Bit of a long shot I know, but I’m always surprised by what crops up on here…

Anyway, just wondered if anyone on here had any knowledge about what is, and what isn’t, allowed to be done in a ancient woodland.

The reason I am asking is that we are currently planning on keeping a small number of pigs on some local woodland, which we have managed to get grazing rights for, but have just been informed by someone else that the area of woods is in fact an ancient woodland.

I’ve done a quick trawl of the web but can’t actually find any rules and regs about ancient woodland, and what is allowed and what isn’t.

My thoughts are that as long as we don’t chop trees down, and don’t right royally screw the place up we should be fine, but I just can’t find anything which gives any idea on the issue.

So, does anyone know anything about this?

Cheers…

Try contacting the Woodland Trust? They might advise on best ways of doing it. Might actually be good for the woodland!

Rachel

I know someone at work who may know…he used to work for national trust so knows something about what’s permitted and what isn’t I will report back in the week !!

I think it more likley to be bylaw based. Pigs in scent wood land sounds standard and logical to me though!

Good call on the Woodland Trust… will give the a call tomorrow…

And cheers gk, that would be ace thank you.

I’ll just point out it not a huge wood, just looks like a normal patch of woodland, no really old trees that we can see, lots of silver birch and the like. We have access to about an acre next to a road, and at the moment it’s hard to walk around due to all the bramble everywhere. So it’s not some pristine bluebell filled oasis that we are looking to destroy!!

My thinking too Brick, it’s what would most likely have been on there years ago!

Good luck, funkynick! What you are proposing to do has always been a dream of mine.

Please let us know what the Woodland Trust say.

If your in England.

http://www.forestry.gov.uk/pdf/FCPG201.pdf/$file/FCPG201.pdf

The woodland may be protected by the local planning authority under a Tree Preservation Order or Conservation area. Check with them first.

If you plan to fell trees you’ll need to talk to the Forestry Commission aboit a felling license.

As for keeping pigs in an ancient woodland? A handful might not be too harmful if you regularly rotate them around large compartments as per the New Forest pannage rights or even wild boar populations in Northern Europe. But in my experience pigs kill woodlands. They eat young roots killing trees and wipe out the delicate soil ecology. In an ancient woodland it is likely to be a bit of a disaster unless very carefully managed. I’d recommend you do a bit of reading up on the nature of an ancient woodland before introducing piggies into one. It’s not just the trees that are at risk.

If the local planning authority get wind of it they may well try to stop you by serving a Preservation Order which would leave you liable to criminal prosecution if even so much as a sapling gets trodden on.

The Woodland Trust is a good placw to start as well as your regional Forestry Commission office.

I would add that if the wood is designated as a SSSI introducing grazing is likely to be a PDO / OLD and you would need the consent of Natural England.

Generally pigs and ancient woodlands its fair to say aren’t exactly the best combination…. Would need to be very tightly managed at a minimum due to the soil disturbance.

Remember its not just the trees in an ancient woodland, but the under-story and ground flora and fauna that are as equally valuable. Pigs will trash this habitat rapidly.

I’d be speaking to Natural England for advice before proceeding any further and wouldn’t expect them to look on your proposal favorably.

hop on to http://www.magic.gov.uk and start clicking through designations to see if its recorded as SSSI or anything else statutory.

Aspirational bacon would go down well on here.

Before I commit, just one question.
These pigs, how long are their legs?

http://www.highweald.org/look-after/land-management/woodland/1612-keeping-pigs-in-a-woodland.html

it’s hard to walk around due to all the bramble everywhere. So it’s not some pristine bluebell filled oasis that we are looking to destroy

Lol.. as if the ancient world was all chocolate box covers.. they still had bramble thickets back then you know 🙂

What si says.

It’s good for woodland generally to actively manage it including ancient woodland thin fell trees etc. in ancient woodland don’t forget that a lot of the value is in the ground flora. It’s easy to plant a new crop of trees and get a broad leaved woodland in 100 yrs but you’ll not have the the other bits (the plants and animals) that are there in an ancient woodland because it’s been continuously wooded for centuries.

Pigs could damage this but with all animals I guess it depends on the stocking and management. Pigs will root around and eat bulbs, roots and seeds etc from all the things that ecologically you’d want to keep. Some rooting is good to mix things up a bit.

The new forest and pan age pigs is a little different as it’s a pasture woodland and only 40% or so actually wooded. Also it’s tightly controlled and the pigs are only allowed out for a number of weeks in the autumn primarily to eat acorns so the ponies don’t eat them and consequently die. The new forest pigs are very lightly impacting the new forest as it’s such a massive place. 30k hectares or there abouts with a couple of hundred pigs turned out for 6 weeks or so. They are also rung through the nose to stop them rooting around.

Speak to your local FC woodland officer. Chances are they’d love to know you and support you in managing your wood. If you want a management plan written ( the FC will pay for it and it’ll unlock the potential in your wood) give me a shout. Email in profile.

No experience of pigs, but I’ve been trying to ‘manage’ about 3 acres of woodland that used to be ancient. As above, it takes a huge amount of time to manage, let alone try and return to native species.
But there are people and organisations that can help, all mentioned above.

http://www.conservationpigs.co.uk/ not ancient woodland but pigs being used in woods at Haigh Hall

grazed responsibly what could be more natural? surely its only a few hundred years since wild boar were rooting about in any ancient woods in the UK?

T1000 – half a dozen pigs would take a couple of weeks to completely shit up a small woodland. Wild boar have ranges on the 1000’s of acres. Not necessarily a bad idea but would require careful management. maybe pen them and let them out for a forage periodically.

I should have added that friends of mine graze their pigs responsibly in about 8 acres of woodlands and use temporary pens etc + are constantly moving them around (the woods are a treat for the pigs and not their permanent grazing site + they seem to graze areas only every 4 or 5 years).

Right, I’ve checked on the Magic gov website and it’s not listed as an SSSI or conservation area. Have also checked on the local council site and it’s not listed there as a conservation area either. Not checked on the TPO situation yet as apparently that search needs paying for… unless I go to the local council offices. So will send t’other half there one day for a look.

I have spoken to the Woodland Trust and the general message I got from them was that officially they would frown upon it, but unless there is some higher level of protection in place there is nothing that could be done anyway. However, if stocking densities are kept low and the area kept under observation to ensure it wasn’t getting damaged then it shouldn’t really be a problem. That shouldn’t a problem as we are only planning on keeping a couple of pigs for ourselves and to cover their costs, so would only have them for a 3-4 months a year, the rest of the time the area would be left to recover.

And yes, I know that they had thickets of brambles back in the day… I was just trying to point out that this isn’t some idyllic glade full of woodland flowers, it’s an overgrown, unmanaged area of woodland, next to a road, surrounded by farmland, which we have been given permission by the owner to keep some pigs on.

No tree felling planned, maybe some branch trimming to stop damage to the fence, but nothing else.

And burko, thanks for the offer but unfortunately it’s not actually our woodland, the owner is allowing us to keep animals on it. I will mention it to them though, to see what they say, and I’ll also speak to the local FC woodland officer to see what they have to say about it too.

I still maintain your local Natural England advisor will be a better bet than the FC – should have a broader knowledge in relation to livestock grazing obligations, cross compliance etc too.