Any primary school teachers in?

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  • Any primary school teachers in?
  • johndoh
    Member

    Can I ask what protocol is in this scenario…

    Year 2 child ‘A’ says something hurtful about another child ‘B’. Child B doesn’t hear this but playground gossip gets back to the mother of child B who complains.

    Child A is spoken to by the teacher but is told she doesn’t have to tell her parents that she has been spoken to. Ours is child A and we know she has been spoken to but she won’t tell us why because her teacher told her she doesn’t have to

    hammerite
    Member

    There’s no real protocol. I always find it difficult to deal with situations that I haven’t directly seen or heard happen. Most of the time the children involved (and their friends) tend to twist what has been said or simply can’t remember. – it tends to be that other children start to get involved.

    I go with the “bang both heads together” approach most of the time. Get both parties together at the same time, get an understanding of what’s happened (which can be difficult) and explain to both parties how it’s not nice for anyone to feel that way. Usually both parties have been unkind to each other one way or another.

    If it’s something that isn’t really very nasty or serious I wouldn’t mention to the child anything about speaking to parents. If it is something I think parents need to know I tend to talk to them myself with the child present. I’d never say you don’t need to tell a parent, secrets are never a good idea – if the child wants to tell their parents about something that has happened at school it’s up to them.

    Premier Icon Trekster
    Subscriber

    MissT is an early years teacher, she would have spoken to all parents concerned. I wouldn’t want to be those parents 😐

    johndoh
    Member

    The reason I am concerned is around child protection issues (long term, not directly related to this of course). Should an authority figure be telling a child they don’t need to tell their parents something? Surely the child should be told to always speak to their parents, not be encouraged to withhold things from them?

    I am very surprised, but then the teacher is an NQT so perhaps I shouldn’t be… 😕

    MoseyMTB
    Member

    Coukd it be that normal protocol is that parents will be told but in this case the child has been given a warning with the reminder that next time parents will be told.

    Often, at my school, we tell children we will have to tell parents but make the final decision that this is not needed.

    This has then been mistaken by the child to mean they don’t have to tell either.

    johndoh
    Member

    She was told she could tell us but didn’t have to. She wouldn’t tell mummy but after I spoke to her she did.

    And all she did (allegedly – she says it was another girl who has quite a lot of previous) was say she hated someone.

    All seems, frankly, absurd to me.

    Surely the child should be told to always speak to their parents, not be encouraged to withhold things from them?

    I am very surprised, but then the teacher is an NQT so perhaps I shouldn’t be.

    I would go see the head. just check if Childa was really told this.

    What part do you consider absurd?

    johndoh
    Member

    Absurd that parents have gone to a teacher asking for action to be taken because another child said they hated their child.

    (And the rumour was started by child ‘C’ so not an adult or anything – just a 6 yr old telling her mum, who told child B’s mum).

    Stupid playground politics not helped by an inexperienced teacher.

    revs1972
    Member

    ^^^^^
    Get used to it, it gets worse lol
    Playground politics , made especially worse when mummy/ daddy think their offspring are angels
    and couldn’t possibly have said / done such things.
    And no, teachers should not be encouraging kids not to tell parents things. We’ve had something similar and the wife went ballistic at the school when she found out

    johndoh
    Member

    Don’t get me wrong – she is no angel (she does say things she doesn’t mean but she is a child coming to grips with her emotions). What staggers me is both the other parent’s reaction and the approach taken by the teacher.

    what did the other parents do?

    Sometimes kids lie. Even yours, this is shocking I know. Even more shocking is that sometimes a teacher can say something they dont mean to.

    johndoh
    Member

    A kid yes, they do. A big grown up teacher should be above it.

    To be honest, she (the teacher) should have told the parent to get a grip and if she couldn’t manage that much, at least not teach a child to withhold things from their parents.

    johndoh
    Member

    what did the other parents do?

    Spoke to the teacher on the basis of another parent telling them something that their child had overheard something that my child may have said.

    johndoh
    Member

    As I say, absurd.

    If I was the only party involved I would handle things very differently but my wife (friends with all the mums) wants to try to sort things out.

    revs1972
    Member

    We have been called in before because a child overheard something my son said to his friend in the toilet.
    This child went home and told his parents what he had heard ( it was of a sexual nature) and the next day both his parents went up the school and demanded to speak to the head about it.
    All sat round , asked my son if he had said it, he said yes, so we told him he shouldn’t be talking like that at school ( or anywhere else come to that), and that was that.
    I did mention to the parents of the child who had stirred up all the sh*t, that if they had a problem then perhaps they should discuss it with us directly rather than waste the schools time over a trivial matter but they were convinced that this was something the school should deal with.

    johndoh
    Member

    Tell me about it – the mother of child ‘D’ (the child that child A actually said the thing) has now forbidden child D from playing with child A. All because of a silly little comment that one of them may or may not have said that may or may not have been overhead by another child.

    revs1972
    Member

    I’m with you on handling things differently etc, but like you my wife tries to sort things out amicably as she is the one who has to face the parents etc day when picking up and dropping off.
    Some real nasty, snidey , lying little ba*tards in his class too. You wouldn’t believe they are only 8-9 years old.
    I think the future of the Tory party is safe with these lot around. 😆

    Premier Icon ampthill
    Subscriber

    i did safe guarding training yesterday

    It would be wrong to “you can’t tell your parents”

    But surely the general situation is that you don’t have to tell your parents what your teacher said. Which is lucky because sadly students forget most of what a teacher says

    If you are really worried the speak to the head

    But being a primary school teacher is probably close to impossible. So i would advise on being supportive or keeping quiet if possible

    Hang on a mo’ how do you know all this if child A didn’t tell you?

    PS I don’t think I have ever said “you don’t need to tell your parents”

    PPS did child A say “do have to tell me parents?”

    So just surmise this is all based on what child a has said.
    Has there been any conversation with the other parents or teacher involved. Seems like without corroboration from the teacher the mums the word is just down to the child a. I would still seek clarification from the teacher to clear it up otherwise its just child a b and c perspectives

    johndoh
    Member

    Child B never heard anything, Child C told her mum who then told child B’s mum.

    In fact I think there are more children involved – D, E and F. The parents.

    My wife is in tears but all I see is a bunch of adults needing to get over themselves and accept we are talking about 6 yr olds.

    Still think the teacher needs her arse kicking though.

    Premier Icon Wally
    Subscriber

    Please calm down and ask nicely for a meeting with the school in a carefully worded email. Your child will be looking at you to see how you handle this and will simply mimic you.

    johndoh
    Member

    ? So next time my child falls out with a friend she’ll arrange a meeting via email?

    Premier Icon ampthill
    Subscriber

    My last post was a bit OTT

    I think to say a teacher “needs her arse kicking though.” is a bit drastic

    I’ll try and keep out of all the rights and wrongs. But I’ll try and take a teacher perspective

    Parent reports concern about what may or may not have been said.

    Teacher could do nothing which was was your preferred option. Fair enough you are entitled to an opinion.

    But the teacher decided to take the least drastic option and spoke to your child. To me that doesn’t mean told off or even found fault. It could getting your childs version of events. The “you don’t need to tell your parents thing wasn’t ideal”

    But are we saying your wife is in tears and started a thread on the internet because a teacher talked to your child about what was going on?

    How are teachers ever going to resolve things if they are in trouble for talking to the students involved

    Premier Icon chakaping
    Subscriber

    Feel sorry for you teachers. Keep up the good work.

    johndoh
    Member

    No, my wife was in tears because the whole episode upset her (friends talking about our child behind her back , realising our child isn’t perfect etc).

    All of that is shit that happens. A teacher telling a child she doesn’t have to tell her parents is the bit I am not happy about.

    Premier Icon ampthill
    Subscriber

    A teacher telling a child she doesn’t have to tell her parents is the bit I am not happy about.

    OK fair comment

    mattsccm
    Member

    “A teacher telling a child she doesn’t have to tell her parents is the bit I am not happy about. “
    I am bemused. Can’t see above where this is accurately quoted.
    You’ll find that even the brightest child won’t often repeat things verbatim.
    Not saying never, just that there are so many variables (mostly to do with the unreliability of children) that the whole argument is pointless.
    If there was a abuse issue involved maybe you would take the pessimistic view, and then probably find that it was wrong, but in this case? Really!

    outofbreath
    Member

    sometimes a teacher can say something they dont mean to.

    This.

    However I doubt what the teacher said was in any way controversial and you’re hearing it misreported and out of context.

    Forget it. Do nothing. All forgotten by Monday.

    sc-xc
    Member

    It may have been ‘don’t worry, we won’t tell your parents…you don’t have to either’

    Or something equally innocuous.

    MoseyMTB
    Member

    This is just another example of how primary teachers can’t win.

    I guarantee that if you speak to the teacher in question they will not have told your child that they don’t have to tell you. These accusations happen everyday, and every day we have to explain misquoted comments and frankly things that simply never happened. But, take the word of your year 2 child without actually talking to the teacher in question.

    Your NQT comment is absurd, whilst this may mean the teacher is a little naive, they may still have worked in a school for many years as a TA. NQT’s are fully qualified. They’re not on training.

    Can I be honest and tell you the worst part of a near impossible job that I still love… The parents!

    johndoh
    Member

    Why not believe my year two child? The teacher believed an account started by another year two child…

    MoseyMTB
    Member

    Nope, the teacher followed school protocol and spoke to your child. Did your child not say it?

    I thought, from your post and your wife’s tears, that it was actually said.

    Little the teacher could do to win here. If your child said it then they deserve to be spoken to. Wether they report it to you is the schools (most likely the heads) decision.

    MoseyMTB
    Member

    And also, you do know why they were spoken to. You make that clear in the first post with your scenario. Your child said something that hurt another child. They may not have meant to hurt them and via a PSHE approach were probably told why these actions were wrong.

    I see no part in your scenario where your child received a consequence and therefore why you did not need to be told. I assume your school protocol is the same as all I’ve worked in and speaking to parents being a step of action after an incident if decided necessary.

    johndoh
    Member

    I do not know if my child said it. She says another child did. The teacher spoke to my child on the basis of the wronged child’s mum being told by another mum who was told by her year two child.

    The situation is absurd but I go back to my original point – a teacher shouldn’t be telling a child that she doesn’t have to tell her parents. Because of this, our child won’t tell us the full story because she has been told she doesn’t have to.

    johndoh
    Member

    And I don’t mind her being spoken to – she shouldn’t have been offered an opportunity where she thought it was okay to keep something from us (ie, the teacher should have just spoken to her and left it at that, not add that she didn’t have to tell us).

    Premier Icon Ming the Merciless
    Subscriber

    Is child A making up the bit about “don’t have to tell parents”. Go to the teacher and politely ask what happened. Mrs M had a couple of run ins with parents raving about punishments she had dished out to their “perfect” children.

    Mrs M said one of the worst things about teaching was the Roman Senate-esque nature of playground politics.

    Premier Icon jamj1974
    Subscriber

    Trekster – Member
    MissT is an early years teacher, she would have spoken to all parents concerned. I wouldn’t want to be those parents
    POSTED 17 HOURS AGO # REPORT-POST

    Why?

    MoseyMTB
    Member

    Did the teacher tell your child not to tell you?

    I can’t find any evidence for this other than a year 2 child’s word.

    If your child was child B and you went to the teacher would you not want them to investigate and talk to your child?

    How do you know, like in all schools, that each individual child has not been approached and said that this did happen?

    What was your child’s consequence? I don’t see one here?

    We deal with this everyday.

    Speak to the teacher, I assure you they did not say you don’t need to tell your parents, rather in this case they (the teacher) does not need to tell you (the parents).

    MoseyMTB
    Member

    Oh, I’m sure most parents don’t realise too that half of each day of teaching time is wasted by the investigation playground incidents.

    We talk to each child, fill out two forms, and contact parents if necessary.

    All when i could actually be teaching the other children and giving them the education they deserve.

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