Early morning shock purchase advice needed.

Mroning fellas.

You may have seen yesterday i had another Monarch shock die, so i was going to get this.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fox-RP23-Rear-shock-Boost-Valve-Rockshox-DVO-X-Fusion-Immaculate/114670157768?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649

An older Fox RP23.

But in my research i found

Which shows i can fit a Cane Creek IL coil…

So was thinking i may go for the coil over the RP23. I’ve never owned a coil shock, but hoping i’d have less issues than i am with the RS’s. This is my 2nd one now and it’s getting tiresome.

So, thoughts on coil shocks ? Thoughts on CC IL coils in particular ? Or even thoughts on the RP23…..

Ideally need this before the guy ships the RP23 and i can cancel it.

Do you like tinkering? There are a lot of adjustments on the CC shocks so can take a while to set up. Though once set up they are ace. But more costly than the rp23. Most seen to go for enough second hand that they are not worth it over new (less than a service cost difference between new and used!). Think the IL coil has proved reliable. It was the air version that had issues (in the air can rather than damper iirc).

Check that the IL Coil is suitable for your bike. There have been problems with Levos snapping shock shafts. CC increased the diameter of the shaft to combat this but it still happens. Buying new gives you warranty peace of mind.

I thought G-160’s had a regressive rate and so a coil was a massive no no?

YEah i love a bit of tinkering, usually i use a Shockwiz which clearly will be no use in this instance LOL. But i think i’ve got to the stage i can dial a rear in without one now.

I’m under no illusion it’s more expensive, but you know what, it’s been a long year and a longer winter, so Saurdays disappointment of the shock being banjaxed really outweighs any cost. I’ve had the bike 18 months now and love it and can’t see me changing it for ages, considering i only paid £1025 for the G-160 i think it can take the hit of a purchase without me being unhappy. I can of course also sell the Monarch RC3 when it’s sorted/replace by SRAM.

I need to shout TFT when they open to ensure there’s not a 3-4 week turnaround on it for example, the sun is coming this weekend and i don’t want to miss the nice weather waiting for a shock. So that could also play a factor.

Check that the IL Coil is suitable for your bike.

I thought G-160’s had a regressive rate and so a coil was a massive no no?

This is why i started the thread before pressing the button on my basket.

Firstly, check how ? I’m struggling to find any information, but the pic above certainly implies it fits the bike.

I have absolutely no idea what a regressive rate is, let alone the effect it would have by fitting a coil….

I think broadly that the G160 suspension setup needs less force to compress the further it goes through the travel. By using an air shock which is naturally progressive this balances out. But a coil is generally linear and so I think that means it will bottom out a lot. I did some digging into this when my monarch blew up on mine and I think the consensus was that a coil wouldn’t work properly. I am not a suspension expert so may have all of that completely wrong.

It sounds like you’ve done some research which is a good start for me mate, even if you’re wrong, it’s nice to have another bit of information, so thank you.

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kneebiscuit
Full Member

I thought G-160’s had a regressive rate and so a coil was a massive no no?

This, it’s likely to feel like shite as it won’t ramp up as required, and 160s need all the help they can get. Folk on the Facebook groups bang on about how good it is, but when pushed finally admit they’ve had to whack on a massive amount of Low Speed Compression and the small bump is ruined.

However…… swap the spring out for a Cane Creek progressive spring and it might just work

and 160s need all the help they can get

Oh i’ve been more than happy with mine, it’s way better than me.

The progressive spring is an interesting thought though, i’ve used them on motorbikes before.

BTW, if anyone is sitting there thinking “why the heck don’t you just buy….”

Then feel free to let me know what that one is… I’m not set on these 2 options, if there’s something better that isn’t ridiculous money, then shoot. I’d prefer it not to have an external air can though, but if that can’t be helped then so be it.

Inline on an enduro bike? I’d be looking at the regular Double Barrel at that shock stroke, db inlines have a bit of history with popping, the newer ones are much better, never had any issues at the shorter strokes.

A quick search mirrors what others above have said about the regressive rate, you really want an air shock in there.

https://j-techsuspension.co.uk/collections/shocks/products/cane-creek-dbair-cs?variant=720140173337

Not sure i’d need the CS, (climb Switch) over the standard DB Air IL if i were to go with air.
https://www.tftuned.com/shocks/cane-creek/cane-creek-db-air-il/c406

J-tech don’t show it in stock in the 216*63 and it’s a lot more expensive than the DB IL if bought from TFTuned. But then i’m sitting thinking, if i’m going air, why not just stick with the cheaper Fox RP23 anyway.

Along with the fact the DBair looks very ‘fat’ around the top and i worry slightly about fitting and clearnace.

2016 G160 linkage analysis

https://linkagedesign.blogspot.com/2015/08/whyte-g-160-275-2016.html?m=1

It’s slightly progressive then massively regressive, so unless they’ve changed it on whatever model year yours is, it’s pretty unsuitable for a coil.

I’ve tried a coil on a linear bike and whilst it’s obviously completely ridable as above you either need to up the spring rate or add loads of compression damping so you end up with a harsh ride and a heavy shock.

A progressive spring or coil with a air bottom out system might work ok but if it was me I’d just stick with air as that’s what the frame is designed for.

OK, right, brilliant information guys, we’ll scrap the coil idea then.

So currently i’ve got the RP23 at £115 with 12 months (theoretical) warranty or the CC DB Air IL at £359 i believe also with 12 months warranty.

I guess i could stick with the RP23 in the short term, see how it goes and i wouldn’t really lose anything if i out it after a few months, plus it also gets me back out on the trails ASAP. But obviously the RP23 is quite old technology compared to the CC shocks.

That’s the link I was trying to find. 👍. I did read about the progressive coils and I think I came to the conclusion they weren’t progressive enough to overcome that regressive rate, so at best would end up linear-ish

The good thing is, all are cheaper than this which i was tempted to just say “sod it all, lets buy this” https://www.leisurelakesbikes.com/bikes/frames/specialized-stumpjumper-evo-carbon-275-frame-set-carbon-satin-carbon__329827

Oh i’ve been more than happy with mine, it’s way better than me.

Indeed, but have you not whacked in a load of volume spacers?

I’ll sell you that Fox DPX back to you, COVID tax will MASSIVELY affect the price though 😉

NAh, i only had 2 in there. BUt i was wondering at first if it was me messing about fitting spacers that’s causing my issues by blocking something etc ?

The DPX indeed sounds ideal… but i’m still troubled by the ‘modifications’ needed as you’ve never shown me what they are 😀

Along with the fact it then means i potentially can’t run a water bottle if it’s as sticky out at the RC3 is.

IMO the G-160 doesn’t work well with a coil due to its lack of progressiveness, just like my S-150.

Weeksy as a massive improvement over monarchs, fox rp23 and near coil plushness and tuning I would strongly recommend picking up a DVO topaz. Made a major improvement to my Hightower. Super supple without blowing through the travel which the original fox did. Lots of tuning options send very easy to service at home. The guys there are super helpful and excellent service even though they are stateside.

I got a new one for around £300, sports pursuit we’re doing a good deal not so long ago.

As others have said & highlighted, if it’s not progressive enough (and yours is regressive, so definitely not) then a coil won’t work. It won’t even work properly with a progressive spring, there just isn’t enough support there for the shock.

As for the RP23, it was a great shock, about 10 years ago.

DB Air wouldn’t be my choice for an air. For something you can bolt on, with minimal adjustments you can make a mess of which works well, i’d struggle to see past a DPX2. Get a Factory, or Performance Elite model, it has a lockout, trail & open mode, with separate low speed compression & rebound adjusters.

I would strongly recommend picking up a DVO topaz

Find me one in a 216*63 and i will, but i cannot.

i’d struggle to see past a DPX2.

Water bottle aside, there’s also the mounting issues which Mashr seems to know about. I thought it was the top mount, frame side that needs ‘tweaking’ but if it’s the Yoke, then i wouldn’t actually mind modding that slightly.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fox-DPX2-Factory-2018-216×63-8-5×2-5/233894764501?hash=item367536dfd5:g:Vb8AAOSwppZgJ787

That’s not a terrible price..

Seems inline with this

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fox-DPX2-2019-Performance-FLOAT-Rear-Shock-216x63mm-3-pos-Enduro-MTB/265045836907?hash=item3db5f6846b:g:3c4AAOSw-HZgIasV

Aha I may be able to help! I have a Topaz T3 216×63 that’s been sat in his box after being serviced by a DVO registered service centre. PM me if you’re interested. Brilliant shock btw just doesn’t fit my megatower.

Haven’t clicked the eBay links but I’d be checking the fox tune ID on the can. And having a look which bike it came from and looking at the suspension of that model. Depending on the tune – it could end up being not suited to the bike. Either that, or budget for a revalve/tune.

PM me if you’re interested

done.

Haven’t clicked the eBay links but I’d be checking the fox tune ID on the can. And having a look which bike it came from and looking at the suspension of that model. Depending on the tune – it could end up being not suited to the bike. Either that, or budget for a revalve/tune.

All very complex this… not sure i’m good enough to notice.

Water bottle aside, there’s also the mounting issues which Mashr seems to know about. I thought it was the top mount, frame side that needs ‘tweaking’ but if it’s the Yoke, then i wouldn’t actually mind modding that slightly

What mounting issues? I would be ‘really’ surprised if a DPX2 didn’t fit. Water bottle issues can be resolved easily, Wolftooth make the mount adapters which mean you can run the cage lower.

Of the two you linked the Factory one is the better shock, the second is the more basic one – you can get the all black shock but it needs to be the Elite version to get the low speed compression adjuster (small adjuster in the middle of the blue dial).

And not wanting to piss on others chips, i’d run one every day of the week over anything by DVO. Couple of calls to suspension tuners would confirm that would be a good decision 🙂

I tried the wolftooth cage mount and it still didn’t help with water bottle mounting. Interested to hear how you get on with the DVO if you go that route

What mounting issues?

I don’t know the details, it’s something to do with the mounts needing some filing but as i say, i’m not sure at which end it is an issue.

I’ve got a relocator for the bottle cage on there, but it still only allowed me to fit a 400ml bottle which is a bit child like, that is, with the RC3 shock.

Haven’t clicked the eBay links but I’d be checking the fox tune ID on the can. And having a look which bike it came from and looking at the suspension of that model. Depending on the tune – it could end up being not suited to the bike. Either that, or budget for a revalve/tune.

All very complex this… not sure i’m good enough to notice.

The db air inline is very good and you should be able to set up a base tune for your weight for most bikes. Just checked on the dialed app – the 2017 G-160 is on there with a base tune for a db air inline.

Just want to say thank you to all, irrespective of what i go for or don’t, i very much appreciate the input anyhow. It may also serve as useful for other people with the same frame on google searches too, so thanks.

The yoke end will be where you struggle with fitting non RS (monarch) shocks. I’ve cut a standard yoke in half and machined it out to fit the profile of other shock boddies above the eyelet. But this won’t help with your shocks being side loaded.

I’ve got a Fox X2 mounted with a custom yoke that flips the bolt to vertical so the shock is free to pivot side to side and not be flexed by being pushed sideways in the front mount. I would no way go with a coil on a g160, I have the X2 over packed with volume reducers to make it far more progressive.

The problem you are having with your shocks is miss-alignment and flex in the frame, linkage and bearings. Rockshox are particularly bad for this seemingly though as they don’t deal with being flexed.

I have absolutely no idea what a regressive rate is, let alone the effect it would have by fitting a coil….

I think people have covered this….

RE the CCDB air IL…. i’ve one on my stumpy and it’s brill.
I LOVE tinkering, so the 4 dials really appeals to me..once you actually understand them, you can get a great shock set up.
Also teh climb switch is WAAAY fancier than a simple lockout – it increases comp AND rebound damping. I can deffo tell the difference.

Mine was in a super cheap TFT sell out… £240 or something…. but worth it.

DrP

Inline on an enduro bike? I’d be looking at the regular Double Barrel at that shock stroke, db inlines have a bit of history with popping, the newer ones are much better, never had any issues at the shorter strokes

no issues with mine coming down munros.

I would look for a manitou macleod shock to replace the stock one.

Weeksy,

I have a CCDB CS – so the piggy back version. I could not get the inline to work with my weight ( 105 kg). I was running it at 240 psi to sort out the correct sag – and then getting about 5mm of movement through out the stoke. Drop the Psi – and sag was about 40 %. Quick talk with Cy – and he swapped it for a CS version – which is great. I run at 170 psi – with no compression damping , but tinker with the rebound, and it has been very good.

I’ve got the Wolftooth mount, combined with a slightly shorter bottle (Prime, Nukeproof, 76 Projects and Elite do them for starters, still 550ml) it works fine. I’ve now seen that 76Projects do one for half the price

The tweek is just filing away the yoke in the 12 and 6 o’clock positions. You can see exactly what needs done when you line up the shock. Doubt it took longer than 10mins to do, and doesn’t even need the yoke off the bike

I’ve got a CCDB inline coil with climbswitch fitted to my Whyte S150s.

I’ve no idea how the suspension action compares to the G160 but it performs faultlessly on my S150.

I bought it from TF tuned who set it up; the only change I made was to back off the high speed compression & rebound. I can’t fault it.

I weigh 15 stone but I am fairly smooth.

Right then kids…. I’ve gone for the DVO Topaz as per the seller up above…. couple of reasons.

1. It’s nice to keep it within STW
2. I fancy trying a DVO actually as i’ve read lots about them before.
3. it’s green… so is my frame 🙂

I’ve got a Topaz T3 on my Ripmo and it’s by far the best air shock I’ve had. TBF I’ve generally only had base versions of Fox air shocks and more recently a RS Super Deluxe R and the Topaz has performed better than any of those.
DVO are super helpful if you have any questions on set up too.