Assisted Suicide – for or against

Even if I had Alzheimer's, I still want to be able to suck every last second of life out of being alive that I could.

1 in 3 over 65's will die with some form of dementia. Fact.[/url]

You may well get the opportunity to test that theory. In a nursing home, waiting for the end, and you think you'll be aware of what's going on and why you're there or anything else for that matter?

Of course not!

1 in 3 over 65's will die with some form of dementia. Fact.[/url]

For

1 in 3 over 65's will die with some form of dementia. Fact.[/url]

1 in 3 over 65's will die with some form of dementia. Fact.[/url]

100% for, I should be able to determine my own destiny in the way I see fit. I don't see what it's got to do with the government. If it comes to a point where I've had enough and for whatever reason I'm incapable of sorting things out myself then this sort of facility will be invaluable.

Why on earth would anyone want to spend their remaining years being completely dependant on others/in constant pain/in a terribly humiliating position? It's beyond me. Let people have some dignity for christ's sake. We treat our pets better than we treat each other, at least they get to drift away painlessly and without compromise.

Bromptons cocktail for me Ever increasing doses

Samuri – other people have other views for a range of reasons. We MUST respect this

but I must respect his and his families wishes

which may not coincide…

against.

mainly because the likes of me would be doing the doing.

'the patients wishes are clear'. don't make me laugh. and what about the relatives who contest the clearness of the patient's wishes? i'd be spending half my time in court!

post shipman we already see enough people not getting pain relief because of twitchy litigious guilty feeling relatives and the effect they have on prescribers. i wouldn't touch 'assisted suicide' with a bargepole.

This used to be really hard for me.As a Christian I believe human life is sacred, however compassion for fellow human beings means I am against seeing people suffer.My Gran raised four kids before and after ww2, when life was hard, despite losing a lung to TB. Seeing her waste away in the last couple of years,slowly robbed of all her strength and freedom was awful and put me into the yes camp.But it has to be the persons choice,not next of kin.
However;
Despite any jolly quotes about friendly Victorian doctors helping you along,how long before assisted suicide becomes resource driven OR we have another Harold Shipman?

how long before assisted suicide becomes resource driven OR we have another Harold Shipman?

A very long time as the lecture pointed out this has not occured in countries that do allow assisted suicide – unless you have evidence to the contrary. Shipman was a mudering criminal – Legislation did not prevent him so not sure what the point is that you are trying to make with that comparison. Murder will still be illegal
Resource driven – again any evidence this will happen? We are talking about being humane not engaging in a population cull.

Ti29er – Member

Even if I had Alzheimer's, I still want to be able to suck every last second of life out of being alive that I could.

1 in 3 over 65's will die with some form of dementia. Fact.

You may well get the opportunity to test that theory. In a nursing home, waiting for the end, and you think you'll be aware of what's going on and why you're there or anything else for that matter?

Of course not!

You missed the present tense in the sentence.

I am making that decision for myself pro-actively, just as Terry Pratchett is making the opposite one, pro-actively…

I am, however, in the "for" camp – if the drugs weren't working anymore and I couldn't stand the pain.

Samuri – other people have other views for a range of reasons. We MUST respect this

I agree entirely. Those people can stay alive. The point is that those lucky bastards currently have the law working in their favour whereas as far as I can tell from the majority of responses so far on this thread, most of us do not.

duckman – Member

This used to be really hard for me.As a Christian I believe human life is sacred, however compassion for fellow human beings means I am against seeing people suffer.My Gran raised four kids before and after ww2, when life was hard, despite losing a lung to TB. Seeing her waste away in the last couple of years,slowly robbed of all her strength and freedom was awful and put me into the yes camp.But it has to be the persons choice,not next of kin.
However;
Despite any jolly quotes about friendly Victorian doctors helping you along,how long before assisted suicide becomes resource driven OR we have another Harold Shipman?

Don't worry – I'm sure it's all part of god's big plan. Eh?

maybe it's a test.

Sounds more like shitty bad luck to me mind.

Ti29er – Member

1 in 3 over 65's will die with some form of dementia. Fact.
..
1 in 3 over 65's will die with some form of dementia. Fact.
..
1 in 3 over 65's will die with some form of dementia. Fact.
..

Short term memory loss is the first sign apparently 😀

Ti29er – Member

1 in 3 over 65's will die with some form of dementia. Fact.
..
1 in 3 over 65's will die with some form of dementia. Fact.
..
1 in 3 over 65's will die with some form of dementia. Fact.
..

Short term memory loss is the first sign apparently 😀

Go on Granny, hurry up, you've got nothing left to keep going on for anyway granny, just move on now and let the kids have their inheritance.

Pressure and a very slipperly slope.

I agree in principle to a worthwhile life and a dignified death but it's a very dangerous precedent.

Sorry about the several posts.

Anyhow, you should see how loved ones have to cope. 😥

As I said, my father has been diagnosed by the same team Terry Pratchett's under at Gt Addenbrookes.
In the first 18 months there was a mis-diagnosis, as he also developed disphasia, which masked the true nature of the illness.
There were days worth of tests, all including my mother as my father is part of a UK trial / test. They want his brain after his death.
Now my mother, also 74, has to manage my father in every way, not helped by prostate issues in the last 4 months and her breaking bones in her leg during the summer.

Getting old looks positively vile, the truth be told.

Ok – all those who want to be offed please form an orderly queue at Nurse TJs euthanasia clinic and burger bar. 🙂

Go on Granny, hurry up, you've got nothing left to keep going on for anyway granny, just move on now and let the kids have their inheritance

Any evidence to support this anecdotal story?
I think most people will agree that wanting someone money will not be an accpeted reason for the granting of a request. You do realise the perosn involved has to give consent as well dont you.

GrahamS deliberate double post for humour??
Duckman – do you see a lot of gods love in the slow death of a loved one wasting away before your eyes via a terminal disease? I see mainly pain and suffering and a god [if one existed]who chooses to let it happen

TJ….. I heard your cooking was bad but is it really deadly 😉

I'm for from the point of view of me getting in a state of being unable to loko after myself or having machines keeping me alive. It would be a lot harder to decide for someone else but then that also depends on the circumstances,

Scottish law ( and I believe English also now) states that when an adult is not capable of making such a decision then their known views should be taken into account.

You can also write a "living will" which has legal standing to define your wishes.

Resource driven; So people get to stay in hospital for as long as they need do they? Everybody gets the drugs they need with no such thing as a postcode lottery? Which primary care district do you stay in,must be good to have that level of treatment. By Harold Shipman, how long before consent can come from next of kin? Just say, in cases where the ill person is in a coma, the nice doctor who has known family for years convinces family member it is for the better.
Sorry for daring to disagree with the mighty intellect that is Junkyard, but your are,as frequently shown, a horses arse.I don't see any of God's love in a family member dying; what sort of a stupid question is that? And why is it relevant to this thread?…Oh wait, I see where you are going with that.

You can also write a "living will" which has legal standing to define your wishes.

Both my wife & me have living wills, clearly stating that the other has absolute authority concerning whether or not medical assistance is given
we've also written into them that the other has the right to help the other one die if required

Now, I know a lot of that is illegal etc. but at least it puts something down if the other one were to face prosecution

Uplink.
Having just been all around the houses with my own father's situation, and having employed a neighbour who is a solicitor to complete all the reams & reams of legal paperwork, having dragged my sister down from the wilds of Wales for 3 separate meetings, I am left wondering if your own paperwork is worth anything in a court of law.
Did you draft it in the presence of and have it signed by the necessary people?

.I don't see any of God's love in a family member dying

Quite. 😛

T129er. It has some legal standing, Its not definite but acts as an indication of the persons wishes so any doc would have to have a good reason to go against it and would have to be able to justify going against it.

Its much easier to do before you become ill.

Unless the drugs had stopped working and I was in unbearable pain, I wouldn't want to be assisted.[/i]

So that's "for" then?

But we do all die Mr woppit,yes? I happen to believe that is not the end.

I am left wondering if your own paperwork is worth anything in a court of law

None whatsoever I would think other than TJs thoughts on it

At the end of the day [see what I did there?] it doesn't really concern either of us to any degree what the law would make of it
As I said earlier, it may well end up that both of us go at the same time, we've been together 32 years now, I couldn't face being a lonely old man 🙂
If I were to be prosecuted & imprisoned, so what? – I don't really care, I'm sure there's worse places to live out your days.

duckman – Member

But we do all die Mr woppit,yes? I happen to believe that is not the end.

That's your problem, but let's not start it all up again, it was done to death (oops) last time…

"I am not afraid of death. I was dead for billions of years before I was alive and it inconvenienced me not in the slightest" – Mark Twain.

Duckman – you wont help your case by throwing insults in my general direction. Can you not forgive those who trespass against you?
OT I find it difficult to believe that the postcode lottery will extend to assisted suicide and I find the slippery slope argument a little weak. The suggestion that a doctor will persuade the loved ones to kill the person is somewhat far fetched IMHO. I suspect appropriate legislation and independence could prevent any of this occuring without too much difficulty. I suspect most people agree there should be some legal /appropriate checks to any decision.

DezB – Member

Unless the drugs had stopped working and I was in unbearable pain, I wouldn't want to be assisted.

So that's "for" then?

I refer the honourable member to the reply that I gave earlier…

I don't really care, I'm sure there's worse places to live out your days.

Hull?

Exactly 😀

For. But only for people incapable of committing suicide themselves.

Your tale is bizarre TJ. Why didn't you give your grandfather some advice on how to do it properly after his first failure?

I was rather hoping Uplink might shed some light on it himself.

For example, he has stated he doesn't care is his wife ends up in prison if she helps him die, "Me & my wife will help each other die if required & neither of us really cares if that means we end up in prison" & that he seems to be making changes to the legal statute book (?) "we've also written into them that the other has the right to help the other one die if required", so I'm keen to know who helped them draw up these documents & how they might be worded.

As stated, we employed a solicitor to ensure it's as water tight especially with regard to power of attorney and transferring financial assets and the like, so as you'll appreciate, I interested to learn more. I still got a bill for £180 per hour.

For example, he has stated he doesn't care is his wife ends up in prison if she helps him die

no I didn't – I said I don't really care if I ended up up prison for helping my wife out of pain
She says the same

I'm not trying to change any legal statutes – just trying to put in writing how we feel

EDIT – We wrote them, without help

You seem to think legal considerations outweigh the love I feel for my wife, it doesn't
& – I'll say it again – If I were to be imprisoned for helping her to die with dignity rather than in prolonged pain, so what? – I truly don't care
My wife, I know, feels the same