Half-hearted ? When did this become true?

Wasn’t Alan Johnson in charge?

Media only interested in Tory in fighting.

Stage 1 get yourself into the media debate.
Stage 2 arrange a large wooden horse for your support in the country to infiltrate your party at, let’s say, 3 quid a pop.
Stage 3 use your new power base to promote your few PLP buddies to the front bench.
Stage 4 appear, reluctantly.to back the eventual loser in an international political earthquake when everybody knows you’re lying through your teeth about it.
Stage 4 then provoke a showdown in the PLP resulting in sackings and resignations.
Stage 5 complete the takeover.

Stage 6…. Hello SDP 2.0.

Benn on Marr now. No punches pulled so far ….

“a good and decent man, but not a leader…..”

NSS!!!!

I thought it started at 9 – buggar booting computer niw

Damn forget to reset my watch 🙁

I suspect corbyn supporters will still support him as and the last research I saw showed that he easily had enough grass roots support tp win another vote

Clearly he cannot carry the PLP and the labour party is split between members and elected officials

I suspect corbyn supporters will still support him as and the last research I saw showed that he easily had enough grass roots support tp win another vote

But what about the disaffected? Nobody gets elected by their own supporters (to PM) they need the rest

Hilary will “reluctantly” allow himself to be persuaded by the rest of the anti-Corbyn PLP to run for the leadership.

Junky – yes I susoect they will still vote for him in any challenge but its curious as he’s delivered a Leave vote by his relative inaction. What I wondered is if many of those Momentum types ahd voted Leave as per left leave etc

I have voted Labour in every general/council election I have been able to (1992). I live in the North and work in manufacturing. Presumably this makes me a ‘core labour voter?’

I am pro-Europe, pro-nuclear power and pro-Trident.

I will never vote for the labour party with Corbyn in charge. Elections are won from the centre ground. Doesn’t matter how popular you are with your momentum pals.

PS my current view is Corbyn is desperate to get to the Hutton report publication so he can tell us all how vindicated he is. In the meantime Rome burns.

Just realised how rambling my post it – **** it – I’m going to ride over some passes now because I am so hacked off with what my country and party seem to have become.

http://www.bbc.com/news/live/uk-politics-36570120
Clever games, get the crisis in while the Tories get in line for theirs, by Tuesday the front pages will be about Tory Civil war – well if more than one has the balls to step up. Didn’t somebody mention a Major moment again….

IDS on Marr just now confirming that 350m was a lie.

Tuesday mike? Sunday Torygraphy already has this as its headline

Both major parties in a bloody mess. We have unleashed some “interesting” events now…..interesting and appalling in equal measure.

Extraordinary times to have a political vacuum with FA leadership. Great…

THM, at least it’s not come out in the streets yet… going to be plenty of it and hard to find a cabinet for a bit

a muddy, Tubby Watson, on his way back from Glasto to paddle about in some more shit back at westminster 🙂

Tom Watson, Labour's Deputy leader, returns to London following a night at Glastonbury. pic.twitter.com/s1gDmzA156

— Laura Hughes (@Laura_K_Hughes) June 26, 2016

DrJ yawn, that’s not what he said at all. What he said it was up to the Government of the day to decide.

@AD not rambling at all, coherant and totally understandable stance.

@Stoner top repost ! Have met him a few times at Hacked Off events

DrJ yawn, that’s not what he said at all. What he said it was up to the Government of the day to decide

He said that support to farmers, Wales etc would have to continue, and of what was left some may be spent on the NHS. The promise was to spend 350m on the NHS. Lie.

DrJ yawn, that’s not what he said at all. What he said it was up to the Government of the day to decid

yep so true, remind me again who does he work for…. and why is it not 350 million. It’s as if some idiot wrote it on the side of a bus or something

Elections are won from the centre ground.

Have you noticed the results of a referendum we had recently?

Jambas, it ok, folk can start telling the truth now, The end has been achieved, the means can change now surely…?

Judging by this morning, perhaps not.

JMcD just had a tricky 5 mins with Neill

Have you noticed the results of a referendum we had recently?

Virtually 50:50? Don’t get more central than that.

and to put this government of the day stuff to bed

BoJo/Gove/IDS etc. are at the forefront of the party of government and in the event of a decisive victory odds on to pick up the 3 top jobs. Making claims and running away from them tells you exactly what you need to hear. they don’t give a **** about the people or the country.
they have tricked lied and bluffed their way to get them over the line.
They now are at the point where a ponzi scheme comes unstuck, all those promises are to be repaid and delivered on.

Letting them off with “they were only ideas” is BS

TMH at the Referendum debate Boris used the £10bn figure as the amount available

The Remain side are clutching at straws here, people in Sunderland didn’t vote Leave because of what’s written on a red bus

@5th – as jamba put it:

Wishful thinking. the Leave vote in the North of England was very strong, ie in support of the central UKIP pollicy.

The Remain side are clutching at straws here, people in Sunderland didn’t vote Leave because of what’s written on a red bus

Eh? Did they see the bus and say “I recognise that is an idea not a promise or a proposal, and in any case refers to a gross figure and not the actual funds available. Nevertheless I will walk my whippet down to the polling station and vote Leave ”

The Remain side are clutching at straws here, people in Sunderland didn’t vote Leave because of what’s written on a red bus

Given your insightful and in depth exit polling which was it?
Fear of immigration
Racism
Shit life created by successive governments operating with lots of CONTROL over the UK
Lack of opportunity?

How does Labour represent them? Do they want to? Should they?

@5th – as jamba put it:

The extremes would always vote one way or another. The centre is the only area you can influence. Telling racist halfwits foreigners are a good thing will not work ever. Telling middle aged middle managers who dislike unaccountable EU beurocrats to suck it up might.

Jambas, mon ami, keep believing what you WANT to believe.

Blair, yes him, actually said something sensible on Andrew Neil. The devil really is in the detail so you boys better stop bluffing and work out what to do. This IS serious it’s not longer a silly Tory game of who’s next in the hot seat.

Powerful events have been set off that we don’t know how to deal with. We have to have some leadership and no one is stepping up to the plate. Indeed they are all looking after number one. Pathetic.

Anyone listen to Frank Field on the radio Sat am? He’s no fan of Blairites and not to impressed with JC after referendum. Thought he spoke much sense and would (to me) make a Labour leader I could support. Its just my view I’m not assassinating JC just trying to be practical as I think he could make most Tories look like numpties to much of the electorate.

Agreed on Blair generally talks sense, sadly large sections of the Labour Party aren’t willing to listen.

I never saw this as a game which is why for the first time ever I personally took part in campaigning.

@mike

Below is not my priority order but what I heard

No doubt the insanity of uncontrolled immigration a system which exists no where else in the world was a major issue, probably the number 1.

Second-ish I think was lack of democracy at the EU combined with the move to the Euroepean superstate

I say Second-ish as the Remain campaign’s involvement of external agents like Obama and political organisation’s like IMF and the accusations of “racism” created a strong FU response. I spoke to a neighbour yesterday who said those accusations in particular hardened her view to vote Leave

How would the Corbyn supporters who elected him to the leadership have voted in the Referendum ? (Remain I imagine) What is their reaction to his half hearted campaigning ? Will they continue to support him as they are somewhat conflicted ?

When you talk about Corbyn supporters, are you talking about party members or the electorate?
I’m very quickly discovering that capering about like buffoons slapping one another with red herrings seems to be the public face of modern politics..

I don’t think Corbyn’s lacklustre campaigning over the referendum will have any bearing on his popularity to be honest.. The referendum was a ridiculous double edged sword with neoliberal capitalism winning either way.. I’m not surprised that he refused to fully engage with the whole sordid farce

All this smoke and mirrors, distraction techniques and propaganda machinery are diametrically opposed to Corbyn’s transparent politics

Now that the latest slight of hand trick is over, as the referendum fever fades, I think that the bullshit you deal in will fast become an outdated joke

I say Second-ish as the Remain campaign’s involvement of external agents like Obama and political organisation’s like IMF and the accusations of “racism” created a strong FU response. I spoke to a neighbour yesterday who said those accusations in particular hardened her view to vote Leave

That is no basis on which to make such an important decision, and is just indicative of the problem with the referendum as a whole.

I see. So accusations of racism led your neighbour to vote with a racist mob. Naturally.

I spoke to a neighbour yesterday who said those accusations in particular hardened her view to vote Leave

I’ve found similar.

The “deserters will be shot” line from Brussels just wound up Leave voters moreso.

Great so Immigration that happen across the EU – it might amaze you but under the awesome Aussie scheme we still have this sort of fear of immigrants. Leave exploited the fear though and never turned down the support of the right wing.

The EU superstate BS again, more pedalling fear

Great, no actual real reasons and a lot of smoke and mirrors. That is the biggest problem going forward. The leave vote will not fix any of the problems some of these people have. With an abandonment of the 350 million, immigration etc. within 24 hrs of the vote leave might just have found out how other parties/campaigners felt. Good luck when they ask again

yunki:

https://twitter.com/election_data/status/746970961761669120

In my poll of Labour members from February 81% were voting to Remain. 82% of those who voted for JC in the leadership contest were Remain.

The “deserters will be shot” line from Brussels just wound up Leave voters moreso.

Yes, as soon as the threats from Europe appeared I thought that would be worth a couple of points for leave.

well of course… remain was obviously the least troublesome outcome

what’s your point stoner?

The “deserters will be shot” line from Brussels just wound up Leave voters moreso.

Perhaps the turkeys should have listened?