I’ve decided to finally take the plunge and enter the world of e-bikes, albeit somewhat reluctantly.

I’ve ridden analogue bikes for some years and the last 12 months on my Stumpjumper Evo have been really amazing, I love this bike but with the type of riding I do – big loops linking up my favourite natural trails at Cannock Chase + the odd trip to BPW, FOD, Shropshire – I’ve found myself sweating my knackers off climbing to the top of some of my favourite sections and really wishing I could have more energy to fit more in.

75% of my riding is solo, 25% riding with people on both analogue bikes or full fats.

I’d definitely get another Specialized as my LBS is a main dealer and has incredible customer service. They’ll take my Stumpy in PX and give me a healthy discount off the tag of a new bike. They’ve currently got in a KSL comp at £5600 and the Levo Carbon Comp at £6600

Aesthetics are as important to me as the functionality and while the Levo has a bigger battery and more power, outside of the ‘Pro’ version (which I can’t afford) I think they’re pretty ugly. The Kenevo SL on the other hand to my eye looks just perfect. Also, coming from a reasonably lightweight Carbon trail bike and having to lift it into my house and van, I’d prefer to get something along the same lines. But the range and power of the Levo is a draw… the Levo is almost a grand more mind you.

This’ll be my only bike for at least a couple of years and the investment is significant, so I need to get it right.

Anyone else been in a similar position?
Bought a KSL and regretted it?
Bought a KSL and never looked back?

I think there a few who have bought a Lev SL and regretted it. Try the KSL. See if the power available meets your needs/expectations. 35nm max is not a lot compared to the non-SL versions.

@iainC on here went from a FF Levo to a Levo SL, just to buck the trend.
There been rumors the SL motor would be uprated with more power on a replacment model which has been due for over a year or two now…
Worth searching/posting on Emtb forums too

I’ve had a quick go on the KSL in a car park but I’m struggling to find anywhere that’ll let me demo one properly. It felt ok in the carpark but obviously not enough of a blast to give me a good idea…

Bought a KSL and never looked back?

👋 Me. Went from a Rail to a KSL and don’t regret it one little bit. The KSL is a far better bike downhill, which is what it’s all about for me. I recently took the Rail out for a change and uphill was hilarious; just so much power it’s silly.

At non-eBike pace on winch and plummet days I can easily do 50+ KM and 1800m climbing over 2 days on 1 battery and the RE and I’m a lazy fat knacker.

May be worth bearing in mind all ebikes tend to break down now and again.
If this will be your only bike then that could leave you out of action when the inevitable happens.

Spesh warranty is great, but I’m sure the turn around isnt instant.
Personally speaking I’d be annoyed if I lost riding time, and if my eeb was my only bike then yes…I would have lost riding time.

Spesh warranty is great, but I’m sure the turn around isn’t instant.

Depends entirely on the dealer. I was at Raceco for a replacement pivot bolt and they noticed the motor had too much play in the cranks so swapped it out on the spot.

I’m down the road from Raceco, I’ll be buying from them!

z1ppy
Free Member

@iainC on here went from a FF Levo to a Levo SL, just to buck the trend.
There been rumors the SL motor would be uprated with more power on a replacment model which has been due for over a year or two now…
Worth searching/posting on Emtb forums too

Posted 1 hour ago

almost, I went Orbea Wild to Levo SL. As a reasonably fit rider, for me the SL is a better bike. It has more than enough power to help me on steep climbs (I have some heart problems), yet is light enough to feel pretty much the same as a regular Stumpy on the flats and downs. Plus it is ok to lift over gates, into car etc.

It had a few small issues in first year, all sorted under warranty at local dealer. It is now 2.5 yrs old and I replaced the motor last month as the bearings were starting to hang up a little.

Specialized did it at 40% discount and I sold on the original motor for repair so net cost to me was about £300.

I have upgraded a lot over the couple of years, fork to a Fox 36 with 160mm travel, bars, stem, and have AXS shifting and dropper on it.

You could be me.
Been riding a 130mm S6 stumpjumper for a while and want to get back to going in the peak district often. But no where near as fit as some years ago.
After thinking about it for about a year the current price drop on an KSL expert and 0% finance persuaded me.
I spent some time comparing geometry and it depends on you current bike size.
As I ride an s6 stumpjumper the biggest levo SL was 2″ shorter. The S5 KSL is only 18mm shorter reach and similar in other areas.

When I got the bike I had one ride and had a fairly substantial pedal strike after that it was set up to steepest and highest BB settings. Oh and follow the suspension set up on specialized web site, seems fairly accurate

Am currently loving it but not used to E assist e.g. turbo mode feels weird with the difference between effort and speed, I start a ride on Eco then switch to trail at the first climb.

Get a mud hugger (the new one with the extension) and trim the extension so it fits past the chainstay and it will stop a lot of mud from the rear wheel getting near the low shock, eventually I will get some shorter cranks though.

I’m predominantly a normally aspirated rider, went from a Rail to a Levo to a KSL which I got very bored of very quickly and back on a Rail.

I’m quite happy doing a 2000m day on the leg bike, & the KSL didn’t actually make riding much quicker, unless I rode it in Turbo & that would flatten the battery so quickly, it was pointless. I couldn’t really use it for lunchtime power laps & it couldn’t even get close to a FF range. Appreciate everyone is different, but for me an ebike is to be sufficiently different to my normal bikes & well, it wasn’t.

The Rail is a better bike overall for me. It gives up a few % going down, but it’s better everywhere else, and in reality, was only a couple of kilos more in weight by the time you put a decent set of wheels & tyres on the KSL.

That said I don’t rate the back end on the new Levo, that was one of the shorted owned bikes I’ve ever had.

For me e-bikes are all about smashing the laps out quickly, or when I’m so cooked from riding the normal bike, I want them to do the work so it’s a full power one for me 🙂

We’re all different however.

I think I’m pretty close to HobNob.

I’ve got a Decoy and a Levo SL. I bought the Levo because I thought the Decoy was too heavy and I didn’t need the power it offered and I planned to sell the Decoy soon after. This isn’t as flash as it sounds, I bought the Decoy in C2W and the Levo was second hand.

The Levo SL is much better overall in that the weight is close to my Sentinel, and it’s really nice to ride but it’s not sufficiently different to mechanical and I often and easily put out enough power on the climbs that the motor doesn’t top up with much extra.

I think they are both compromised, one on weight, and one on power. The newer stuff coming out, around 40lb and 60Nm is where I think the sweet spot is. I’ll be getting rid of both for a new Orbea Wild when I can get around to selling them and can get a Wild as a replacement – or maybe the new Transition Relay when it comes out.

That said, for the last month or two I haven’t ridden the bike at all and I’ve really enjoyed riding the normal bike again, albeit annoyed that the bike has robbed me of the top end power I definitely had before I got lazy… After a few great years on an e-bike, I think I could easily return to a normal bike for a while – I’ve missed the lightness.

Thanks all, really good comments. It’s interesting how different people’s opinions are but I guess it does all boil down to personal preference.

The more I think about it, as much as I wouldn’t mind the extra torque, the £1k cheaper price of the KSL is a bit of a deal breaker.

E bikes for me should have the full grunt when you want it.

I’ve got a 1st Gen full fat Kenevo – weighs 25kgs, but there’s only the odd occassion you notice the heft. I probably spend 90% of the time in eco @ 25% assist. Sometimes on a steep climb I’ll go to trail @ 50%. But when you really need a dig to get you through something, the full turbo is ace. Also good if you’ve done a ride and have a dull slog home – whack it on full beans and get back. Just as happy eating some road miles up as it is smashing down a rock garden. As for the DH – it’s quicker for me than my Capra was

They’ll take my Stumpy in PX and give me a healthy discount off the tag of a new bike. They’ve currently got in a KSL comp at £5600 and the Levo Carbon Comp at £6600

I hope that isnt with the PX, as currently spesh have the KSL comp at £5425
https://www.specialized.com/gb/en/turbo-kenevo-sl-comp/p/199105?color=318000-199105

Maybe best test riding then buy direct. Keep your analogue bike.

Probably a thread drift, but I hired a Rail a few days ago….the motor packed in halfway round the trail (Swinley) about the furthest point from the start….

It was perfectly rideable without assist, but it’s really put me off TBH. It felt alright when it did work, but not the revelation I was expecting.

My mate on a Levo SL was way behind when my motor worked and reasonably matched when mine was dead.

Think I’ll just stick to my triggers broom of a FS….

I hired a Rail a few days ago….the motor packed in halfway round the trail (Swinley) about the furthest point from the start….

It was perfectly rideable without assist, but it’s really put me off TBH. It felt alright when it did work, but not the revelation I was expecting.

I rode my Shan HT bike round Swinley last summer. A couple of weeks later I rode my Kenevo round Swinley – the Kenevo was so much more fun

I will try again soon, I’ve got a free re-hire after my experience….

Full power kenevo owner here.
I don’t own a kenevo sl but have tried a couple of them.

My take is though the sl was lighter it wasn’t light enough for the little power it had.
It didn’t really give anything that my pedal powered bikes don’t.
Personally I’ll stick with either riding a leg powered bike or a full powered bike as I do at the moment.
The sl just seems to be stuck in a no mans land. It either needs to be lighter or have more power.

KSL here, came from a full fat Scott Ransom. Found the scott to be a heffalump, good in a straight line and that was about it, didn’t go round corners all that well, I liked that I could ride with my mates on their eeeb, but detested riding it, when it shit itself, test rode a KSL and didn’t look back.

For me the KSL means you can go further in a day and put more climbing in. Most I’ve had out of it in a day is 9000ft, one main battery and three range extenders, the lads on the big eebs were struggling with upper body fatigue by the end of the day, my legs were shot to pieces instead!

KSL goes downhill very well, not quite as good as my G1, but pretty damn close. Its a little bit shorter overall, if they did an S4.5 with a 455mm back end it would be perfect for me.

Never ride the bike in turbo and as a result have altered the 3 modes quite a bit. The latest software update seemed to make quite a difference in the level of assistance and a bit more range.
Eco is 35/45
Trail 50/60
Turbo 70/80

Can get around 4000ft out of the main battery in trail, still feels like a good leg workout and pushing hard in ‘turbo’ can get a bit less, but 2000ft an hour. If you try and hurry the KSL, it will drain the battery quickly, but if you ride somehere between a full fat and an NA bike up the hills, its pretty economical.

But the range and power of the Levo is a draw… the Levo is almost a grand more mind you.

Range? I’ve not yet ridden with a full-fat that had the range I’ve got (combination of fitness, battery and lack of power), regularly do 7000ft of elevation (with the extender).

I bought a KSL after renting one from the Bike Shop in Innerleithen (Alpine at Glentress also hire them). Best £85 I’ve spent in a long while.

I then bought an Expert (£800 more than the Comp in the Black Friday sales but better components plus more importantly a top-spec Fox 38). I’m fit but old and found that I was struggling with 3-4 rides a week on my normal bikes, the KSL helps fill the energy gap.

I wanted the geometry as per my analogue Cotic, luckily in the Tweed Valley so lots of steep off-piste.

It’s not got the power of a full-fat, but I don’t want a motorbike – it will though get up/down anything I want to do, and rides just like a normal bike really (sub 19kg with pedals/cage etc and Michelin Wild Enduro’s).

One thing to be aware of, if you hold the handlebar + button the bike drops into a +/-10% mode where each press up/down moves the power by 10% – I use this every time as it’s easier to ‘trim’ the power to need rather than the big steps of Eco/Trail/Turbo.

I’ve had it 3.5 months and done nearly 800 miles – first motor went at <500 miles, replaced within the week.

My usual advice to anyone buying a new bike is go try and demo, if you can’t demo then spending <£100 to establish that something costing +£5k isn’t what you want is reasonable value.

Sams Bikes is a no nonsense place to start. Has pretty much all the combinations your looking for.

last two comments by SirHC and intheborders are music to my ears, thanks for contributing.

I’m sold on the KSL.

Now to decide on spec, whether Comp or Expert level. On paper the extra £1k for the expert gets you quite a bit more with the bigger forks, better rear shock and slightly better wheels… I’d have likely upgraded the forks on the cheaper comp version pretty early on to a set of Factory 38s so maybe cancel that idea and just stump for the Expert off the bat. I just wish I liked the colours, I’m not that buzzed on the expert offerings. The Peach in comp spec is very nice though, and the gloss black / raw carbon would be easy to live with.

First world problems I guess!

Didn’t fancy the peach, all my bikes are black or dark colours! I would of changed quite a bit on the expert, so wen’t with the comp, if the sworks frame was in the dark green, would of gone frame only.

https://ep1.pinkbike.org/p5pb23537960/p5pb23537960.jpg

certini have some big discounts(40%) on ex-demo KSL’s

Now to decide on spec, whether Comp or Expert level.

I had the same dilemma. As I had forks, shock, wheels and AXS gears waiting to go on I decided on the Comp in Smoke. Without those parts I would have chosen the Expert.

Originally I was going to buy the cheaper version and swap out the 36 for my Lyric Ultimate, that’s when the Comp’s were £7.5k and Expert’s £9.5k. But at the discounted price, bu99er it and leave the Lyric on my Cotic.

I did decide early on whichever version I bought I’d be replacing the brakes as I just don’t get on with SRAM’s, swapped to Saints and Galfer rotors – very happy with it.

Already stretched one chain, and the 2nd is at 0.5 so will be replaced this week along with the tyres as they are now pretty sha99ed.

I’ve got nothing!

All my nice parts will be going with the Stumpy, unfortunately. In the trade I will see if I can negotiate me keeping my AXS bits but sadly the Fox 38s I have won’t easily transfer over to a KSL, otherwise I’d happily get the Comp. Looks like I’ll be looking down the back of the sofa for some extra change for the Expert model :/

I’ve got the comp KSL and it’s extra weight actually makes the fork work better than I thought it would.
The fact it’s not full heavyweight makes it stable but still pretty agile

As for the power at 70kg and pretty fit but feeling all my 53years. The eco will do for most climbs, the trail is good for fast climbs will give 1000m but importantly allow it to be done in half the time (either because its a bit quicker but also no need to stop at the top) turbo only for a few ridiculous steep bits, which wouldn’t be feasible more than once in a non-e.
I love it and since getting it probably 50:50 it and my hardtail pace. Lots of tweed valley steepness.

gavinnn

sadly the Fox 38s I have won’t easily transfer over to a KSL,

Why not?

I don’t own either of the bikes you’re looking at but thought I’d stick my oar in anyway as an Orbea Rise owner.

Not to try and sway you to a Rise, but slightly objectively on the low power/low weight thing.

My Rise is just over 20kg now and I have it set to Eco/22nM Trail/42nM and Boost/60nM.

It’s somewhere between slightly heavier and moderately heavier than the KSL, depending on which model you compare it to.

I find 42nM is actually more than I feel like I need most of the time but 22nM in Eco isn’t enough so the KSL at 30 on paper sounds perfect. Particularly if I could magically lose another 2kg I’d the bike!

With 22nM in Eco, the bike feels the same as my hardtail in terms of how much effort it needs to pedal it along/ up things. HT is an Orange Crush built up on the light side that weighs considerably less than the Rise.

I rarely use boost but when I do its because either I’m knackered on the way back to car or because of the extra momentum that it gives rather than all out power. There’s another option in the setup that Orbea (or Shimano?) refer to as ‘Assistance Characteristic’. I don’t know whether the KSL has something similar? To me, This is a much more useful option to fiddle with as it makes it easier (or harder) to achieve the maximum power. With it set to a low value, you have to work much, much harder to get the assistance whereas setting a high number means the assistance is available easier.

I reckon with a high assistance value, 30nM would probably be a good level of power for a light bike with a fit and enthusiastic rider on board.

The reason I went for the Rise was because I didn’t want an ‘E Bike’, I wanted an MTB with a bit of assistance which is what I’ve found in the Rise. The KSL sounds very similar, just with less weight and less power (and more money which was what ruled it out for me).

If you treat the KSL as you probably would any other bike and stick some lighter wheels on there, more efficient tyres, lighter cassette etc, the gains from those will be the same as they would on a normal bike. Less effort for you, more range from the battery which is only going to improve things.

Yes it’s nice knowing I’ve got extra power in reserve if and when I need it but if I was stuck with my 42nM and had nothing more, I doubt I’d think I needed it.

If you’ve got 30nM and that’s all you’ve got, you’ll adjust your riding style to suit that. You’ll have to attack the hills a bit harder than on a full power bike but it won’t really be any different from riding a normal bike.

I had a KSL, and before that had a whyte e150 full fat. I recently sold it though – mainly as I’m not riding much at the moment and when I do ride I need the exercise so back to a normal bike.

If you’re riding proper enduro trails fast, the KSL is a hell of a bike. The back end is fantastic. And the power is perfect for giving a bit of help without being OTT like a full fat bike is. The lack of weight (relatively) makes it handle way better than the whyte.

Two things – the seatpost insertion is crap, and on my S4 at 180cm I could only run a 150mm dropper (I’ve got relatively short legs). That annoyed me. The second thing isn’t a problem with the bike, but it is a super capable 170mm travel weapon, and for a lot of my riding it was just too much bike, engine or not. I prefer shorter travel bikes with proper geo unless I’m riding somewhere really rough and fast.

I’ve got a full fat ebike (orbea wild fs – ~24kg) and a lightweight ebike (trek fuel exe – ~19kg). These days I mostly only ride the trek, because I prefer the lower weight.

If you’re only going to be riding on your own then I’d say you wont miss the full fat ebike, but if you were going to be riding with others on full fat bikes a lot then you might find a lightweight ebike a bit undergunned, but it all depends how the other riders ride their full fats, and how fit you are.

Before I bought the trek I deliberated long and hard about getting a KSL instead (they look decent value with the discounts) , but I had a couple of concerns about the KSL. Firstly, they’ve been around a while now and the motor is lower powered compared to the competition, and its rumoured there will be a more powerful version announced soon (hence the discounts) . Secondly when I tested one it felt a little too low on power, plus the motor whine is horrendous (IMO).

#participateinmyfreemarketresearchwarning

Sorry to hijack the thread but I was interested to know from the riders of the mid spec engines what power outputs they had their engines set to. Are you just tweaking the torque but leaving the power at max, or are you tweaking the power too? If so what power max are you settling for in each setting?

The reason I went for the Rise was because I didn’t want an ‘E Bike’, I wanted an MTB with a bit of assistance which is what I’ve found in the Rise. The KSL sounds very similar, just with less weight and less power (and more money which was what ruled it out for me).

I did have a 2-day demo of a Rise (and also a full-fat Cube). I liked the Rise and with the alloy bike having a bigger battery plus the extender it was an option, but, too much of a trail bike style geometry. Fine for most stuff but it was a bit out of its depth on rougher trails here. The Trek Fuel EXE was an option, but mega-money for the spec.

The full-fat Cube was fine while riding, but just too heavy/cumbersome for everything else – workshop, car etc.

Sorry to hijack the thread but I was interested to know from the riders of the mid spec engines what power outputs they had their engines set to. Are you just tweaking the torque but leaving the power at max, or are you tweaking the power too? If so what power max are you settling for in each setting?

with the trek fuel exe you cant set torque, you just get the following parameters in each mode ( 3 modes in total)

– Assist % – How much power the motor will produce as a percentage of what you are generating with your legs ,is configurable in a range from something like 20% up to 200%, so if you’re putting in 200w, and this is set to 100%, then the motor will add another 200w (asumming that the max power – see below- is not set lower)
– max power – a power output limit that the motor will not exceed (max 300w)
– pedal response – how quickly the motor ramps up to the desired assist power

I tend to vary the settings depending on whether I think i’m going to be depleting the battery to zero on any given ride.

trying to eke out max range I use the following

mode 1 : assist 40%, max power 180w
mode 2 : assist 125%, max power 180w
mode 3 : assist 150%, max power 300w

and I will ride mainly in mode 1, my average speed on these kinds of rides will be about 8.5 – 9.5mph

If I know I wont have a problem with range

mode 1 : assist 40%, max power 300w
mode 2 : assist 125%, max power 300w
mode 3 : assist 170%, max power 300w

and I will ride mainly in mode 2 or 3,my average speed on these kind of rides will be about 11mph

Sorry to hijack the thread but I was interested to know from the riders of the mid spec engines what power outputs they had their engines set to. Are you just tweaking the torque but leaving the power at max, or are you tweaking the power too? If so what power max are you settling for in each setting?

I’ve tweaked mine from stock:
Eco is 35/45
Trail 50/60
Turbo 70/80

Explanation here: https://support.specialized.com/home/missioncontrol/en/using-mission-control/tune-your-bike

Sorry to hijack the thread but I was interested to know from the riders of the mid spec engines what power outputs they had their engines set to. Are you just tweaking the torque but leaving the power at max, or are you tweaking the power too? If so what power max are you settling for in each setting?

I initially tweaked them using the app but then settled on using just using the +/- 10% approach.

Hold down the handlebar ‘+’ button until mode changes, then move up ‘+’/down ‘-‘ as needed, from 0% through to 100%. It means rather than having the large jumps between the 3 modes (eco/trail/turbo) you can just have a bit more or a bit less, or if needed go straight from 10% to 90% say. Really helps with range.

benpinnick

#participateinmyfreemarketresearchwarning

Sorry to hijack the thread but I was interested to know from the riders of the mid spec engines what power outputs they had their engines set to. Are you just tweaking the torque but leaving the power at max, or are you tweaking the power too? If so what power max are you settling for in each setting?

Any progress on Ethic, Ben? Was really interested in some of the plans you had talked about, can only imagine the challenges in rolling them out

Any progress on Ethic, Ben? Was really interested in some of the plans you had talked about, can only imagine the challenges in rolling them out

The full fat one is paused while we contemplate the challenges of warranty and support. We’re also working on a lightweight one, hence the interest in what people are running.