise you’ve got a problem and that’s a start. Good luck.

Big point for me is not only what I eat but when I eat it.
I always try to have my main meal at lunchtime and often only need a minimal snack early evening, sometimes nothing. Eating in the evening keeps my HR up at night and badly affects sleep.

Some good points – when I am able to exercise regularly it’s better, but busy kids and ageing parents make it hard to get any consistency.

Booze is a very rare treat for me. Sugar is probably the biggest issue. I had wondered about diabetes, currently awaiting results of prostate checks so will ask the doc when that comes back.

I do simply love nice food though. New swanky cafe opened in the next village this week – guess where I’m posting this from 🤦‍♂️

(After a 15 mile loop to get here)

I can relate.

As Pickers says when you eat can really make a difference. We are wedded to the idea of a big evening meal being the main event but it’s not good for us.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/food/articles/eating_times

Not that I am always successful but I’ve found it relatively easy to make a window from say 7pm – 7am where I don’t eat or drink anything other than water then gradually extend that. Ideally you’d eat a small meal at 6pm then nothing until 10-11am the next morning, which is quite achievable at least some of the time.

Maybe sounds like yet another faddy diet thing but I’ve found it helpful.

I agree, it’s the sorr of thing you’d never think of but of course it totally makes sense once it’s pointed out! I definitely comfort eat when I’m tired

I used to struggle to get to sleep at night – anxiety, mind not shutting down. An early bedtime – light off by 10 pm – has had a transformational effect on me, and I now fall asleep easily most nights, even with anxiety.

The other thing which has made a huge difference is eating my main meal at lunchtime (middle of day), as others have said, and having a light dinner (early evening) … so I’m not trying to sleep while digesting a large meal. A porridge breakfast means I don’t need to snack before lunch, and a substantial lunch means I don’t generally feel inclined to snack in the afternoon. This change took a real shift of perspective, but I wouldn’t change back now. When I used to work outside the home this required planning, commitment and a food flask! Harder with a busy family life, of course.

This works for me. Hope you find what works for you.

I do simply love nice food though.

Plenty of nice food without lots of sugar.

I fell into the same trap you’re in while unemployed and found it really hard to break out of it for a long, long time. I found that exercise, eating a light evening meal at least an hour before bedtime and sticking to a routine even on the weekends/days off really helped. It’s incredibly easy to let one long lie-in reset your rhythm and struggle to get back to good habits for the rest of the week.

Complicated in my case by issues with anxiety and depression.

Had this too, plus high levels of stress from looking after my parents and trying to rebuild a new career. I found the trick was to get up early (like 5-6am) and get something done before the day actually starts for everyone else. Than can be anything from a short walk to just doing the odd household chore. It sets the mind up for the rest of the day and stops the negative cycle of getting to 3-4pm and realising you’ve done nothing so reaching for the snacks. For example I’ve got up this morning at 7am (which is a lie-in for me, work starts at 6am so up at 4!) and in the last 3 hours I’ve put the bins out, washed the car and ordered a few bits online for my mum’s car. My neighbours (block of flats) are just starting to appear and almost all are stressed and rushing around, whereas I’m just about to go out for the day and see friends and family knowing I’ve ticked off a few things already.

As for motivating your partner: get yourself into good habits and she will hopefully follow. Don’t force her to do it, gentle persuasion will work. The same goes for her towards you, work as a team and you’ll get much better results. Good luck!

Sounds a lot like us to be honest. One tip from me is try something like the Gousto. Cooked from raw ingredients, tasty, dont have to think whe shopping, easy to cook. Probably not the healthiest option but has reduced our takeaways down to a max of one and I definitely eat more veg and salad. Can feel expensive but if it avoids one takeaway you’ve paid for it.

I was going to suggest cutting down on the booze it has helped me loads – but I see you don’t drink much already.

My other suggestion is not diet, but sleeping arrangements. If you or your partner are waking each other by snoring, have bed made up in spare room, if you’ve got one, and decamp to there if necessary. It really helps. It’s not all the time but when one of you is keeping the other awake it makes sense to us

I found the trick was to get up early (like 5-6am)

Just to point out that this only works for morning people. For evening people this is physically detrimental – and yes, the morning/evening person thing is a real thing with a scientific basis. Just posting this in case people are beating themselves up for being lazy because they can’t do stuff.

My tip for evening people is to try working at night. My wife’s a morning person so she wants to be in bed by 10pm if not earlier. I found I can amuse myself for much of the day, then work after she’s gone to bed. I can get four hours of amazingly focused work in between 10pm and 2am, much better than between 10am and 2pm! Fortunately my work allows me to do this.

Anything you do is going to need some discipline. When you go food shopping do you make a shopping list

it’s amazing how many complete aisles of the supermarket are dedicated to things you won’t have on your list if you do that

I found cutting out sugar, giving up booze and strong coffe and sticking to a routine has helped.
I now only have a real coffee before a hard training session which is an amazing feeling. The power of caffeine is great when you use it sparingly 😀
Not eating after 6pm as well.

Little steps – identify one thing you *can* do (e.g. phone on other side of bedroom) and get it done. Success breeds confidence to build on that.

Little steps – identify one thing you *can* do (e.g. phone on other side of bedroom) and get it done. Success breeds confidence to build on that.

Good point, lots to work on so need to prioritise.

I found cutting out sugar, giving up booze and strong coffe

I found that helped with anxiety, and to some extent sleep
perhaps if you decide whats for lunch, etc, get it out on the counter early, it should be easier to avoid snacks. And do you eat much ‘bland’ food, like plain meat and veg? that might help with cravings. Apparently eating at regular times controls your sugar spikes,which otherwise disturbs sleep.
i obviously dont know what im talking about, since i try very hard to sleep well and it rarely works

Im similar, lack of sleep, or 2 or 3 hours at best, little interest in food(not even steak 😯 ) eating to mainly easy foods like ham flavoured pringles and monster drinks, coupled with a complete lack of motivation, where as previously i did everything at a million miles an hour. I had loads of energy, now i have none, and its not just a case of getting older, as many men of my age perform labour intensive jobs.

I saw an article the other day(forget the paper) of a proposed research on people who haven’t had covid, but are experiencing long covid like symptoms. lethargy, lack of sleep,food etc, and it was reckoned it was down to people living a sedentary lifestyle over the last 2 years and it had changed their brain patterns away from their usual busy selves, to something akin to a hermit. Little energy spent,.. so little energy or food intake needed, which leads to less interest in getting out and about.

Obviously the remedy, though it didnt say it, is to try to get back into the things you did previously. Get out more, do more and from those actions you would get into a different tune and be able to break the cycle you have fallen into.

Heres a link to the guardian, concerning pre/probiotics, gut health and sleep
its easy to make your own kombucha and kefir, not so easy to make it taste good

I feel your pain.  I am not sleeping badly but boy am I struggling to eat properly.  Id much rather nip to the shop for a pie and a cake than cook a meal

I don’t have any answers tho

Some good advice here I think

Nasty cycle though and requires committment from the household rather than jealousy regarding folk escaping the mad house.

Added bonus of clearing headspace too.

That rings a bell.

The missus tends to both encourage me to get out cycling and then later make snippy comments about needing “time for herself as well” I sleep marginally better, getting to bed earlier and getting up earlier (mostly through necessity).

She’s joined a gym a couple of weeks ago and been twice.