If his mind doesn’t work that way then he must be a really seriously ignorant person considering that we live in a world where professional footballers face monkey chants and banana throwing. A large proportion of the population face vile discrimination on a regular basis but hey why should Danny Baker know about that?!

Also very impressed with aweeshoes post.

Also very impressed with aweeshoes post

And as impressed with his perseverance in explaining the situation to dullards who won’t change their mind.

I’ve just seen Danny Baker on BBC news claiming that he had no idea who had had a baby

Nonsense. More nonsense.
you only have to read this
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-48212693

I wish I wasn’t bombarded with constant news about the royal family but I find it impossible to avoid it.

Really? I honestly know next to nothing about them and only found out about a baby because of this thread. In what way are you constantly bombarded? Do you live with them? Then again I actually thought Danny Baker was dead so my knowledge of celebrities is not good at best.

Way too many middle class white DB apologists on here.
https://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/anyone-else-call-their-kids-a-little-monkey/

Could have linked a dozen threads all saying how stuppid/planned/ conniving and racist this sort of thing is. But good ol Danny boy, nah he didnt mean it.

My ass he didnt, bloke is way to clever to do this by accident.

tpbiker is right.

It is a racist post to racists (and to those constantly vigilant for potential offence I suppose), but if your mind doesn’t work that way there isn’t anything obvious to be upset about. It took me a long time to work out what the offence was.

Meghan Markles race is no issue whatsoever to me, in fact I could barely care less so it really does need someone to point it out before it even registers. I presume the same for Danny Baker.

Because you are white and therefore don’t get the offence. Telling others what they should or shouldn’t find offensive is bollocks, assuming others don’t find things offensive just because you don’t is bollocks.

Eat_The_Pudding is right – DezB is an idiot. If Baker had done this by accident he wouldn’t have done the non-apology.

Besides, if intent was all that was needed – I could walk into my work office and greet everyone by calling them a “Whaddup my ****” in a jovial fashion. I wouldn’t mean it, but it would probably get me punched.

How many of you have seen South Park? (specifically the Nagger incident) There are a lot of Randy Marshes on here.

So the black people and those who are aware of the discrimination that they face are racist? Got to love whitesplaning, racism is still racism whether it affects you negatively or not.

+1 This is a classic racists defence mechanism.

assuming others don’t find things offensive just because you don’t is bollocks.

I don’t think anyone is claiming that though are they? Folk have just stated that they didn’t see that it could be offensive until it was pointed out to them. I definitely fall in to that camp. Naive or just white I dunno.

I’ve no idea what Danny Baker’s intentions were as I know very little about him. Other than I thought he was dead and looks like a cheap version of Danny DeVito. Either way I bet he’s regretting it now.

He should have just done a rape joke, seems like those are all right (if you’re a ‘Kipper).

he wouldn’t have done the non-apology.

Raybanwomble is a stupid moron calling “my sincerest apologies” a non-apology.

I’m quite surprised at the number of people saying they had no idea that associating black people with simians is a well established historical insult. I know sod all about football, but I’m well aware of the institutional monkey insults aimed at black players. There have been plenty of stories about other cases over the years, where celebrities and politicians like the Obamas have been targeted. It’s not even the first time it’s been discussed here. Five page thread from last year:
https://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/anyone-else-call-their-kids-a-little-monkey/
(Edit: Sorry, didn’t notice that link had already been posted)

I’m also struggling to get my head around the allegedly obvious interpretation that Danny Baker’s post was a play on the Royal family as “performing monkeys”. It really seems a stretch to come up with that one. Danny Baker is a pretty sharp humourist, so his jokes aren’t usually incredibly opaque.

Baker has never come across as racist from what I’ve heard him say, so I’ve no idea what he was thinking when he posted that Tweet, but the way he used that photo is obviously wrong, and he made a hash of the subsequent “apology”.

No funkmasterp I don’t live with them, I read and listen to the news, you presumably don’t.

You can’t be selectively death and blind when you read or watch the news or listen to the radio.

Presumably Danny Baker also knew about the birth, he just seems to have very limited information about it, despite his apparent strong urge to comment about it.

cumberlanddan

eat_the_pudding – you are talking shite.

What does Roseanne Barr have to do with Danny Baker?

If you can’t see that (rosanne barrs) tweet about a mixed race person implying they were the child of an ape bears some relationship to a story about (danny bakers) tweeting a picture of an ape while referring to a mixed race child then you have my pity.

Archie’s dad dressed as a Nazi for a laugh
Archie’s grandad pleaded for a paedophile not to be punished
Archie’s great grandad rivalled Bernard Manning with his racist “jokes”.
Irony meter off the scale.

I’m quite surprised at the number of people saying they had no idea that associating black people with simians is a well established historical insult.

I’d be very keen for you to point out anyone who has said that. What has been said is that there are people whose first thought when they see a picture of a monkey/chimp is not racism orientated and also people who have said the first thing they think of when thinking about Megan Markle is not mixed race person. That is very different to your assertion.

I’m also struggling to get my head around the allegedly obvious interpretation that Danny Baker’s post was a play on the Royal family as “performing monkeys”. It really seems a stretch to come up with that one.

Which just goes to show we are all wired differently as I find it very odd that it would not be immediately obvious. Like seeing one of those magic eye images instantly and finding it strange when someone else can’t.

The point is that there are people who do think it is racist, therefor it is.

Really? If some people believe something is racist then it definitely is?how many people? Is one enough, or do we have to get into double figures?

The Guardian had an article claiming that barbecues were racist. By your reasoning as some people think that it’s definitely true – so any white person who has a barbecue is racist.

The stw racists are tying themselves in knots over this!

… another thread implodes by the Brexit thread loons I think!

It shows how blinkered and pathetic some people are, you’re really clutching at straws if you’re juxtaposing racism with bbqs and questioning how many people does it take for a comment to be considered racist.

The answer is none, if you’re surrounded by like minded eejits. If you compare, joke or even just tolerate dehumanising people then you are a bigot and are participating in discrimination.

Claimed ignorance if you wish but you’re looking mighty stupid trying to defend it

He’s always been upfront about his preference for red.

Listened to his radio shows for two decades now and never heard a hint of racism, however he does love that “chimpanzee riding on a Segway” ditty – so I absolutely believe it was just an unfortunate coincidence.

His reaction may have been a bit awkward, but I think the underlying anger is more to do with his famously prickly relationship with the “pinheads” at the BBC than with the social media lynch mob mentality.

Shame the news headlines couldn’t have read “Danny Baker fired for unintentionally ‘racist’ tweet”, as casual viewers may unjustly jump to conclusions.

Fans of his radio show may wish to check out the Lineker and Baker podcast. Brilliant stuff and includes Gazza stories not fit for radio.

Thank you, nick1962.

He’s really the Duke of Edinburgh and ICMFP

@aweeshoe
It was a serious question – I cannot quite get my head around the “some people think it’s racist therefore it is racist” statement.

I also think you might try a bit more tolerance and argue a little more politely. No doubt you by now have me down as some sort of Klansman, but I don’t think so.
I try not to be racist though I accept that sometimes I probably am. I apologise if it’s pointed out to me that I’ve said something crass or ignorant. I think very carefully about things like racism and I consider how things might seem very different to me than they do to someone who has experienced bigotry.

If there are people here you that you consider have got this wrong you need to explain why, not call them bigots and morons – you’ll never enlighten anyone that way, they’ll probably just call you a moron back.

1: I can totally understand why people think Baker’s post was offensive
2: I can believe that he made that post without considering the potentially racist message
3: I accept that this lack of consideration is itself part of racism
4: He seems to be genuinely sorry, has apologised and withdrawn the post
5: If Baker had been punching down at someone poor and unable to defend themselves I would be much more upset – the Royal Family are probably well-insulated from many of the effects of racism
6: Sorry if I’ve wound you up, that was not my intention.

I had no idea that Meghan was mixed race. I do follow politics and sport but its perfectly possible to listen to the news and skip royal gossip.

The first thing that came to mind was his “Chimpanzees Dressed as Famous People with Fairground Music” thing.

Never quite as funny as he thought it was,though I enjoyed it the first few times.

I doubt he’s a racist, just a bit too caught up in himself.

I presume its part of his job to be topical and produce ‘satire’ on current events rather than endless jokes about the 1980s so not knowing about the mixed race isn’t really an excuse he can hide behind.

I don’t think he intended to be racist, but it was badly judged and very likely to appear that he was. He put himself in the firing line and got the old tin tack. FWIW I don’t think he should have been fired, but I can also understand why he was.

Whatever the ins and outs of the tweet, deletion, apology and sacking he will be suffering a far worse fate soon.

Namely being a cause celebre for every real Daily Mail reading gammony racist and, no doubt, being ‘backed’ by our very own perma-tanned Pound Shop Mussolini, Farage (although I could also be talking about BoJo).

I’m quite surprised at the number of people saying they had no idea that associating black people with simians is a well established historical insult.

I’d be very keen for you to point out anyone who has said that.

OK, here you go:

Another here who didn’t make a race connection.

I started in the camp of “what he did was misjudged but not racist”

I think that once its pointed out, its obvious it can be seen as racist. But unless you are a racist yourself, or have suffered from racism, its not immediately obvious.

Etc…

As for your alternative interpretation…

What has been said is that there are people whose first thought when they see a picture of a monkey/chimp is not racism orientated and also people who have said the first thing they think of when thinking about Megan Markle is not mixed race person.

In the context what Baker posted, and who he posted it about, I’m pretty damn surprised about that too…

No funkmasterp I don’t live with them, I read and listen to the news, you presumably don’t.

Kind of correct. What I do (and you should try this because it’s awesome) is read the news stories that interest me or seem important. Therefore I can avoid royal news. Bombardment ceased! You’re welcome 😉

@kcr

You quoted me in your post above.

I didn’t say “I had no idea that associating black people with simians is a well established historical insult” – of course I knew that.
What I said was that in this case I didn’t make that connection, I saw it as mockery of the Royal Family, not as mockery of a mixed-race child.
Since it has been pointed out that the post could be interpreted as racist I agree that the post should be withdrawn and Baker should apologise even if the racist meaning was unintended.

People make mistakes, that doesn’t necessarily make them bad people.

OK, here you go:

All incorrect. What you stated is that people were unaware that associating black people with simians is a well established historical insult. Where do any of the people you quoted state that or where are you getting that inference from? I am fully aware of the monkey/chimp gybes made at black footballers etc – how could you not be. But even aware of the historic implications that was not the first association I made when seeing the image on page one. As I said at the time….

I went……. royal family = performing monkeys, next little insta-celeb performing monkey has been born ready to entertain the great unthinking unwashed…..very funny……oh hang on……’monkey’…….never crosses my mind but those nasty racists use it as an insult………sharp intake of breath.

Why would someone be offended because I implied that what they thought and said was stupid? I’m not offended so no one else should be, what a bunch of drama queens 😝 It’s not like I equated your appearance or intelligence to that of an animal. Hmmm. Hypocritical much? Mibbes aye

I’m sorry if I’m coming across as antagonistic but I have previously explained my perspective on this thread and others. I’ve had similar discussions many, many times as I have children of mixed heritage. I’m white and lived in a little bubble, believing attitudes had progressed. That’s was until I had a black partner, I can’t believe what I’ve seen and experienced since meeting him and having children. It’s the sort of treatment you see in films. He just brushes it off, he’s thankful the police are keeping an eye on him as it makes him feel safer. He ignores the looks and comments on the street, in shops, restaurants…

Our kids don’t. They feel disenfranchised when the teacher said they couldn’t do something, because they were black. They feel disgusting when a friend says that they are dirty, because they are black. They feel scared when someone shouts at them in the street, because they are black.

But you’re not offended, so that’s ok.

1. Racism is more than just hate. It’s apathy. It’s disinterest. It’s ignorance. It’s power. It’s privilege. And so on. It doesn’t matter whether you know it or not, it still works in your favour if you are white. Paraphrase of Scott Wood’s lists.

2. Unconscious biases are learned and automatic stereotypes which are so deeply ingrained in our psyche that we aren’t even aware of them, yet they influence our behaviour. You are responsible if your actions or words are harmful to someone else, directly or indirectly and intentional or not. Studies have demonstrated that teachers will mark a student lower if they have a foreign sounding name, judges will pass a harsher sentence if the defendant is black and black people are less likely to be promoted. But no one is racist, right? It’s just an opinion.

3. If you were to see Megan in the street wearing joggy bottoms and a hoodie you’d call her black, money makes her whiter and more acceptable. To say you don’t see colour means that you are blind to the difficulties black people face every day.

If you were to see Megan in the street wearing joggy bottoms and a hoodie you’d call her black

I’d call her Megan if I knew her.

To say you don’t see colour means that you are blind to the difficulties black people face every day.

I find this quite objectionable and pretty ignorant. It is perfectly possible to not see colour consciously (though I admit I may well see it subconsciously – I suspect we all do) and have personal dealings that are equal and fair with those around us and still have empathy with those who for reasons of the racism in others do not have it as easy as I do. I have a blind friend. His blindness is not something that I consciously think about in my dealings with him and the esteem I hold him in. That does not mean I do not have a heightened awareness of the difficulties others put in his path. The two are not mutually exclusive.

Kind of correct. What I do (and you should try this because it’s awesome) is read the news stories that interest me or seem important. Therefore I can avoid royal news. Bombardment ceased! You’re welcome

I’m impressed, your ears can obviously filter out certain news items when they are mentioned on the radio or TV.

However I doubt that Danny Baker possess such evolutionary advanced ears.

So, if you can see how it can be detrimental to equate someone or group with an animal why are you supporting it? I could accept his ignorance if he had sincerely been so, but he hasn’t.

Your argument gives the association a legitimacy that sets us back 200 years, when really we should be planning a revolution

@aweeshoe

I’m not sure if your post was a reply to mine, it seems to be but I don’t see how much of what you say has to do with what I said.

We’re obviously having difficulty communicating this way, so i’m going to call it a day. For the record I agree with much … most even … of what you say.
A genuine apology from me if I’ve annoyed you in any way. It wasn’t my intention to rile you up – I think of discussions like this as a way of learning and improving, I’ve certainly read things here I wouldn’t have thought of myself.
I’m also sorry about what your kids have had to experience, and you should get that teacher sacked – someone like that has no place educating anyone.

Who is supporting it? There is not a person on this thread who has not said that once they had made the association with racism that the image should have been brought down and profuse apology made.

I mentioned many pages back a friend, who by the sounds of it is in exactly the same personal circumstances as you – white with a black partner and mixed race child, who posted a photo of her boy being naughty with the comment ‘cheeky monkey!’. Would you do that? It was meant in the most innocent of ways in the way the phrase has been used about white kids for generations. Is there not some positive in normalising the term for its real meaning and ignoring the negative connotations.

@easily my post wasn’t specifically addressed to you but to the thread in general. <span style=”font-size: 0.8rem;”>There are people on the thread who are defending what DB said and that they don’t see how or why people could be offended and those who are are [insert insult here] and no, I don’t mean you either @convert, go back to page 4 or was it page 3</span>

I’ve met white people who have black partners and are also racist, as I’ve said before that the intention is irrelevant. We are all conditioned by the same system, even black people can hold racial prejudice towards other black people. I called my ex a cheeky monkey once, I never thought anything of it but I may as well have called him a c*** judging by the look on his face. Would I call my kids it now? No. Never. Not when monkey noises are made at them in the school corridor and not while the majority of society associates them with animals. I wouldn’t call a white kid it either.

Have you ever done the Harvard implicit bias test? It covers a range of biases from ableism to sexism I was surprised to discover that I’m racist owards white people! I’m paler than pale 😂

https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/education.html