Hey,

I’ve got a a few days off work at the start of November and I was thinking of multi-day biking packing trip between Bothies in the Cairngorms with my mate. We’ll be driving up from NW England and I’d hazard a guess we’ll get to Aviemore for about 2 or 3ish in the afternoon. Also the drive back South would be early morning.

I’ve put together a route, would any locals or those with more knowledge of the area care to comment? Obviously will change the route if the forecast is rubbish!

Day 1:
Drive from NW England to Glenmore, then take the Ryvoan pass to Fords of Avon Refuge

Day 2:
Fords of Avon Refuge, down Glen Avon, up the North of Beinn a’Bhuird and descend via An Diollaid (great video here). Along Glen Quoich briefly before ascending Clais Fhearnaig and dropping into Glen Lui and then the obvious path to Corrour Bothy.
GPX

Day 3:
Corrour Bothy to Allt Clash Nan Taillear (as recommended here) and ascending to Ben Macdui before descending the path by the Hutchison Memorial Hut. Over Lairig Laoigh to Fords of Avon Refuge and up to the Saddle and ascending Bynack More and finally following the path down to Ryvoan Bothy.
GPX

Day 4:
Ryvoan Bothy to Glemore and drive back to NW England.

Obviously the meat of the trip will be Day 2 and 3, and I expect that they are going to be tough. We could drop Bynack More if we’re totally knackered.

How ridable is the route? Fully expect some pushing up the major ups but everything mostly ridable?

Also feel free to suggest a totally different route if you think there something better which we should with our time!

The Fords of Avon can be quite deep. This was taken on September’s Cairngorm Loop:

November might have snow on the tops, keep an eye on the various webcams

Cheers!

I saw it was 3 degrees on the top of Cairngorm today.

The Fords of Avon Refuge is a Refuge and not a comfortable bothy as such. Think spending the night in a garden shed.

In terms of rideable, the Lairig an Laoigh is variable at best. Lots of small bits of rideable trail interspersed with pushing.

Day 4 Ryvoan to Glennore will take you 15 mins. Just do it on day 3?

Be aware that it’s getting dark just after 6pm. That doesn’t give you much time on day 1 especially

I don’t know you and your mountain experience and abilities, so please take the following in the good spirit with which it is intended. These plans are for big days out when daylight is in quite short supply, so exposure and risk is therefore quite high. Think what you have in mind would be a great challenge in the summertime but in November, is likely to be either miserable or downright dangerous. I’d def not plan to overnight at the Avon refuge at any time of year, even with its recent wood-lined facelift, it’s still a cold, dank hole with no means of warming up. There are some much better routes around that will push you hard but which will not kill you if something goes wrong.

Agree with highlandman i don’t think it is the right time of year for an outing of this magnitude, even if you set off and the weather is benign it can change suddenly at this time of year, expect snow on the high tops and severe windchill, good navigation is also key on the plateau.

Bynack mor really isn’t worth the detour on this route.

PS. if you do attempt this route good luck but be prepared.

But don’t choose Strath Nethy as a route from The Saddle either

Alternatively, if you base yourself in or near Aviemore there are lots of good local lower level routes. I’ve had some big days out around that area in November, even when it has been snowing heavily.

Thanks for the advice everyone. We’ve both got Scottish winter mountaineering experience and one is ML trained. Although both have only done a couple of bike packing trips and very little Scottish big mountain mountain biking experience.

I picked a night over at Fords of Avon to make day 2 a bit more manageable. Could extend it down to Faindouran Lodge but that makes day 1 too long. Not good news about it being a dank hole, I was thinking it might warm up with 2 of us in it.

Perhaps I’d be better re-thinking the whole route.

Be aware that it’s getting dark just after 6pm

And it’s not properly light until after 7.30 am (later if it’s dull/overcast like this morning. Probably nearer 8!)…

If you do an ‘Outer’ loop that takes in Feshie, you have the choice then of including an overnight at the pleasant Ruigh Aiteachain bothy and then including Sgorr Gaoith summit, from which there are a couple of very interesting and rideable descents. This gives the option of sacking off at the time if the weather is vile. The hardest part of the Lairig an Laoigh route is the Avon river crossing, which can become impassable at short notice during wet weather. Although mostly rideable along its length, there are a couple of completely unrideable stretches that test your patience and resolve. To do a Cairngorms loop in winter you need options, and also to have some pretty decent luck with conditions. Another great trail in this area is the upper Tilt gorge, which rides in both directions; uphill is more fun than you’d expect as it is mostly rideable. However, the same problem then arises as in so much other ambitious winter route planning- the Geldie is prone to flash floods when the ground is saturated so you need a plan B in this area too.

And the clocks go back next week so dark at 5pm.

I like a big day out as much as anyone, but November through to February I’d be basing myself somewhere safe (campsites at Coylumbridge or Glenmore) and doing long day rides. Spending a night in the Avon refuge then heading out into 60mph winds and rain for a long day with little alternative does not appeal.

including an overnight at the pleasant Ruigh Aiteachain bothy

Still closed a couple of weeks ago. Didn’t look it was going to be open any time soon.

Given the weather and ground/river conditions for the September Cairngorm Loop ITT group start there was a lot of talk both online and in the pub the previous night about escape routes should certain burns and rivers be impassable.

One escape route was Fords of Avon down to Faindouran but even here you’ve a couple of Km of hike-a-bike (downhill!) before you get to a rideable track plus there are several big burns to cross. Generally though the escape route was the route itself, it’s very committing.

Though my shot shows the A’an in strong flow it wasn’t the deepest burn we had to cross, there were a couple that were waist deep. It was so wet that just about the entire track from just after Bynack Mor to over the Lairig an Laoigh was shoe deep in water – route finding wasn’t a problem – you just followed the ribbon of water!

My wife was also doing the CL and stopped at the Fords of Avon refuge on the first night – fine to get out of the wind and rain but definitely not cosy.

It’s worth having a read of the cairngormwanderer blog by Neil Reid – he’s the chap who cleans out the Corrour bothy toilet! There’s lots of info about the refurbishment of various bothies including the Fords of Avon – his tale of walking out from there during the refurbishment shows just how much commitment is needed in the area.

We did the Lairig an Laoigh N-S and the southern side down to Glen Derry is rideable for the most part, just the occasional water bar and burn to negotiate. Heading north I wouldn’t have thought it as pleasant, hard to tell when you are going the opposite direction but there was a lot of carrying bikes across boulders trying not to slip into the gaps.

I’m not sure I’d chose the Cairngorms in November for a bikepacking trip TBH, you are piling a whole lot of seriousness onto some big days. Still in the Cairngorms but generally at a lower elevation is The Deeside Trail. I’ve not done it but Phil Clarke who I rode with on the Highland Trail has done a route based on it. Here’s his account, I don’t think there are any committing river crossings.

Not trying to be overly negative in the above, just realistic. I’d rather people got out and did stuff.

Re: Highlandman’s assessment of the Avon refuge hut ..200% in agreement ..only to be used in the most extreme circumstances ..
A lot of what we believed to be rideable over the pass of calves from that point was anything but!

As the above, I’d not be doing that route in November. We did some of it in May (write up here). And it was tough and the first 15 miles from Glenmore to Glen of Dee took us about 8 hours! Different route to you but the hard bit is the same as what you have planned. Sounds like you are a lot fitter than us so could do it quicker, but we had ideal weather conditions.

I’d be going for something a lot less epic at that time of year.

Hi,
I would echo many of the sentiments expressed already especially if you don’t know the Cairngorms. Much of your route is unrideable. I would advise lower level routes that are more rideable especially in November when you will get very wet(unless there is some miracle). Without wishing to sound too pessimistic, looking after oneself for 4 days in the wet Cairngorms in November is certainly a challenge. (Three people & dogs helicoptered out of Strath Nethy last night) However if you hit the weather right it could be spectacular!!

It’s all weather dependent really – i was there for a couple of weeks last Nov and couldn;t ride as it was wet then super cold and verglace. Carrying enough kit to be warm esp when you will bet wet, and you will be wet, will be your challenge. I’d suggest a slightly less epic adventure frankly.

have the choice then of including an overnight at the pleasant Ruigh Aiteachain bothy

I was past on Thursday and the workmen were saying it is still a few weeks off completion. No date on MBA site for opening.

I think someone above mentioned it, but the Fords of Avon refuge is very much not a bothy. It’s a tiny, cramped, dark shelter that’s there really for emergency overnights more than anything else.