Almost stranded touring because of my impossibility tight tyres. Advice please

I’ve just got back from a mini tour in Scotland.

had a train booked and then I got a puncture.

no problem I thought, as I had all the gear, good tire levers etc.

however, could I get the bugger off the rim…Jesus! Snapped a tire lever straight away. Was impossibly  tight.

luckily my saviour cycled past at the perfect time. A middle aged Scot with bloody strong hands.

he somehow got it off the rim and it took 3 of us to get the bead back on.

New Mavic open pros and conti contact plus.

anyway, I can’t be in that situation again so I’m gonna change tyres.

but before I do, I noticed some new tire levers (slide style things) and some forceps for reseating.

are they any good?

Pedros are some of the strongest levers. You could also talc the inside of the tyre and tube – this realy helps.

I suspect a mix of rims and te4chnique because I found these conti tyres pretty easy when I used them.  At the risk of teaching my granny to suck eggs – Did you get the bead right into the well and work the slack to one side?

I’ve only ever had to resort to Park Tool TL-5 levers once. Almost at risk of bending the rim I thought, but they worked with a stupidly tight rim and Schwalbe Marathon Plus tyre on Mrs a11y’s commuter.

I use Pedro’s levers.

I bought and sold some continental GP something because I could not get them on my rims with any amount of force.

Sell the tires! Who wants to get stuck in the middle of nowhere and walk out

I learned on 21″ motocross tires.

Washing up liquid is your friend!

Apply thinly to rim and bead, doesn’t help removing the tire, however.

Won’t those Conti Contact Plus get easier to remove and put back on the wheels with practice, just like many other tyres?

I struggled to put a new 25mm Schwalbe Pro One on my front Vel 50 RL last week, but after removing it when I thought I’d punctured the latex tube while setting up (turned out it was poor threads on the core that wouldn’t screw into the valve extenders, replacement core solved it), it was a doddle to reseat with my thumbs.

Contact plus are awful for changing , Mrs kilo had them on her cx commuter and when I tried to remove one I ended up going out and buying a gatorskin rather than sticking the contact plus back on – hateful pieces of shite. Aeleron velocity rims so not just a problem with mavic.

VAR Tyre Levers.

https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/tools/var-tyre-levers/

Work a treat on really, really tight tyres (think Schwalbe Marathon Plus on a Brompton).

Also carry a pair of Pedros because they work most of the time.

I also have a Koolstop Tyre Mate in the shed.

https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/tools/koolstop-tyre-mate/

Continental seem to have highly variable quality control.

I had a set of Conti inner tubes (bought on CRC to bump the overall price up so I could use a discount code) and they all failed, I’ve seen some tyres that are unbelievably tight to fit or remove and some that just fall into place.

I’d never buy any of their stuff again, it’s a lottery as to whether it’s very good or truly shite.

a lot of it is technique, you need to break the bead across the tyre then move the slack to the point you’re levering before you lever anything.

I’ve changed so many tyres over the years but these were something else. Carrying a big tool isn’t an issue as it’s a touring bike with 4 panniers.

but I’ll practice a little now I’m at home before I make a decision.

Rehook Tyre Glider – Change Stubborn Bike Tyres

One of these.

They had them at an event I was at. Impossibly tight tyres as a demo – couldn’t do anything with a normal lever (he had a box of snapped ones!). Got the tyre on and off with one of these. Bought one as it’s nicer than levers to use in the garage little bulky to take out on a ride but I carry it in winter as it will help with cold hands.

I bought one of the Vittoria things that featured on FGF a couple of weeks back – erm, Vittoria Air Liner Tool, there are two versions, a mountain bike and a road one. I used it as a last resort to successfully to break the extraordinary bond between a WTB rim and a 2.8 Rekon + helped by a Schwalbe Pro Core system.

The tool worked, just about. This was after standing on the bead with full bodyweight and various other applications of quite a lot of force. I’m not a numpty, it was just a really extraordinarily difficult bead to dislodge, I’ve never encountered anything like it even though WTB rims have a horrid reputation for tightness. Anyway, the Vittoria tool did the job if you need something to break a really tight bead-lock.

Once I’d got the bead off, the rest was straightforward with Pedros levers. If you can’t dislodge the bead to start off with, the rest is a bit academic… though obviously any number of STWers would have simply removed it using only their little fingers and a lolly stick 🙂

https://www.merlincycles.com/feedback-sports-steel-core-tyre-levers-20-300890.html

And to help getting them back on:

https://www.merlincycles.com/cushcore-bead-bro-284422.html

Don’t flame me for this, but…

I hate tubeless tyres and rims for this very reason. The only success I’ve had whilst out and about is keeping riding on the flat tyre as that seemed to be literally the only way to break the bead. WTB, of course, whose tyres (and rims) I will never buy again.

I’ve a tiny bottle of washing up liquid on tour/camping, also good for lubing tyre beads.
But you’re right, some tyres and some combo of tyre and rim are utter pains…

…get the bead right into the well…

I’ve found this is usually the key trick when dealing with tight tyres. When you are trying to roll the last bit into place, make sure the bead diametrically opposite is shoved right down into the well, and that should give you the wee bit of slack you need to pop the bead over the rim.

The tyres will also get easier with age, or so I find.

Pedro’s levers are the best, will not break.

And some tyres just get easier after they’ve been on and off a couple of times.

I seem to remember a database of tyre and rim combos that do or don’t work well together.. was that on the STW forum??

EDIT- I’m just repeating what other people have said earlier 😒

what kind of rim tape are you using?

Sticky rim tape v important, pushed right into the well. I had an impossible wheel tyre combo and it was the supplied rim tape that was to blame.
The VAR thing above is very good.

I have limited use of my left arm, pretty much no grip so I know how difficult it can be when you find a tyre / rim combo that just won’t work. Reynolds deep rim carbon wheels and Conti 5000 tubed just wouldn’t work for me.

Like one of the posters above has mentioned the Kool Stop Tyre Mate Tool does work.And I know its closing the gate after the horse bolted, but with new tyres I now always go through the process of removing tyres, putting them back on again, removing them etc. Just to ensure I’m not in your position again.

I’ve had Contact Plus, Contact and Top Contact before. On two different rims. They all went on and off just fine.

I had this with WTB rims and tyres, nearly ended a two week trip as I got a puncture on the way to the train station and thought I was going to have to cut the tyre off the rim. Managed it in the end, luckily no more punctures that trip but changed rims and tyres (Light Bicycle & Schwalbe) as soon as I got home and have had no issues since!

Some rims or tires are just out of spec. I bought a second hand wheel with a Rigida Chrina rim. Even fitting a well used tyre using all tricks was almost impossible in the shed. First time I got a puncture I broke 4 tyre levers at the roadside trying to get it back on. By a huge bit of fortune a friend passed in his car and gave me a lift home. Wheel binned.

A set of Nokian tyres got binned as they needed workshop tools to get in the rim. Not helped by it being a disc only rim with very shallow well  other tyres went on the same runs ok.

For touring I would always go with a combination I knew worked ok.

…get the bead right into the well…

And start opposite the valve.

Pedros levers are bloody good, should you still need to use more than your thumbs.

Don’t put washing up liquid on as it contains salt and will corrode stuff…

forceps for reseating.

Go careful with those.  You can put so much force on the rim you can bend the rim.

I bent the rim and had to replace it when using with a very tight tyre a few years ago (Challenge hand made tyre which I actually gave up with) and in my usual way of learning nothing I went and did it again a few weeks ago with a Tubeless tyre on an old 26″ mountain bike rim.  I bent it back straight but it had actually split the rim so had to change the rim (again)

That same Vittoria Mezcal went straight on to my new rim with just my hands.

I’ve a tiny bottle of washing up liquid on tour/camping, also good for lubing tyre beads.

I used to carry miniature hotel shampoo bottles in my moto toolkit for this purpose. You can buy ‘special’ vegetable based soap too.

And I know its closing the gate after the horse bolted, but with new tyres I now always go through the process of removing tyres, putting them back on again, removing them etc. Just to ensure I’m not in your position again.

We sometimes suggest this in event literature – tell participants that although it’s supported, there are not the resources to fix every puncture for you so make sure you know how to do it yourself and do a dummy run in a warm house before you have to do it for real on a cold wet roadside.

So many people default to using Conti – it seems to be the standard answer to “what tyres should I use?” and everyone goes “oh, GP5000!” and as I mentioned previously, their QC seems quite random. You get some that’ll come off rims with bare hands, some that need 8 tyre levers and thumbs like Arnie’s biceps.

Pedro’s levers are the best, will not break.

I thought that as well, but we snapped a few trying to get a Supergravity tyre on my pal’s carbon rims in a car park.

Super-stuck tyres seem to be an increasingly common thing for me. Michelin and WTB tyres have both needed to be put in the vice in the last year here.

I bought the steel cored levers (and the Cushcore Bead Bro) I linked above after breaking two Pedro levers trying to get a Michelin onto my front wheel a couple of months ago. I wanted tools I’d know would work and that I could feasibly carry as standard kit.

I remember snapping a carbon rim wall using steel levers to seat an impossibly tight tyre so be warned..

Toughest tyre I ever tried to fit was the original gp5000 tubeless. Absolutely impossible and I’ve changed hundreds of tyres in my time. They were notoriously bad

. I bought a second hand wheel with a Rigida Chrina rim. Even fitting a well used tyre using all tricks was almost impossible in the shed

I used one of those for my first go at building a wheel, ended up with a perfectly true wheel that I’d never trust to use as it was almost impossible to get a tyre on 🙂

@oceanskipper it won’t.

Does washing-up liquid damage your vehicle?
We asked Dr Bob Eden BSc MSc PhD MICorr (Member of the Institute of Corrosion) for the truth:

“Washing up liquid does contain a ‘salt’ but this is the active ingredient and should not be confused with road salt.
There is nothing in a washing-up liquid that will exacerbate corrosion – there’s no sodium chloride salt to worry about.
The issue regarding corrosion is the ‘chloride’ bit of the salt. In ‘chloride nests’ at the base of a corrosion pit, the chloride exists as hydrogen chloride, which in damp conditions creates a solution of dilute hydrochloric acid, and it’s this acid that does the damage.
You need to avoid ‘chloride’ from any and all sources, e.g. seawater, road grit and fish & chips (but not washing up liquid). When I wash my aluminium bodied Lea Francis, a dash of Fairy is just fine…”

Pedro’s levers are the best, will not break.

Hahaha.

They do and I have.

Had a couple that bent and one that even snapped.

I dread it when the GF has a puncture on her gravel bike. Either it’s the Schwalbe G Ones or the rims, or just that combo, but they’re stupidly tight.

a lot of it is technique, you need to break the bead across the tyre then move the slack to the point you’re levering before you lever anything.

This +1

And always work it into the rim OPPOSITE the valve, and then work back round, keeping tension in the bead until you get to the valve and pull it over the rim there.  Anything else and the valve isn’t letting the bead sit in the well and you’ll never get enough slack in the bead to get it off.

what kind of rim tape are you using?

This +1 , the implication being that you should use the minimum amount of the right tape, not layer upon layer of the wrong one.  The thickness of the tape in the well is the difference between an easy tyre and an impossible one.

I’m one of those annoying people with magic thumbs that stops to help people with stuck tyres at the roadside. Funniest one was a group of tourers on e-bikes with those Tannus foam inserts in Marathon+ tyres 😬 yet a 3/4″ thorn had still made it straight through.  I managed to jiggle it off the rim before they’d even finished asking did I know where “Pete’s Bike Shed”* was that they’d found on google and could he fix it.

Tyre levers still come out occasionally, but 99% of the time just technique will shift supposedly stuck tyres. If it is stuck I use metal levers, if it’s that bad it’s going to damage the rim anyway I may as well not waste £20 worth of plastic levers first 😂

*local mobile mechanic based a mile or so down the road

I had a rim/tyre combo that i broke every single tyre lever in the house, Schwalbe, Conti, Pedros, Soma steel core (broke the hook off), Park steel core (bent, then split the plastic).

Ended up taking a break and managed with my fingers and thumbs in the end… They came off and on easily the next time i did them.

That was the closest i’ve ever come to giving up.

(UCI spec 33 mm tubeless tyres on a 21mm wide (internal) mtb rim, Vittoria tyres and Stans Rims IIRC.)

Yes, the rim tape makes a huge difference.

I had similar with a CX tyre and foam inserts. I gave up and took them to my regular LBS, he also gave up (which surprised me, he’s normally able to fix anything!).

Eventually I went to another shop and he had the tyre off almost before I’d finished telling him what an absolute bastard tyre it was. Annoyingly I didn’t see what he used, he may have had some of those long pliers to push the foam insert into the central well of the rim.

The replacement tyre – even with the foam insert – went on in seconds using just thumbs. Weird.